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23-08-2010, 13:37   #1
TippFan77
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Requirement to register racing greyhounds with Irish Coursing Club

Any views on the current rule requiring that greyhounds be registered with the ICC. Fine, I say, if they are coursing dogs, but why should someone who wants to race his dog on the track have to pay a registration fee to the hare coursing people?

A bit like asking a hurler to register with a rugby club or some other unrelated organisation.

The point is: Not all greyhound owners support hare coursing...so I believe they should be entitled tro register with, say, Bord na gCon. The option should be there.
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24-08-2010, 12:57   #2
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The i.c.c produce the stud book and register all greyhounds. The igb and i.c.c have to work together as there is a crossover between the organisations .
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25-08-2010, 10:57   #3
TippFan77
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ICC and IGB

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The i.c.c produce the stud book and register all greyhounds. The igb and i.c.c have to work together as there is a crossover between the organisations .
Yes...but my point is that, while coursing people have no objection that we know of to greyhound racing, the same cannot be said of all owners of greyhounds entered on the track. Coursing is not universally loved.

What I am suggesting that coursing dogs be registered with the ICC...and racing dogs be registered with a seperate body. Nobody could fault that.

The present situation is most unfair in my opinion...Take the horse world for example. We know many people support hunting...but it would be unfair to require anyone who wishes to take up horse jumping to join a foxhunt...

It's about respecting people's views on these things...
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25-08-2010, 14:26   #4
convert
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Originally Posted by TippFan77 View Post
.Take the horse world for example. We know many people support hunting...but it would be unfair to require anyone who wishes to take up horse jumping to join a foxhunt...
Horses don't have to be registered with any body in order to hunt. If an owner wants to send their horse show jumping, they must register with the SJI. For eventing it's Eventing Ireland. If the horse goes racing, then their passport needs to be registered with the Turf Club.

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It's about respecting people's views on these things.
Maybe I'm wrong, but from reading your posts it seems you want the ICC and IGB to change their regulations because it doesn't suit your views. Surely that's not respecting their veiws or the workings of the organisation(s)?
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25-08-2010, 17:10   #5
TippFan77
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ICC and IGB

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Horses don't have to be registered with any body in order to hunt. If an owner wants to send their horse show jumping, they must register with the SJI. For eventing it's Eventing Ireland. If the horse goes racing, then their passport needs to be registered with the Turf Club.



Maybe I'm wrong, but from reading your posts it seems you want the ICC and IGB to change their regulations because it doesn't suit your views. Surely that's not respecting their veiws or the workings of the organisation(s)?
You may possibly be missing the point...it's about respecting the views of people within the greyhound industry AND members of the public who may wish to get involved in track racing but do not, for ethical reasons, want to support hare coursing.

Any change on this issue I reckon has to come from the legislators because this rule obliging people to register both racing and coursing dogs with the ICC is actually legally binding. People don't have a choice.

I'm not out to get the ICC...just suggesting that the substantial number of people in this country who detest coursing but want to get into track racing...should not be blocked or held back by this rule.

Coursing and track racing are different sports, even if both involve greyhounds.

So why not have either 1) seperate registration bodies for each sport or 2) have all greyhounds (coursing and trackers) registered with IGB?

People who joind Sinn Fein no longer have to express support for the "armed struggle"...hurlers don't have to register with a rugby club or vice versa...and incidentally it's not to suit my own personal views on coursing that I propose this change.

I don't advocate an all-out ban on coursing, just cleaning up one's act where necesary...but I think it's grossly unfair to expect people out there who see all coursing as cruel etc to pay a fee (of any kind) to the umbrella organisation for coursing when they only want to race a dog on the track...
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26-08-2010, 01:02   #6
scartman1
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When track racing was established in the 1920's it was controlled by the ICC. in 1958 the running of the tracks was handed over to the newly formed Bord na Gon, or IGb in latter day speak, but the stud book remained in the control of the ICC. The stud book and its integrity goes back even further when it was controled by the National Coursing club in England. The ICC split from them in the 1920's i think and took control of the Irish stud book. Irish dogs have since grown to be the most dominant breed in the world today.
The ICC has a revenue stream from the registration and control this side of the industry very effectively.
Greyhound supporters are generally supportive of both disciplines and the objectors of conscience that you refer to are few and far between. It wouldn't make sense to change it for this minor issue if it is even an issue at all.

by the way people should go coursing and see for themselves the great work the ICC do in hare conservation.
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26-08-2010, 09:53   #7
TippFan77
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Hardly a minor issue?

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When track racing was established in the 1920's it was controlled by the ICC. in 1958 the running of the tracks was handed over to the newly formed Bord na Gon, or IGb in latter day speak, but the stud book remained in the control of the ICC. The stud book and its integrity goes back even further when it was controled by the National Coursing club in England. The ICC split from them in the 1920's i think and took control of the Irish stud book. Irish dogs have since grown to be the most dominant breed in the world today.
The ICC has a revenue stream from the registration and control this side of the industry very effectively.
Greyhound supporters are generally supportive of both disciplines and the objectors of conscience that you refer to are few and far between. It wouldn't make sense to change it for this minor issue if it is even an issue at all.

by the way people should go coursing and see for themselves the great work the ICC do in hare conservation.
I have no problem Scartman with your assessment of the ICC and its performance, but that isn't really the issue I was raising, and I'm afraid I can't agree that the widespread objection to coursing is a minor issue for people who wish to get involved in greyhound track racing only.

I personally many people who simply will not go near greyhound racing because they can't support hare coursing...which they would clearly be doing if they paid a registration fee to the ICC.

This is not to denigrate the ICC...the point is that greyhound track racing enjoys far more more public approval than hare coursing...whereas coursing as you know has something of a shadow over it for many people, and it's banned in a number of countries.

Let me repeat that I'm not advocating banning coursing itself, as I believe that it can be cleaned up where necessary. What I can't accept is forcing people to subsidise coursing before they can get into track racing.

Likewise I wouldn't expect someone who joined a hurling club to pay a registration fee to a cricket club instead...or people
who join Sinn Fein to register with the IRA...that would be absurd and unfair...and so, I suggest, is compelling owners of racing greyhounds to, in effect, prop up hare coursing via that registration fee.

I have no issue with Scartman's suggestion that people attend coursing meetings or his views on the ICC's conservation policy. But coursing is coursing and racing is racing. Coursing is very different from racing and we see how RTE, for example, treats it differently, not giving coursing results while giving track racing nornal sports coverage.

At the very least I suggest we need a debate on the registration fee issue to see how the politicians will deal with this and address people's concerns.
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