Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2018/2019 warning in OP 24/2/19

deaddonkey15 · 21-01-2019 9:32pm

I thought Rashford looked class on Saturday. Seemed so confident, almost to the point of arrogance.

Zeek12 · 21-01-2019 9:32pm

S.M.B. wrote: »

Rashford has done extremely well under Olé and has had some moments of absolute class.

I'll be interested to see how he, Olé and the fans react when he misses a few important clear cut chances or has a barren patch.

In fairness, Rashford has missed plenty of chances already this season. Some of them important.

The impressive thing is when it happens - it rarely seems to affect his confidence.
He picks himself up and keeps trying the right things.

jayo26 · 21-01-2019 9:34pm

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

I thought Rashford looked class on Saturday. Seemed so confident, almost to the point of arrogance.

He is playing with confidence buddy it's great to see.

Your Airbag · 21-01-2019 9:35pm

Ah yes, the same three posters, the upholders of truth and all thats good in posting on the Man Utd thread, here too tell us what we should talk about yet again and how we drag the thread down. The three upholders of all thats right who are totally not sensitive at all, they just like to decide whats to be discussed. Lads what are we allowed to talk about tonight that won't upset you?

21-01-2019 9:40pm

Put down the interwebz

Surely there is more important stuff than getting this worked up over absolutely **** all :P

21-01-2019 9:40pm

Back to Utd, thanks Wayne. Legend

https://twitter.com/ManUtd/status/1087324223608160256?s=19

bangkok · 21-01-2019 9:41pm

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/manchester-united-to-appoint-director-of-football-before-deciding-who-will-be-next-manager-37733512.html

Whatsisname · 21-01-2019 9:42pm

This thread is such a ****ing headache to read.

bangkok · 21-01-2019 9:43pm

brinty wrote: »

Put kettle black

Jayo26 is not noted for dragging the thread down, provoking or stirring things up or being warned by mods repeatedly to stop dragging thread off topic.

It's people like you and a few others who he have caused a huge drop off in posting on thread by long term posters with your constant argumentative posting style

Take a look in the mirror before Manning accusations of other will respected posters

ha, who told you that?! lots of stuff being posted on here

pjohnson · 21-01-2019 9:45pm

bangkok wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/manchester-united-to-appoint-director-of-football-before-deciding-who-will-be-next-manager-37733512.html

How has VDS done at Ajax?

I know they had a hard enough time of it but their academy is on fire like usual but other than that has he done well?

21-01-2019 9:45pm

Whatsisname wrote: »

This thread is such a ****ing headache to read.

Unreal ****e continues on

Trigger · 21-01-2019 9:48pm

pjohnson wrote: »

How has VDS done at Ajax?

I know they had a hard enough time of it but their academy is on fire like usual but other than that has he done well?

They have an excellent set up and a good club philosophy.. but they aren't a club that is going to be spending hindred millions on players so hard to judge

Kiith · 21-01-2019 9:49pm

Enough with the bickering folks. If you have an issue with a post, report it and move on. Constant back and forth helps no one, and only annoys everyone who wants to talk about actual Man Utd related topics.

Nothing that has been said so far warrants any action, other then to say try and keep things civil and on topic.

bangkok · 21-01-2019 9:50pm

pjohnson wrote: »

How has VDS done at Ajax?

I know they had a hard enough time of it but their academy is on fire like usual but other than that has he done well?

no idea, VDS is the general director, Marc Overmars is Technical director so not sure who does what

jayo26 · 21-01-2019 9:52pm

pjohnson wrote: »

How has VDS done at Ajax?

I know they had a hard enough time of it but their academy is on fire like usual but other than that has he done well?

All though different roles the vds as dof at Ajax could be compared to the same reasons why so far ogs is working out at United, vds is an ex through and through he is pedling the club's philosophy and saying all the right things and has a great atmosphere going similar as to what's happened with ole.

I'm not saying the roles that ole and vds are doing are the same but the reasons why they are working is similar.

bangkok · 21-01-2019 9:54pm

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

I thought Rashford looked class on Saturday. Seemed so confident, almost to the point of arrogance.

just chatting there today, he was told in dubai his one the no1 striker at the club going forward, that alone would have given him huge confidence, he is probably also getting lots of 1 on 1 training with solskjaer who was a lethal finisher himself.

id say he was also told to try things on the field and shoot more often without fear of being dropped

S.M.B. · 21-01-2019 9:58pm

Zeek12 wrote: »

In fairness, Rashford has missed plenty of chances already this season. Some of them important.

The impressive thing is when it happens - it rarely seems to affect his confidence.
He picks himself up and keeps trying the right things.

Yeah, but now he is uniteds "first choice striker" with £75 million lukaku sitting on the bench breathing down his kneck. So far Rashford has dealt with everthing that has been thrown at him and I hope he's up to the task.

As I said it's as much Olé's challenge as it is Rashfords.

21-01-2019 10:52pm

There's no harm in getting McTominay tied down to a long term contract.

Waiting for news about one for Herrera...

chris445 · 22-01-2019 12:51am

S.M.B. wrote: »

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I would say they noticed, but the calculation was to keep him on - figuring other subs and tactical changes were needed rather than Rashford coming off.

The Mata for Lingard substitution was odd. I guess this was around the time that Rashford started to run out of gas.

I wonder was the plan to bring Lukaku on for Martial just before Huddersfield scored. Rashford seems to get moved onto the left in place of Martial as he is more likely to stick to his defensive duties but it's not the ideal spot for someone who has little more to give.

Just before Huddersfield scored both Mata and Lukaku were stripped and on the sideline ready to come on.

Agree with other poster too about rashford being gassed after about 70 minutes. Pogba was the same. A few bursting runs from both but struggled to recover afterwards. Would worry about fitness coming up to cl games after a busy Christmas for the starting team.

chris445 · 22-01-2019 12:51am

S.M.B. wrote: »

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I would say they noticed, but the calculation was to keep him on - figuring other subs and tactical changes were needed rather than Rashford coming off.

The Mata for Lingard substitution was odd. I guess this was around the time that Rashford started to run out of gas.

I wonder was the plan to bring Lukaku on for Martial just before Huddersfield scored. Rashford seems to get moved onto the left in place of Martial as he is more likely to stick to his defensive duties but it's not the ideal spot for someone who has little more to give.

Just before Huddersfield scored both Mata and Lukaku were stripped and on the sideline ready to come on.

Agree with other poster too about rashford being gassed after about 70 minutes. Pogba was the same. A few bursting runs from both but struggled to recover afterwards. Would worry about fitness coming up to cl games after a busy Christmas for the starting team.

bangkok · 22-01-2019 9:23am

'Pogba or Rashford top of Power Rankings?'

http://www.skysports.com/share/11613784

Pogba top for 4th week in a row, rashford 2nd

S.M.B. · 22-01-2019 9:30am

chris445 wrote: »

Just before Huddersfield scored both Mata and Lukaku were stripped and on the sideline ready to come on.

Agree with other poster too about rashford being gassed after about 70 minutes. Pogba was the same. A few bursting runs from both but struggled to recover afterwards. Would worry about fitness coming up to cl games after a busy Christmas for the starting team.

Didn't realise Mata was also ready to come on too. So was it going to be Mata & Lukaku for Lingard & Martial at a time when Rashford was clearly struggling? Seems odd.

Mitch Connor · 22-01-2019 10:45am

Speaking of Rashford and his fitness towards the end of the game - I see Big Sam was on TalkSport this morning saying he reckons Rashford will be burn out by 27/28 to 30.

Said given his level of talent that he will become/is first choice for club and country, will play most games in a season and rarely have any real time off from the game - with summer tours and summer tournements. Pointed to the toll that will have on his ankles, hips, back etc over time, and then he opined that you don't see too many top players in the PL over 30 anymore (not sure about that).

Now, firstly you can point to Messi and Ronaldo as examples of him being wrong. Two players that are still top of their game, top of the game and into their 30s. They've played huge numbers of games every season and keep going - I could see Rashford taking inspiration from Ronaldo in terms of training and conditioning, etc - so that isn't a huge concern for me. However, it does bring up a simple fitness/endurance question of Rashford.

I'm not being critical of him fading late in games - playing the way he does that is bound to happen, but may happen less over time. But, does it mean he should change his gamee. Part of the issue, imo, is how much tracking back and pressuring runs he does. Sure, it is cool to see and shows great drive, but that sprint back is going to cost him. A feature of Ronaldo and Messi's games have been how they measure their input in a game. I remember Messi used to not really involve himself defensively (possibly still the case or not) so that he could conserve his energy for the attacking runs. Same with Ronaldo - many called him selfish or lazy defensively, but being allowed to not defend massively would clearly impact the energy levels for attacking play and playing more matches in general.

I'm not saying Rashford should stop pressing altogether, but should the club and staff be looking to help him change his game so that his pressing is done in the final third rather than see him sprinting back to track a runner. Do United need to be looking at a 10 plan for this kid - and how his game will see him in that time period.

damowill · 22-01-2019 11:07am

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Speaking of Rashford and his fitness towards the end of the game - I see Big Sam was on TalkSport this morning saying he reckons Rashford will be burn out by 27/28 to 30.

Said given his level of talent that he will become/is first choice for club and country, will play most games in a season and rarely have any real time off from the game - with summer tours and summer tournements. Pointed to the toll that will have on his ankles, hips, back etc over time, and then he opined that you don't see too many top players in the PL over 30 anymore (not sure about that).

Now, firstly you can point to Messi and Ronaldo as examples of him being wrong. Two players that are still top of their game, top of the game and into their 30s. They've played huge numbers of games every season and keep going - I could see Rashford taking inspiration from Ronaldo in terms of training and conditioning, etc - so that isn't a huge concern for me. However, it does bring up a simple fitness/endurance question of Rashford.

I'm not being critical of him fading late in games - playing the way he does that is bound to happen, but may happen less over time. But, does it mean he should change his gamee. Part of the issue, imo, is how much tracking back and pressuring runs he does. Sure, it is cool to see and shows great drive, but that sprint back is going to cost him. A feature of Ronaldo and Messi's games have been how they measure their input in a game. I remember Messi used to not really involve himself defensively (possibly still the case or not) so that he could conserve his energy for the attacking runs. Same with Ronaldo - many called him selfish or lazy defensively, but being allowed to not defend massively would clearly impact the energy levels for attacking play and playing more matches in general.

I'm not saying Rashford should stop pressing altogether, but should the club and staff be looking to help him change his game so that his pressing is done in the final third rather than see him sprinting back to track a runner. Do United need to be looking at a 10 plan for this kid - and how his game will see him in that time period.

I believe if the front 3 or 4 press together, and chase down defenders in unison then the workload is shared. This season Rashfords workrate has out weighed any of our other forwards. Sometimes he chases down lost causes but if the team has a high press then his chasing wont be fruitless.

Rooney was similar for his first few years, he used to put in a huge shift. Both players have fire in their bellies, they want to help the team and they give it their all. Constantly harassing and chasing down defenders. Personally i love it but we should question it, at the risk of burnout (which happened to rooney).

I think he just needs to be managed better. Messi & Ronaldo dont do the same amount of individual pressing imo.

On a side note, do you think our team is as fit or works as hard as, lets say Liverpool? The pool to me, look like the fittest team in the league. They dont have a big squad but they are very hard to play against. They have the talent but their tactics and workrate is admirable.

Liam O · 22-01-2019 11:19am

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Speaking of Rashford and his fitness towards the end of the game - I see Big Sam was on TalkSport this morning saying he reckons Rashford will be burn out by 27/28 to 30.

Said given his level of talent that he will become/is first choice for club and country, will play most games in a season and rarely have any real time off from the game - with summer tours and summer tournements. Pointed to the toll that will have on his ankles, hips, back etc over time, and then he opined that you don't see too many top players in the PL over 30 anymore (not sure about that).

Now, firstly you can point to Messi and Ronaldo as examples of him being wrong. Two players that are still top of their game, top of the game and into their 30s. They've played huge numbers of games every season and keep going - I could see Rashford taking inspiration from Ronaldo in terms of training and conditioning, etc - so that isn't a huge concern for me. However, it does bring up a simple fitness/endurance question of Rashford.

I'm not being critical of him fading late in games - playing the way he does that is bound to happen, but may happen less over time. But, does it mean he should change his gamee. Part of the issue, imo, is how much tracking back and pressuring runs he does. Sure, it is cool to see and shows great drive, but that sprint back is going to cost him. A feature of Ronaldo and Messi's games have been how they measure their input in a game. I remember Messi used to not really involve himself defensively (possibly still the case or not) so that he could conserve his energy for the attacking runs. Same with Ronaldo - many called him selfish or lazy defensively, but being allowed to not defend massively would clearly impact the energy levels for attacking play and playing more matches in general.

I'm not saying Rashford should stop pressing altogether, but should the club and staff be looking to help him change his game so that his pressing is done in the final third rather than see him sprinting back to track a runner. Do United need to be looking at a 10 plan for this kid - and how his game will see him in that time period.

Rashford would need to show that he is good enough to allow him to play like that. You already have Pogba and Martial doing minimal running and it's probably costing the team defensively. Adding a 3rd to the list suddenly means that you are asking a lot from the other midfielders.

Only earlier in this season you had people suggesting Rashford should go on loan and his finishing required a lot of work. Now, he was very good under Jose in the last few months and has stepped it up again under Ole so it's obviously not something I'd agree with but people mentioning him near Messi and Ronaldo is very premature imo.

Liverpool and City are showing that games based around high tempo pressing and quick attacking transitions are the way forward. Now there's obviously more than one way to skin a cat but I feel United aren't in a position to absolve 3 or 4 players in a team of defensive responsibility.

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 11:37am

Out of all the forwards at the club Rashford would be the least I'd be worried about, going by what Jose said in past Rashford is one of the most dedicated and professional athletes training and fitness wise.

I think half the battle with Rashford been gassed at end of games is type of training the club has been doing under Jose. Its been said that jose did not put an emphasis on cardio training as his style did not need high pressing for 90 minutes he was much more focused on tactical and technical end if training.

This is part to the reason why ole brought them away for the week to try concentrate on fitness but endurance is one of the easiest things to fix in football as someone said on here few days ago.

Not saying your points are invalid Mitch it is something to be thinking about it's what happened with Rooney and micheal Owen but there is a big difference in Rooneys physique towards Rashford.

DM_7 · 22-01-2019 11:54am

Injuries will shorten a career as will lack of rest time.

Even in players who appear to be aware of fitness like Sanchez or Schweinsteiger.

Yet is there value in getting a Rashford still doing well into his 30s if it is at the expense of getting the most from him in younger years? Do teams accept the early in age career fall off for players who start out at a high demanding level at a young age? If Rashford's important output is linked to pace, something that should drop off as he ages anyway do they maximise what they get from him while he has it?

Beasty · 22-01-2019 12:15pm

DM_7 wrote: »

Injuries will shorten a career as will lack of rest time.

Even in players who appear to be aware of fitness like Sanchez or Schweinsteiger.

Yet is there value in getting a Rashford still doing well into his 30s if it is at the expense of getting the most from him in younger years? Do teams accept the early in age career fall off for players who start out at a high demanding level at a young age? If Rashford's important output is linked to pace, something that should drop off as he ages anyway do they maximise what they get from him while he has it?

But we also had Giggs, who had the pace early on, but was given plenty of rest. He managed his injury problems incredibly well, and adapted his play as he go older and slowed down a bit.

With a bit of care and good luck there's no reason Rashford should not be banging them in until his early thirties while still contributing at the highest level now. Just needs to be recognised when he needs a bit of a break

Adamcp898 · 22-01-2019 12:17pm

I think we're getting a little ahead of ourselves if we're worrying about what sort of player Rashford will be when he's 32.

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 12:20pm

Beasty wrote: »

But we also had Giggs, who had the pace early on, but was given plenty of rest. He managed his injury problems incredibly well, and adapted his play as he go older and slowed down a bit.

With a bit of care and good luck there's no reason Rashford should not be banging them in until his early thirties while still contributing at the highest level now. Just needs to be recognised when he needs a bit of a break

To be fair giggs played feck all international football by world class player standards.

DM_7 · 22-01-2019 12:49pm

Beasty wrote: »

But we also had Giggs, who had the pace early on, but was given plenty of rest. He managed his injury problems incredibly well, and adapted his play as he go older and slowed down a bit.

With a bit of care and good luck there's no reason Rashford should not be banging them in until his early thirties while still contributing at the highest level now. Just needs to be recognised when he needs a bit of a break

As Jayo touched on, Giggs had a lot more rest time, he was also forced to change his preperation due to niggling injuries. Giggs did not retire as a speedy winger, had to change his game and his position.

Giggs was not the norm, most players would fail if they tried to reinvent themselves.

While Rashford has obvious technique, vision we have no idea if he will develop his game in a way that removes a need for his pace but with a high output.

I think a short term vision of managing seasons is what teams would do. Can't worry about what he will be like at 30. Effort to make sure players do not overcommit in games and lead to fatique type injury now must be something teams are aware of for all their players?

Drumpot · 22-01-2019 2:47pm

This is one of the reasons why I always felt Rooney really could of been as good as Ronaldo. Whether it was lifestyle or just his physical build, Rooney was as good if not better then Ronaldo when they were 19. Rooney’s best years were behind him by the time most players are at their peak. The older Rooney got the longer it took for him to regain fitness even after minor injuries. It’s not insulting the guy, just observing his career to Ronaldo’s.

If Rashford keeps his focus on his football , prioritizes improving and being the best (like Ronaldo’s insatiable hunger for greatness) he will be a superb player. If he lowers that drive even a few percent he may have a solid career but not reach the levels he might of attained.

I t hink at the top level your mentality , drive, focus and application can have huge knock on affects in longevity and success. These things are very difficult to assess and become in many cases the focus of subjective debate. I think they can often explain why a seemingly less talented player will start consistently in a team because they are sort of intangible qualities. I think Ronaldo has these qualities more then any player in the world , even more then Messi. But Messi just has more natural football gifts that no other player can match. So one quality evens out another.

However, Rashford doesn’t appeer to get involved in any drama, seems like a humble lad and has shown a great ability to deal with the pressures of playing for united at a ridiculously young age. That’s all gravy and suggests he has a solid foundation in which to build a very successful career.

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 3:04pm

DM_7 wrote: »

As Jayo touched on, Giggs had a lot more rest time, he was also forced to change his preperation due to niggling injuries. Giggs did not retire as a speedy winger, had to change his game and his position.

And his car seat

ericzeking · 22-01-2019 3:17pm

DM_7 wrote: »

As Jayo touched on, Giggs had a lot more rest time, he was also forced to change his preperation due to niggling injuries. Giggs did not retire as a speedy winger, had to change his game and his position.

Giggs was not the norm, most players would fail if they tried to reinvent themselves.

While Rashford has obvious technique, vision we have no idea if he will develop his game in a way that removes a need for his pace but with a high output.

I think a short term vision of managing seasons is what teams would do. Can't worry about what he will be like at 30. Effort to make sure players do not overcommit in games and lead to fatique type injury now must be something teams are aware of for all their players?

Wasn't Rashford more of a number 10 coming through the ranks? And he has a great shot from distance, I could see him maturing nicely if he lost a yard of pace in later years.

paulbok · 22-01-2019 4:41pm

jayo26 wrote: »

And his car seat

And his Christmas dinner arrangements

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 5:02pm

ericzeking wrote: »

Wasn't Rashford more of a number 10 coming through the ranks? And he has a great shot from distance, I could see him maturing nicely if he lost a yard of pace in later years.

Was a winger as far as I remember.

bangkok · 22-01-2019 6:04pm

ericzeking wrote: »

Wasn't Rashford more of a number 10 coming through the ranks? And he has a great shot from distance, I could see him maturing nicely if he lost a yard of pace in later years.

Yep played the no10 role

Donnielighto · 22-01-2019 6:11pm

Tried to catch up, painful reading.

Trigger · 22-01-2019 6:16pm

Think he only played 1 or 2 games iirc behind the striker at u18/19 and u23.. the rest were up top.. u16's he played from a wide position, as in a wide forward not a winger sense

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 7:29pm

Dele alli ruled out until March now too, unfortunate to see any player injured of course but hopefully spurs will drop a few points in next few weeks.

22-01-2019 7:36pm

Ya Spurs have had awful luck with injuries thier next four games in the league arent bad though but they are still in all comps so have lots of other fixtures to play

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 7:51pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Ya Spurs have had awful luck with injuries thier next four games in the league arent bad though but they are still in all comps so have lots of other fixtures to play

much prefer have 4 teams fighting for two spots instead of 3 fighting for 1 spot hopefully we can continue the run up to pool game put ourselves in a good position too we have some tough games in March and April but that's when season's are made.

22-01-2019 7:59pm

jayo26 wrote: »

much prefer have 4 teams fighting for two spots instead of 3 fighting for 1 spot hopefully we can continue the run up to pool game put ourselves in a good position too we have some tough games in March and April but that's when season's are made.

Yip we need to make as much hay as possible up to the Southampton game (excluding the liverpool) as after that we play 7 in a row via top 10 opposition, it will be tough but we have made serious progress so youd never know

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 8:34pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yip we need to make as much hay as possible up to the Southampton game (excluding the liverpool) as after that we play 7 in a row via top 10 opposition, it will be tough but we have made serious progress so youd never know

If we keep the momentum going I'd fancy us it's just the games in between like psg could spoil momentum if neymar and mbappe give us a bit of a spanking but sure we see.

S.M.B. · 22-01-2019 8:49pm

Putting ourselves in a position where a win against Chelsea would put us ahead of them with a few to play would be outstanding but actually looks achievable.

I'd say we'll need to take 4/5 points off the other top 6 teams too though.

jayo26 · 22-01-2019 8:57pm

S.M.B. wrote: »

Putting ourselves in a position where a win against Chelsea would put us ahead of them with a few to play would be outstanding but actually looks achievable.

I'd say we'll need to take 4/5 points off the other top 6 teams too though.

It's hard to know it depends if spurs collapse arsenal could end up been our biggest challengers after the chelsea outburst the weekend. but if we end up losing momentum we could be out of it all together ourselves.

Its so hard to predict what way it will go and I know top four is a lousy ambition but where the club is coming from it's a bit of excitement no one expected to have a month ago.

bangkok · 23-01-2019 11:11am

'Revealed: The hidden costs of transfers'

http://www.skysports.com/share/11612738

An interesting read

fatherted1969 · 23-01-2019 11:57am

Was a credit to Fergie in the way he managed Giggs in his early years at the club. Limited him with the media and didn't overuse him from what I remember. Wonder how much of an influence Fergie was in the amount of international caps he won too. Could be a factor in Giggs longetivity at the top level. Fergie ahead of his time in many ways

DARK-KNIGHT · 23-01-2019 12:00pm

Anyone else here think ole is the perfect fit

Mitch Connor · 23-01-2019 12:06pm

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

Anyone else here think ole is the perfect fit

I can't make that call yet.

I don't know what he is like at setting a team up in big matches to counter big threats.
I don't know what he is like dealing with problems at the club.
I don't know what he is like identifying players who should be sold.
I don't know what he is like identifying players who should be replaced in the first 11.
I don't know what he is like identifying players who should be bought.
I don't know what he is like adjusting to changes in a match (Spurs changed approach and hammered at us for 30 mins).

I don't see how people could say he is a perfect fit based on just these 7 games. There are so many unanswered questions.

RDM won the CL with Chelsea, getting a great bounce off a dejected but talented squad isn't proof of being a perfect fit.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2018/2019 **warning in OP 24/2/19**

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Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2018/2019 warning in OP 24/2/19