Theft of Items from our Baby’s Grave

cullieh · 21-11-2019 12:52am #1

Hi People. In the last couple of months items ( toys that her cousins gave her) have been going missing from my baby’s resting place. On the first occasion 3 action hero figures went missing, These were replace with 5 new figures all similar to what were taken. These 5 figures have now been removed. My wife and I are dismayed as to how anybody could do this, let alone to Baby. — I guess my reason for posting here is.. Can anyone recommend a camera or anything at all that I could get to film what is going on. I would need something with a long life as unfortunately we cannot be there all the time to see who is doing this.

Many thanks In Advance,

A Distraught Parent.

Quantum Erasure · 21-11-2019 1:11am

they'll just take the camera...

(sorry for your loss)

Wibbs · 21-11-2019 1:15am

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:15am

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

they'll just take the camera...

(sorry for your loss)

There are Trees and Bushes locates next to her grave.I am sure I can set it up that it won’t be seen. - I just want these lowlifes caught as it will just continue otherwise.

Thanks for the condolences.

Raconteuse · 21-11-2019 1:16am

That just hurts my fricking heart. So sorry to read it...

Might there be a type of spy camera that wouldn't be easily spotted/could be hidden elsewhere? Grave interference is unfortunately not super unusual - if you ask someone in the security industry, they might know of something specific.

Pieces of sh1t - can't believe the pain some get off on causing.

antix80 · 21-11-2019 1:17am

Op it might just be kids taking them.
Even if it's a junkie robbing them, it's not a battle worth fighting.
I'd say stop leaving such items on the grave if it's going to upset you when they go missing.

Maybe give toys to charity instead.

Just to add.. There are people who believe it's tacky to leave a lot of toys at a grave.. Esp older people. Well, complain all you want but they might be clearing them away. I still don't think setting up a camera will bring you any peace.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:18am

Raconteuse wrote: »

That just hurts my fricking heart. So sorry to read it...

Might there be a type of spy camera that wouldn't be easily spotted/could be hidden elsewhere? Grave interference is unfortunately not super unusual - if you ask someone in the security industry, they might know of something specific.

Pieces of sh1t - can't believe the pain some get off on causing.

Thanks for the heartfelt response. We will certainly be looking into doing something as it can not continue.
Thanks again

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:21am

antix80 wrote: »

Op it might just be kids taking them.
Even if it's a junkie robbing them, it's not a battle worth fighting.
I'd say stop leaving such items on the grave if it's going to upset you when they go missing.

Maybe give toys to charity instead.

It most likely is Kids. I certainly will not let thieves stop me from placing toys on my daughters grave. I would prefer them to be stopped rather than stopping giving her gifts. There is not much more we can do for her

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:24am

antix80 wrote: »

Op it might just be kids taking them.
Even if it's a junkie robbing them, it's not a battle worth fighting.
I'd say stop leaving such items on the grave if it's going to upset you when they go missing.

Maybe give toys to charity instead.

Just to add.. There are people who believe it's tacky to leave a lot of toys at a grave.. Esp older people. Well, complain all you want but they might be clearing them away. I still don't think setting up a camera will bring you any peace.

Well we certainly do not find it as you put it, Tacky. Anyway I know you are trying to be of help, just maybe not the advice I was looking for.

Thanks all the same.

Raconteuse · 21-11-2019 1:28am

I'm seeing "Leave the scumbags to it" here. And the items initially removed were replaced so it's not as cut and dry as e.g. people removing them due to thinking they're tacky. Also, what kind of **** would remove toys from a baby's grave, whatever the reason?

21-11-2019 1:30am

"Thumbcam".

: Euromart used to sell them. Try larger store. Their battery will run out after a few hours though.

Maybe buy a few of them. Still unlikely to find culprits

One eyed Jack · 21-11-2019 1:32am

I understand your frustration OP, but I think the better course of action would be to report the incident to the Gardaí and allow them to investigate, rather than the idea of setting up a camera.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:34am

Raconteuse wrote: »

I'm seeing "Leave the scumbags to it" here. And the items initially removed were replaced so it's not as cut and dry as e.g. people removing them due to thinking they're tacky. Also, what kind of **** would remove toys from a baby's grave, whatever the reason?

Thanks ... Everyones view is different I guess. There must be about 20 teddy’s on a bench and another 10 toys up by her headstone left by her cousins and my wife and I. They keep taking the same (Pj masks ) ones. They are of no value to anyone except to us.

wakka12 · 21-11-2019 1:35am

I would say it's just little kids taking them as they spot them and are interested in them and they're unattended toys. And they dont undertsand what theyre doing. I cant imagine any adult is deliberately doing this to upset you, as you say they have no value. Still worth a look into Im sure.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:35am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

"Thumbcam".

: Euromart used to sell them. Try larger store. Their battery will run out after a few hours though.

Maybe buy a few of them. Still unlikely to find culprits

Thanks- Will check that out. Appreciated.

Raconteuse · 21-11-2019 1:37am

wakka12 wrote: »

I would say it's just little kids taking them as they spot them and are interested in them and they're unattended toys. And they dont undertsand what theyre doing. I cant imagine any adult is deliberately doing this to upset you. Still worth a look into Im sure.

What little kids would be in a graveyard though? Other than those accompanied by an adult.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:38am

One eyed Jack wrote: »

I understand your frustration OP, but I think the better course of action would be to report the incident to the Gardaí and allow them to investigate, rather than the idea of setting up a camera.

We have got her replacements, and we will see how that goes, To be honest I don’t think the Garda will do much but again it all depends on which Garda you get. Thanks for that

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:39am

Raconteuse wrote: »

What little kids would be in a graveyard though? Other than those accompanied by an adult.

Our thoughts exactly. Unless parents are stealing them for their kids instead.

wakka12 · 21-11-2019 1:40am

Raconteuse wrote: »

What little kids would be in a graveyard though? Other than those accompanied by an adult.

Maybe locals? Depends on the graveyard in question but some graveyards act like parks with spacious pathways around graves and spaces to walk and jog. Glasnevin for instance.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:41am

wakka12 wrote: »

I would say it's just little kids taking them as they spot them and are interested in them and they're unattended toys. And they dont undertsand what theyre doing. I cant imagine any adult is deliberately doing this to upset you, as you say they have no value. Still worth a look into Im sure.

Thanks Wakka, No matter what way we look at it it is just so wrong whoever is doing it. If it is kids, where are the parents, and if it is adults stealing them for their kids, well that is beyond belief

21-11-2019 1:42am

Trailcam from Amazon. But, even though it must break your heart, there is little you can do about it. Even if you identify them from the footage will the gaurds do anything?
One point that may help, you should know that the theft is not personal to you or your child. It's just someone with serious problems doing crazy ****. What kind of human takes toys from a child's grave? Your baby might feel sorry for such sad people.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:44am

wakka12 wrote: »

Maybe locals? Depends on the graveyard in question but some graveyards act like parks with spacious pathways around graves and spaces to walk and jog. Glasnevin for instance.

It is possible that kids from a relatively close estate are going in there. Not sure why they would, unless of course to steal toys, as that have a huge green to play on. Also what do the parent say/do when they see the kids with the said toys... presuming it is the Kids of course

riffmongous · 21-11-2019 1:47am

Raconteuse wrote: »

What little kids would be in a graveyard though? Other than those accompanied by an adult.

At a funeral? Kids will be running around unsupervised.. that they were replaced the first time sounds like maybe parents found out. 2nd time probably different kids

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:48am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Trailcam from Amazon. But, even though it must break your heart, there is little you can do about it. Even if you identify them from the footage will the gaurds do anything?
One point that may help, you should know that the theft is not personal to you or your child. It's just someone with serious problems doing crazy ****. What kind of human takes toys from a child's grave? Your baby might feel sorry for such sad people.

Thank you for that reply. I don’t really know what it would achieve, it just breaks our heart that our innocent baby’s toys are being stolen.

Not sure what I would do either if we did get a camera and caught those responsible. I have a feeling I would get into a lot more trouble than they would.

Jet Black · 21-11-2019 1:49am

Hunting/wildlife camera. Long battery, detects movement, designed for outdoors. Have you asked the caretakers? They may have removed them. My brother's grave had a small fence around it and a little statue for 20 years that was removed by the caretakers due to the rules being enforced.

Strumms · 21-11-2019 1:50am

I don’t think there is a hell of a lot you can do. Leaving a camera around... well if toys go missing so can a camera even if hidden to a degree. Also if the staff of the cemetery find it they’ll just take it. I doubt they’d be happy about an unapproved recording device in a sensitive location like a cemetery. Have you thought about getting toys mounted in a glass display that could somehow be affixed to the grave ? Even if it was kids they’d be with parents so it shouldn’t have happened.

A few years ago the expensive stone flower vase/pot went missing from my sisters grave and before that flowers went missing from the vase itself. We found it on a grave directly behind but two rows away... it was an expensive stone one and heavy so it couldn’t just have been blown away and put on the wrong grave by accident...

Unfortunately if you are a horrible robbing cûnt the location of your evil endeavors doesn’t matter so much... it’s want it...take it...it’s ingrained in certain mindsets.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:51am

riffmongous wrote: »

At a funeral? Kids will be running around unsupervised.. that they were replaced the first time sounds like maybe parents found out. 2nd time probably different kids

Sorry I may have worded the post wrong, They were replaced by us after the first time. Not by the people who took them unfortunately

Del2005 · 21-11-2019 1:51am

Placing a camera in a public place will most likely end up with you getting in trouble not the thieves. While you have no right to privacy in public, this means that a person can take pictures or videos in public, setting up a spy/trail camera to record a public place is a big no no. That's even if a graveyard is considered public and not private, where you definitely can't set up a camera unless it's your private property. Even home CCTV isn't supposed to record any public areas.

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:53am

Strumms wrote: »

I don’t think there is a hell of a lot you can do. Leaving a camera around... well if toys go missing so can a camera even if hidden to a degree. Also if the staff of the cemetery find it they’ll just take it. I doubt they’d be happy about an unapproved recording device in a sensitive location like a cemetery. Have you thought about getting toys mounted in a glass display that could somehow be affixed to the grave ? Even if it was kids they’d be with parents so it shouldn’t have happened.

A few years ago the expensive stone flower vase/pot went missing from my sisters grave and before that flowers went missing from the vase itself. We found it on a grave directly behind but two rows away... it was an expensive stone one and heavy so it couldn’t just have been blown away and put on the wrong grave by accident...

Unfortunately if you are a horrible robbing cûnt the location of your evil endeavors doesn’t matter so much... it’s want it...take it...it’s ingrained in certain mindsets.

I am sorry to hear of the loss of you’re sister. Isn’t it awful that we have to go to such measures to keep our loved ones items safe. Some people have no shame!

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:56am

Jet Black wrote: »

Hunting/wildlife camera. Long battery, detects movement, designed for outdoors. Have you asked the caretakers? They may have removed them. My brother's grave had a small fence around it and a little statue for 20 years that was removed by the caretakers due to the rules being enforced.

Thanks Jet. No we didn’t say it to the caretakers to tell you the truth. Surely they would say it to us prior to removing them if it was them. Also these toys are in no way offensive, there are teddy bears of the toy that go untouched. They are just small figurines that someone takes a shining to

cullieh · 21-11-2019 1:58am

Del2005 wrote: »

Placing a camera in a public place will most likely end up with you getting in trouble not the thieves. While you have no right to privacy in public, this means that a person can take pictures or videos in public, setting up a spy/trail camera to record a public place is a big no no. That's even if a graveyard is considered public and not private, where you definitely can't set up a camera unless it's your private property. Even home CCTV isn't supposed to record any public areas.

Cheers man. I think I will say to the caretakers what is happening maybe the church has cameras although I walked around the building many times and never saw any.

By the sounds of it the guilty win then eh!

riffmongous · 21-11-2019 2:00am

cullieh wrote: »

Sorry I may have worded the post wrong, They were replaced by us after the first time. Not by the people who took them unfortunately

Ah ok. Well I still reckon it could be kids from a funeral.. how quick do you replace them and do they go missing again? I know it's not easy but it's most likely harmless kids not realising so try not to get let it get to you

kowloon · 21-11-2019 2:00am

What you need is a trail camera. Hunters and wildlife watchers use them. I have one myself that looks over the back of the house and capture video of the local Badger, They're not expensive, usually come with an attachment for trees and they can capture video or photos day or night activated by movement. They're usually printed with a camo pattern and as long as the sensors and cameras aren't covered you can add more to it to obscure the shape.

Ursus Horribilis · 21-11-2019 2:02am

Why does it have to be toys you put on the grave? Maybe you might be better getting something tasteful and more weather resistant for the grave instead? Cheap toys look like sh*t in no time at all, especially this time of year.

wakka12 · 21-11-2019 2:03am

I think you should still do it. If you hide it well the chances of any trouble coming of it are so small. I know if I was you I dont think Id be able to go on without just knowing for sure who it was that did it, even though I do think its more than likely just children who dont know any better.

21-11-2019 2:03am

cullieh wrote: »

Thank you for that reply. I don’t really know what it would achieve, it just breaks our heart that our innocent baby’s toys are being stolen.

Not sure what I would do either if we did get a camera and caught those responsible. I have a feeling I would get into a lot more trouble than they would.

Yes. I appreciate your honesty and can understand some of your pain my friend. I have a child buried too. Please try to appreciate that your child is not there in that hole in the ground. If he/she is anywhere it is in nature, in the sunset and the cherry blossom, the Autumn leaves, Winter river, Spring flowers. I used to bring my kids to the grave and then one cold winter night I thought why am I bringing them here? After that I just worked on making our home garden nice for her instead. The graveyard is just a symbol. Your child is everywhere now.

Mean Laqueefa · 21-11-2019 2:03am

cullieh wrote: »

It is possible that kids from a relatively close estate are going in there. Not sure why they would, unless of course to steal toys, as that have a huge green to play on. Also what do the parent say/do when they see the kids with the said toys... presuming it is the Kids of course

Im sorry for your loss and the hardship you are going through

I live 5mins from glasnevin graveyard, grew up closer than that, and it pains me to say, when younger with friends with dossed about in there, drinking and what not but never damaged a thing, ive always found it peaceful.

I rarely walk by the Angles plots for children, i find it too difficult but know everywhere else like the back of my hand, it would not be uncommon for teenagers being dickheads to ruin a touching tribute to ones lost children and its a shame.

I can only speak of Glasnevin mind, but i dont think it would be legal to place cameras or trail cams on the trusts property tho, but i may be wrong.

I would seek out the maintenance dept and diggers etc and ask politely if they have seen anything to give you some guidance, also the flower stalls near the museum and opposite the old esso garage.

Thats was hard to write and even harder to read your story, i hope you are ok

Raconteuse · 21-11-2019 2:03am

riffmongous wrote: »

At a funeral? Kids will be running around unsupervised

I truly hope it's as innocent as that, but... and even though I firmly believe most people are good... the tiny minority have no limits to the depths they'd stoop to.

Raconteuse · 21-11-2019 2:05am

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

Why does it have to be toys you put on the grave? Maybe you might be better getting something tasteful and more weather resistant for the grave instead? Cheap toys look like sh*t in no time at all, especially this time of year.

Is this really the way to speak to the grieving parent of a deceased baby?

riffmongous · 21-11-2019 2:06am

Raconteuse wrote: »

I truly hope it's as innocent as that, but... and even though I firmly most people are good... the tiny minority have no limits to the depths they'd stoop to.

But to do it repeatedly? If it's someone doing it on purpose they must have serious mental issues. If you want to steal stuff then take everything.. it's not vandalism.. it's so specific it's just seems unlikely to be done maliciously.

Gringo180 · 21-11-2019 2:08am

So sorry for your loss OP. Godbles to you and your family, I cannot fathom losing a child

riffmongous · 21-11-2019 2:08am

Raconteuse wrote: »

Is this really the way to speak to the grieving parent of a deceased baby?

Just ignore the troll

Mean Laqueefa · 21-11-2019 2:11am

riffmongous wrote: »

But to do it repeatedly? If it's someone doing it on purpose they must have serious mental issues. If you want to steal stuff then take everything.. it's not vandalism.. it's so specific it's just seems unlikely to be done maliciously.

On the way to glasnevin graveyard from tolka bridge upto the circle k garage at each predestrion crossing for the last 2 week there was a family placing pictures on the lamposts of there lost dog, ive watched the same group repeatly rip the lost dog signs down for nothing elese than banter it seemed. i was seriously close to punching a teenager when i saw them do it

riffmongous · 21-11-2019 2:19am

Mean Laqueefa wrote: »

On the way to glasnevin graveyard from tolka bridge upto the circle k garage at each predestrion crossing for the last 2 week there was a family placing pictures on the lamposts of there lost dog, ive watched the same group repeatly rip the lost dog signs down for nothing elese than banter it seemed. i was seriously close to punching a teenager when i saw them do it

Yeah I'd consider that under 'vandalism' though, if the graves were wrecked I could unfortunately believe it.. but this case is just stealing a few items

Mean Laqueefa · 21-11-2019 2:24am

riffmongous wrote: »

Yeah I'd consider that under 'vandalism' though, if the graves were wrecked I could unfortunately believe it.. but this case is just stealing a few items

The grave was wrecked tho, the family tend to the grave of the deceased. The family placed tributes on the grave to seek something, anyone who ****s with that is vandilism in my eyes atleast.

And its not just a few stolen items in this case as you can imagine, its heartfelt tributes i cant even imagine seeing that done to a grave of a family member.

Im not trying to be hard i understand your point, but put yourself in OP's shoes.

Strumms · 21-11-2019 2:34am

riffmongous wrote: »

Yeah I'd consider that under 'vandalism' though, if the graves were wrecked I could unfortunately believe it.. but this case is just stealing a few items

Just stealing a few items, wow... ridiculous comment. Stealing from the grave of a recently deceased child. ‘Just a few items’ which clearly meant a lot to the parents who placed them there and the child. Wow,

Vita nova · 21-11-2019 3:24am

cullieh wrote: »

Hi People. In the last couple of months items ( toys that her cousins gave her) have been going missing from my baby’s resting place. On the first occasion 3 action hero figures went missing, These were replace with 5 new figures all similar to what were taken. These 5 figures have now been removed. My wife and I are dismayed as to how anybody could do this, let alone to Baby. — I guess my reason for posting here is.. Can anyone recommend a camera or anything at all that I could get to film what is going on. I would need something with a long life as unfortunately we cannot be there all the time to see who is doing this.

Many thanks In Advance,

A Distraught Parent.

I can totally understand why you want to catch the thieves and there have been some useful suggestions on how to go about it.

In the meantime, if you haven't already done it, is it worth leaving a heartfelt note, perhaps with a photo, asking the would-be thieves to please not take your baby's toys. It's a long shot but you never know.

Gynoid · 21-11-2019 6:32am

So very sorry for your loss.

This may be a bit of an odd suggestion but could you put a heavy, weatherproof yet smallish toy chest on the plot, maybe even get one specially made of metal or some heavy material. And put the gifts in there while you are away, and lock it. And take them out when you visit. Maybe even have bolts on the chest attaching it to kerb stones or something. The toy chest could be decorated a bit so it does not look merely functional but is lovely also.

Graces7 · 21-11-2019 9:35am

Deleted User wrote: »

Yes. I appreciate your honesty and can understand some of your pain my friend. I have a child buried too. Please try to appreciate that your child is not there in that hole in the ground. If he/she is anywhere it is in nature, in the sunset and the cherry blossom, the Autumn leaves, Winter river, Spring flowers. I used to bring my kids to the grave and then one cold winter night I thought why am I bringing them here? After that I just worked on making our home garden nice for her instead. The graveyard is just a symbol. Your child is everywhere now.

I met a lady who had lost her baby at a year old. The grave was a shrine, a place of pilgrimage where she could mourn and be with her grief and give her little one gifts and flowers. It was beautiful and the last place she had seen her baby. Toys year by year. I used to visit too

It is to her, even ten years on, far far more than a symbol. Else no one would put flowers on a grave and they do.

Jb1989 · 21-11-2019 9:49am

Strumms wrote: »

I don’t think there is a hell of a lot you can do. Leaving a camera around... well if toys go missing so can a camera even if hidden to a degree. Also if the staff of the cemetery find it they’ll just take it. I doubt they’d be happy about an unapproved recording device in a sensitive location like a cemetery. Have you thought about getting toys mounted in a glass display that could somehow be affixed to the grave ? Even if it was kids they’d be with parents so it shouldn’t have happened.

A few years ago the expensive stone flower vase/pot went missing from my sisters grave and before that flowers went missing from the vase itself. We found it on a grave directly behind but two rows away... it was an expensive stone one and heavy so it couldn’t just have been blown away and put on the wrong grave by accident...

Unfortunately if you are a horrible robbing cûnt the location of your evil endeavors doesn’t matter so much... it’s want it...take it...it’s ingrained in certain mindsets.

Agreed with this, try glueing the toys of putting them in some cage type thing, anything to make it a bulky item, and always try and sign your initials on all item, in case of mistaken movements

Sorry about that · 21-11-2019 10:00am

I was going to suggest something very similar to Gynoid's idea. Could you possibly get some type of (lockable) decorative metal container, custom made, and have it bolted to some part of the surrounds of the grave. That way, the little toys can be there all the time. When you and your family visit, the toys can be taken out and put back again when you leave.

I can't imagine the pain of losing your little girl, but to have her mementos stolen from over her is almost impossible to believe; I hope you find something that works.

Theft of Items from our Baby’s Grave

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