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Why do people do things in the name of ideology that they normally wouldn't do?

  • 25-08-2012 12:23pm
    #1
    paky
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,138 ✭✭✭


    themselves?
    For instance, think about the risks people take when fighting wars under no other belief but freedom or religion? They go out and risk their lives for nothing other than belief. In fact, you could actually say they kill in the name of altruism. Yet when people make sacrifices for themselves or are just selfish, its frowned upon by society since selfishness doesn't benefit the group but only the individual. And all you have to do is look at the countless statues around this country and many other countries to martyrs and civil agitators commemorating them because they dedicated their lives to self sacrifice.
    Why are people designed like this?


Comments

  • #2
    Fromthetrees
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,846 ✭✭✭Fromthetrees


    All those statues dedicated to self sacrifice around the world would be of men. Men have been conditioned by society to fight, from the dawn of the human race right up until today, whereas woman have been and are conditioned to nurture, think of a toy plastic gun/sword vrs. doll or cooking set.
    This has been the case to ensure the survival of all the tribes/empires/nations for all of humankind, it was/is necessary. The women care for the the young and old at home while the men go out and fight or get food.
    It's how men have been thought how to love and be loved, men earn their love through self sacrifice (literally and figuritively) by being away from the home.

    Self sacrifice because of religious reasons is a case of brainwashing the person into a belief that the next life will reward them.
    Self sacrifice because of nationalism can be simply to overthrow an oppressor to try make life better.


  • #3
    robp
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,934 ✭✭✭robp


    Fromthetrees wrote: »
    All those statues dedicated to self sacrifice around the world would be of men. Men have been conditioned by society to fight, from the dawn of the human race right up until today, whereas woman have been and are conditioned to nurture, think of a toy plastic gun/sword vrs. doll or cooking set.
    This has been the case to ensure the survival of all the tribes/empires/nations for all of humankind, it was/is necessary. The women care for the the young and old at home while the men go out and fight or get food.
    It's how men have been thought how to love and be loved, men earn their love through self sacrifice (literally and figuritively) by being away from the home.

    Self sacrifice because of religious reasons is a case of brainwashing the person into a belief that the next life will reward them.
    Self sacrifice because of nationalism can be simply to overthrow an oppressor to try make life better.

    Freedom of religion is important. If you deny people the right to follow their conscience you can make people ill. Its well documented that there are psychological repercussions to forcing people away from their value systems. The afterlife argument often doesn't at all hold because in cases such as al-qaeda their contradicting their own religious doctrines by using terrorism so an afterlife of bliss seems a bit less likely.

    It isn't just nationalism or religion. There are countless examples or left wing and right wing guerilla movements in the 20th century. There often not nationalistic. What oppressor were the Loyalist death squads of northern Ireland responding too? I could cite environmental movements or animal rights groups also.

    However I don't have an answer for the OP's question!


  • #4
    Jan Hus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭Jan Hus


    Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things unseen


  • #5
    Janey_Mac
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 139 ✭✭Janey_Mac


    paky wrote: »
    themselves?
    For instance, think about the risks people take when fighting wars under no other belief but freedom or religion? They go out and risk their lives for nothing other than belief. In fact, you could actually say they kill in the name of altruism. Yet when people make sacrifices for themselves or are just selfish, its frowned upon by society since selfishness doesn't benefit the group but only the individual. And all you have to do is look at the countless statues around this country and many other countries to martyrs and civil agitators commemorating them because they dedicated their lives to self sacrifice.
    Why are people designed like this?

    My guess would be that it's not so much that people are "designed like this" as that ideologies are a good psychological/sociological hack, so to speak: a way to take existing functionality and use it in a way that was unintended but that suits your goals.

    The following statements are probably true of almost all humans:
    humans like to be part of a social group,
    humans aspire to higher social status,
    humans are altruistic within their own family groups.

    How are they hacked?

    An ideology can inspire a very strong group-membership feeling because of the shared values

    Many ideologies strongly promote the notion of group-membership as family: fraternity, brotherhood, senior members as "father" and "mother"

    Within the group, high status is given to people fulfilling desired behaviour, such a self-sacrifice (or sacrifice of the group's designated enemy.) (This high status might be post-mortem.)

    Group members who fail to conform are ostracised, punished or diminished socially. (Like young men being sent white feathers during WWI.)

    Result: Thousands of young men go over the top in the trenches, people fly planes into buildings, people fight Nazis, people kill Jews, people take vows of celibacy and silence, people plant bombs under cars, people spend their entire lives in strange countries trying to convert others to their religion. Etc.

    That's what I've come up with twenty minutes' thought! I'm sure there's loads of factors I haven't thought of.


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