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Homemade car stand. Thoughts?

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    #32
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    kadman wrote: »
    No


    That's exactly the box I was trying to describe in my post...safest form of raising a car to work underneath. Hardest part is jacking it up, and that is not too hard either with a good trolley jack. That's for the front wheels,,,I'm not so sure about the rear set up in the video though , I don't really like it for some reason. I would just use the axle stands under the chassis rail's or rear axle,


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    #33
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    Good to hear I'm not the only one worried about axle stands! Exactly, they look like it would be easy to give the car a push and topple them.

    Box idea sounds interesting. So you had the car lifted by 14" (18-4)? My jack just goes up to 34cm so even at that I'll have to raise the jack on blocks to slip my thing under the wheels.


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    #34
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    bobbyy gee wrote: »
    wood will break and splinter buy some jack stands

    No it won't.

    If it'll hold a ship in dry dock, it'll hold a car.....

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #35
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    MrCostington wrote: »
    Good to hear I'm not the only one worried about axle stands! Exactly, they look like it would be easy to give the car a push and topple them.

    Box idea sounds interesting. So you had the car lifted by 14" (18-4)? My jack just goes up to 34cm so even at that I'll have to raise the jack on blocks to slip my thing under the wheels.

    I personaly think your fears about axle stands used properly are unfounded.

    I have used these axle stands for years, and fully extended under beetles I have worked on. And if you can topple these from below, then you can topple your blocks too.

    And these are not the el cheapo versions that come from lidl/aldi.

    Support stands are all about the base of the stand, the wider the better..
    You would have to be the hulk to push a car, PROPERLY set up on these stands
    524068.jpg


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    #36
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    MrCostington wrote: »
    Do you think the one support in the middle is enough?
    kadman wrote: »
    No

    Wheel cribs video

    I'm confused here, I'm asking if you think one support in the middle is enough and you say no, but post something with none!

    This is what I am planning:

    stand.jpg

    But, do you think I need to do this?

    stand2.jpg


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    #37
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    kadman wrote: »
    I personaly think your fears about axle stands used properly are unfounded.

    I'm sure you're right, but it's just a personal feel thing ...

    Agree re base size, that's why mine will be 12" x 20"


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    #38
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    2nd pic is a 100% improvement.

    Drilled and screwed instead of nailing.

    I am still puzzled that this pad of timber totalling 135mm allows you enough room to manouvre
    underneath the car, let alone reach around for spanners ect.

    I definitely could not get under with them and work at that height.

    Of course I am a well fed gossin with 2 damaged shoulders:P


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    #39
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    MrCostington wrote: »
    I'm sure you're right, but it's just a personal feel thing ...

    Agree re base size, that's why mine will be 12" x 20"

    Axle stands , good strong and well designed ones are quite safe. But when placing them you need to be very careful...the first one is not a problem, because the the jack is lifting the side that the stand will go under. The problem is when you jack up the other side, it can shift the position of the first one.. and even topple it over. That's why I always have sledge hammer with me when raising a car on stands...as I lift the 2nd side, I keep checking the first stand, and giving it a few taps to keep it in the correct position. Even when the car is lowered and fully resting on the stands,l give them another few taps with the sledge to "settle" them in position. I've never had an accident with them, but I have seen what badly placed stands can do. But if I'm planning on working underneath the car, I'll jack it up and drop the two front wheels into the "boxes". Then I feel safe working underneath it. I recently changed the auto transmission fluid in a Merc , a job that takes a bit of time, while the car was lifted in this manner. No problem.


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    #40
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 7,499 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Its annoying when you jack a car at the jack point that you cant put the stand under the jack point or sometimes even close to it because the base of the stand hits the trolly jack.

    I always put some folded corrugated cardboard between the car and the stand to protect the car a bit.


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    #41
    Kevhog1988
    Registered Users Posts: 3,960 ✭✭✭Kevhog1988


    listermint wrote: »
    Everytime I see them i cringe, I mean I'm sure they've been safety tested properly but the gauge and size of the angle bar they use just doesn't sit well with me. I'd never buy them.

    I have a set of them in the shed for years and have never had any issue.


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    #42
    KB22
    Registered Users Posts: 160 ✭✭KB22


    Kevhog1988 wrote: »
    I have a set of them in the shed for years and have never had any issue.

    Kevhog :- You will never have an issue with your axle stand's. If you leave them in your shed? Regard's KB


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    #43
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    kadman wrote: »
    2nd pic is a 100% improvement.

    Drilled and screwed instead of nailing.

    I am still puzzled that this pad of timber totalling 135mm allows you enough room to manouvre underneath the car, let alone reach around for spanners ect.


    Thanks, yes I plan to drill and screw it together.


    It sure won't be very comfortable, but like I said I'm slim and did have two wheels up on the kerb which is about 4.5", I was just under to have a look (and check a part number on the gearbox). It was hard no doubt but doable, and I think having all 4 wheels up will make a difference. Also, amybe the car has better than average ground clearance??

    Anyway, if not enough I will extend by 1 layer.


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    #44
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    BrownFinger wrote: »
    I always put some folded corrugated cardboard between the car and the stand to protect the car a bit.


    A video I've seen (Kent Bergsma / Mercedessource) suggested reinforced hose:


    https://youtu.be/cpOypTmGwUA?t=181


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    #45
    Kevhog1988
    Registered Users Posts: 3,960 ✭✭✭Kevhog1988


    KB22 wrote: »
    Kevhog :- You will never have an issue with your axle stand's. If you leave them in your shed? Regard's KB


    Ive seen the crap halfrauds axle stand collapse in the past


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    #46
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    BrownFinger wrote: »
    Its annoying when you jack a car at the jack point that you cant put the stand under the jack point or sometimes even close to it because the base of the stand hits the trolly jack.

    I always put some folded corrugated cardboard between the car and the stand to protect the car a bit.

    If you look at the sill panel ( its the very bottom panel, running the length of the car, between the wheels) you will find an edge running along it as well. When cars are damaged in an accident, its this "lip" that is used to clamp the car to the jig-... and from this point, the car is hydraulically pulled back into alignment, so it's very strong. Its actually several panels spot welded together that forms the lip. So what I do in the same situation as you, is I put a length of 4 "x 2" x 4 r 5' along the sill under the lip, and jack the car up from there, that leaves the actual jacking point clear. Place the jack just far enough away from the jacking point to allow placement of the axle stand. Never place the jack in in the centre of the sill panel, to try and lift both wheels on the same side, always do it wheel by wheel. Personally, I would never put anything between the jacking point and the jack..for me, its metal to metal all the way, as this is the way its designed to operate. Dont worry to much about damaging the car, it wont happen, if the jack / axle stand is placed correctly. ( as a matter of fact most of the jacks supplied with the car, have a "V" shape in the top of the jack, and this is to allow it to be used along the sill panel lip. Some others have a "spud" at the top and this fit's into the car jacking point. )


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    #47
    RobAMerc
    Registered Users Posts: 5,862 ✭✭✭RobAMerc


    kadman wrote: »
    I personaly think your fears about axle stands used properly are unfounded.

    524068.jpg

    I like to use axle stands under a cross member or something of the subframe if possible - and I hate the way the axle stands have those 2 "prongs" ( upward part of the top U plates ) - I worry one will bend and cause the car to tip and then slide off ( poorly explained, I know ! ). I would like interchangeable ones, flat when under something flat, U shaped for curved surfaces like an axle


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    #48
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    The draper axle stands are 5mm wall thickness of the tube, so no car made could bend these babies.
    And the top of the axle stands U shape is probably about 8mm thickness , or more.

    These are the best available that I could buy at the time, and i have used them many times.

    As Jmreire pointed out, its important to tap each leg of the stand to make sure the 3 legs have firm contact with the
    ground, as you dont want them rocking on 2 legs. Thats the proper method of using these.

    Combined they carry a weight of 6 ton on each axle stand. And i never ever had any hesitation getting under any vehicle
    with these stands.

    I bought them for 35 euro a piece at the time, which I thought was expensive, but now they are 80 euro each.

    I rarely use them now as I have a full height scissor lift, 7foot to the top of the tables, that are brilliant.


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    #49
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    RobAMerc wrote: »
    I like to use axle stands under a cross member or something of the subframe if possible - and I hate the way the axle stands have those 2 "prongs" ( upward part of the top U plates ) - I worry one will bend and cause the car to tip and then slide off ( poorly explained, I know ! ). I would like interchangeable ones, flat when under something flat, U shaped for curved surfaces like an axle

    Unless the stands had these "prongs" on them, I would not even consider using them....and I have plenty of experience using stands including "Jack- Stands", which are 6' stands used with lift. They are used for maneuvering / positioning a vehicle on a lift.


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    #50
    Isambard
    Registered Users Posts: 5,796 ✭✭✭Isambard


    two railway sleepers ftw....make sloping ramps and drive it on up. tbh I'd go for purpose built ramps, cheap enough or better still, big jack and axle stands.


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    #51
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    Hi, just to update you all. After much faffing around, including a false economy of buying a really cheap jack, I finally finished the stands and got the car up on them.

    Myself and another guy tried to rock and push the car off them, everything was solid. If anybody can see any reason not to get under it, please let me know.

    Thanks!

    stand-3.jpg

    stand-4.jpg


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    #52
    RobAMerc
    Registered Users Posts: 5,862 ✭✭✭RobAMerc


    looks good to me, great job !

    The Merc is a beaut by the way.


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    #53
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    MrCostington wrote: »
    Hi, just to update you all. After much faffing around, including a false economy of buying a really cheap jack, I finally finished the stands and got the car up on them.

    Myself and another guy tried to rock and push the car off them, everything was solid. If anybody can see any reason not to get under it, please let me know.

    Thanks!

    stand-3.jpg

    stand-4.jpg

    Personally, I'd have gone a bit higher, at least one but possibly two more layer's of wood,while I was at it. If you are trying to do a transmission ATF change and flush, you will need plenty of room to maneuver the large basin needed to catch all the oil underneath. Lovely Merc BTW.


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    #54
    kadman
    Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 5,057 Mod ✭✭✭✭kadman


    jmreire wrote: »
    Personally, I'd have gone a bit higher, at least one but possibly two more layer's of wood,while I was at it. If you are trying to do a transmission ATF change and flush, you will need plenty of room to maneuver the large basin needed to catch all the oil underneath. Lovely Merc BTW.

    Totally agree. You are only up an additional 4 1/2 " from no stands.

    How do you get under. Do you use a creeper, which surely raises your body
    another couple of inches.

    Its too low for me anyway, and too cramped for ease of working if you are not on a creeper. Apart from that the higher up it is, the more light is getting in under the car for working.

    Personally I would double the height, but of course that doubles the cost.


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    #55
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    kadman wrote: »

    Personally I would double the height, but of course that doubles the cost.

    Doubling the cost of that amount of timber could see you hit the - €20 ? - mark.
    Hardly a factor.......


    Check out the wooden supports holding this 45t lot up at:

    00:41
    01:41

    https://www.emining.ch/en/


    Cars really aren't going to test a wooden stand....

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #56
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    jmreire wrote: »
    Personally, I'd have gone a bit higher, at least one but possibly two more layer's of wood,while I was at it.
    kadman wrote: »
    Totally agree. You are only up an additional 4 1/2 " from no stands.

    How do you get under. Do you use a creeper, which surely raises your body another couple of inches.

    Thanks both. I agree is it a bit tight and uncomfortable, but I'll put up with it for maybe 5 hours a year under it. I just had a quick look under it (no creeper, just slid on the foil covered yoga/exercise mat you can see there). As I said before, I might go up one more layer, hopefully I'll do at least the engine oil this weekend and see how it goes.

    The thing about going higher, is getting it jacked. I used a 3 tonne jack that goes from 14cm to 43cm and even with that had to put a block of wood under the diff. I think trying to go too high increases the odds of an accident during the jacking process (don't forget I have to bottom out the suspension travel before the wheels start to raise).
    galwaytt wrote: »
    Doubling the cost of that amount of timber could see you hit the - €20 ? - mark.

    Actually, it took many lengths of 2x4 and 2 off 2x2 and a box of screws, over 50 quid so far (in Chadwicks)

    Anyway, any further thoughts re safety?


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    #57
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    MrCostington wrote: »

    Actually, it took many lengths of 2x4 and 2 off 2x2 and a box of screws, over 50 quid so far (in Chadwicks)

    Anyway, any further thoughts re safety?

    I suspect my timber buying price is better than what you pay Chadwicks ;)

    I think the safety is fine. Timber blocking is widely used: look at what holds up the keel of a ship in dry dock...........can't see a W123 testing it tbh....

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #58
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    MrCostington wrote: »
    Thanks both. I agree is it a bit tight and uncomfortable, but I'll put up with it for maybe 5 hours a year under it. I just had a quick look under it (no creeper, just slid on the foil covered yoga/exercise mat you can see there). As I said before, I might go up one more layer, hopefully I'll do at least the engine oil this weekend and see how it goes.

    The thing about going higher, is getting it jacked. I used a 3 tonne jack that goes from 14cm to 43cm and even with that had to put a block of wood under the diff. I think trying to go too high increases the odds of an accident during the jacking process (don't forget I have to bottom out the suspension travel before the wheels start to raise).



    Actually, it took many lengths of 2x4 and 2 off 2x2 and a box of screws, over 50 quid so far (in Chadwicks)

    Anyway, any further thoughts re safety?

    I'd have no qualms about getting under the car with that kind of a set-up safety wise....but as already mentioned, its a little bit on the low side for comfortable working conditions. 18" between the ground ( or better ) would be fine for me. That's not saying that the boards would have to raise the wheels 18" though...the suspension's will also lift the car up.


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    #59
    MrCostington
    Registered Users Posts: 1,244 ✭✭✭MrCostington


    Thanks for everyone for your help.

    jmreire wrote: »
    I'd have no qualms about getting under the car with that kind of a set-up safety wise....but as already mentioned, its a little bit on the low side for comfortable working conditions. 18" between the ground ( or better ) would be fine for me. That's not saying that the boards would have to raise the wheels 18" though...the suspension's will also lift the car up.


    I hope to try them out this weekend, so will see how I get on and report back!


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    #60
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 33,645 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    kadman wrote: »
    I personaly think your fears about axle stands used properly are unfounded.

    I have used these axle stands for years, and fully extended under beetles I have worked on. And if you can topple these from below, then you can topple your blocks too.

    And these are not the el cheapo versions that come from lidl/aldi.

    Support stands are all about the base of the stand, the wider the better..
    You would have to be the hulk to push a car, PROPERLY set up on these stands
    524068.jpg

    I have these, https://ige.ie/3-ton-axle-stands-pair/

    And i still dont like getting under the car. Have been known to throw wheels underneath just in case something goes wrong. Awful fear and rightly so around working underneath vehicles. Theres been enough poor soles have a vehicle drop on them.


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    #61
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,298 ✭✭✭jmreire


    And thats the right attitude to have,,I've been under many vehicles, either jacked up, as in this post, or in a pit, under 4 post or 2 post lift's...and I well remember many years ago working under a 2 post lift that was operated by compressed air,, and it had an alarming habit of unexpectedly dropping several inches. It was like this until a visiting German Engineer ( perhaps not too happy about working under it) decided to investigate why it was dropping, it turned out that when it had been installed, a pipe was incorrectly placed. But I know of one case where a car came off a 2 post lift, and badly injured a mechanic. So take care, check twice ( or more) that the car is secure before getting under it.


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