How to register motorcycle club??

chrabo · 25-02-2021 4:29pm #1

Hi folks, Looking to set up MX club with many riders to get going against new scrambler law.

Cant find online any criteria to set up club, or where to register etc.

Can someone advise me please??

ratracer · 25-02-2021 4:38pm

chrabo wrote: »

Hi folks, Looking to set up MX club with many riders to get going against new scrambler law.

Cant find online any criteria to set up club, or where to register etc.

Can someone advise me please??

What is it your looking to fight ‘against’ exactly? And what do you hope to achieve for your new club?

chrabo · 25-02-2021 4:48pm

To either get trials from colite to use for enduro riding, or get some land from state to make a track. Lads in Limerick going well with this now. We looking for more midlands and dublin/wicklow spots. Only this tbh.

Fabio · 25-02-2021 4:58pm

Fair play, although I don't know the answer to your question. Maybe try MAG Ireland, ask them how to go about it? FEMA might be another resource, they're the European representative for motorcycle groups.

The best of luck with the effort, it sounds good.

mr c · 25-02-2021 5:13pm

chrabo wrote: »

Hi folks, Looking to set up MX club with many riders to get going against new scrambler law.

Cant find online any criteria to set up club, or where to register etc.

Can someone advise me please??

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/sport_and_leisure/setting_up_a_new_club.html

I think that should help,sports club etc. very same thing afaik

ratracer · 25-02-2021 6:47pm

Best of luck with it, good to see interest in developing a sport.

Hotblack Desiato · 25-02-2021 7:13pm

chrabo wrote: »

To either get trials from colite to use for enduro riding, or get some land from state to make a track.

That's the funniest thing I've heard in years tbh :pac:

Will never happen as politicians in this country hate motorbikes and even if they didn't, insurance makes it impossible anyway.

Mjolnir · 25-02-2021 7:23pm

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

That's the funniest thing I've heard in years tbh :pac:

You'd have more chance asking the minister for a ........

100% but sure let them on with it, there's a very good reason there isn't any government funded bike tracks.

Not even taking into account the amount of road bike users is tiny never mind lads interested in trails, they're emails will be ignored.

There's no official body to set one up as far as I'm aware op. So unlike say cycling Ireland you don't have criteria to meet and can just set up and rock on. Good luck but go into it eyes wide open.

Also just note the new laws are more so aimed at young people on bikes in parks, greens and on roads.

chrabo · 25-02-2021 8:15pm

We will try to sort this out. I understand problem in parts of Dublin, Limerick and so on. But we are not criminals all of us. I have my own bikes insured, enduro as well. Hard work on.
Impossible is nothing, just do it!

Del2005 · 25-02-2021 8:16pm

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

That's the funniest thing I've heard in years tbh :pac:

Will never happen as politicians in this country hate motorbikes and even if they didn't, insurance makes it impossible anyway.

Yet we have bicycles doing nearly the exact same thing on state lands as the OP wants. So it's possible with the correct lobbying.

You could even say that motorcycles are safer than bicycles in forestry as people will hear the motorbikes unlike bicycles.

Mjolnir · 25-02-2021 8:27pm

Del2005 wrote: »

Yet we have bicycles doing nearly the exact same thing on state lands as the OP wants. So it's possible with the correct lobbying.

You could even say that motorcycles are safer than bicycles in forestry as people will hear the motorbikes unlike bicycles.

Motorbikes have a much higher risk to the user than bicycles, there's also a lot of cycle tracks that were never actually sanctioned and people just make and use them.

The liability implications are far too high, lobby as much as you like its been looked into by people from the view of it being government funded or privately funded and once they realised the implications in terms of liability was deemed a non runner.

chrabo · 25-02-2021 8:34pm

Mjolnir wrote: »

Motorbikes have a much higher risk to the user than bicycles, there's also a lot of cycle tracks that were never actually sanctioned and people just make and use them.

The liability implications are far too high, lobby as much as you like its been looked into by people from the view of it being government funded or privately funded and once they realised the implications in terms of liability was deemed a non runner.

But, bikers have no insurance, enduro motors have full insurance and they are road legal. It is a big difference

Mjolnir · 25-02-2021 8:39pm

chrabo wrote: »

But, bikers have no insurance, enduro motors have full insurance and they are road legal. It is a big difference

Land owner / track operator is still liable for any damages / injuries.

Those bikes are insured for road usage, against fire and theft and for commuting (believe it or not that is excluded as standard by one).
You'd have to ask the individual insurer if using it on a track is covered. However that is very unlikely as racing/track use is precluded by the policy.
Most of the bikes that would be used are not road legal either.

ratracer · 25-02-2021 8:42pm

chrabo wrote: »

But, bikers have no insurance, enduro motors have full insurance and they are road legal. It is a big difference

I think this is not the way to form a club!

Cyclists that are members of a recognised club are also members of Cycling Ireland, and have third party insurance.

Also, the new ‘scrambler’ laws are targeting scramblers that aren’t road legal afaik, so those with no lights, or reg, or tax and insurance. These things are legal requirements for motor vehicles, not so for cyclists.

chrabo · 25-02-2021 8:52pm

ratracer wrote: »

I think this is not the way to form a club!

Cyclists that are members of a recognised club are also members of Cycling Ireland, and have third party insurance.

Also, the new ‘scrambler’ laws are targeting scramblers that aren’t road legal afaik, so those with no lights, or reg, or tax and insurance. These things are legal requirements for motor vehicles, not so for cyclists.

this new law can be used against anyone.

Mjolnir · 25-02-2021 8:55pm

chrabo wrote: »

this new law can be used against anyone.

Anyone with a non road legal bike you're leaving out a very important aspect of it.

If you can find someone to allow you onto their land or fund it amongst your group go ahead.
Between the price of insurance and the cost of the inevitable claim it won't last long

afatbollix · 25-02-2021 9:03pm

https://www.motorcycling-ireland.com/

These guys will be able to help. They offer permits for the road races with insurance and what not.

They even have an Encro championship.

Maybe see if a club is near you already? That way you wouldn't have to start from scratch.

https://www.motorcycling-ireland.com/clubs.htm

Hillybilly4 · 25-02-2021 9:07pm

Motorcycling Ireland for your first port of call
https://www.motorcycling-ireland.com/

You'd need to affiliate to a governing body for your insurances etc.
YMSA is one that some Irish clubs use.
https://ymsaltd.co.uk/

Edit - cross-posted with the above!

two wheels good · 25-02-2021 9:34pm

Coillte have been known to permit motorsport events, car rallying or maybe "time trials" is the correct term. Staged on the graded forest tracks.
They charge for the pleasure and for making good the tracks afterwards. I've been told it's not cheap.
AFAIK they're always one-off events e.g. for a weekend. I suppose what you have in mind is a permanent track.
You might get some useful info from a relevant car club.

Cienciano · 25-02-2021 10:39pm

First thing in registering a MC. Kill a man

Hotblack Desiato · 26-02-2021 3:11am

Mjolnir wrote: »

Anyone with a non road legal bike you're leaving out a very important aspect of it.

If you can find someone to allow you onto their land or fund it amongst your group go ahead.
Between the price of insurance and the cost of the inevitable claim it won't last long

Any proposed law changes I've heard are to do with non road legal bikes being used in public places. Nothing to do with using a vehicle on private land with permission of the landowner but in this country, good luck with that - unless you own it yourself. Landowners don't even want walkers on their land.

Mjolnir · 26-02-2021 3:20am

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Any proposed law changes I've heard are to do with non road legal bikes being used in public places. Nothing to do with using a vehicle on private land with permission of the landowner but in this country, good luck with that - unless you own it yourself. Landowners don't even want walkers on their land.

There are a few places around the land owner let's people use it on their bike, yes it is very rare.

The new law was designed to prevent the usual kid getting a quad, scrambler etc for xmas and ripping around estates, roads and parks where they've no place being. Making it legal for the guard to take the it there and then. We can all see the obvious elephant in the room with its execution though.
That being said it is still illegal to use any non road legal bike in a public setting so if you're caught tough luck.

I'd genuinely love to be a fly on the wall for some of the possible arguments put forward though it'd be a great laugh.

endacl · 26-02-2021 3:22am

chrabo wrote: »

this new law can be used against anyone.

It'll only be used against people acting the maggot though. What's the issue?

Del2005 · 26-02-2021 5:57am

Mjolnir wrote: »

There are a few places around the land owner let's people use it on their bike, yes it is very rare.

The new law was designed to prevent the usual kid getting a quad, scrambler etc for xmas and ripping around estates, roads and parks where they've no place being. Making it legal for the guard to take the it there and then. We can all see the obvious elephant in the room with its execution though.
That being said it is still illegal to use any non road legal bike in a public setting so if you're caught tough luck.

I'd genuinely love to be a fly on the wall for some of the possible arguments put forward though it'd be a great laugh.

The Gardaí could always take a bike off someone if they where breaking the law in public, what this law is doing is that they can take the bike from your property or another private place without needing to catch you breaking the law.

endacl wrote: »

It'll only be used against people acting the maggot though. What's the issue?

How do you know that? Plenty of laws have had unintended consequences or have being used for other purposes.

Mjolnir · 26-02-2021 10:08am

Del2005 wrote: »

The Gardaí could always take a bike off someone if they where breaking the law in public, what this law is doing is that they can take the bike from your property or another private place without needing to catch you breaking the law.

How do you know that? Plenty of laws have had unintended consequences or have being used for other purposes.

Not strictly true, while I over simplified it the bil allows for them to enter your property to seize it without a warrant.
Under the circumstances you've been using it illegally.
Note an important part of the law is on private land without the land owners permission.
They still need to see the bike being used in am illegal manner they can't arrive at a random house see a non road bike and take it.

Also no they couldn't, speeding is breaking a law they can't take my bike off me for that, not that I ever would of course.

Interestingly I think the bill allows them to destroy it after seizure I briefly skimmed it, bit of a shame if a decent one is.destroyed if it's a generic Chinese junk bike, crush it to.

Hotblack Desiato · 26-02-2021 11:40am

Anybody got a link to the text of the bill? Otherwise we're arguing over what colour a cat in a dark room is

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 11:52am

chrabo wrote: »

To either get trials from colite to use for enduro riding, or get some land from state to make a track. Lads in Limerick going well with this now. We looking for more midlands and dublin/wicklow spots. Only this tbh.

I love a good laugh on a Friday morning.

Why should the Coillte, or the State just provide you with land?
I haven't seen such an entitled proposal in a while.

Coillte are a forestry service and they do try to make their forests accessible amenities for people, and do a reasonably good job of it. Lots of trails for walking and hiking and families. No way in hell are they going to give permission to motorbikers to go into forest trails and pose a hazard to people and families walking, ploughing up trails, ploughing up ground resulting in erosion.

I have seen motorbikers going into forests though, near land my family has near the mountains. They are an absolute pest. Damage roadways, damage boundaries, leave litter after them, tearing up the ground letting erosion set in in a severe way.

Why should the state hand over land to allow it be torn up? The state have enough going on with housing crisis, covid, mother and baby homes, etc and haven't the time to be entertaining this. If the state took a mad notion to hand over land for motorbiking, there would be uproar over it and rightly so.

Even in the event that they did,, you would have to get planning permission and insurance to use it as a scrambler course. And I can tell you it will be severely objected to by locals. The noise off of these bikes is very annoying, it travels for miles.
My sister has fellas on bikes going up the mountain behind her house and they are a constant source of annoyance. She likes to walk up those paths with the kids but some days she can't for fear of being mown down by these lunatics.

Politically, anything involving scramblers will be very unpopular. Basically, there are no votes to be had in it, and the majority of average families won't want to hear of it in their area.

These places also often attract antisocial behaviour. Here in Cork Vernon Mount was made into one of these tracks and there was always a lot of anitsocial behavior around the place, eventually resulting in the lovely historic house being burnt down.

You're off your game if you think this is a realistic proposal.

Henry Ford III · 26-02-2021 12:16pm

This attitude of entitlement is a strange one. There's no requirement for motorsport facilities to be provided just because a few people want them.

There might be an argument for a pay as you go facility to be built, but it would be very expensive.

Cienciano · 26-02-2021 12:18pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I love a good laugh on a Friday morning.

Why should the Coillte, or the State just provide you with land?
I haven't seen such an entitled proposal in a while.

Because that's what the state does. If you have a registered club you can ask for a grant. I was in 2 different clubs that were given the use of land.

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Coillte are a forestry service and they do try to make their forests accessible amenities for people, and do a reasonably good job of it. Lots of trails for walking and hiking and families. No way in hell are they going to give permission to motorbikers to go into forest trails and pose a hazard to people and families walking, ploughing up trails, ploughing up ground resulting in erosion.

Just wanted to laugh at that bit!

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I have seen motorbikers going into forests though, near land my family has near the mountains. They are an absolute pest. Damage roadways, damage boundaries, leave litter after them, tearing up the ground letting erosion set in in a severe way.

Littering? I've seen hillwalkers do the same thing. And using roadways is why they want a club!

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Why should the state hand over land to allow it be torn up? The state have enough going on with housing crisis, covid, mother and baby homes, etc and haven't the time to be entertaining this. If the state took a mad notion to hand over land for motorbiking, there would be uproar over it and rightly so.

Because they do it all the time for clubs. If you think the land is "torn up" wait till you see a farmer with a plough. The land is unusable afterwards :pac:

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Even in the event that they did,, you would have to get planning permission and insurance to use it as a scrambler course. And I can tell you it will be severely objected to by locals. The noise off of these bikes is very annoying, it travels for miles.

I agree with that. The noise travels for miles, if I lived in a rural area and a motocross track was built nearby I'd be well píssed off. Evergreen trees around it would help. Land around mondello, but it's probably all owned by farmers so not going to happen. Insurance is the big problem as you say.

TheBoyConor wrote: »

My sister has fellas on bikes going up the mountain behind her house and they are a constant source of annoyance. She likes to walk up those paths with the kids but some days she can't for fear of being mown down by these lunatics.

That's because they don't have a track!

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Politically, anything involving scramblers will be very unpopular. Basically, there are no votes to be had in it, and the majority of average families won't want to hear of it in their area.

These places also often attract antisocial behaviour. Here in Cork Vernon Mount was made into one of these tracks and there was always a lot of anitsocial behavior around the place, eventually resulting in the lovely historic house being burnt down.

You're off your game if you think this is a realistic proposal.

I don't think it'll happen, but because of noise and insurance. Ploughing up the land, erosion, the goverment giving land, someone on a bike leaving litter (no idea how you know it was bikers), your sister, antisocial behavior are all irrelevant. Just imagine how crazy it would be to say you don't want a football club built beside you because football fans once burned down an old house! Politically, it was the council that gave us land. But can't picture it happening a MX club.

Henry Ford III · 26-02-2021 12:31pm

Anti social behavior is a big part of the problem. Danger, noise and nuisance in public areas such as housing estates.

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 12:35pm

Op can go on ahead and write their letter or whatever, but they should be going in with the understanding that it is 99% likely to be a waste of time. The government wants to promote things like active travel and they give funding to clubs that engage in sports and development of young people's physical and mental health . It would be very hard to make that case for enduro bikes, especially so when it is a relatively high risk activity with a lot of negative elements like noise, and the general public not really holding off road motorbiking in a good view.

It would be polititcally unpopular. So it'll go nowhere. Never happen. OP be better off go and expend their efforts at something more worthwhile.

Most people view off road motor biking in a bad light due to the association with antisocial behaviour in housing estates. I personally also think the noise of it is a sort of antisocial behaviour. Why should people have to listen to the racket of these yokes on a sunday afternoon.

Cienciano · 26-02-2021 12:37pm

Henry Ford III wrote: »

This attitude of entitlement is a strange one. There's no requirement for motorsport facilities to be provided just because a few people want them.

There might be an argument for a pay as you go facility to be built, but it would be very expensive.

There is actually! They won't built it, they can provide land and part of the money. Depends on a lot of things. You need to be organised (which is doubtful in this case) but it's normal enough to be given land and money through government grants, lotto grants and county council. You'll only be given a small percentage of the money, hence clubs always trying to raise money. Even well funded local clubs with lots of members like GAA clubs.
To get a grant or land, you need a few things, be a proper sport, registered club, insured, certain amount of members. If you had all that and had 5000 members they'd listen. Having 10 lads with a bike, no organized club you'll be laughed at.

Even if you did get a field handed to you and €5 grant, there's probably all sorts of requirements from the insurance like having toilets, having areas barricaded off, having first aid on site. If you were given a random field you'd need to put in a car park. Your €5k would be spent just talking to people about building the car park, never mind a machine breaking ground.
Without and endless supply of cash, you need a lot of members willing to give up their time. A few builders, guy with a digger, solicitor, couple of brothers or sisters of high up councilors can save you tens of thousands.

Just googling motocross tracks ireland, there's a few around already. Definitely not worth starting your own when there's already a few others.

ratracer · 26-02-2021 12:41pm

LIGHTNING wrote: »

I hear this all the time, sounds like a great business opportunity! Why then do I see a million posts like this across boards and it goes nowhere...

Most definitely because it would be uninsurable!! The one private mountain bike facility that put huge investment into their tracks ( Bike Park Ireland) had to close after a couple of years. Despite being a very well run, and used, place, their increasing insurance costs simply made it unviable. I can't imagine an MX facility having any easier time with insurance.

Cienciano · 26-02-2021 12:47pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Most people view off road motor biking in a bad light due to the association with antisocial behaviour in housing estates. I personally also think the noise of it is a sort of antisocial behaviour. Why should people have to listen to the racket of these yokes on a sunday afternoon.

That's the exact reason a club is good! I live in clondalkin, if someone built a club in west dublin so the skangers could go there, I'd be delighted. Gives people a place to meet, a common interest.
But again, noise is the big problem. Imagine it being built within 100m of your house? Christ. There is land that could be used, near casement aerodrome for example.

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 12:49pm

Insurance costs.
You'd need planning permission. That then requires all sorts of environmental assessments for the effects on water, the ground. Engineers to design car park facilities, toilets, drainage with measures to prevent pollution of watercourses, a proper road entrance. You'd need to show some sort of plan that you can deal with fires or medical emergencies.
And all this, you can't just cobble it together yourself - you need to get professionals in each field to do it. And they don't come cheap. Professional fees are the biggest cost in a planning application.
And then building it to make it happen is a whole other level of cost.

And then you have to deal with the objectors in the area. Realistically, no-one is going to want this sort of thing in their area. So you will be fighting an uphill battle.
Antisocial behaviour is going to be a major concern. The thing is, if a rural person, say a farmer's son has one of these bikes, they can just tip it around the fields at home. But if a club track is to be made, then it is probably going to be largely people coming out from towns and cities to use it. And in those places, those with the bikes tend to be associated with more antisocial behaviour and trouble making. That will be another reason the local community will not want it - the risk of outsiders coming in causing trouble.

I live in Douglas, Cork. Vernon mount is a few miles away and I can hear the bikes regularly making noise. It is so annoying. And I can only imagine how annoying it is for people living over the way closer to it. And they have the whole area around vernon mount absolutely destroyed. The place is like a perpetual building site - all torn up. There are probably massive amounts of silt laden runoff running down into the tramore river.
If that place had not been a bike track, it is likely that it would not have attacted the antisocial behaviour that resulted in the burning of the house.

By all means, if you have a club bank account with a million in it you might get going OK.

But a few lads with a few bikes - get rich or keep dreaming.

Henry Ford III · 26-02-2021 1:33pm

Cienciano wrote: »

There is actually! They won't built it, they can provide land and part of the money. Depends on a lot of things. You need to be organised (which is doubtful in this case) but it's normal enough to be given land and money through government grants, lotto grants and county council. You'll only be given a small percentage of the money, hence clubs always trying to raise money. Even well funded local clubs with lots of members like GAA clubs.
To get a grant or land, you need a few things, be a proper sport, registered club, insured, certain amount of members. If you had all that and had 5000 members they'd listen. Having 10 lads with a bike, no organized club you'll be laughed at.

Even if you did get a field handed to you and €5 grant, there's probably all sorts of requirements from the insurance like having toilets, having areas barricaded off, having first aid on site. If you were given a random field you'd need to put in a car park. Your €5k would be spent just talking to people about building the car park, never mind a machine breaking ground.
Without and endless supply of cash, you need a lot of members willing to give up their time. A few builders, guy with a digger, solicitor, couple of brothers or sisters of high up councilors can save you tens of thousands.

Just googling motocross tracks ireland, there's a few around already. Definitely not worth starting your own when there's already a few others.

They won't do anything. They won't provide funding, land or anything. They don't want to nor need to.

It's up to you and your buddies to fund your own new track, or just use existing ones.

p.s. Could you imagine the scobes in housing estates (at whom this legislation is aimed) putting their scramablers and quads into trailers/vans and heading to a track for an organised but expensive event? No nor could I.

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 2:19pm

Exactly. The scumbags on scramblers aren't interested in organised sport events. They are doing it just for the hell of it and to intimidate and terrorise as many people as possible.

zubair · 26-02-2021 2:49pm

The new law is clearly targeting anti social behaviour and I'd be 100% behind it. It's not intended to do they can send guards into the wilderness finding lads on trails.

Also it really wouldn't be that hard to find someone in the kildare bog land with a couple of acres no good for farming that would let you use it, obviously you'd have to pay them but I doubt it would be extortionate.

Mjolnir · 26-02-2021 2:57pm

zubair wrote: »

The new law is clearly targeting anti social behaviour and I'd be 100% behind it. It's not intended to do they can send guards into the wilderness finding lads on trails.

It's a way to take bikes of repeat offenders that are known to them but for obvious reasons wouldn't give chase to.

"Oh look little Johnny is on a non road legal bike, on the n81 with no helmet.
Grand we'll head to his house ad grab the bike in a bit."

If anyone even attempted to challenge that law the first thing thrown at them would be that poor fella in the park a few years ago.

It's a bloody insurance nightmare, with bikes it's not if an accident occurs its when and how bad.

Are you going to inspect each individual bike is upto a standard to be there without being a danger to anyone?

I love bikes but jesus the noise of those things rots me after 10 minutes, my neighbours hate the sound of me coming and going and I'm on a 600cc sports bike that still has a baffle, they'd be miserable with little 2 strokes going around all day.

Cienciano · 26-02-2021 3:56pm

Henry Ford III wrote: »

They won't do anything. They won't provide funding, land or anything. They don't want to nor need to.

It's up to you and your buddies to fund your own new track, or just use existing ones.

p.s. Could you imagine the scobes in housing estates (at whom this legislation is aimed) putting their scramablers and quads into trailers/vans and heading to a track for an organised but expensive event? No nor could I.

No, this won't get past the first hurdle. You'll need an organized club, members, treasurers, probably a bank account, insurance etc, hold AGM's etc before they even talk to you.

I knew a guy who worked on sports grants, 99% of grants applications are done so bad they don't make it past the first stage.

Cienciano · 26-02-2021 3:59pm

Mjolnir wrote: »

It's a way to take bikes of repeat offenders that are known to them but for obvious reasons wouldn't give chase to.

"Oh look little Johnny is on a non road legal bike, on the n81 with no helmet.
Grand we'll head to his house ad grab the bike in a bit."

If anyone even attempted to challenge that law the first thing thrown at them would be that poor fella in the park a few years ago.

It's a bloody insurance nightmare, with bikes it's not if an accident occurs its when and how bad.

Are you going to inspect each individual bike is upto a standard to be there without being a danger to anyone?

I love bikes but jesus the noise of those things rots me after 10 minutes, my neighbours hate the sound of me coming and going and I'm on a 600cc sports bike that still has a baffle, they'd be miserable with little 2 strokes going around all day.

Yeah, there's a nice park near me, corkagh park and you'd be out there having a picnic with the kids and a few of their friends and then 10 scramblers would come across the park. Absolute scumbags. You can hear them miles away. All kids around 15 who's parents don't give a fúck. It's sad really.

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 4:36pm

zubair wrote: »

The new law is clearly targeting anti social behaviour and I'd be 100% behind it. It's not intended to do they can send guards into the wilderness finding lads on trails.

Also it really wouldn't be that hard to find someone in the kildare bog land with a couple of acres no good for farming that would let you use it, obviously you'd have to pay them but I doubt it would be extortionate.

Nobody with any shred of sense would give scrambler bikers permission to go into their land.

Firstly they would have the place absolutely destroyed with holes and ruts.
Then if anything happens and someone is hurt, it'll be the landowner that is liable.
What are you likely to get for it? A few hundred quid or so for a fairly big risk of problems.
Next you drive by some day and find they or some associates of theirs are in there after making ramps or water holes or some other mad thing.
Next you'll never get fellas out of it. Even if the first lads who approached you for it go away, you'll have other fellas getting wind of it and coming down trespassing on you.
ANyone living locally will blame the bikers for any damage or theft in the immediate locality, and will blame the landowner for inviting in these outsiders.

Also, if it is being used as a scrambler run, then it is a change of use and will require planning permission. And if there is a complaint in to the council, it is the land owners they will be going after to reinstate the land to it's prior condition and rectify any environmental damage. All probably at a quite substantial cost to the landowner. And plenty hassle too.
The scrambler lads won't want to know about it and will ride off into the sunset on their scramblers, with the poor landowner left behind to foot the bill.

No way in hell would I be letting bikes in on my land. Too much to go wrong for feck all benefit only hassle. So no, it would actually be very hard to find someone (well, someone with a bit of sense) to let you into their land for scrambling.

If anyone has any doubts about it, I'll say go up to the grounds of Vernon Mount and have a look at the absolute cut of the place. The likes of the erosion going on in there is bonkers. In rainy weather there is silt laden soupy runoff down on the access road in off of the N40. The place is an environmental disaster zone from the pounding the ground gets from the bikes.

Henry Ford III · 26-02-2021 4:44pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Exactly. The scumbags on scramblers aren't interested in organised sport events. They are doing it just for the hell of it and to intimidate and terrorise as many people as possible.

Wouldn't agree with that entirely.

They are using scramblers etc. wherever they want because they are allowed do so.

Esho · 26-02-2021 4:54pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I live in Douglas, Cork. Vernon mount is a few miles away and I can hear the bikes regularly making noise. It is so annoying. And I can only imagine how annoying it is for people living over the way closer to it. And they have the whole area around vernon mount absolutely destroyed. The place is like a perpetual building site - all torn up. There are probably massive amounts of silt laden runoff running down into the tramore river. .

Yes I lived close to this for a while, it is noisy but looks well run.
They even have an ambo on site when doing time trials.

I'd give them a shout - I think its great that there's this facility for trial bikes.

As regards the anti-social behaviour, maybe bikers are a different breed - a mate of mine broke his spine when he came off his bike in mid-air.
After he finished slagging me for my new haircut while immobile and in traction, he said "Yeah, if this happens again, I'll give up biking!

His anti-social behaviour sounded like loads of fun.

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 5:01pm

Sorry, the place is a disaster zone. Whatever about the events that are run there, the whole site is an environmental disaster. Take a walk through it. You can because the site boundaries aren't at all secure.
With most of the vegetation stripped off, a heavy shower of rain carries soil literally by the ton down the steep slopes, out on to the access road, and ultimately down into the Tramore River and Douglas Estuary.

How this place is allowed to function as it is without planning permission, i do not know. It is a crazy set up to have right beside housing estates.

Cienciano · 26-02-2021 5:06pm

another on here in cork. Looks good

https://goo.gl/maps/zKQXLgbVaRrm1QXi9

TheBoyConor · 26-02-2021 5:12pm

Another place with no planning permission.

Mjolnir · 26-02-2021 6:19pm

Esho wrote: »

Yes I lived close to this for a while, it is noisy but looks well run.
They even have an ambo on site when doing time trials.

I'd give them a shout - I think its great that there's this facility for trial bikes.

As regards the anti-social behaviour, maybe bikers are a different breed - a mate of mine broke his spine when he came off his bike in mid-air.
After he finished slagging me for my new haircut while immobile and in traction, he said "Yeah, if this happens again, I'll give up biking!

His anti-social behaviour sounded like loads of fun.

We ride around on with a tank of petrol and an engine between our legs, I'd argue we're not all in it to be fair hahaha.

I got brought off in an ambulance after a bike accident, call to the mother to meet me there for a lift home, call to the misses let her know I came off.
I'm there laughing and joking away, hang up, your man in the ambulance there laughing away at me saying you're in great humour for someone who's injured and wrote off their bike.
We're mostly a special kind of people.

There'd be people round my way same as your mate nearly die and as soon as they're up they're on the way to buy a new one. To be fair for the most part a great community that can't help each other enough even if you're a complete stranger.

The adults and young fellas the law is aimed at are definitely not part of our community.

doctorchopper · 26-02-2021 7:27pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Sorry, the place is a disaster zone. Whatever about the events that are run there, the whole site is an environmental disaster. Take a walk through it. You can because the site boundaries aren't at all secure.
With most of the vegetation stripped off, a heavy shower of rain carries soil literally by the ton down the steep slopes, out on to the access road, and ultimately down into the Tramore River and Douglas Estuary.

How this place is allowed to function as it is without planning permission, i do not know. It is a crazy set up to have right beside housing estates.

You want to talk about environmental disasters, please comment on this mess

All Coillte are interested in are clearing forests for as much profit as they can get. Most of the forests around our area have been destroyed by clear cut logging, a few trails from bikes hardly compare with the devastation caused by the track machines and logging equipment that they use

doctorchopper · 26-02-2021 7:32pm

Leinster off road was granted over 6000 acres in wexford for off road jeeps, but insurance has killed the club in the last few years. I don't think anyone is asking for facilities to be setup and government funded, just looking for access to forest areas to legally ride as most people just want to do it legally.

Hotblack Desiato · 26-02-2021 7:33pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Another place with no planning permission.

Houses 200m away too, jaysus.

How to register motorcycle club??

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