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seaghán or seán?

  • 08-06-2010 10:23PM
    #1
    TEMPLAR KNIGHT
    Closed Accounts Posts: 961 ✭✭✭


    Hi, I dont know if this is the right place to put it but feel free to move it if it isnt. recently I heard there is another old irish way of spelling Seán and that is Seaghán is this true? did it originate before Seán started to be used or is it just another varation of Seán like shawn (I couldnt find much about it on google)?. thanks for reading!


Comments

  • #2
    Aard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,905 ✭✭✭Aard


    I don't know anything about "Seaghán", but I would imagine it is a spelling that predates the spelling reform. I doubt it was specifically Old Irish.

    Also, "Shawn" is just an Anglicisation of "Seán".


  • #3
    Micilin Muc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Micilin Muc


    The spelling Seaghán was used by the scribe Seaghán Mac Dómhnaill in 1780, which classifies as Modern Irish (what we speak today), as oppposed to Classical Irish (or Early Modern Irish) which was in use until the start of the seventeenth century.

    I reckon the newer spelling, Seán was probably first used by the end of the nineteenth century.


  • #4
    Micilin Muc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Micilin Muc


    The earliest reference I can find tonight to the spelling Seán is 1927 (from Dineen's Dictionary).

    I'm sure it goes back at least another 30 years or so, to when the people mentioned in the dictionary were christened.


  • #5
    Micilin Muc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Micilin Muc


    The 1901 and 1911 censuses give the following hits:
    • 1901: Seaghán (14) Seán (0)
    • 1911: Seaghán (987) Seán (149)


  • #6
    An gal gréine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 942 ✭✭✭An gal gréine


    One question, Micilin, should'nt the fada be dropped when Seán has the 'gh' added? Dónal Ó Domhnall is an example of what I mean.


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  • #7
    Micilin Muc
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,842 ✭✭✭Micilin Muc


    I believe you're right. I've only seen it spelled (spelt?) Seaghan in any modern usage.

    According to Litriú na Gaeilge in An Caighdeán Oifigiúil, a gh or gha in the middle of a word would be omitted. It gives the following examples:
    • bleaghan > bleán
    • breághthacht > breáthacht

    The problem is that these recommendations were made in 1947. There was no standard previous to this ...


  • #8
    An gal gréine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 942 ✭✭✭An gal gréine


    I see....thanks for that. They're currently looking for recommendations for an updated caighdeán from any interested parties...results will be interesting.


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