Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime?

freshpopcorn · 26-09-2019 5:22pm #1

I was watching a program on Virgin Media One about gangland crime in Ireland and a senior a Garda said something along the lines of that the average/social drug user contributes a lot to this?
(This would include cocaine,weed,etc or prescription drugs that you may purchase illegally).

I can see where the Gardai was coming from but I don't think most people would care. I wouldn't feel to guilty to be honest especially if I was in my late teens,etc.
However I wouldn't bother with anything now.

Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime?

riemann · 26-09-2019 5:25pm

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I was watching a program on Virgin Media One about gangland crime in Ireland and a senior a Garda said something along the lines of that the average/social drug user contributes a lot to this?
(This would include cocaine,weed,etc or prescription drugs that you may purchase illegally).

I can see where the Gardai was coming from but I don't think most people would care. I wouldn't feel to guilty to be honest especially if I was in my late teens,etc.
However I wouldn't bother with anything now.

Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime?

Absolutely not.

Recreational drug use has no correlation to gangland crime. How would it?

I've seen the wire so I know what I'm talking about.

Will I Am Not · 26-09-2019 5:25pm

I stopped taking drugs years ago and it didn’t make any difference so no.

BDI · 26-09-2019 5:28pm

I wonder how many people in the world would starve to death without the drugs trade.

Cordell · 26-09-2019 5:28pm

It's that false argument that if there will be no customers for their racket then criminals will become good standing tax paying citizens.

kneemos · 26-09-2019 5:30pm

Will I Am Not wrote: »

I stopped taking drugs years ago and it didn’t make any difference so no.

QED.

26-09-2019 5:31pm

I used to take drugs. I still do, but I used to, too.

King of Kings · 26-09-2019 5:31pm

Stupid argument. The state bans drugs creating a black market.
The huge success of the head shops and the resulting ire of drug gangs to these shops is testament to the fact that given a choice people would buy drugs legally.
Its the states decision to keep drugs illegal

26-09-2019 5:33pm

If the government don’t want the money funding criminal gangs then it’s up to them to tax and regulate the drugs.

99.9% of recreational drug users would be happy to pay a bit extra for taxed drugs of guaranteed quality from a legitimate source rather than from a criminal dealer.

They aren’t given that option unfortunately so there’s no other choice.
Some sensible policy from the government could easily change this and provide a windfall in revenues which are currently going through the net AND creating costs in policing.

frag420 · 26-09-2019 5:35pm

My mate grows mine and any chems we get are made by a chemist frond in Prague that we know, he studied in Trinity. No criminals involved and the quality is top notch!

Next...

Mickeroo · 26-09-2019 5:36pm

Haven't used them in years but thanks to cognitive dissonance/mental acrobatics I'd likely not feel guilty if I still used them.

kneemos · 26-09-2019 5:41pm

Batrachotox wrote: »

If the government don’t want the money funding criminal gangs then it’s up to them to tax and regulate the drugs.

99.9% of recreational drug users would be happy to pay a bit extra for taxed drugs of guaranteed quality from a legitimate source rather than from a criminal dealer.

They aren’t given that option unfortunately so there’s no other choice.
Some sensible policy from the government could easily change this and provide a windfall in revenues which are currently going through the net AND creating costs in policing.

Yeah sure dealing out hallucinogens,speed and opiods is a spiffing idea.

26-09-2019 5:48pm

kneemos wrote: »

Yeah sure dealing out hallucinogens,speed and opiods is a spiffing idea.

Speed is already given out in the form of ADHD drugs (Adderal is literally amphetamine salts) while opioids are widely prescribed and available.

People aren’t just going to suddenly start doing heroin for the craic just because there’s no criminal penalty. If I wanted to I could go into an off license right now and buy enough alcohol to kill me. Anyone can. But it doesn’t mean that they avail of that freedom just because they can.

Portugal has decriminalised drugs for years now, explain to me why their society hasn’t come crashing down around their ears?

The Satanist · 26-09-2019 5:53pm

I bypass the evil drug gangs by having my heroin shipped directly from Afghanistan to my PO Box no. 666, GPO, Dublin 1 every month.

skallywag · 26-09-2019 5:53pm

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime?

Not if you grow your own.

skallywag · 26-09-2019 5:58pm

frag420 wrote: »

... by a chemist frond in Prague...

Is that a Trinity pronunciation of 'Friend' ?

kneemos · 26-09-2019 5:58pm

Batrachotox wrote: »

Speed is already given out in the form of ADHD drugs (Adderal is literally amphetamine salts) while opioids are widely prescribed and available.

People aren’t just going to suddenly start doing heroin for the craic just because there’s no criminal penalty. If I wanted to I could go into an off license right now and buy enough alcohol to kill me. Anyone can. But it doesn’t mean that they avail of that freedom just because they can.

Portugal has decriminalised drugs for years now, explain to me why their society hasn’t come crashing down around their ears?

They decriminalised small quantities for personal use, they're still illegal.
Those caught are given treatment rather than a criminal record.

Only need to look to America for what happens when heavy duty and legal drugs are freely available.

Tacitus Kilgore · 26-09-2019 6:01pm

The only thing getting fueled by my drug use is the profits from mega meanies and purple monster munch sales.

Seriously though, I would much prefer to pay double and buy it legally if it were an option, I'm a shite gardener and it really shows in my plants

enricoh · 26-09-2019 6:02pm

The Satanist wrote: »

I bypass the evil drug gangs by having my heroin shipped directly from Afghanistan to my PO Box no. 666, GPO, Dublin 1 every month.

A mate of nine buys all his online these days, he went abroad on a stag n got everything delivered to the hotel the datly they arrived.
I thought it was a very efficient service n no dealing with scobes!

uck51js9zml2yt · 26-09-2019 6:09pm

I didn't know my caffeine consumption contributed to gangland crime!!

harry Bailey esq · 26-09-2019 6:12pm

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I used to take drugs. I still do, but I used to, too.

Likewise. Is it contributing towards the coffers of 'gangland' ? A resounding yes. Do I feel guilty about it? Couldn't give a bollocks. Anyone who's wallet is full of rolled up notes at the end of a weekend and says they feel guilty about lining some ne'er-do-wells pockets is a liar.

boombang · 26-09-2019 6:12pm

Little did I know that all the talk on the boardwalk about "Blueies" related to my addition to addiction to Lindor truffles.

Lindt-Lindor-Truffles-Dark-Chocolate_400x.jpg?v=1559663573

Lindt-Lindor-Truffles-Dark-Chocolate_400x.jpg?v=1559663573

harry Bailey esq · 26-09-2019 6:23pm

boombang wrote: »

Little did I know that all the talk on the boardwalk about "Blueies" related to my addition to addiction to Lindor truffles.

It would make more sense financially to go on the brown...

Arghus · 26-09-2019 6:31pm

I don't use drugs a lot. I might take a pill a few times a year, maybe 4-5 times, but, yes, I would think of that aspect of it. It's one of the reasons I don't partake all that much.

There are some people I know that are absolute drug hoovers, will take anything and do so all the time. I don't think they think about it all.

What I find interesting is that some of them - not all of them - are painfully right-on about a load of things: don't eat meat, very much into social justice, but don't have much qualms about gobbling up drugs that aren't exactly ethically sourced.

mr_fegelien · 26-09-2019 6:35pm

Batrachotox wrote: »

Speed is already given out in the form of ADHD drugs (Adderal is literally amphetamine salts) while opioids are widely prescribed and available.

People aren’t just going to suddenly start doing heroin for the craic just because there’s no criminal penalty. If I wanted to I could go into an off license right now and buy enough alcohol to kill me. Anyone can. But it doesn’t mean that they avail of that freedom just because they can.

Portugal has decriminalised drugs for years now, explain to me why their society hasn’t come crashing down around their ears?

True but your wrong that Speed is given out. Not here in Ireland. In fact one of my American friends who has ADHD and found difficulty getting methylphenidate (Ritalin) said, if a doctor prescribes you ADHD meds in Ireland, he's probably fake.

Doctors here and in the U.K. are reluctant to give opioids to cancer patients, nevermind ADHD meds to kids.

mr_fegelien · 26-09-2019 6:39pm

I will say this and say this again, is this thread a minority of Irish people, or the majority? Do most Irish people approve of drug use?

My family is African and you can imagine their views on drugs. Quite uneduated especially about weed.

mr_fegelien · 26-09-2019 6:39pm

Frank N Stein wrote: »

One of the reasons I refuse to take drugs, you are giving money to scum.

That a sod reason because would you stop drinking alcohol if it got banned tomorrow? Because you'd be fueling gangland crime?

HorrorScope · 26-09-2019 6:59pm

Nope no guilt here. Grow my own or buy it from a friend who does the same - you’d swear by the media we were all fueling cartels when like everything related to the “war on drugs”, it’s complete bull****.

topmanamillion · 26-09-2019 7:05pm

I used to be on the "legalise drugs" side. But some traveling changed my mind where I saw first hand the reality in countries where it is legal.

If the government legalised say cannabis, it would have to adhere to standards and it'd be more expensive than your average lad growing and selling it in his attic sells it for.
Not only that but certain strains would be deemed unfit for human consumption as they'd be deemed too potent/toxic. This is where the criminals would step in.

Each to their own but there's alot of naivety here from people who are putting money in the hands of the very people they are on other threads giving out about.

AlphabetCards · 26-09-2019 7:06pm

If you are paying for coke, your a tool tbh. Think of everyone along the way that suffers for your ****ty middle-class habit.

Aceandstuff · 26-09-2019 7:06pm

I don't do any illegal drugs, I just make my own jenkem at home.

26-09-2019 7:09pm

mr_fegelien wrote: »

True but your wrong that Speed is given out. Not here in Ireland. In fact one of my American friends who has ADHD and found difficulty getting methylphenidate (Ritalin) said, if a doctor prescribes you ADHD meds in Ireland, he's probably fake.

Doctors here and in the U.K. are reluctant to give opioids to cancer patients, nevermind ADHD meds to kids.

Can’t speak for your friend, but methylphenidate/Ritalin are most certainly prescribed for ADHD in Ireland.

Skylinehead · 26-09-2019 8:21pm

I'd blame the people keeping it illegal actually. Do they feel guilt?

AllForIt · 26-09-2019 8:48pm

I take drugs to cope with the guilt.

It works.

corner of hells · 26-09-2019 8:54pm

mr_fegelien wrote: »

True but your wrong that Speed is given out. Not here in Ireland. In fact one of my American friends who has ADHD and found difficulty getting methylphenidate (Ritalin) said, if a doctor prescribes you ADHD meds in Ireland, he's probably fake.

Doctors here and in the U.K. are reluctant to give opioids to cancer patients, nevermind ADHD meds to kids.

I just dropped my stethoscope, fake doctors you say ?

harry Bailey esq · 26-09-2019 9:44pm

corner of hells wrote: »

I just dropped my stethoscope, fake doctors you say ?

My old friend Mr McGreg.. with a leg for an arm and an arm for a leg.

Hal3000 · 26-09-2019 9:49pm

frag420 wrote: »

My mate grows mine and any chems we get are made by a chemist frond in Prague that we know, he studied in Trinity. No criminals involved and the quality is top notch!

Next...

Next what ? You tell us Mr International Man of Mystery !

gctest50 · 26-09-2019 9:55pm

AlphabetCards wrote: »

If you are paying for coke, your a tool tbh. Think of everyone along the way that suffers for your ****ty middle-class habit.

How about the diamonds ?

How about kids compressor diving for gold ?

padd b1975 · 26-09-2019 10:23pm

BDI wrote: »

I wonder how many people in the world would starve to death without the drugs trade.

That would be offset by a massive decline in stoners getting the munchies.

Graces7 · 27-09-2019 12:59am

mr_fegelien wrote: »

True but your wrong that Speed is given out. Not here in Ireland. In fact one of my American friends who has ADHD and found difficulty getting methylphenidate (Ritalin) said, if a doctor prescribes you ADHD meds in Ireland, he's probably fake.

Doctors here and in the U.K. are reluctant to give opioids to cancer patients, nevermind ADHD meds to kids.

None of this is true. drs are wary of giving drugs to folk who do not need them .

mr_fegelien · 27-09-2019 2:00am

Graces7 wrote: »

None of this is true. drs are wary of giving drugs to folk who do not need them .

Aren't you agreeing with me in your post??? I did say that doctors were wary. But I think it's ott on the other side here, people who are in pain and people with mental issues not being treated properly by the system are denied medication because they might get addicted.

There's no doubt that the States has a big opioid problem but in a way it's confirmation bias. There are plenty of Americans who are prescribed these addictive painkillers and don't lose their job, go homeless, steal etc... My aunt is one of them. Prescribed 90 tablets of vidocin (hydrocodone) every month and I think she said the least she's used are 15 in a whole month with a spare bottle when she gets the doctor refilling them easily. She's not an addict.

Why can't doctors just be a bit liberal here? Besides, the drug addicts are going to get their drug of choice from the black market anyway. Didn't Scotlands valium crisis increase tremendously when they increased alcohol prices

Graces7 · 27-09-2019 7:07am

mr_fegelien wrote: »

Aren't you agreeing with me in your post??? I did say that doctors were wary. But I think it's ott on the other side here, people who are in pain and people with mental issues not being treated properly by the system are denied medication because they might get addicted.

There's no doubt that the States has a big opioid problem but in a way it's confirmation bias. There are plenty of Americans who are prescribed these addictive painkillers and don't lose their job, go homeless, steal etc... My aunt is one of them. Prescribed 90 tablets of vidocin (hydrocodone) every month and I think she said the least she's used are 15 in a whole month with a spare bottle when she gets the doctor refilling them easily. She's not an addict.

Why can't doctors just be a bit liberal here? Besides, the drug addicts are going to get their drug of choice from the black market anyway. Didn't Scotlands valium crisis increase tremendously when they increased alcohol prices

Cannot believe anyone with any intelligence wrote that; you expect drs, medically trained and experienced, to prescribe damaging drugs to feed addiction?

And in the US, those who need the meds are given them as your aunt is so what point are you trying to make?

But reading back to your earlier posts and threads..

TheMilkyPirate · 27-09-2019 7:10am

I couldn't give a ****e tbh.

debok · 27-09-2019 7:18am

mr_fegelien wrote: »

Aren't you agreeing with me in your post??? I did say that doctors were wary. But I think it's ott on the other side here, people who are in pain and people with mental issues not being treated properly by the system are denied medication because they might get addicted.

There's no doubt that the States has a big opioid problem but in a way it's confirmation bias. There are plenty of Americans who are prescribed these addictive painkillers and don't lose their job, go homeless, steal etc... My aunt is one of them. Prescribed 90 tablets of vidocin (hydrocodone) every month and I think she said the least she's used are 15 in a whole month with a spare bottle when she gets the doctor refilling them easily. She's not an addict.

Why can't doctors just be a bit liberal here? Besides, the drug addicts are going to get their drug of choice from the black market anyway. Didn't Scotlands valium crisis increase tremendously when they increased alcohol prices

She is an addict

weldoninhio · 27-09-2019 7:35am

frag420 wrote: »

My mate grows mine and any chems we get are made by a chemist frond in Prague that we know, he studied in Trinity. No criminals involved and the quality is top notch!

Next...

Eh, both your mates are criminals. It’s illegal to grow/manufacture drugs.

Samuel T. Cogley · 27-09-2019 7:53am

Just a couple of points. AFAIK Aderal (sp?) Isnt licenced in Ireland, even Ritalin is very tightly controlled. Portugal has decriminalised possession only and as with the swiss approach they've seen an increase in use although a decrease in harm.

All for full legalisation and regulation personally, but there will always be a black market and if you're using that be it for cigs or whatever you're funding God knows what.

27-09-2019 8:19am

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime?

I am the most irregular of drug users - and most of what I do use is given to me as gifts by students of the local university here and I never pay for it.

That said though if a government policy gives me a legal and illegal option for buying drugs - and I buy illegal - then I would indeed feel guilty for my choice to fuel illegal underground gangs. That is on me.

If government policy only gives me one option however - that is on them. Not a shred of guilt from me.

I know there is still an impressive value of illegal tobacco sales in Ireland. Last figure I saw was surprisingly large. However what I do not know is what % of legal drug sales it is. I get the feeling that most people - given the choice between legal expensive product and illegal less expensive product - tend to choose the legal option.

HorrorScope · 27-09-2019 8:45am

Deleted User wrote: »

I am the most irregular of drug users - and most of what I do use is given to me as gifts by students of the local university here and I never pay for it.

That said though if a government policy gives me a legal and illegal option for buying drugs - and I buy illegal - then I would indeed feel guilty for my choice to fuel illegal underground gangs. That is on me.

If government policy only gives me one option however - that is on them. Not a shred of guilt from me.

I know there is still an impressive value of illegal tobacco sales in Ireland. Last figure I saw was surprisingly large. However what I do not know is what % of legal drug sales it is. I get the feeling that most people - given the choice between legal expensive product and illegal less expensive product - tend to choose the legal option.

Your line about the government policy only giving one option applies to tobacco as wel. Over successive years we have watched them remove 10 boxes - only allowing smokers the option of 20 packs. They removed 12.5g packs of rolling tobacco, only allowing the minimum and more expensive 30g available. I'd even guess that smokers increased their intake because of these short sighted options, I would have happily stayed as a 10 a day smoker but government decided I was only allowed to buy 20 instead. And on top of that, they have increased the price of both year on year.

Meanwhile in illegal tobacco land, I can get a 50G pouch of rolling tobacco for 15e. I haven't bought tobacco products in a shop for at least 4 years and I never will again - there is limits to what people will put up with and we are far past that line in regards to tobacco.

sasta le · 27-09-2019 8:48am

frag420 wrote: »

My mate grows mine and any chems we get are made by a chemist frond in Prague that we know, he studied in Trinity. No criminals involved and the quality is top notch!

Next...

How ye get the drugs in?

Ragnar Lothbrok · 27-09-2019 9:58am

HorrorScope wrote: »

Your line about the government policy only giving one option applies to tobacco as wel. Over successive years we have watched them remove 10 boxes - only allowing smokers the option of 20 packs. They removed 12.5g packs of rolling tobacco, only allowing the minimum and more expensive 30g available. I'd even guess that smokers increased their intake because of these short sighted options, I would have happily stayed as a 10 a day smoker but government decided I was only allowed to buy 20 instead. And on top of that, they have increased the price of both year on year.

Meanwhile in illegal tobacco land, I can get a 50G pouch of rolling tobacco for 15e. I haven't bought tobacco products in a shop for at least 4 years and I never will again - there is limits to what people will put up with and we are far past that line in regards to tobacco.

I miss the old 10 boxes too. I now buy a pack of 29 JPS Blue (yes, 29!) every day. The normal 20 boxes look tiny to me now.

A few years ago I would regularly buy "dodgy" boxes, 200 for €40, but the quality wasn't great and then I read about the production methods and ingredients (ironic for a smoker I suppose) and decided that I'd go back to buying them in shops. There was also a documentary on TV around the same time explaining that the illegal cigarettes industry funded the major criminal gangs and that helped make my mind up.

sbsquarepants · 27-09-2019 10:20am

My drug taking days are behind me, but back when i was buying them i never cared in the slightest. The legality was a just never an issue for me, the chaos wrought in latin america and so on was just never an issue, the empowering of criminals here in Ireland was never an issue, and they're still not in all honesty.

People die for gold, for timber, for coffee, kids are worked like slaves for the cheap knickers you buy in penneys - the world is a fúcking cruel place.

My belief is that idiotic laws deserve no respect and the whole war on drugs / prohibition ship sailed decades ago. It's an absolutely failed policy, it's madness to keep pursuing it. Globally it has done far more harm than good and it has sucked countless billions into a black hole, that could have been much better used elsewhere.

Drugs are here to stay, people like drugs, pretending they don't is just lying to ourselves. We can legalise and regulate or accept the consequences. End of story really.

If you want to improve the lot of the worlds poor - pay more for your phone, or your coffee, or your socks - don't pat yourself on the back for not doing the odd line like that's made a jot of difference!

Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime?

Do you feel guilty that your drug use is fueling gangland crime? 187 votes

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