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Day/Night rate.

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  • 01-11-2020 12:25pm
    #1
    johnire
    Registered Users Posts: 1,522 ✭✭✭


    Why are customers who have this tariff penalised as the day rate is higher than the normal day rate?


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    #2
    Electric Ireland: Una
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭Electric Ireland: Una


    Hi johnire,

    The night rate (in effect from 11pm to 8am at present) is approximately half of the day rate. So the day rate (including VAT) is (cents) 21.24 and the night rate (including VAT) is (cents) 10.49. They are lower if the customer pays by direct debit.

    Kind regards,
    Una


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    #3
    johnire
    Registered Users Posts: 1,522 ✭✭✭johnire


    Hi Una.

    Thanks for the reply.
    I thought that there was a difference in the unit rate between what’s charged at the daytime rate for accounts that have the night saver tariff and those that have not?
    I know at one stage that definitely was the case. Are you saying then that my daytime rate is exactly the same as my neighbours who don’t have a Nightsaver meter?
    I know I have to allow for any DD discount or online billing discount.

    Many thanks
    Electric Ireland: Una wrote: »
    Hi johnire,

    The night rate (in effect from 11pm to 8am at present) is approximately half of the day rate. So the day rate (including VAT) is (cents) 21.24 and the night rate (including VAT) is (cents) 10.49. They are lower if the customer pays by direct debit.

    Kind regards,
    Una


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    #4
    Electric Ireland: Una
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭Electric Ireland: Una


    Hi johnire,

    The day rate with the NightSaver is higher than the rate for a 24-hour meter.

    The night rate is significantly lower than the rate of the 24-hour meter though.

    This is the case for all providers - the meter is from ESB Networks.

    Kind regards,
    Una


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    #5
    johnire
    Registered Users Posts: 1,522 ✭✭✭johnire


    Hi Una

    That’s my question though.... why is the day rate higher?
    That means despite the fact that the night rate is cheaper some of those savings are being negated because the day rate is higher?
    It doesn’t make sense.
    Thanks
    Electric Ireland: Una wrote: »
    Hi johnire,

    The day rate with the NightSaver is higher than the rate for a 24-hour meter.

    The night rate is significantly lower than the rate of the 24-hour meter though.

    This is the case for all providers - the meter is from ESB Networks.

    Kind regards,
    Una


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    #6
    Electric Ireland: Una
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭Electric Ireland: Una


    Hi johnire,

    The day/night meter is primarily for customers who use significant amounts of electricity during the night/early morning (the night rate is in effect from 11pm to 8am at present; it will be in effect from midnight to 9am when the clocks change in March).

    If customers with night storage heating or an electric vehicle charger had a 24-hour meter, this would be costlier than having a day/night meter, during whose night rate hours the storage heaters heat up, and the electric vehicle can be charged.

    Una


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    #7
    johnire
    Registered Users Posts: 1,522 ✭✭✭johnire


    I’m sorry Una my question still isn’t being answered.
    I want to know very simply why the daytime unit rate on a double tariff meter is higher than the unit rate if I just had an ordinary meter? I appreciate the fact that the units used after 11pm/12 pm are at a cheaper rate-but thats irrelevant-that’s the whole point of having the meter in the first place.
    My point is and this is being conveniently ignored is that by having the day time unit rate higher than the normal daytime unit rate some of the savings made at nighttime are wiped out.
    I want to know why the daytime unit rate on a double tariff meter is higher than the daytime rate on an ordinary meter?
    Can you give me the exact price of the unit rate for a Double Tariff Meter(Urban) for Day and Night?
    Please give the price that allows for discount for online billing and Direct Debit and inclusive of VAT.
    Also then please give me the unit rate for an ordinary meter-again Urban with those same discounts.
    I will persist until I get a straight answer-I will contact the office of Pat ODoherty if necessary.

    Many thanks

    Electric Ireland: Una wrote: »
    Hi johnire,

    The day/night meter is primarily for customers who use significant amounts of electricity during the night/early morning (the night rate is in effect from 11pm to 8am at present; it will be in effect from midnight to 9am when the clocks change in March).

    If customers with night storage heating or an electric vehicle charger had a 24-hour meter, this would be costlier than having a day/night meter, during whose night rate hours the storage heaters heat up, and the electric vehicle can be charged.

    Una


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    #8
    Electric Ireland: Aoife
    Company Representative Posts: 361 Verified rep ✭Electric Ireland: Aoife


    Hi there, 

    We are looking to see if we can get further clarification on this, and we will get back to you.

    Kind regards, 
    Aoife 


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    #9
    JackieChang
    Registered Users Posts: 1,494 ✭✭✭JackieChang


    johnire wrote: »
    I want to know very simply why the daytime unit rate on a double tariff meter is higher than the unit rate if I just had an ordinary meter? I appreciate 
    Don't forget the standing charge is also €53 more expensive for the double tariff meter. €226 per year. 

    The normal meter standing charge is €173 per year. 


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    #10
    johnire
    Registered Users Posts: 1,522 ✭✭✭johnire


    Thank for pointing this out- I wasn’t aware of that.
    That makes it even worse- this reduces any savings made on the nighttime rate even further.
    ****Electric Ireland-please take note and I’d like an answer to that as well.
    JackieChang wrote: »
    Don't forget the standing charge is also €53 more expensive for the double tariff meter. €226 per year. 

    The normal meter standing charge is €173 per year. 


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    #11
    JackieChang
    Registered Users Posts: 1,494 ✭✭✭JackieChang


    Since I'm on the night "saver" rate, I'd also like to know why the standing charge is more expensive.


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    #12
    Black_Knight
    Moderators Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Black_Knight


    Interesting question about the standing charge. EI have a guide on what a standing charge is, but don't explain why it's more expensive than a 24hour rate.
    [font=Arial, "Arial Narrow", sans-serif]The standing charge is a fixed daily cost on your bill no matter how much electricity you use in your home. It is a combination of the fixed charges associated with providing and maintaining the supply of electricity to your home, the collection of meter readings and a share of the supplier costs in servicing your account. A low usage charge may apply where you use two units or less of electricity on average per day in a billing period (typically 61 days).[/font]


    [font=Arial, Arial Narrow, sans-serif]Providing and supplying is no different if you've a night rate.[/font]
    [font=Arial, Arial Narrow, sans-serif]Collection of meter readings isn't any different. I changed to a night rate meter and nothing changed, I still use the exact same meter.[/font]
    [font=Arial, Arial Narrow, sans-serif]Servicing my account, can't see why that incurs any additional expense.[/font]


    [font=Arial, Arial Narrow, sans-serif]Propping up the cheaper energy usage is the only reason I can see, similar to the "low usage charge".[/font]


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    #13
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,404 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    If a company sells two products and one product is unilaterally better value to the customer then it makes no sense to provide the other because nobody will sign up for it. If you were on a dual-rate and day was the same as everyone else and night cheaper then there would be zero point in signing up to the single rate. They simply have two different customers for people with different needs. In general if you use more than 4 units at night a night-meter is cheaper, if not there's no point.


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    #14
    Electric Ireland: Una
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭Electric Ireland: Una


    Hi all,

    Thanks for bearing with us.

    The different costs for 24-hour electricity and day/night electricity relate to the ESB Distribution Charges, applicable for all electricity billing companies and having to be applied differently for the two types of meter.

    With the day/night meter, the present prices with Electric Ireland are:

    Day unit (also known as KWH) - 21.24 cents including VAT; 20.07 cents with direct debit/online billing discount, including VAT.
    Night unit - 10.49 cents including VAT; 9.91 cents with direct debit/online billing discount, including VAT.
    Standing charge urban - €227 per year including VAT (approximately 62 cents per day); standing charge rural - €285.56 per year including VAT (approximately 78 cents per day).

    With the 24-hour meter, the present prices with Electric Ireland are:

    19.9 cents per unit, including VAT; 18.81 cents with direct debit/online billing discount, including VAT.
    Standing charge urban - €173.27 per year including VAT (approximately 47 cents per day); standing charge rural - €228.56 per year including VAT (approximately 63 cents per day).

    (There are more costs involved in ESB Networks supplying to rural than urban properties).

    Kind regards,
    Una


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