Near misses - mod warning 22/04 - see OP/post 822

Tombo2001 · 23-03-2017 1:17pm #1

Am a cycle commuter for past 6 years, and use the bike daily for work and for getting around. In Dublin.

I've had a more 'near misses' than normal in the past few weeks.

Last week, for second time ever - car hit me on the bike - wing mirror clipped the handlebar as he was pulling over to the left (to drop someone off I think). Fortunately in very slow traffic.

Week before I was a half second from going flying when parked car opened driver door in front of me.

And I've had quite few drivers leaving 50/60cms on an overtake, leaving me feeling very comfortable.

Mostly young-ish men and women. I get the sense that a lot of people, more than before, are driving around with a phone on their lap - picking it up at lights, putting it down again, and are a bit more distracted than before.

Any other cyclists experiencing this?

(And note, I have zero interest in 'advice' or 'constructive criticism' from drivers - there are a million other threads where I can find this).

Mod warning 22/04

Beasty wrote: »

Anyone else starting to discuss red light jumping or otherwise trying to change the topic into a discussion of cyclist behaviour can expect mod action

Any questions PM me

sullivlo · 23-03-2017 1:35pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Am a cycle commuter for past 6 years, and use the bike daily for work and for getting around. In Dublin.

I've had a more 'near misses' than normal in the past few weeks.

Last week, for second time ever - car hit me on the bike - wing mirror clipped the handlebar as he was pulling over to the left (to drop someone off I think). Fortunately in very slow traffic.

Week before I was a half second from going flying when parked car opened driver door in front of me.

And I've had quite few drivers leaving 50/60cms on an overtake, leaving me feeling very comfortable.

Mostly young-ish men and women. I get the sense that a lot of people, more than before, are driving around with a phone on their lap - picking it up at lights, putting it down again, and are a bit more distracted than before.

Any other cyclists experiencing this?

(And note, I have zero interest in 'advice' or 'constructive criticism' from drivers - there are a million other threads where I can find this).

Yes.

I commuted on my bike last week for the first time this year and I noticed a big difference in how I felt safety wise in traffic and whatnot.

There also seems to be way more kamikaze pedestrians around recently too. I'm always in fear of someone stepping out onto the road to overtake slow walkers, and don't get me started on the risk of umbrellas.

Jack the Stripper · 23-03-2017 1:38pm

The amount of people using phones at lights is definitely a common thing. Why people can't put the phone away while making a journey is mind boggling.

endacl · 23-03-2017 1:38pm

Don't be cycling with an umbrella!

Weepsie · 23-03-2017 1:43pm

Nope, other than the van driver who was (I am convinced) trying to knock me down the other day, I've found it better lately for the most part. I've been taking the lane more too though, and waiting til I think it's safe for people to pass, or pulling in somewhere if I feel that I'm at a stage where I'm going to slow.

I'm getting a lot more waves, thank you beeps and flashes of the light too as I think they see me as behaving more typically like a car. Waiting in the queue of traffic at lights rather than squeezing up if it's too tight is a big one for some I think. A bit of give and take is needed.

That's not to say I'm not seeing 100% perfect behaviour, but I'm mostly feeling safer as I am managing it better and being courteous etc. I am seeing an alarming amount of RLJing at busy junctions by cars though. It's definitely on the increase.

Tombo2001 · 23-03-2017 1:48pm

Weepsie wrote: »

Nope, other than the van driver who was (I am convinced) trying to knock me down the other day, I've found it better lately for the most part. I've been taking the lane more too though, and waiting til I think it's safe for people to pass, or pulling in somewhere if I feel that I'm at a stage where I'm going to slow.

I'm getting a lot more waves, thank you beeps and flashes of the light too as I think they see me as behaving more typically like a car. Waiting in the queue of traffic at lights rather than squeezing up if it's too tight is a big one for some I think. A bit of give and take is needed.

That's not to say I'm not seeing 100% perfect behaviour, but I'm mostly feeling safer as I am managing it better and being courteous etc. I am seeing an alarming amount of RLJing at busy junctions by cars though. It's definitely on the increase.

Presume you mean bike lane here.

My commute doesn't have any, Clonliffe Road or else Richmond Road would be the main thoroughfares.

A bit of give and take refers to what exactly?

What am I not doing that I should be doing?

And again, yes I see plenty of very pleasant drivers. Just more for example overtaking when there is oncoming traffic and not enough room.

Hungrycol · 23-03-2017 2:11pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

And I've had quite few drivers leaving 50/60cms on an overtake, leaving me feeling very comfortable.

50-60cm passing? That's loads in the city centre! So many buses and taxi's only give 5 to 6 cms. Other cyclists passing give you even less (not that that's frequent :cool:)

PS. I haven't noticed any discernible change in motorists behavior in the last month.

mrcheez · 23-03-2017 2:16pm

sullivlo wrote: »

There also seems to be way more kamikaze pedestrians around recently too.

Text-walker epidemic.

It'll be even more fun when augmented reality glasses become mainstream:

"Is that bike really coming for me, or is this part of the game I'm playing??"

Weepsie · 23-03-2017 2:18pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Presume you mean bike lane here.

My commute doesn't have any, Clonliffe Road or else Richmond Road would be the main thoroughfares.

A bit of give and take refers to what exactly?

What am I not doing that I should be doing?

And again, yes I see plenty of very pleasant drivers. Just more for example overtaking when there is oncoming traffic and not enough room.

I mean taking the full lane. In urban traffic I'm not going to be at the kerb if I can help it as much as possible. It invites close overtakes for some and is rutted, potholed, and covered in standing water at the moment.I take ownership of the lane as I can generally keep pace with it, though am often faster. Part of my route have decent enough cycle lane so I'll use it then. Drumcondra road has a brutal cycle lane, but more often than not I'll use it as it's the stretch where I think people will get impatient or take a stupid chance.

average_runner · 23-03-2017 2:38pm

Two cars drove up on the footpath today as I was walking to work. Then when I pointed it out to them, they looked confused.

Tombo2001 · 23-03-2017 2:39pm

Weepsie wrote: »

I mean taking the full lane. In urban traffic I'm not going to be at the kerb if I can help it as much as possible. It invites close overtakes for some and is rutted, potholed, and covered in standing water at the moment.I take ownership of the lane as I can generally keep pace with it, though am often faster. Part of my route have decent enough cycle lane so I'll use it then. Drumcondra road has a brutal cycle lane, but more often than not I'll use it as it's the stretch where I think people will get impatient or take a stupid chance.

That's interesting. Something I've thought about, and should probably do more of.

Best example of this is bus lanes. Taxis will over take unless you dominate the lane.

Funny enough, I would identify the bike lane on Drumcondra road as quite a high risk place, simply as pedestrians are so likely to walk onto the lane. And also, cyclists often undertake on this lane.

NeedMoreGears · 23-03-2017 2:57pm

I've been getting more close passes lately - don't know if it's just a statistical blip or evidence of a more extensive change. I did have some numpty clip me with a mirror at the top of Howth on Sunday last. I stayed upright but got a good fright.

He was an older man. He pulled in down the road and appeared to be quite a bit shocked. I let one or two wtf's out of me and kept going. Otherwise I would just got into a shouting match with a seventy year old - no point.

check_six · 23-03-2017 3:17pm

NeedMoreGears wrote: »

I did have some numpty clip me with a mirror at the top of Howth on Sunday last.

I think that's a 'near miss' only in the sense that he 'nearly missed' you while actually hitting you with his car. Clearly off topic meanderings!

mrcheez · 23-03-2017 3:19pm

Perhaps bikes are becoming more ubiquitous on the roads now and stand out less as something unusual and noteworthy in a driver's mind so they become part of the scenery rather than another road user.

Or perhaps it's kick-back from the recent discussion about enforcing 1.5m overtake rule. And if there's one thing Irish drivers hate above all else is being told to give MORE allowances to cyclists.

Or perhaps this is all complete bull****

Samuel T. Cogley · 23-03-2017 3:25pm

Phones. Morons on them would be one of the main reasons I don't cycle very much. It's definitely getting worse.

shootermacg · 23-03-2017 3:41pm

You can command the road all you want, but the graveyards are littered with cyclists and pedestrians who commanded the road. The problem is, you absolutely cannot even rely on every driver looking out their front window these days.

I've seen many looking out for a second, then looking at their phone for 4 to 5 seconds, before another quick glance up. These days you're up against some people who actually spend 20% of their time actually looking at the road.

I haven't heard anything yet about the most recent cyclist death, but I'd be very interested in the cause.

helimachoptor · 23-03-2017 3:42pm

I had 3 incidents on the way home last night on the n11, all were turning left without checking.

I'm at the point where i dont go mad anymore its happening so often

Alanstrainor · 23-03-2017 4:00pm

This was on Monday, unfortunately it is a common enough occurrence:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJAWavsVlcU

I haven't noticed much change of late, I've been commuting on my bike for 10 years or so now, more if I include my journeys to school! I do go through weeks here and there where I encounter more idiots than usual however.

Samuel T. Cogley · 23-03-2017 4:33pm

Thanks an arsehole who can't use a gear box. Can't possibly change down, hang back and go round 5 seconds later that would require actually driving the car.

shootermacg · 23-03-2017 4:36pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

This was on Monday, unfortunately it is a common enough occurrence:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJAWavsVlcU

I haven't noticed much change of late, I've been commuting on my bike for 10 years or so now, more if I include my journeys to school! I do go through weeks here and there where I encounter more idiots than usual however.

Pretty close there! I actually got pushed off the road last week by a Dublin bus that drew level with me and then drove me off the road by pulling into the cycle lane.

Old bus driver got out finally, just saying sorry, sorry I'm really sorry. Sometimes I think its our fault for going cycling each day, it's simply not a safe enough environment no matter what steps you take.

Alanstrainor · 23-03-2017 4:40pm

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Thanks an arsehole who can't use a gear box. Can't possibly change down, hang back and go round 5 seconds later that would require actually driving the car.

I reckon it was caused by this idiot blindly following the guy in front. Although the first overtake left plenty of room, it was still around a blind bend on a continuous white line. And I was fairly prominently out in the lane. My solution is to cycle further out now, so far so good.

Borderfox · 23-03-2017 4:48pm

Cycled through the city centre last Monday and it's exactly as I remember, not better or worse

Indricotherium · 23-03-2017 4:53pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I reckon it was caused by this idiot blindly following the guy in front. Although the first overtake left plenty of room, it was still around a blind bend on a continuous white line. And I was fairly prominently out in the lane. My solution is to cycle further out now, so far so good.

People don't seem to realise that they can back out of an overtake if a car comes the other way, hit the brakes and pull in behind the cyclist.

They invariably seem to pull in and squash the cyclist rather than back out of the over take and slot in behind.

Esho · 23-03-2017 5:06pm

If a driver has the opportunity to do something stupid, I'll expect them to. Still I've had a few close ones since the new year, cycling defensively didn't make a difference. Mostly yahoos overtaking to turn left.
There's def a difference in pedestrian vigilance, more important to catch that pokemon or whatever.

shansey · 23-03-2017 5:28pm

Massive Argos lorry coming down under Christchurch nearly took me out last week. Was so close I had to jump (with bike) onto the footpath... Few other cyclists stopped from shock of it.

ED E · 23-03-2017 5:42pm

shansey wrote: »

Massive Argos lorry coming down under Christchurch nearly took me out last week. Was so close I had to jump (with bike) onto the footpath... Few other cyclists stopped from shock of it.

If you got the reg Argos CC are very good. Worth an email/tweet.

JazzyJ · 23-03-2017 5:53pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

This was on Monday, unfortunately it is a common enough occurrence:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJAWavsVlcU

I haven't noticed much change of late, I've been commuting on my bike for 10 years or so now, more if I include my journeys to school! I do go through weeks here and there where I encounter more idiots than usual however.

I'd be sending that to the gardai.

vg88 · 23-03-2017 6:16pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

This was on Monday, unfortunately it is a common enough occurrence:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJAWavsVlcU

I haven't noticed much change of late, I've been commuting on my bike for 10 years or so now, more if I include my journeys to school! I do go through weeks here and there where I encounter more idiots than usual however.

I cycle that route often, I've found it to be one of the most dangerous cycling parts in Dublin between Portmarnock and Baldoyle. This use to happen to me until I slightly pushed out more into the road to prevent doggy over takes like this.

I really hope it doesn't take a death until they build that cycleway.

mrcheez · 23-03-2017 7:38pm

Generally speaking if you can see a car coming in the other direction, and you know there's no way for someone to pass you without coming close, take the lane.

I do this now for the stretch opposite St Annes Park (where the S2S is being built) when I can see cars coming in the opposite direction, to indicate to the cars behind me that they cannot overtake.

VW 1 · 23-03-2017 7:51pm

I'm back commuting to city centre the last 3-4 weeks having been out of city centre for 3 years.

Couple of close passes but nothing noteworthy until this morning. Coming down constitution hill and a woman turns left across the cycle lane into Kings Inn without indicating. I jammed on the brakes but smashed sideways into the side of the car. Luckily not hurt I'd scrubbed a lot of speed off and dropped the bike and landed on my feet after hitting the car.

She was apologising but I didn't want to hear it, I let off a few expletives and got back on the bike. hopefully she learned a lesson about indicating and looking in mirrors when turning left, luckily no damage done this time.

Arcade_Tryer · 23-03-2017 8:11pm

VW 1 wrote: »

I'm back commuting to city centre the last 3-4 weeks having been out of city centre for 3 years.

Couple of close passes but nothing noteworthy until this morning. Coming down constitution hill and a woman turns left across the cycle lane into Kings Inn without indicating. I jammed on the brakes but smashed sideways into the side of the car. Luckily not hurt I'd scrubbed a lot of speed off and dropped the bike and landed on my feet after hitting the car.

She was apologising but I didn't want to hear it, I let off a few expletives and got back on the bike. hopefully she learned a lesson about indicating and looking in mirrors when turning left, luckily no damage done this time.

Whatever about not checking the mirror, not indicating is frankly inexcusable. We all forget to check our mirror on occasion when turning, which is why we have an indicator literally attacked to the steering wheel to indicate our intentions before making a manoeuvre and reducing the risk of an incident. Basically, I'd forgive her for turning without checking her mirror if she had indicated prior. But f**k anyone who is neither checking mirrors or indicating.

Alanstrainor · 23-03-2017 8:15pm

JazzyJ wrote: »

I'd be sending that to the gardai.

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

Arcade_Tryer · 23-03-2017 8:21pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

Move further out into the road? You're as entitled to use the road as any automated vehicle.

It's motorists' responsibility to overtake correctly and when safe to do so.

Indricotherium · 23-03-2017 8:21pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

Go to your local station and make a complaint.

Samuel T. Cogley · 23-03-2017 8:32pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

The guards *may* seize the camera and storage if it's considered serious enough. My suggestion would be a quick call to traffic watch who will forward it on to the local station for a word with the driver.

Wishbone Ash · 23-03-2017 8:39pm

Tombo2001 wrote: »

... I would identify the bike lane on Drumcondra road... .... And also, cyclists often undertake on this lane.

If by 'undertake' you mean pass on the left, then I'm puzzled. I would almost always pass another cyclist on the left there as it's much safer. Passing a cyclist on the right can be difficult if they are meandering over all the lane and they may swerve sending the passing cyclist over the kerb and under a bus.

blackbox · 23-03-2017 8:43pm

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

If by 'undertake' you mean pass on the left, then I'm puzzled. I would almost always pass another cyclist on the left there as it's much safer. Passing a cyclist on the right can be difficult if they are meandering over all the lane and they may swerve sending the passing cyclist over the kerb and under a bus.

Are you mixing up your left and right?

ED E · 23-03-2017 8:49pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

Members of the public can report traffic-related incidents using the Traffic Watch lo-call number 1890 205 805. These calls are answered and logged by civilian personnel at the Garda Information Services Centre, Castlebar, Mayo F23 D303. The incident is then forwarded to the relevant District Officer (Superintendent) for investigation.

You call.
Local Super assigns it to a lackie
Lackie calls you
Lackie turns up at drivers door for a chat.

Wishbone Ash · 23-03-2017 8:50pm

blackbox wrote: »

Are you mixing up your left and right?

No!

The cycle track is on the right side of the footpath. I'd prefer to encroach into the pedestrian area on the left (if safe to do so) to pass another cyclist rather than taking my chances along the edge of a kerb and a busy bus lane.

Kaisr Sose · 23-03-2017 8:51pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

I reckon it was caused by this idiot blindly following the guy in front. Although the first overtake left plenty of room, it was still around a blind bend on a continuous white line. And I was fairly prominently out in the lane. My solution is to cycle further out now, so far so good.

That's a huge problem - car A may wait and wait until it's safe to pass, but then a stream of cars come in the slip stream, many speeding to get in quick and thereby engaging in a blind and close pass. What bugs me is that they will do it on a blind bend or with oncoming traffic for a cyclist. Crazy stuff - often for no real time benefit / saving. They hate slowing down!!

Kaisr Sose · 23-03-2017 9:00pm

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

No!

The cycle track is on the right side of the footpath. I'd prefer to encroach into the pedestrian area on the left (if safe to do so) to pass another cyclist rather than taking my chances along the edge of a kerb and a busy bus lane.

Your example may be a special case but in my opinion it's never a good idea to pass on the left. It psisses me off when it happens me at lights as you don't expect it on the left. I try to block it by staying in near the kerb but as soon as you move off, the door opens for those that may not have had to stop at the light. In free flow traffic, cyclists overtaking cyclists on the left is dangerous, but it happens!

Wishbone Ash · 23-03-2017 9:47pm

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

Your example may be a special case but in my opinion it's never a good idea to pass on the left. It psisses me off when it happens me at lights as you don't expect it on the left. I try to block it by staying in near the kerb but as soon as you move off, the door opens for those that may not have had to stop at the light. In free flow traffic, cyclists overtaking cyclists on the left is dangerous, but it happens!

I'm referring to an off road segregated cycle track. I'd never pass on the left on an on-road cycle track.

Rogue-Trooper · 23-03-2017 9:53pm

Alanstrainor wrote: »

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

ED E wrote: »

Members of the public can report traffic-related incidents using the Traffic Watch lo-call number 1890 205 805. These calls are answered and logged by civilian personnel at the Garda Information Services Centre, Castlebar, Mayo F23 D303. The incident is then forwarded to the relevant District Officer (Superintendent) for investigation.

You call.
Local Super assigns it to a lackie
Lackie calls you
Lackie turns up at drivers door for a chat.

As Ed E has said above (although I'm not sure I'd use the term lackie which is unfairly derogatory). I've had to use the Traffic Watch service twice, both times supported by video evidence and both times for dangerously close passes.

The first time yielded a satisfactory outcome with a sincere apology passed on from the offending driver. The guy flatly denied it until the Garda informed him that they had 'incredibly clear camera footage from the cyclist' which apparently made the blood drain from his face and promptly changed his tune. I was given the option in advance to have him charged or just for them to have a chat. I opted for a chat and indicated I would be happy with that as long as he took on board the seriousness of what he did.

The second time was only 2 weeks ago. I've reported it and am currently waiting on a visit from the boys in blue who have already been in touch and are eager to see the footage. Will update on how that goes.

Having watched your video I'd be of the opinion that it warrants reporting. If you do decide to do it, let us know how you get on.

Danbo! · 23-03-2017 11:54pm

Best thing I have ever done was get a helmet cam. Almost 3 years of incident free cycling since I got it

I did recently move jobs from the dock lands to near the four courts. Cycling in from firhouse is a pleasure now as I don't really get into the city centre and no need to go near the canal except to cross it.

Worst area for me was turning right from harolds cross onto the canal. Two lanes of merging into one, majority going straight so lots of extremely close passes as I waited to turn right. Best thing to do is find a car in the queue turning right and plant myself behind it. It's great being able to go straight through the junction now.

New hotspot for me is from Patrick's cathedral to Christchurch. The bus lane at the start is a mess of dodgy merging, queue jumpers and deeply recessed man holes, and then the top of the road is a bit of a **** storm with two lanes becoming three and then four soon after.

HivemindXX · 24-03-2017 12:45am

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

The first time yielded a satisfactory outcome with a sincere apology passed on from the offending driver. The guy flatly denied it until the Garda informed him that they had 'incredibly clear camera footage from the cyclist' which apparently made the blood drain from his face and promptly changed his tune.

I don't really see how that's a sincere apology. It seems like this person was perfectly happy to lie to a guard about what he did and was not in the least bit sorry.

uck51js9zml2yt · 24-03-2017 9:00am

I took the lane on the quays this week in slow moving traffic only to be blown out of it by a flash car driver. He got my finger as he overtook for all of 5 seconds.
I beat him to the next lights

secman · 24-03-2017 9:05am

An unfortunate Man in his 40's hit by a car near Christchurch last night has died, may in rest in peace

ED E · 24-03-2017 9:30am

Rogue-Trooper wrote: »

(although I'm not sure I'd use the term lackie which is unfairly derogatory)

Poor choice of words. Just trying to make it clear that it'll be a junior member who's desk it lands on, you wont get a Super nor a Sgt handling it.

Danjamin1 · 24-03-2017 10:54am

Danbo! wrote: »

Worst area for me was turning right from harolds cross onto the canal. Two lanes of merging into one, majority going straight so lots of extremely close passes as I waited to turn right. Best thing to do is find a car in the queue turning right and plant myself behind it. It's great being able to go straight through the junction now.

New hotspot for me is from Patrick's cathedral to Christchurch. The bus lane at the start is a mess of dodgy merging, queue jumpers and deeply recessed man holes, and then the top of the road is a bit of a **** storm with two lanes becoming three and then four soon after.

These areas are both a serious scramble for space but I haven't seen many near misses at either myself. The junction at Kevin street & Patrick street is a nightmare as you always ALWAYS get the cycle lane blocked by cars sitting with their noses across it as they wait to get through the lights.

Tombo2001 · 24-03-2017 11:03am

HivemindXX wrote: »

I don't really see how that's a sincere apology. It seems like this person was perfectly happy to lie to a guard about what he did and was not in the least bit sorry.

The point here I suppose is that a cyclist will always know if there has been a near miss, but a lot of the time the driver is not even aware of it (and so obviously will deny it until video evidence is shown to them).

mrcheez · 24-03-2017 11:24am

Alanstrainor wrote: »

How though? Any advice here? I had another pass this evening which was worse.

- Put a copy of the unaltered video on DVD

- Put a copy of the video snippet in a separate video on the DVD

- Include a Notepad file with a description of the incident on the DVD
(time, place, description of event, your contact details)

Take it to the Gardai station and file a report. They will investigate and you will get a followup call etc. They will likely pay the driver a visit.

I've done this before when some kids threw a stone at me out of their car as they passed and I got it on video. Went all the way to the courts and they brought the car owner in for questioning, and I was congratulated on the evidence I produced - apparently no-one else thought to provide videos like this, but as I didn't get a visual on the driver they couldn't "prove" who was at the wheel.

Ridiculous I know, but now I know: *ALWAYS GET A VISUAL OF THE DRIVER*

Same with Dublin Bus drivers etc

At least the driver got a scare by being pulled into the station.

Near misses - mod warning 22/04 - see OP/post 822

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