Financial advice for teachers

Teach30 · 03-08-2020 5:33pm #1

Hi just wondering could anyone recommend where to get financial advice for a teacher. I’m unsure if I’m being paid correctly and despite having read the Union info on pay I’m still very confused by it all, particularly on The pay scale and increments.

Is there an easy way to work out what scale I should be on if I have been teaching since 2008? I’m really confused as to whether I should be Should I be on point 12 or 14.

I feel embarrassed to ask friends as I’ve been teaching for quite a while and I should have it all figured out by now. A professional might be good to help me sort out things like taxes etc. I’m very clueless about all this!

Thank in advance.

mtoutlemonde · 03-08-2020 5:42pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Hi just wondering could anyone recommend where to get financial advice for a teacher. I’m unsure if I’m being paid correctly and despite having read the Union info on pay I’m still very confused by it all, particularly on The pay scale and increments.

Is there an easy way to work out what scale I should be on if I have been teaching since 2008? I’m really confused as to whether I should be Should I be on point 12 or 14.

I feel embarrassed to ask friends as I’ve been teaching for quite a while and I should have it all figured out by now. A professional might be good to help me sort out things like taxes etc. I’m very clueless about all this!

Thank in advance.

You're pre 2011 so you're getting your allowances.
Point of scale - I don't know your job situation since 2008 but 600 hours in a year resulted in increment. An RPT/Fixed term resulted in increment every year. You would have started on point 3.

Teach30 · 03-08-2020 5:59pm

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

You're pre 2011 so you're getting your allowances.
Point of scale - I don't know your job situation since 2008 but 600 hours in a year resulted in increment. An RPT/Fixed term resulted in increment every year. You would have started on point 3.

Ok thanks for the information. I honestly can’t remember how many hours I had when I first started out. I have been teaching continuously since since 2008.
However if I was on maternity leave and similar contracts I wouldn’t move up so as they are not my own hours?

If I rang the financial section I wonder would they be of any help. I’m assuming they would have my hours etc to hand...?

mtoutlemonde · 03-08-2020 7:24pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Ok thanks for the information. I honestly can’t remember how many hours I had when I first started out. I have been teaching continuously since since 2008.
However if I was on maternity leave and similar contracts I wouldn’t move up so as they are not my own hours?

If I rang the financial section I wonder would they be of any help. I’m assuming they would have my hours etc to hand...?

Yes maternity makes up the 600 hours. Maternity is not CIDable but is eligible for increments. The payroll department will be able to provide you with a statement of hours worked - you'll be able work it out from that.

am_zarathustra · 03-08-2020 7:41pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Ok thanks for the information. I honestly can’t remember how many hours I had when I first started out. I have been teaching continuously since since 2008.
However if I was on maternity leave and similar contracts I wouldn’t move up so as they are not my own hours?

If I rang the financial section I wonder would they be of any help. I’m assuming they would have my hours etc to hand...?

Hey, just email payroll in the department in Cornamaddy. They are pretty helpful and you can just ask what increment you are on and when is your next one due. It's a simple request so I'm sure they will get back to you in a couple of days. I've done it a couple of times when moving systems

rainbowtrout · 03-08-2020 8:34pm

Assuming full hours since 2008, you've done 12 years, so starting on point 3 you would be now on point 14.

Assuming you started in September 2008, you would also have to take into account that there was a freeze on increments in 2014-2016. As you were lower down the payscale, you probably only had one 3 month freeze, so if your increment was originally in September, it's probably now in December.

No need to go to a financial advisor, you'd still have to get the info from the DES, who will be able to tell you what increment you are on and when you are due to go up again.

If you are on 14, when you go on to 15 (and 16), there is no financial increase again until you reach 17.

Teach30 · 03-08-2020 9:01pm

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Assuming full hours since 2008, you've done 12 years, so starting on point 3 you would be now on point 14.

Assuming you started in September 2008, you would also have to take into account that there was a freeze on increments in 2014-2016. As you were lower down the payscale, you probably only had one 3 month freeze, so if your increment was originally in September, it's probably now in December.

No need to go to a financial advisor, you'd still have to get the info from the DES, who will be able to tell you what increment you are on and when you are due to go up again.

If you are on 14, when you go on to 15 (and 16), there is no financial increase again until you reach 17.

Thank you for the help. I’ll pop them an email and see where it’s gone astray as I think I should be on point 14.

I know I might have done 11 hours contract for one year but always got more hours during the year so maybe that affected it. I wasn’t dept paid at one stage either so I’ll ask them how do I fix that.

Thanks everyone.

am_zarathustra · 03-08-2020 10:01pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Thank you for the help. I’ll pop them an email and see where it’s gone astray as I think I should be on point 14.

I know I might have done 11 hours contract for one year but always got more hours during the year so maybe that affected it. I wasn’t dept paid at one stage either so I’ll ask them how do I fix that.

Thanks everyone.

If you weren't department paid you'll have to apply to have the service recognised for incremental credit. If it was a private school you'll need to get them to fill in the paperwork.

Might be worth checking your pension too while your at it, private pay isn't reackonable so it might be worth looking at buying time back now, it's cheaper the earlier you do it. I had a friend get stung by this.

Teach30 · 03-08-2020 11:03pm

am_zarathustra wrote: »

If you weren't department paid you'll have to apply to have the service recognised for incremental credit. If it was a private school you'll need to get them to fill in the paperwork.

Might be worth checking your pension too while your at it, private pay isn't reackonable so it might be worth looking at buying time back now, it's cheaper the earlier you do it. I had a friend get stung by this.

Ok thanks. What’s the buying back pension thing about? Sorry totally clueless about all this, hence why a financial advisor might be useful to me. I know there’s something about allowances for equipment too but I’ve never taken it further and don’t know who to ask.

Teach30 · 03-08-2020 11:03pm

am_zarathustra wrote: »

If you weren't department paid you'll have to apply to have the service recognised for incremental credit. If it was a private school you'll need to get them to fill in the paperwork.

Might be worth checking your pension too while your at it, private pay isn't reackonable so it might be worth looking at buying time back now, it's cheaper the earlier you do it. I had a friend get stung by this.

Ok thanks. What’s the buying back pension thing about? Sorry totally clueless about all this, hence why a financial advisor might be useful to me. I know there’s something about allowances for equipment too but I’ve never taken it further and don’t know who to ask.

rainbowtrout · 03-08-2020 11:48pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Ok thanks. What’s the buying back pension thing about? Sorry totally clueless about all this, hence why a financial advisor might be useful to me. I know there’s something about allowances for equipment too but I’ve never taken it further and don’t know who to ask.

There's a tax credit for lots of different professions, teacher is one of them. You can claim that yourself on the revenue online service, if you haven't claimed it already. It comes under the title of flat rate expenses. It's about €500, you might be able to claim back for previous years too if you haven't previously claimed it.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/employing-people/employee-expenses/flat-rate-expense-allowances/index.aspx

If you won't have the full 40 years (max for pension) by the time you reach 65, you are allowed 'buy back' years by making extra contributions.

There are two ways of doing this: start an AVC which is essentially a private pension to make up the shortfall that you wouldn't get from the public pension or do what is called 'Notional Service Purchase' where the DES will give you a quote on how much it is to buy back the year or years you are short at retirement age. You can buy back a max of 5 years.

So if for example you went into teaching at 30, you would have 35 years complete at 65, the earliest you can draw down your pension, you could buy back up to 5 years. I think you can make a lump sum payment or have it deducted from salary.

On the other hand, if you were close to the 40 years at retirement some would not see it as worth the hassle of buying back the years.

If you did not reach the 600 hour threshold in the year you were on a 11 hour contract, it wouldn't have counted for the increment.

amacca · 03-08-2020 11:49pm

am_zarathustra wrote: »

might be worth looking at buying time back now, it's cheaper the earlier you do it. I had a friend get stung by this.

I had no idea it was cheaper the earlier you do it......is there a formula or something available

rainbowtrout · 03-08-2020 11:55pm

https://www.education.ie/en/Education-Staff/Services/Retirement-Pensions/Teaching-Staff/Notional-Service-Scheme

There's information on it here.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:08am

Teach30 wrote: »

Ok thanks. What’s the buying back pension thing about? Sorry totally clueless about all this, hence why a financial advisor might be useful to me. I know there’s something about allowances for equipment too but I’ve never taken it further and don’t know who to ask.

First of all, check your tax credits.

The tax allowance for expenses should be there, 518.

A financial advisor will be no good on:

increments/salary scale
buying back years

Do your own research, read AAM, and ask here and on AAM.

mtoutlemonde · 04-08-2020 12:24am

rainbowtrout wrote: »

There's a tax credit for lots of different professions, teacher is one of them. You can claim that yourself on the revenue online service, if you haven't claimed it already. It comes under the title of flat rate expenses. It's about €500, you might be able to claim back for previous years too if you haven't previously claimed it.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/employing-people/employee-expenses/flat-rate-expense-allowances/index.aspx

If you won't have the full 40 years (max for pension) by the time you reach 65, you are allowed 'buy back' years by making extra contributions.

There are two ways of doing this: start an AVC which is essentially a private pension to make up the shortfall that you wouldn't get from the public pension or do what is called 'Notional Service Purchase' where the DES will give you a quote on how much it is to buy back the year or years you are short at retirement age. You can buy back a max of 5 years.

So if for example you went into teaching at 30, you would have 35 years complete at 65, the earliest you can draw down your pension, you could buy back up to 5 years. I think you can make a lump sum payment or have it deducted from salary.

On the other hand, if you were close to the 40 years at retirement some would not see it as worth the hassle of buying back the years.

If you did not reach the 600 hour threshold in the year you were on a 11 hour contract, it wouldn't have counted for the increment.

I'm not going searching now but as far as I know RPT/fixed term is awarded every year not dependant on hours.

Teach30 · 04-08-2020 12:26am

rainbowtrout wrote: »

There's a tax credit for lots of different professions, teacher is one of them. You can claim that yourself on the revenue online service, if you haven't claimed it already. It comes under the title of flat rate expenses. It's about €500, you might be able to claim back for previous years too if you haven't previously claimed it.

https://www.revenue.ie/en/employing-people/employee-expenses/flat-rate-expense-allowances/index.aspx

If you won't have the full 40 years (max for pension) by the time you reach 65, you are allowed 'buy back' years by making extra contributions.

There are two ways of doing this: start an AVC which is essentially a private pension to make up the shortfall that you wouldn't get from the public pension or do what is called 'Notional Service Purchase' where the DES will give you a quote on how much it is to buy back the year or years you are short at retirement age. You can buy back a max of 5 years.

So if for example you went into teaching at 30, you would have 35 years complete at 65, the earliest you can draw down your pension, you could buy back up to 5 years. I think you can make a lump sum payment or have it deducted from salary.

On the other hand, if you were close to the 40 years at retirement some would not see it as worth the hassle of buying back the years.

If you did not reach the 600 hour threshold in the year you were on a 11 hour contract, it wouldn't have counted for the increment.

Great I’ll look up the revenue so and see if I can figure that but out.

Are AVCs like savings? I assume I’ll be teaching until I’m 68 so I’ll have the 40 years done by then. I hadn’t really thought about stopping earlier and I dont think it would bother me to be there until then.
I can’t really afford to save more at the minute, well at least not where I can’t access the money quickly so maybe they won’t suit me.

I had a quick look and Cornmarket seem to give advice on this, are there alternatives?

Sorry for all the questions I’m trying to get get my head more organised. I hadn’t opened a pay slip until today - I never ever open them and It made me start wondering was I getting paid correctly - there’s info online but really if you don’t have a head for it it’s difficult to understand.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:28am

Yes, AVCs are pensions savings.

Yes, Cornmarket are an active and large broker selling AVCs.

Yes, there are other brokers selling the same plans, at lower charges than Cornmarket, but often with less advice.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:29am

Teach30 wrote: »

Sorry for all the questions I’m trying to get get my head more organised. I hadn’t opened a pay slip until today - I never ever open them and It made me start wondering was I getting paid correctly - there’s info online but really if you don’t have a head for it it’s difficult to understand.

Every worker should read every payslip they receive.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:32am

Teach30 wrote: »

Great I’ll look up the revenue so and see if I can figure that but out.

I'm sure you have a Revenue MyAccount.

You can read your Certificate of Tax Credits in there.

am_zarathustra · 04-08-2020 12:38am

Teach30 wrote: »

Great I’ll look up the revenue so and see if I can figure that but out.

Are AVCs like savings? I assume I’ll be teaching until I’m 68 so I’ll have the 40 years done by then. I hadn’t really thought about stopping earlier and I dont think it would bother me to be there until then.
I can’t really afford to save more at the minute, well at least not where I can’t access the money quickly so maybe they won’t suit me.

I had a quick look and Cornmarket seem to give advice on this, are there alternatives?

Sorry for all the questions I’m trying to get get my head more organised. I hadn’t opened a pay slip until today - I never ever open them and It made me start wondering was I getting paid correctly - there’s info online but really if you don’t have a head for it it’s difficult to understand.

Just remember if you are paid privately it's not pensionable.

Solid advice here. Cornmarket are good because they understand teachers but they will try and sell you their product which might not be the best so as stated above, try and do a little research

Teach30 · 04-08-2020 12:42am

Geuze wrote: »

Every worker should read every payslip they receive.

Why?
I check my bank account and I see I get paid.
It’s all well and good say read it but I dont understand it. Yes I can look it up but I don’t know anyone I can ask to explain it to me in the simplest terms possible.

I’ve read about increments - I’m still lost as to where I should be on the scale. I’ve no idea how many hours I worked years ago.

Also I dont think I need AVCs, does every teacher get them?
How would I find out what my pension would be when I retire.. a Financial advisor?

I’d totally pay someone to just do all this stuff for me.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 1:25am

Teach30 wrote: »

Why?
I check my bank account and I see I get paid.
It’s all well and good say read it but I dont understand it. Yes I can look it up but I don’t know anyone I can ask to explain it to me in the simplest terms possible.

I’ve read about increments - I’m still lost as to where I should be on the scale. I’ve no idea how many hours I worked years ago.

Also I dont think I need AVCs, does every teacher get them?
How would I find out what my pension would be when I retire.. a Financial advisor?

I’d totally pay someone to just do all this stuff for me.

I can't help you on the increments.

Nobody can, just yourself doing the calculations, and asking your employers, and the DES in Athlone.

I can help you on the pension.

Are AVCs popular? I actually don't know what % of PS do them.

But I do read plenty of discussion here and on AAM about them.

If workers will have 40 years service, and a full work pension, personally I don't see much point in AVCs or NSP.

Even 35 years service gives a good work pension.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 1:27am

Teach30 wrote: »

Why?
I check my bank account and I see I get paid.
It’s all well and good say read it but I dont understand it. Yes I can look it up but I don’t know anyone I can ask to explain it to me in the simplest terms possible.

Ask here or on AAM.

I will tell you now.

Main things to check are they correct:

(1) tax credits

(2) SRCOP

That's a good start.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 1:27am

Teach30 wrote: »

I’d totally pay someone to just do all this stuff for me.

No need. All info available for free.

Here is some info:

https://www.education.ie/en/Education-Staff/Services/Retirement-Pensions/Teaching-Staff/Teaching-Staff.html

rainbowtrout · 04-08-2020 9:31am

Teach30 wrote: »

Why?
I check my bank account and I see I get paid.
It’s all well and good say read it but I dont understand it. Yes I can look it up but I don’t know anyone I can ask to explain it to me in the simplest terms possible.

I’ve read about increments - I’m still lost as to where I should be on the scale. I’ve no idea how many hours I worked years ago.

Also I dont think I need AVCs, does every teacher get them?
How would I find out what my pension would be when I retire.. a Financial advisor?

I’d totally pay someone to just do all this stuff for me.

Well to make sure i get paid properly.

For instance I get my increment in the middle of March every year. So I check the payslip dated after that to see if the increment has changed. If it hasn’t, I’d be on to payroll to ask why.

A few years back I got a payslip (and pay) for €400 for two weeks work and I’m full time permanent. Got on to payroll and they told me that my tax credits had changed and they were just following the updated details they got grain revenue. Turns out when I had sent something else into revenue for some bizarre reason whoever was working on my account applied my entire tax credit to a place I had worked in for a summer job 15 years earlier. They moved it back straight away and I got my money back.

AVCs are there to make up the shortfall if you don’t have the full years when you retire. Like Geuze said not particularly useful to someone who will have full service. There is a limit to what you can have in the AVC before you pay tax on it because it is supposed to make up a shortfall in the public service pension if you have one. If you do the full 40 years then you have no shortfall.

It’s worth your while sitting down and educating yourself on all of this stuff. If you do go down the road of an AVC or any other financial product in the future it’s best to be armed with the facts first.

For pension calculation you get 1/80 of your final salary (ie the salary you were on when you retired) for every year worked up to a max of 40/80s or 1/2.

So If you were on 60k when you retire after 40 years, then your pension would be 30k annually. You also get a lump sum which is three times the pension so 90k in this example. The lump sum is tax free.

Teach30 · 04-08-2020 10:03am

Geuze wrote: »

Ask here or on AAM.

I will tell you now.

Main things to check are they correct:

(1) tax credits

(2) SRCOP

That's a good start.

Thanks for trying to help. I know you mean well but I don’t have a head for these things.
What’s SRCOP.. and how would I know what my tax credits should be?

I read through the pension article you linked and can safely say after the 28 pages I’m none the wiser. I don’t have a maths brain and working out the payments is not easy as I haven’t a clue what I’m at.

Thanks anyways I tried to log Into the revenue but it’s not letting me so working on that.

Teach30 · 04-08-2020 10:09am

rainbowtrout wrote: »

Well to make sure i get paid properly.

For instance I get my increment in the middle of March every year. So I check the payslip dated after that to see if the increment has changed. If it hasn’t, I’d be on to payroll to ask why.

A few years back I got a payslip (and pay) for €400 for two weeks work and I’m full time permanent. Got on to payroll and they told me that my tax credits had changed and they were just following the updated details they got grain revenue. Turns out when I had sent something else into revenue for some bizarre reason whoever was working on my account applied my entire tax credit to a place I had worked in for a summer job 15 years earlier. They moved it back straight away and I got my money back.

AVCs are there to make up the shortfall if you don’t have the full years when you retire. Like Geuze said not particularly useful to someone who will have full service. There is a limit to what you can have in the AVC before you pay tax on it because it is supposed to make up a shortfall in the public service pension if you have one. If you do the full 40 years then you have no shortfall.

It’s worth your while sitting down and educating yourself on all of this stuff. If you do go down the road of an AVC or any other financial product in the future it’s best to be armed with the facts first.

For pension calculation you get 1/80 of your final salary (ie the salary you were on when you retired) for every year worked up to a max of 40/80s or 1/2.

So If you were on 60k when you retire after 40 years, then your pension would be 30k annually. You also get a lump sum which is three times the pension so 90k in this example. The lump sum is tax free.

Thanks, I don’t know when I get increments or that I even got them u til lately so I’ll email the financial section and see what they say to me.

I don’t have a head for maths so even working things out I wouldn’t be sure I had calculated it correctly. I know you have an example for pensions but I can’t follow it.. I think my embarrassment about not understanding these things has led me to never ask about them. I’m usually just delighted I get paid.

With the example... I would look at the pay scale and see what I would be be on and then if it’s 1/80 of it divide that number by 80? And if I work 40 years I divide the number by 40 no?
Sorry totally don’t get it.

Not to worry through I’ll see if I’m being paid right first and work on the pay scale number and see if that’s right.

am_zarathustra · 04-08-2020 11:16am

If you email payroll at the department they will send you out a service printout, after 5 years teaching mine was a decent manuscript size but if you need more detail that's where to go.

You are incremented in the paycheck that changes every year or two. You in the middle of the scale so it'll be harder to see but you pay should change around the same paycheck. I know in sept I'll get a little pay bump, like Rainbowtrout said I'd keep my eye of this. I've had plenty of run ins over the years around pay, incorrect tax etc.

With regards to AVCs, if you go to a financial advisor they will try and sell you these. Thats there job, they get commission. You need to have some knowledge going in. If you are short years from working in a private school just buy them back from the department. It will be worth more to you that way, especially given your on the middle pension (there are 3 pension systems currently in place for teachers depending on when you started)

The 1/80th means that if you do 40 years you get 40/80 of your final salary. So your pension will be half. Also you get a very decent lump sum tax free. Do you have a post or do you plan on applying? What year did you start teaching and when do you plan on retiring? Have you ever taken maternity? How many years were you paid privately? If you know the answer to these I could give you a rough idea of your pension on here. It's good to know for yourself, unless you know the financial advisor personally they can give bad advice.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:00pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Thanks for trying to help. I know you mean well but I don’t have a head for these things.
What’s SRCOP.. and how would I know what my tax credits should be?

Tax credits listed here:

https://revenue.ie/en/personal-tax-credits-reliefs-and-exemptions/tax-relief-charts/index.aspx

Most people get two:

the personal tax credit = 1650
the PAYE tax credit = 1650

but there are others that you may be due, depending on your circumstances.

Then there is the tax relief for flat-rate work expenses, worth 518.

Setup and/or login to your Revenue account to check them.

Or easier, check them on your payslip.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:04pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Thanks for trying to help. I know you mean well but I don’t have a head for these things.
What’s SRCOP.. and how would I know what my tax credits should be?

SRCOP = standard rate cut-off point, the point at which workers move to the top tax rate 40%.

Also known as tax bands.

See here:

https://revenue.ie/en/personal-tax-credits-reliefs-and-exemptions/tax-relief-charts/index.aspx

It's 35,300 for a single person.

Check your payslip, and/or your Certificate of Tax Credits.

Geuze · 04-08-2020 12:06pm

Teach30 wrote: »

Thanks anyways I tried to log Into the revenue but it’s not letting me so working on that.

Register for Revenue MyAccount here:

https://www.ros.ie/myaccount-web/register.html?execution=e4s1

Financial advice for teachers

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