Is there really that many working from home?

dinorebel · 22-10-2020 12:00am

I work for an IT company in the NW that has approx 1500 employees on average 30/40 are in the office each day the rest WFH. Before Covid it would of been a ratio of maybe 7/10 in the office daily.

25-10-2020 1:12pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I bring lunch into work, so I'm paying the same for lunch either way. I commute on the bike, so I'm not saving any money.

I've had to provide furniture, space, and now heating - all excess and no saving.

Then you will have plenty of money saved away from the years of no commuting costs to tide you over for the cost of furniture, space and heating.

AndrewJRenko · 25-10-2020 10:50pm

salonfire wrote: »

Then you will have plenty of money saved away from the years of no commuting costs to tide you over for the cost of furniture, space and heating.

My previous frugality doesn't create an entitlement for me, or any employee, to subsidise the costs of their employer. But presuming that I don't have savings, and indeed, that I have debts, where does that leave the obligations of the employer to provide a safe working environment?

3d4life · 25-10-2020 11:11pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

.....where does that leave the obligations of the employer to provide a safe working environment?

Thats for you to sort out with your employer

25-10-2020 11:50pm

If you're at home, working or not it's YOUR responsibility to have a safe living (& working) environment.
If the carpet is a trip hazard, or the electrics are dodgy as the owner occupier it is your responsibility to ensure they are safe, rented property it's the landlord.

AndrewJRenko · 26-10-2020 1:14am

Deleted User wrote: »

If you're at home, working or not it's YOUR responsibility to have a safe living (& working) environment.
If the carpet is a trip hazard, or the electrics are dodgy as the owner occupier it is your responsibility to ensure they are safe, rented property it's the landlord.

And if you don't have a proper desk, or a proper chair, or proper screen or two necessary to work safely (without causing a back or neck injury), who's responsibility is that?

AndrewJRenko · 26-10-2020 1:14am

3d4life wrote: »

Thats for you to sort out with your employer

The Safety Health and Welfare at Work Act disagrees with you.

26-10-2020 1:29am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

And if you don't have a proper desk, or a proper chair, or proper screen or two necessary to work safely (without causing a back or neck injury), who's responsibility is that?

Many companies are allowing staff to take their desk docking stations,monitors & peripherals home to use, as for desks & chairs that's your responsibility.
Some companies may help there but most people have some sort of provision at home, those who don't should rent local office space (payable by the employer if WFH is impossible) or simply go to the office.
I have two office desks that I paid €5 each as they were surplus at a former emploter.

AndrewJRenko · 26-10-2020 2:02am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Many companies are allowing staff to take their desk docking stations,monitors & peripherals home to use, as for desks & chairs that's your responsibility.
Some companies may help there but most people have some sort of provision at home, those who don't should rent local office space (payable by the employer if WFH is impossible) or simply go to the office.
I have two office desks that I paid €5 each as they were surplus at a former emploter.

And many aren't providing equipment, or funds to buy equipment.

And they're not paying for renting of office space.

And they're not allowing staff to go into the office.

26-10-2020 10:08am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

And many aren't providing equipment, or funds to buy equipment.

And they're not paying for renting of office space.

And they're not allowing staff to go into the office.

and how do you plan to resolve these issues?

a_squirrelman · 26-10-2020 10:12am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

And many aren't providing equipment, or funds to buy equipment.

And they're not paying for renting of office space.

And they're not allowing staff to go into the office.

What are you looking for? Ask your boss for some allowance if you like, but you're not entitled to anything.

AndrewJRenko · 26-10-2020 10:20am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

and how do you plan to resolve these issues?

How do you plan to resolve the pandemic?

It's not my issue to resolve.

26-10-2020 10:23am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

How do you plan to resolve the pandemic?

It's not my issue to resolve.

We're looking for solutions not more problems, the vast majority of people who are WFH have worked something out.

Blazer · 26-10-2020 10:33am

how the hell is WFH costing people more.
I'm running a high powered laptop, dock, speakers, 2 x 34" inch monitors and while my esb bits are a bit higher I'm actually up from not using the car plus I gain back about 5 hours a week from not travelling to work.
Also all employers should be providing laptops /monitors etc for people to work from home. Its common sense ffs.

magicbastarder · 26-10-2020 10:49am

salonfire wrote: »

Then you will have plenty of money saved away from the years of no commuting costs to tide you over for the cost of furniture, space and heating.

surely this is a reflection more on how much it costs to drive to work than it is on how cheap it is to cycle?

anyway, whether this should be a factor in how your employer treats you is moot. my sister's workplace is less than five minutes walk from her home, but if we start factoring in whether she saves on getting to work or not would mean kinda arbitrarily treating employees differently, based on what their commute had been previously.

one benefit working from home will have is that there are certain to be people for whom it's a relief, if they're being bullied in the workplace.

that said, i know a couple of people who live on their own who are finding it difficult as they've lost a major outlet for social interaction (but this obviously is more than just the workplace)

magicbastarder · 26-10-2020 10:52am

Blazer wrote: »

how the hell is WFH costing people more.

as above; it depends on circumstances. i know people who were able to get to the office essentially for free, and during the winter working from home, their heating bills will be going up.

AndrewJRenko · 26-10-2020 10:59am

Blazer wrote: »

how the hell is WFH costing people more.
I'm running a high powered laptop, dock, speakers, 2 x 34" inch monitors and while my esb bits are a bit higher I'm actually up from not using the car plus I gain back about 5 hours a week from not travelling to work.
Also all employers should be providing laptops /monitors etc for people to work from home. Its common sense ffs.

Because not everyone runs a car for travelling to work.

combat14 · 26-10-2020 11:33am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Because not everyone runs a car for travelling to work.

additional home heating usage will also be significant during the winter

Jimson · 26-10-2020 12:54pm

I think some people just hate working and will find any excuse to give out about it.

Oh no, I have to buy a desk and put on an extra bit of heat. My self importance is so high.

Locotastic · 26-10-2020 2:49pm

Blazer wrote: »

how the hell is WFH costing people more.
I'm running a high powered laptop, dock, speakers, 2 x 34" inch monitors and while my esb bits are a bit higher I'm actually up from not using the car plus I gain back about 5 hours a week from not travelling to work.
Also all employers should be providing laptops /monitors etc for people to work from home. Its common sense ffs.

Yeah I don't understand the issue.

Have my own desk and chair at home and I've even offered to supply all my own equipment, laptop, printer, phone etc and still they don't advocate WFH so I'm not allowed.

I'm more productive at home too and can avoid people unnecessarily dropping by my desk with insignificant queries, like phone and email is there we don't need a face to face (and therefore putting us both in close contact status).

I would just be happy to be allowed to WFH, if I was I wouldn't be complaining about my heating bill for starters.

AndrewJRenko · 26-10-2020 6:37pm

Locotastic wrote: »

Yeah I don't understand the issue.

Have my own desk and chair at home and I've even offered to supply all my own equipment, laptop, printer, phone etc and still they don't advocate WFH so I'm not allowed.

I'm more productive at home too and can avoid people unnecessarily dropping by my desk with insignificant queries, like phone and email is there we don't need a face to face (and therefore putting us both in close contact status).

I would just be happy to be allowed to WFH, if I was I wouldn't be complaining about my heating bill for starters.

How hard is it to understand that not everyone has;

1) the space
2) the funds to provide furniture, equipment and heating.

I realise that I'm in the minority here, but that doesn't mean that HR departments should be ignoring the needs of that minority.

magicbastarder · 26-10-2020 6:50pm

Locotastic wrote: »

Yeah I don't understand the issue.

that's to be expected though, as your approach to this issue seems focussed around your own circumstances.
i'm very happy it's working out for you. as AJR points out, there are people who may not be able to adjust as easily.

ArmaniJeanss · 26-10-2020 7:10pm

Blazer wrote: »

how the hell is WFH costing people more?

Tea, coffee, milk, sugar are probably all provided free in the office. Now you have to provide your own. Bottled/filtered water also.

Heating costs.

Telephone use. You could use that phone on your desk in the office to do all your calls including personal ones. Now you have to do them all on your mobile and your employer is only reimbursing for the business ones.

General wear and tear. That carpet where you sit for 8 hours a day is now worn out because of use that was never expected. You've chipped or broken more cups, plates and glasses at home this year than you did in the previous decade.

Dishwasher is now going on every day because of all the extra breakfast/lunch crockery you use.

Locotastic · 26-10-2020 9:41pm

magicbastarder wrote: »

that's to be expected though, as your approach to this issue seems focussed around your own circumstances.
i'm very happy it's working out for you. as AJR points out, there are people who may not be able to adjust as easily.

It's not working out for me at all as my employer doesn't 'do' WFH. I'm in the workplace premises all day, we're not allowed to WFH (even though it's very much a job that can be done from home).

26-10-2020 9:43pm

Locotastic wrote: »

It's not working out for me at all as my employer doesn't 'do' WFH. I'm in the workplace premises all day, we're not allowed to WFH (even though it's very much a job that can be done from home).

There are still too many employers who haven't got the message that staff CAN be trusted to WFH, or are there excessive sensitivity issues?

Jimson · 27-10-2020 1:01am

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Tea, coffee, milk, sugar are probably all provided free in the office. Now you have to provide your own. Bottled/filtered water also.

Heating costs.

Telephone use. You could use that phone on your desk in the office to do all your calls including personal ones. Now you have to do them all on your mobile and your employer is only reimbursing for the business ones.

General wear and tear. That carpet where you sit for 8 hours a day is now worn out because of use that was never expected. You've chipped or broken more cups, plates and glasses at home this year than you did in the previous decade.

Dishwasher is now going on every day because of all the extra breakfast/lunch crockery you use.

Is this a piss take?

The dishwasher and carpet ah ffs.

Hand wash the dishes and put a rug or mat where your working.

With regards the phone just use a soft phone like viber Skype etc. with call packages which are dirt cheap but your employer should really be providing this.

The only thing I can really see challenging for people is space and might not be great for mental health working out of a box room.

AndrewJRenko · 27-10-2020 1:19am

Jimson wrote: »

The only thing I can really see challenging for people is space and might not be great for mental health working out of a box room.

Can you see that it might not be great for physical health working out of a box room hunched over a laptop on a dressing table on a stool with no heating going?

GoneHome · 27-10-2020 1:25am

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

Tea, coffee, milk, sugar are probably all provided free in the office. Now you have to provide your own. Bottled/filtered water also.

Heating costs.

Telephone use. You could use that phone on your desk in the office to do all your calls including personal ones. Now you have to do them all on your mobile and your employer is only reimbursing for the business ones.

General wear and tear. That carpet where you sit for 8 hours a day is now worn out because of use that was never expected. You've chipped or broken more cups, plates and glasses at home this year than you did in the previous decade.

Dishwasher is now going on every day because of all the extra breakfast/lunch crockery you use.

OMG so what would all of that add up to in the week, maybe €10 - €20. in comparison to what it would cost you in diesel/petrol/bus/dart whatever, some people are never happy

kirving · 27-10-2020 1:28am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Can you see that it might not be great for physical health working out of a box room hunched over a laptop on a dressing table on a stool with no heating going?

My desk, chair, monitor and laptop dock which I have in the office easily cost over €2k. Small money to a company who need to provide an ergonomic work space.

At home, I'm on the kitchen table on a small laptop screen.

Half my day at home is usually calls, and I do some work on paper because it suits me, so it's not like I'm staring at the small screen for 8 hours solid, but that would be a problem if I was.

Atlantic Dawn · 27-10-2020 1:33am

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Half my day at home is usually calls, and I do some work on paper because it suits me, so it's not like I'm staring at the small screen for 8 hours solid, but that would be a problem if I was.

I'm worried my eyes will be permanently banjaxed working on the laptop for a year or so, I had 2 monitors in work which were each so much more easier to be productive on and far less eye strain.

GoneHome · 27-10-2020 1:36am

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

I'm worried my eyes will be permanently banjaxed working on the laptop for a year or so, I had 2 monitors in work which were each so much more easier to be productive on and far less eye strain.

There are no words..................

AndrewJRenko · 27-10-2020 1:38am

Kevin Irving wrote: »

My desk, chair, monitor and laptop dock which I have in the office easily cost over €2k. Small money to a company who need to provide an ergonomic work space.

At home, I'm on the kitchen table on a small laptop screen.

Half my day at home is usually calls, and I do some work on paper because it suits me, so it's not like I'm staring at the small screen for 8 hours solid, but that would be a problem if I was.

Are you saying that because you're prepared to jeopardize your eyesight and your spine, everyone else should do the same?

AndrewJRenko · 27-10-2020 1:39am

GoneHome wrote: »

OMG so what would all of that add up to in the week, maybe €10 - €20. in comparison to what it would cost you in diesel/petrol/bus/dart whatever, some people are never happy

Some people didn't have diesel/petrol/bus/dart costs in the first place.

GoneHome · 27-10-2020 1:41am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Some people didn't have diesel/petrol/bus/dart costs in the first place.

But sure that totally negates your point so :rolleyes:

Jimson · 27-10-2020 2:02am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Can you see that it might not be great for physical health working out of a box room hunched over a laptop on a dressing table on a stool with no heating going?

Well rent an office space then or move. An oil heater can easily be got for 40 quid as well.

Look if your company decides to permantly have people work from home your going to have to adjust or find a new job and stop cribbing about it.

Just because your frugal or don't have the space don't make it everyone else's problem.

At least anyway companies should be providing two monitors , docking Station and a 200 euro expense for a desk

Jimson · 27-10-2020 2:05am

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

I'm worried my eyes will be permanently banjaxed working on the laptop for a year or so, I had 2 monitors in work which were each so much more easier to be productive on and far less eye strain.

Surely your employer will let you take home the ones from your office or let you expense new ones back?

AndrewJRenko · 27-10-2020 11:10am

GoneHome wrote: »

But sure that totally negates your point so :rolleyes:

Why?

Jimson wrote: »

Well rent an office space then or move. An oil heater can easily be got for 40 quid as well.

Look if your company decides to permantly have people work from home your going to have to adjust or find a new job and stop cribbing about it.

Just because your frugal or don't have the space don't make it everyone else's problem.

At least anyway companies should be providing two monitors , docking Station and a 200 euro expense for a desk

OK, so where do I get office space that will enable social distance at reasonable cost, and who's going to pay the cost? Because my employer sure as hell won't?

Or move? Your solution to those stuck in Dublin rental hell where it is very difficult to find decent accommodation is that they should move to more expensive, bigger accommodation, just because their employer can't be arsed to provide a safe working environment as they are required to do by law?

"Let them eat cake" springs to mind.

Employers can't just 'decide' to push everyone into a WFH situation. That is a fundamental change to employment conditions, and by law, is required to be negotiated and agreed.

27-10-2020 11:17am

Jimson wrote: »

Surely your employer will let you take home the ones from your office or let you expense new ones back?

I occasionally go to the office as some work is impossible to from home and it is clear that many of the staff have taken home their required IT, docking stations, monitors etc

Almost all those who are WFH have now made suitable arrangements to their home environments to make WFH practical and viable for them.

Any additional costs are usually cancelled out by almost zero commuting expenses, so there are very few who are financially worse off by WFH.

Jimson · 27-10-2020 11:17am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why?

OK, so where do I get office space that will enable social distance at reasonable cost, and who's going to pay the cost? Because my employer sure as hell won't?

Or move? Your solution to those stuck in Dublin rental hell where it is very difficult to find decent accommodation is that they should move to more expensive, bigger accommodation, just because their employer can't be arsed to provide a safe working environment as they are required to do by law?

"Let them eat cake" springs to mind.

Just face facts, if your company decides that they want you to work from home permantly suck it up or move jobs where they want you in the office or move accomadation.

Its simple really. Move out of Dublin either if you can't afford it. Get a massive room outside of Dublin for 350 euro a month in most parts of Ireland.

That would save you a fortune.

I think even if you had a massive bedroom and desk and monitors given by your employer you would still be giving out about having to pay for heat.

27-10-2020 11:23am

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Employers can't just 'decide' to push everyone into a WFH situation. That is a fundamental change to employment conditions, and by law, is required to be negotiated and agreed.

I think that you'll find that many employers will find it harder to get staff back working the 5 x 40 hours office presentism than it was to push them into working from home.
Many will question why they have to travel a long distance to do exactly the same thing in the company office that they can do from their personal home office.

Where I work, the head office management want staff to do at least one day a week in the office, many are happy to go back as they have poor home office facilities, but equally there are many who are resisting this move as it involves the commuting hell they have avoided over the past few months.

kirving · 27-10-2020 1:00pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Are you saying that because you're prepared to jeopardize your eyesight and your spine, everyone else should do the same?

Not in the slightest. I'm lucky in the sense that even when I am working from home, the type of work means I'm not tied to a screen - I know many that are though.

IMO it's completely unacceptable for companies to expect employees to suddenly be OK with with a comparatively tiny screen and often hard chair.

Additional costs are fine if you have a steady job and own your own home where you can invest in home office space, or even extend the house if needs be - but that just isn't an option for anyone in rented accommodation, particularly apartments which were already small to begin with, but the decision to live there justified by people who thought they'd be in the office all day.

Lux23 · 27-10-2020 1:02pm

I think a lot of employers have ignored the recent recommendations; I know a good few people that are back in their poorly ventilated offices with reason to be there!

27-10-2020 1:17pm

At the start of Lockdown I bought a desk, chair and plastic mat for under the chair, fullsize keyboard and a docking dongle. Cost about 650 Euro total. I already had a monitor.

This has been paid back by:

7 months when I didn't have to buy a Luas ticket so 700 euro.
While I often brought my lunch with me I also regularly went to the canteen, even 2 days a week in the canteen is 10 a week saved. 28 weeks x 10 is 280 euro saving.
No change in the usage of my mobile or broadband.
Huge reduction in daily snacks that I probably bought and ate out of boredom or time constraints rather than need.
The 3.20 per day work from home allowance - about 450 euro so far.

So I've saved over a 1500. Finally bit the bullet and now have a proper desk/workstation for work, study and projects, so 850+ saving.

Add in things like not going for a pint on the way home from work or buying something in the shop on the way home that I didn't really need and its maybe closer to over 1000 euro saving total.

bk · 27-10-2020 1:35pm

Kevin Irving wrote: »

IMO it's completely unacceptable for companies to expect employees to suddenly be OK with with a comparatively tiny screen and often hard chair.

Most decent employers are allowing their employees to take their office chair, monitors and other equipment home from the office and some are even paying for extra gear if needed.

Kevin Irving wrote: »

particularly apartments which were already small to begin with, but the decision to live there justified by people who thought they'd be in the office all day.

"justified", you mean forced by the decision to either live close to the office or have a terrible long commute.

Such people will now end up with having the option to live elsewhere if they prefer, in places with more space if they like. All of this gives people more options, not less.

I've got 3 friends all in such circumstances, who have in the past few months have taken this opportunity to move out of Dublin to places closer to their family, with far more room and saving money. They are loving this and want it to continue.

Plus I don't really buy this "I don't have space for a proper desk" stuff, I've lived and rented all over Dublin the past 20 years and even when in a small box room or small apartment, I always still had space for at least a small desk. Check out concepts around flexible and modular living.

In the end, after Covid19, I suspect it will all settle down to a more hybrid office model. There will still be some offices, but overall far less office space, just enough for drop in and for the staff who really want to work out of an office. The majority will work either partly or fully remotely.

This is how it has been at my company for many years already. Choice is good, it gives people the flexibility to work how and from where it suits them.

AndrewJRenko · 27-10-2020 1:45pm

bk wrote: »

Plus I don't really buy this "I don't have space for a proper desk" stuff, I've lived and rented all over Dublin the past 20 years and even when in a small box room or small apartment, I always still had space for at least a small desk. Check out concepts around flexible and modular living.

I am very familiar with box rooms that have space for a bed, a built-in dressing table, and no other furniture on the ground.

bk wrote: »

This is how it has been at my company for many years already. Choice is good, it gives people the flexibility to work how and from where it suits them.

Choice needs to include the choice to work in an office provided by the employer as before, for those for whom WFH doesn't suit.

Deleted User wrote: »

I think that you'll find that many employers will find it harder to get staff back working the 5 x 40 hours office presentism than it was to push them into working from home.
Many will question why they have to travel a long distance to do exactly the same thing in the company office that they can do from their personal home office.

Where I work, the head office management want staff to do at least one day a week in the office, many are happy to go back as they have poor home office facilities, but equally there are many who are resisting this move as it involves the commuting hell they have avoided over the past few months.

Don't disagree with you that this is the majority situation - but WFH doesn't work for everyone.

Jimson wrote: »

Just face facts, if your company decides that they want you to work from home permantly suck it up or move jobs where they want you in the office or move accomadation.

Its simple really. Move out of Dublin either if you can't afford it. Get a massive room outside of Dublin for 350 euro a month in most parts of Ireland.

That would save you a fortune.

Just face legal facts - employers don't get to 'decide' to take space rent-free from their employees. That is a fundamental change to working conditions and needs to be negotiated.

Jimson wrote: »

I think even if you had a massive bedroom and desk and monitors given by your employer you would still be giving out about having to pay for heat.

Yes, I would still be giving out about having to pay for heat. It's not up to me to subsidise my employer's costs.

bk · 27-10-2020 2:08pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I am very familiar with box rooms that have space for a bed, a built-in dressing table, and no other furniture on the ground.

This is just another example of ways things will have to change for changing circumstances.

I'm increasingly seeing landlords making changes to respond to the new reality and demands of renters. Such useless dressing tables being replaced by desks, etc.

These sort of changes were happening anyway, sure they are being forced on more people faster then would otherwise have happened, but that is just reality of being faced by a global pandemic.

Pandemics in the past have always caused sudden massive social and environmental change. The Plague caused the death of a third of the population of Europe, which amongst many other changes, lead to the fall of Feudalism and surving workers ended up with much better pay and working conditions. Diseases like yellow fever and cholera caused massive changes to how cities are built, how people are housed and hygiene. Fresh water, garbage collection, street cleaning, indoor plumbing, sewage systems all developed as a response to those and shaped our cities as we know them today.

It really shouldn't be surprising that Covid19 will cause lasting social changes too.

Some people will do better, some will do worse and perhaps some conservative minded people would be better off if they accepted that this is the new reality and find ways to work with it for their benefit, rather then pinning for the old ways.

HerrKuehn · 27-10-2020 2:09pm

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I am very familiar with box rooms that have space for a bed, a built-in dressing table, and no other furniture on the ground.

Choice needs to include the choice to work in an office provided by the employer as before, for those for whom WFH doesn't suit.

Don't disagree with you that this is the majority situation - but WFH doesn't work for everyone.

Just face legal facts - employers don't get to 'decide' to take space rent-free from their employees. That is a fundamental change to working conditions and needs to be negotiated.

Yes, I would still be giving out about having to pay for heat. It's not up to me to subsidise my employer's costs.

This is a great example of why it would be silly to continue with WFH with the public sector when this is over.

27-10-2020 2:23pm

Plus I don't really buy this "I don't have space for a proper desk" stuff, I've lived and rented all over Dublin the past 20 years and even when in a small box room or small apartment, I always still had space for at least a small desk

I have been lamenting my lack of space for a desk for years. When I finally acknowledged it was a neccessity I re-organised my living room and managed to fit one in. Wish I had done it years ago.

kirving · 27-10-2020 3:05pm

bk wrote: »

Most decent employers are allowing their employees to take their office chair, monitors and other equipment home from the office and some are even paying for extra gear if needed.

The official line in my own place is that it's not allowed, but people are really being encouraged, as opposed to being told to work from home. I believe some higher-risk employees are being accommodated.

bk wrote: »

"justified", you mean forced by the decision to either live close to the office or have a terrible long commute.

Exactly. I know plenty of people who live in a small house for the above reasons.

bk wrote: »

Such people will now end up with having the option to live elsewhere if they prefer, in places with more space if they like. All of this gives people more options, not less.

True, but only within the bounds of their current lease, available accommodation elsewhere, public transport and amenities.

bk wrote: »

Plus I don't really buy this "I don't have space for a proper desk" stuff, I've lived and rented all over Dublin the past 20 years and even when in a small box room or small apartment, I always still had space for at least a small desk. Check out concepts around flexible and modular living.

It depends on your circumstance of course, but add 3 housemates on conference calls to the mix, and you're resigned to a box room for the day. It's effectively a prison for many people, and I completely understand why some people have issue with being sold the "freedom and flexibility" that's often brought up when WFH is discussed.

Myself, I have very few of those issues, but plenty of people close to me do, so I understand their point.

magicbastarder · 27-10-2020 3:14pm

Kevin Irving wrote: »

The official line in my own place is that it's not allowed, but people are really being encouraged, as opposed to being told to work from home.

i have heard stories from before lockdown where employers were doing this. trying to 'encourage' staff to work from home without being explicit about it; so if the employee did work from home, that was their decision so the employer was not responsible for their working environment.
a 'hey, we provide a fully safe working environment in the office, but that employee chose to work from home' response.

Is there really that many working from home?

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