Shops to hide alcohol from view

snubbleste · 17-11-2016 9:17am #1

First the cigarettes, now the alcohol.

Senators and TDs hit out at proposals which would require shops to put up barriers to shield alcohol from public view.
One of the most controversial elements of the Public Health (Alcohol) Bill 2015, requires stores to block off alcohol so it cannot be seen.
Fine Gael senators had claimed the proposals, including curtains/screens or “beer caves” — refrigerated, sectioned-off areas, would put additional financial and staffing pressure on small shops.
http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/marcella-corcoran-kennedy-under-fire-on-plans-to-change-the-sale-advertisement-and-price-of-alcohol-427706.html

Objections from FineGael - the law and order party..

Your Face · 17-11-2016 9:22am

Whatevs.

Poor Uncle Tom · 17-11-2016 9:22am

Nothing wrong with any of that, imo, all common sense really.

The flying mouse · 17-11-2016 9:24am

That should work, Once people can't see there favourite beers n wines they will all stop drinking and we will all live happily ever after. Amen.

SEPT 23 1989 · 17-11-2016 9:25am

Curtains create mystery

durtybit · 17-11-2016 9:28am

Mineral lanes are next, before you know it the whole shop will have exterior curtains

The flying mouse · 17-11-2016 9:28am

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Nothing wrong with any of that, imo, all common sense really.

Really ? Sure next they be covering in pubs . If there really concerned about alcoholic abuse in this country they will start with it in the schools at a young age in trying n show the harm it can do if abused, and take some of the glamour away from it.

James Bond Junior · 17-11-2016 9:29am

This is why people like trump and possibly Le Pen are elected and why we had Brexit. Leave us the funk alone to live our lives. Most people don't get an urge to buy 6 bottles of wine and a case of vodka when they nip to the shop for a packet or rolos. Nanny state nonsense!!!!!

who the fug · 17-11-2016 9:32am

The flying mouse wrote: »

That should work, Once people can't see there favourite beers n wines they will all stop drinking and we will all live happily ever after. Amen.

These Politicians are such clever people , they deserve a pay rise

VinLieger · 17-11-2016 9:32am

The reasoning "restrict visibility so that children and young people will not be attracted to alcohol"

Shes a fvcking retard thinking a mystery curtain will remove children curiosity about alcohol

Poor Uncle Tom · 17-11-2016 9:32am

The flying mouse wrote: »

Really ? Sure next they be covering in pubs . If there really concerned about alcoholic abuse in this country they will start with it in the schools at a young age in trying n show the harm it can do if abused, and take some of the glamour away from it.

No reason why these are mutually exclusive, both are actually good ideas, no reason not to do both and more besides.

who the fug · 17-11-2016 9:32am

James Bond Junior wrote: »

This is why people like trump and possibly Le Pen are elected and why we had Brexit. Leave us the funk alone to live our lives. Most people don't get an urge to buy 6 bottles of wine and a case of vodka when they nip to the shop for a packet or rolos. Nanny state nonsense!!!!!

You had to go there

snubbleste · 17-11-2016 9:33am

VinLieger wrote: »

The reasoning "restrict visibility so that children and young people will not be attracted to alcohol"
Shes a fvcking retard thinking a mystery curtain will remove children curiosity about alcohol

You could argue that it is working with tobacco

VinLieger · 17-11-2016 9:40am

snubbleste wrote: »

You could argue that it is working with tobacco

Tobacco is in a restricted place in the shops already I do not believe that the hiding it behind a door behind the counter that has labels of all the tobacco producers on it has any effect and it is far more likely to do with education and changing of opinions as well as the no smoking in doors.

Imagine you were a child of say 10-12 and went into a shop, there's a curtain all the adults are allowed go through but for some arbitrary reason to do with age you arent. Tell me what happens does your curiosity and need to go into this special room and do what all the lucky adults are doing decrease or increase?

Now your suddenly 15-16 and youve gotten your hands on the magic elixir that your not even allowed be near in shops, what happens?

DontThankMe · 17-11-2016 9:41am

Typical solution to an Irish problem brush it under a rug or in this case hide it behind a curtain. How about we tackle the binge drinking problem in Ireland first where thousands of young people go out every week and get absolutely **** faced. Also the fact you can buy cheap alcohol only adds to the problem of binge drinking in this country, but hey the solution to these problems is the hide the alcohol behind a curtain.

whiskeyman · 17-11-2016 9:43am

It seems like its curtains for the off trade industry

VinLieger · 17-11-2016 9:43am

DontThankMe wrote: »

Typical solution to an Irish problem brush it under a rug or in this case hide it behind a curtain. How about we tackle the binge drinking problem in Ireland first where thousands of young people go out every week and get absolutely **** faced. Also the fact you can buy cheap alcohol only adds to the problem of binge drinking in this country, but hey the solution to these problems is the hide the alcohol behind a curtain.

Binge drinking is actually decreasing year on year since 2012, the public health alcohol bill is a bail out for publicans lobbied HEAVILY for by the VFI

Cookie_Monster · 17-11-2016 9:46am

DontThankMe wrote: »

Typical solution to an Irish problem brush it under a rug or in this case hide it behind a curtain. How about we tackle the binge drinking problem in Ireland first where thousands of young people go out every week and get absolutely **** faced. Also the fact you can buy cheap alcohol only adds to the problem of binge drinking in this country, but hey the solution to these problems is the hide the alcohol behind a curtain.

You can buy cheap booze, where?

kildare lad · 17-11-2016 9:46am

i'd be more concerned about children consuming large energy drinks and eating all the cheap priced chocolate, that i seen them doing on their school breaks.that , than have them seeing alcohol in a shop, while i dont drink myself i do bring my son to the pub for food once a week. will that be outlawed next?? drugs are hidden from view and yet they're freely available.

CINCLANTFLT · 17-11-2016 9:48am

VinLieger wrote: »

Binge drinking is actually decreasing year on year since 2012, the public health alcohol bill is a bail out for publicans lobbied HEAVILY for by the VFI

And here we get to the core of this and other such measures... pubs trying to restrict shop sales of booze in the hope that they will go to the pub instead....

I already get annoyed that I can get a bottle of wine at 10:05pm after a long drive but I could go down to the pub and drink a couple of pints and shots before half eleven!

gramar · 17-11-2016 9:50am

Typical Irish response. Cover up the problem and it will go away.

failinis · 17-11-2016 9:51am

The flying mouse wrote: »

Really ? Sure next they be covering in pubs . If there really concerned about alcoholic abuse in this country they will start with it in the schools at a young age in trying n show the harm it can do if abused, and take some of the glamour away from it.

A lot of people drink for the damage it does. That is the appeal sometimes.

There should be far better support for mental health, might not stop people hitting the bottle but its an attempt, more than a fecking curtain.

sydthebeat · 17-11-2016 9:54am

Obviously supermarkets will just create "Santa's grotto" type facades to make the drinks isle seem like a magical mystery tour, competently rendering the spirit behind the legislation mute and probably end up doing more harm than good.

We have learnt nothing from history if we think creating a mystic around something won't garner interest in it. Its human nature to be curious of something we're told we can't have.

My own personal opinion is that alcohol sale and consumption should be as normalised as possible so that partaking isn't seen as a rebellious act or something to aspire to.

Dravokivich · 17-11-2016 9:55am

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

Nothing wrong with any of that, imo, all common sense really.

i don't see how it is. I find it quite trivial. We know it's there. Why is it being hidden? Am I a three year old who's been too naughty and not allowed to see there's cookies on the counter?

gramar · 17-11-2016 10:00am

Dravokivich wrote: »

i don't see how it is. I find it quite trivial. We know it's there. Why is it being hidden? Am I a three year old who's been too naughty and not allowed to see there's cookies on the counter?

It really is silly. One thing that makes me shake my head is when you're in a supermarket before 10.30am and the drinks aisle is cordoned off.
It looks pathetic.

durtybit · 17-11-2016 10:01am

gramar wrote: »

Typical Irish response. Cover up the problem and it will go away.

Should have had curtains for the alter boys years ago and the Church wouldn't be in this mess today

DontThankMe · 17-11-2016 10:01am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

You can buy cheap booze, where?

Most offies around me sell naggins for 5 euro and you can buy 8 cans for 10 euro.

GreenFolder2 · 17-11-2016 10:02am

James Bond Junior wrote: »

This is why people like trump and possibly Le Pen are elected and why we had Brexit. Leave us the funk alone to live our lives. Most people don't get an urge to buy 6 bottles of wine and a case of vodka when they nip to the shop for a packet or rolos. Nanny state nonsense!!!!!

The French don't do nanny state about alcohol, nobody sees any need to and actually tend to want more regulation in other areas. One of the major French complaints about the EU has been excessive deregulation - complete opposite reason to UKIP.

If you think Trump is going to remove nanny state stuff, think again. He's supported by and surrounding himself with extremely socially conservative political figures, many of whom would likely have very strict views around alcohol and anything associated with 'vice'. That would typically include alcohol - many parts of the Bible belt have extremely tough liquor laws compared to Ireland.

You can expect they'll deregulate things that protected people from market extremes while being extremely intrusive about regulation of personal lives based on notions of religious fundamentalism.

So, if you're voting Trump or Le Pen because of Irish Government attempts to curb a genuinely serious problem with binge drinking, you might want to look a bit harder at what these characters actually represent.

I'm not at all opposed to alcohol but Ireland genuinely does have a massive drinking problem and an international reputation for it.

If, as I suspect is the case, people are drinking way more spirits, we are probably going to see a sharp rise in serious liver disease and other issues. It isn't unreasonable for the government to try and prevent this.

DontThankMe · 17-11-2016 10:04am

VinLieger wrote: »

Binge drinking is actually decreasing year on year since 2012, the public health alcohol bill is a bail out for publicans lobbied HEAVILY for by the VFI

We are going in the right direction but i believe it is still a problem in this country and it will take a lot longer than 3 years to fix it. The government should be puting forward more useful solutions instead of this hiding it behind a curtain.

GreenFolder2 · 17-11-2016 10:12am

They should be trying to change the culture - the race to get locked is partially about really tight pub closing hours that are too early and the total refusal of places to serve even basic food.

They all serve no food and crank up the music so you get on with less talking and more drinking.

Trying to do something to encourage pubs to open later, tax incentives to be foodier and also pushing night clubs later but trying to incentive music focus rather than just late drinking. There's a lot could be done with tax incentives and licences that focused more on quality of venue, live music (and it should include creative DJs etc)

Seems to me there's a vested interest that just wants everyone in at 9, consume maximum number of drinks, avoid all costs like food by limiting choice to a bag of crisps, throw you out by midnight to avoid staffing costs.

You're relieved of maybe €50 and go home locked thinking that equates to a good night.

jameorahiely · 17-11-2016 10:14am

Put the sweets up in the high press too out of reach of the childer, then we nearly have a full mammy state. Wrap the darlings up in cotton wool until they're 35 at least, and strapped in the back seat of the car while we drive them to their jobs on main roads limited to 80km/ hour.

VinLieger · 17-11-2016 10:15am

DontThankMe wrote: »

We are going in the right direction but i believe it is still a problem in this country and it will take a lot longer than 3 years to fix it. The government should be puting forward more useful solutions instead of this hiding it behind a curtain.

This entire bill is a farce, we are going in the right direction and minimum unit pricing will have zero effect on that direction and will simply punish those of us who are able to drink responsibly.

The magic curtain idea may very well even stall the progress we have made

GreenFolder2 · 17-11-2016 10:18am

I'm not sure we made any progress but, we seem to be going the wrong direction on this.

Until you change the drinking culture; which is reinforced by all the tight rules, nothing is going to change.

It's all stick and no carrot.

VinLieger · 17-11-2016 10:21am

GreenFolder2 wrote: »

I'm not sure we made any progress but, we seem to be going the wrong direction on this.

Until you change the drinking culture; which is reinforced by all the tight rules, nothing is going to change.

It's all stick and no carrot.

OECD figures since 2006 show alcohol consumption falling year over year, how are we not going in the right direction when you consider price of alcohol is also cheaper? That indicates price has zero effect on consumption

There is zero evidence that minimum unit pricing will change drinking culture and this magic curtain idiocy definitely won't positively change culture either.

osarusan · 17-11-2016 10:32am

Is this not just a proposal from a junior minister that even her own party disagrees with?

Despite the misleading thread title making it sound like this is decided.

Barry Badrinath · 17-11-2016 10:36am

This is a brilliant idea.....if you are an astounding fcuktard of mega proportions.

The Vintners are obviously in the Governments ear over revenue losses.

*Rubs handys* "If we get the idiot punters to forget you can buy alcohol in the shop, they will have no choice but go to the pub...heh...heh...heh".

They are trying to create a stigma of casual alcohol buying. Now you need to slink into the peep showesque world of debauchery to get your ready mix appletini's.

Fcukers wont be happy until they have full control over everything.

Human barcodes are on the way.

Dr Crayfish · 17-11-2016 10:38am

Can you all stop voting for these retards please? Seriously wtf? Also, whatever happened to personal accounta****ingbility? I hate this country sometimes.

Cee-Jay-Cee · 17-11-2016 10:39am

Thank god for such a common sense bunch of senators...sorry I wrote that wrong what I meant to say is 'holy fcuk what a shower of cretinous **** those failed political has beens really are'.

pcuser · 17-11-2016 10:43am

No matter what they do they will never stop "Underage Drinking" Its just too much craic.

Badly Drunk Boy · 17-11-2016 10:43am

SEPT 23 1989 wrote: »

Curtains create mystery

Now I think I want even more alcohol!!!

2ygb4cmqetsjhx · 17-11-2016 10:44am

Hiding the alcohol so we cannot see it is a Chinese solution to an Irish problem.

pilly · 17-11-2016 10:45am

GreenFolder2 wrote: »

They should be trying to change the culture - the race to get locked is partially about really tight pub closing hours that are too early and the total refusal of places to serve even basic food.

They all serve no food and crank up the music so you get on with less talking and more drinking.

Trying to do something to encourage pubs to open later, tax incentives to be foodier and also pushing night clubs later but trying to incentive music focus rather than just late drinking. There's a lot could be done with tax incentives and licences that focused more on quality of venue, live music (and it should include creative DJs etc)

Seems to me there's a vested interest that just wants everyone in at 9, consume maximum number of drinks, avoid all costs like food by limiting choice to a bag of crisps, throw you out by midnight to avoid staffing costs.

You're relieved of maybe €50 and go home locked thinking that equates to a good night.

You've just reminded me of the days when you got a curry in the nightclub!! I think that was a law at the time, that they had to serve food to open late? It was probably made of crap but always tasted lovely.

That law must have been done away with.

johnnyskeleton · 17-11-2016 10:58am

Poor Uncle Tom wrote: »

No reason why these are mutually exclusive, both are actually good ideas, no reason not to do both and more besides.

The problem is that the pattern is to being in new laws whenever there is an issue because its cheaper than actually doing something.

Rise in crime? Create more new criminal offences. Then when people ask you to pay for more gardai you say "im tough on crime sure didnt i pass this new legislation?"

So while they are not inconsistent policies, in reality by passing a new law they can avoid having to spend money on the educational campaign.

durtybit · 17-11-2016 11:01am

FTP

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

So while they are not inconsistent policies, in reality by passing a new law they can avoid doing Fek all else

bodhrandude · 17-11-2016 11:58am

Would this not effectively render off licences obsolete as they rely on the visual aspect of their stock to make their sales.

VinLieger · 17-11-2016 12:05pm

bodhrandude wrote: »

Would this not effectively render off licences obsolete as they rely on the visual aspect of their stock to make their sales.

And people wonder why the VFI are so heavily lobbying for and supporting this, anyone who thinks its cus they are worried about the health of the nation is deluded or in their pocket

Cienciano · 17-11-2016 12:05pm

It's funny that the people telling us alcohol consumption is a problem are the only people in the country that have access to a bar at work.
If we're to educate people and change how we drink culturally, that change should start from the top and the Dail Bar should close. Although, all that will probably do is increase profits of the bar in the merrion hotel.
It's the usual, do as I say, not as I do.

Atlantic Dawn · 17-11-2016 12:09pm

In most European countries the local newsagents sells alcohol, no problems with drink there as it's normalised, hidding it away will cause more problems. Who comes up with these unproven experiments in blowing vast amounts of money?

Commotion Ocean · 17-11-2016 12:22pm

James Bond Junior wrote: »

This is why people like trump and possibly Le Pen are elected and why we had Brexit. Leave us the funk alone to live our lives. Most people don't get an urge to buy 6 bottles of wine and a case of vodka when they nip to the shop for a packet or rolos. Nanny state nonsense!!!!!

And Hitler ... Let's not forget about Hitler!

suicide_circus · 17-11-2016 12:32pm

VinLieger wrote: »

The reasoning "restrict visibility so that children and young people will not be attracted to alcohol"

Shes a fvcking retard thinking a mystery curtain will remove children curiosity about alcohol

Chief Wiggum: You know you're not supposed to go in there. What is your fascination with my forbidden closet of mystery?

Atlantic Dawn · 17-11-2016 12:33pm

#DontBuildAWallAroundMyAlcohol

Shops to hide alcohol from view

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