Lough Atalia 100 acres of untapped amenity

noelogara · 31-10-2015 12:44am #1

Driving through Galway is always slow and difficult and Lough Atalia a shallow lake within walking distance of the city centre is the most underutilised and wasted asset sitting on the city's doorstep which could provide 100 acres of the most modern amenities such as swimming pools, play grounds, sports centres, car & coach parks, parks, dog walks, etc etc.
With the lorries we have today and quarries just a mile away the lake could be filled in a few months for very small money and topped with gravel. A gift from God to Galway.

D Trent · 31-10-2015 4:59am

*patiently awaits thread closure* ðŸ˜‚

sully2010 · 31-10-2015 5:09am

noelogara wrote: »

Driving through Galway is always slow and difficult and Lough Atalia a shallow lake within walking distance of the city centre is the most underutilised and wasted asset sitting on the city's doorstep which could provide 100 acres of the most modern amenities such as swimming pools, play grounds, sports centres, car & coach parks, parks, dog walks, etc etc.
With the lorries we have today and quarries just a mile away the lake could be filled in a few months for very small money and topped with gravel. A gift from God to Galway.

Its a good point in fairness to you but not going to happen. First you'd have the heads on Lough Atalia going mental about losing their "lake" views and the council there are utter clowns....Lets put in a roundabout...lets take out a roundabout...Lets not let anyone drive in bus lanes off peak, and do them if they are caught in one at 9pm on a Sunday. Love Galway though.

stampydmonkey · 31-10-2015 8:49am

What about the otter..would some please think of the otter!!

Red_Wake · 31-10-2015 9:34am

Nothing yet about Lough Atalia being an open sewer?

Unrealistic · 31-10-2015 11:46am

noelogara wrote: »

Driving through Galway is always slow and difficult and Lough Atalia a shallow lake within walking distance of the city centre is the most underutilised and wasted asset sitting on the city's doorstep which could provide 100 acres of the most modern amenities such as swimming pools, play grounds, sports centres, car & coach parks, parks, dog walks, etc etc.
With the lorries we have today and quarries just a mile away the lake could be filled in a few months for very small money and topped with gravel. A gift from God to Galway.

I think you're on to something there but you should be more ambitious. We could excavate the Twelve Pins, the Maumturks and any other hillock higher than 50m in Connemara and dump the whole lot into Galway Bay. Then with all that extra usable land, both in the former Galway Bay and and the now flat Connemara, we could build hundreds of miles of extra roads, car parks, shopping malls etc. No more need for controversies about the route of a bypass north of the city or what aircraft to use to fly to the Aran Islands. We can just build a 10 lane highway from Oranmore to Kilronan instead.

Second Toughest in_the Freshers · 31-10-2015 12:08pm

Red_Wake wrote: »

Nothing yet about Lough Atalia being an open sewer?

Shur the Prince's Street gardens in Edinburgh used be a huge open sewer, till they drained it.

perfectisthe · 31-10-2015 12:25pm

Unrealistic wrote: »

I think you're on to something there but you should be more ambitious. We could excavate the Twelve Pins, the Maumturks and any other hillock higher than 50m in Connemara and dump the whole lot into Galway Bay. Then with all that extra usable land, both in the former Galway Bay and and the now flat Connemara, we could build hundreds of miles of extra roads, car parks, shopping malls etc. No more need for controversies about the route of a bypass north of the city or what aircraft to use to fly to the Aran Islands. We can just build a 10 lane highway from Oranmore to Kilronan instead.

Proper order.

Eyre Square and the Spanish Arch are just sitting there as well. Plenty of scope for a few extra car parks.

Second Toughest in_the Freshers · 31-10-2015 1:23pm

Don't it always seem to go, you don't know what you've till it's gone..

outsidein98 · 31-10-2015 2:11pm

It is fair to say it's a wasted asset. At the very least there should be some form of water sports facility. Even a park laid out on the shoreline. But as ever there seems to be a lack of vision and ambition in Galway.

Mrs OBumble · 31-10-2015 2:17pm

outsidein98 wrote: »

It is fair to say it's a wasted asset. At the very least there should be some form of water sports facility. Even a park laid out on the shoreline. But as ever there seems to be a lack of vision and ambition in Galway.

Have you smelt it in summer?

pmasterson95 · 31-10-2015 2:19pm

We shoud look to the skys. So much wasted potential there.

outsidein98 · 31-10-2015 2:22pm

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Have you smelt it in summer?

Easily sorted if the will was there.

McTigs · 31-10-2015 9:40pm

sully2010 wrote: »

Lets not let anyone drive in bus lanes off peak, and do them if they are caught in one at 9pm on a Sunday. Love Galway though.

why on earth would anyone want to drive in the bus lane at 9pm on a Sunday when there is loads of space in the regular lane?

outsidein98 · 31-10-2015 11:38pm

McTigs wrote: »

why on earth would anyone want to drive in the bus lane at 9pm on a Sunday when there is loads of space in the regular lane?

You haven't driven in the regular lane very often have you? 9pm gets quiet but only 3am is quieter.

J.pilkington · 01-11-2015 3:37pm

McTigs wrote: »

why on earth would anyone want to drive in the bus lane at 9pm on a Sunday when there is loads of space in the regular lane?

You are taking the next left and want to slow down but not interfere with other drivers?

You want to drive at 50ks(speed limit) and not have drivers up your arse

You are driving a tractor and do not want to hold other motorists up

01-11-2015 3:41pm

Isn't the whole purpose of Lough Atalia to act as an overflow for the docks?

gordongekko · 01-11-2015 8:43pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Isn't the whole purpose of Lough Atalia to act as an overflow for the docks?

Certainly smells like that.

joeKel73 · 02-11-2015 9:33am

Deleted User wrote: »

Isn't the whole purpose of Lough Atalia to act as an overflow for the docks?

No

02-11-2015 12:43pm

We're talking about the body of water down by the Docks & the Huntsman? I could have sworn that it was purpose built to be an overflow for the docks - it's manmade, is it not? Unless I'm misremembering.

biko · 02-11-2015 1:43pm

The Lough actually helped defend Galway back in 1651, be kinda a shame to concrete it over now.

joeKel73 · 02-11-2015 1:54pm

Deleted User wrote: »

We're talking about the body of water down by the Docks & the Huntsman? I could have sworn that it was purpose built to be an overflow for the docks - it's manmade, is it not? Unless I'm misremembering.

How would that work?

The docks is opened to the sea shortly before high tide and closed shortly after high tide. Lough Atalia is also filled and partially drained with the tide.

The only way the docks would "overflow" when closed is if there was persistent torrential rain between high tides, and I'm sure in this case it can overflow at the gate back out to the sea. It would take a huge amount of rain to make a noticeable impact.

02-11-2015 2:27pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

We're talking about the body of water down by the Docks & the Huntsman? I could have sworn that it was purpose built to be an overflow for the docks - it's manmade, is it not? Unless I'm misremembering.

The lough is a tidal bay but the flow was restricted when the railway embankment was built - the poor flow and smell is man made.

It used to be open to the sea - there is a small quay across from the Eye cinema.

Thargor · 03-11-2015 11:53am

biko wrote: »

The Lough actually helped defend Galway back in 1651, be kinda a shame to concrete it over now.

How?

Brendan Flowers · 03-11-2015 12:01pm

Second Toughest in_the Freshers wrote: »

Don't it always seem to go, you don't know what you've till it's gone..

A song in which Joni complains they 'Paved paradise to put up a parking lot', a measure which actually would have alleviated traffic congestion on the outskirts of paradise, something which Joni singularly fails to point out, perhaps because it doesn't quite fit in with her blinkered view of the world. Nevertheless, nice song.

noelogara · 03-11-2015 12:37pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The lough is a tidal bay but the flow was restricted when the railway embankment was built - the poor flow and smell is man made.

It used to be open to the sea - there is a small quay across from the Eye cinema.

Agreed. Galway has developed all around this wastewater inlet and its conversion into a flatland hard surface would unify the city dramatically. It could have great potential as a city park with all amenities including a shuttle bus to connect to Eyre Square.
The city owns it and would have a hundred acres of prime city centre parkland to rival Stephens Green for the price of farmland.

03-11-2015 12:50pm

There's a load of undeveloped land already around the city that should be developed ahead of this.

You would be talking millions and many years to get this to the stage of even being ready for building foundations (look at the new docks proposal)

ben.schlomo · 03-11-2015 1:13pm

noelogara wrote: »

Agreed. Galway has developed all around this wastewater inlet and its conversion into a flatland hard surface would unify the city dramatically. It could have great potential as a city park with all amenities including a shuttle bus to connect to Eyre Square.
The city owns it and would have a hundred acres of prime city centre parkland to rival Stephens Green for the price of farmland.

We would be better filling in the Shannon, more land to be gained.

noelogara · 03-11-2015 1:15pm

Deleted User wrote: »

There's a load of undeveloped land already around the city that should be developed ahead of this.

You would be talking millions and many years to get this to the stage of even being ready for building foundations (look at the new docks proposal)

but this land would be right in the heart of the city. you could turn an eyesore into a valuable asset.
I reckon I could fill it myself in six months and it wouldnt cost the bomb you talk about if the councillors and planners could be kept at bay.

Private Joker · 03-11-2015 1:22pm

it has massive flood storage which would be lost . galway has bad enough flooding issues without adding to it

SeanPuddin_ · 03-11-2015 2:29pm

Thargor wrote: »

How?

It was part of the Eastern shoreline back then, helping to restrict Coote to a siege rather than attack. Defeat was inevitable though really.

https:// upload. wikimedia. org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Old-Galway.jpg

Thargor · 03-11-2015 3:04pm

Interesting thanks.

Private Joker wrote: »

it has massive flood storage which would be lost . galway has bad enough flooding issues without adding to it

Thats not flood storage, its the Atlantic! You could get away with filling it in as long as you ensured the same drainage reached the water unimpeded.

Private Joker · 03-11-2015 3:31pm

Thargor wrote: »

Interesting thanks.

Thats not flood storage, its the Atlantic! You could get away with filling it in as long as you ensured the same drainage reached the water unimpeded.

Of course its flood storage, all surface water in galway eventually finds its way to the atlantic . lough atalia attenuates the storm water

biko · 03-11-2015 3:43pm

Googling "flood storage" I found a page that describes it and as I see it LA is just a small bay open to the big bay/Atlantic and thus not flood storage (which is more like a plain along a river that tends to flood).

Private Joker · 03-11-2015 4:14pm

biko wrote: »

Googling "flood storage" I found a page that describes it and as I see it LA is just a small bay open to the big bay/Atlantic and thus not flood storage (which is more like a plain along a river that tends to flood).

I'd usually agree with you Biko but the fact that its brackish would suggest that it is storm water storage, granted all the water that drains to it could be diverted and pumped out to sea. anyway its a pedantic argument . there are numerous other reasons why it wouldnt and shouldnt happen

03-11-2015 4:54pm

noelogara wrote: »

The city owns it and would have a hundred acres of prime city centre parkland to rival Stephens Green for the price of farmland.

Are you sure the city owns it?

When the Mutton Island causeway was being developed it was discovered that the Grattan family owned the foreshore (the bit of land between high tide and low tide).
Land has been recovered from the sea in Galway before along Grattan Road, Toft Park, Sea Road. I can't imagine it is cheap.

Thargor · 03-11-2015 5:18pm

Private Joker wrote: »

I'd usually agree with you Biko but the fact that its brackish would suggest that it is storm water storage, granted all the water that drains to it could be diverted and pumped out to sea. anyway its a pedantic argument . there are numerous other reasons why it wouldnt and shouldnt happen

What are you on about? Its a tiny inlet of the Atlantic, its completely open to the sea, it doesn't store anything, you might as well call all of Galway Bay "Flood Storage".

Private Joker · 03-11-2015 9:03pm

Thargor wrote: »

What are you on about? Its a tiny inlet of the Atlantic, its completely open to the sea, it doesn't store anything, you might as well call all of Galway Bay "Flood Storage".

It's an estuarine lagoon But I take your point . Flood Storage is probably the wrong phrase for it , although it does play an important drainage role as does galway bay.

noelogara · 03-11-2015 10:18pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Are you sure the city owns it?

When the Mutton Island causeway was being developed it was discovered that the Grattan family owned the foreshore (the bit of land between high tide and low tide).
Land has been recovered from the sea in Galway before along Grattan Road, Toft Park, Sea Road. I can't imagine it is cheap.

Actually nobody owns it. Its not registered in the land registry to anybody and therefore it is open for anybody to stake a claim but they would have to fence it off adverse to the public and hold it for at least twelve years in order to claim it as private property and thats not likely to happen.
Because it has been open or common for many years due to its useless condition, even if somebody tried to claim it now they would not be able to sustain a claim.
A fleet of lorries would fill the shallow bay in a few months at the rate of an acre per day and all from the local quarries just a mile away.
the few deep spots could be left for water sports and swimming pools. the stone could be topped with gravel and then surfaced with tarmac or turf to make a lovely parkland that would rival Stephens Green.

Robbo · 04-11-2015 10:47am

noelogara wrote: »

Actually nobody owns it. Its not registered in the land registry to anybody and therefore it is open for anybody to stake a claim but they would have to fence it off adverse to the public and hold it for at least twelve years in order to claim it as private property and thats not likely to happen.
Because it has been open or common for many years due to its useless condition, even if somebody tried to claim it now they would not be able to sustain a claim.
A fleet of lorries would fill the shallow bay in a few months at the rate of an acre per day and all from the local quarries just a mile away.
the few deep spots could be left for water sports and swimming pools. the stone could be topped with gravel and then surfaced with tarmac or turf to make a lovely parkland that would rival Stephens Green.

Or perhaps a tile showroom?

Cheshire Cat · 04-11-2015 2:26pm

noelogara wrote: »

Actually nobody owns it. Its not registered in the land registry to anybody and therefore it is open for anybody to stake a claim but they would have to fence it off adverse to the public and hold it for at least twelve years in order to claim it as private property and thats not likely to happen.
Because it has been open or common for many years due to its useless condition, even if somebody tried to claim it now they would not be able to sustain a claim.
A fleet of lorries would fill the shallow bay in a few months at the rate of an acre per day and all from the local quarries just a mile away.
the few deep spots could be left for water sports and swimming pools. the stone could be topped with gravel and then surfaced with tarmac or turf to make a lovely parkland that would rival Stephens Green.

You don't have an interest in any haulage companies or quarries, by any chance?

noelogara · 04-11-2015 4:03pm

Cheshire Cat wrote: »

You don't have an interest in any haulage companies or quarries, by any chance?

No. The only interest I have is that I have been passing it on my way to the city for years and years and often wondered why such an easily recoverable city site is left untouched especially as Galway is probably the most traffic congested city in the country and is surrounded with stones. Its got narrow street, few car parks and no main street through the centre. The bay would provide thousands of free car and lorry spaces to benefit the city by keeping the shoppers traffic on the edge of the city centre.

Your Face · 04-11-2015 4:11pm

I wouldn't tap it.

noelogara · 06-11-2015 11:50am

Your Face wrote: »

I wouldn't tap it.

ah sorry but I forgot that there would be conflicting interests in my suggestion. I wasnt thinking vested interests but about the overall benefit to alleviate traffic congestion.
No doubt people on the Salthill side of the city wouldnt like to see the city focus shift to the west side swimming pools and parks and the Renmore residents might be miffed with all that traffic on their doorstep. Then the residents bordering the bay would lose their bay view for a big car park and the sound and dust of lorries would upset them.
There's a lot of conflicting interests at stake and people resist change and innovation. In any case its for the Galway people to decide and debate but speaking as an outsider its a no brainer.
A massive free car park on the city's edge, a park to rival Stephens Green, olympic size swimming pools at no cost, three thousand cars relieved from city centre, a relief road to city centre, all built on an ugly backwater that stinks in hot weather and has been an obstacle to avoid since Galway was first inhabited.

ben.schlomo · 06-11-2015 11:55am

noelogara wrote: »

ah sorry but I forgot that there would be conflicting interests in my suggestion. I wasnt thinking vested interests but about the overall benefit to alleviate traffic congestion.
No doubt people on the Salthill side of the city wouldnt like to see the city focus shift to the west side swimming pools and parks and the Renmore residents might be miffed with all that traffic on their doorstep. Then the residents bordering the bay would lose their bay view for a big car park and the sound and dust of lorries would upset them.
There's a lot of conflicting interests at stake and people resist change and innovation. In any case its for the Galway people to decide and debate but speaking as an outsider its a no brainer.
A massive free car park on the city's edge, a park to rival Stephens Green, olympic size swimming pools at no cost, three thousand cars relieved from city centre, a relief road to city centre, all built on an ugly backwater that stinks in hot weather and has been an obstacle to avoid since Galway was first inhabited.

So who makes money from it, who pays to fill it in, all volunteer work? Laughable.

noelogara · 06-11-2015 12:44pm

ben.schlomo wrote: »

So who makes money from it, who pays to fill it in, all volunteer work? Laughable.

its simple. Basically its a free site needing a bit of remedial work.
It would take a fleet of say twenty trucks one day to fill one acre putting a meter high of stone all over if each truck could drop ten loads a day.
So in one hundred days the 100 acre bay would be filled with a meter high of stone barring the swim pool areas of course.
Then the whole area could be covered again with gravel to the same depth putting an average of two meters of fill all over with a central drainage duct to the sea.
About one hundred Euros per load or 1000 euros per truck per day. for twenty trucks it would be 20,000 per day and for 100 acres it would be 2,000,000 Euros.
Then the gravel layer would be the same again making a total of 4,000,000.
The committee would then be able to put a small charge of say two euros per day for car parking and that would generate a daily income of twenty to fifty thousand Euros and that would pay off the bank loan that financed the development in a year or two.
The charge could be dropped once the loan was repaid or it could be levied again for swimming pool development etc.
I reckon you wouldnt get many acres of prime real estate in Galway city centre for five million today and here is one hundred acres going free but then the gift horse is never recognised.

Robbo · 06-11-2015 2:40pm

noelogara wrote: »

its simple. Basically its a free site needing a bit of remedial work.
It would take a fleet of say twenty trucks one day to fill one acre putting a meter high of stone all over if each truck could drop ten loads a day.
So in one hundred days the 100 acre bay would be filled with a meter high of stone barring the swim pool areas of course.
Then the whole area could be covered again with gravel to the same depth putting an average of two meters of fill all over with a central drainage duct to the sea.
About one hundred Euros per load or 1000 euros per truck per day. for twenty trucks it would be 20,000 per day and for 100 acres it would be 2,000,000 Euros.
Then the gravel layer would be the same again making a total of 4,000,000.
The committee would then be able to put a small charge of say two euros per day for car parking and that would generate a daily income of twenty to fifty thousand Euros and that would pay off the bank loan that financed the development in a year or two.
The charge could be dropped once the loan was repaid or it could be levied again for swimming pool development etc.
I reckon you wouldnt get many acres of prime real estate in Galway city centre for five million today and here is one hundred acres going free but then the gift horse is never recognised.

I had a lengthy post typed out detailing many other things that would costs many other millions, if the will existed for such a project.

I then thought better of it as it'll only encourage this schemola.

However, I'll ask one question in two parts:

How do you think clean title can be acquired by the "committee" to the "land", if at all?
Have you had concern for the many carpet-baggers that may come out of the woodwork with their hands out; with tenuous claims to the land and an appetite for vexatious litigation?

forumfiend · 06-11-2015 5:04pm

Robbo wrote: »

tenuous claims to the land and an appetite for vexatious litigation?

Something like that happened with Dartmouth Square in Dublin a few years ago but I'm sure it would never happen here.

biko · 06-11-2015 5:08pm

If only I could lock developer's plans as easy as I can lock this thread maybe we wouldn't have had the recession.

Lough Atalia 100 acres of untapped amenity

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