Should wolves be reintroduced to Ireland?

realitykeeper · 01-09-2018 1:03pm #1

Wolves lived in the wild in Ireland until about 250 years ago. Their numbers are growing in mainland Europe today and there is talk of a cull. Should reintroducing wolves to Ireland be considered instead? It would save a few wolves on the continent and help to restore Ireland`s natural fauna. I would be in favour of it.

Gingko · 01-09-2018 8:24pm

realitykeeper wrote: »

Wolves lived in the wild in Ireland until about 250 years ago. Their numbers are growing in mainland Europe today and there is talk of a cull. Should reintroducing wolves to Ireland be considered instead? It would save a few wolves on the continent and help to restore Ireland`s natural fauna. I would be in favour of it.

Good article on the reintroduction of wolves in Ireland here.. doesn't look like its possible unfortunately.. http://bioweb.ie/reintroduction-wolves-ireland/

Edgarfrndly · 01-09-2018 8:28pm

Yes. Ireland used to be known as Wolf Land. Deer populations are a huge problem. They are a pest and carry extremely dangerous diseases. The problem however is where to reintroduce them in a manner which is safe for both them and people.

Fathom · 02-09-2018 5:05am

Wolves good to reduce rabbits. Or rely on foxes?

carrollsno1 · 02-09-2018 5:54am

Deedsie wrote: »

In an ideal world it would be brilliant if wolves could be reintroduced in Ireland. Seems highly unlikely it will ever happen. Farmers would lose the plot entirely

I heard before that domesticated dogs are more of a problem for livestock than wolves in some countries.

Avatar MIA · 02-09-2018 5:59am

Think there's another thread on this somewhere.

While relatively sparsely populated humans are widespread around Ireland and there's nowhere where a self sustaining (or any level) number of wolves could be released. Sad to say.

Ireland hasn't had a potential human predator outside a zoo for a long time, and that's hot going to change.

corks finest · 02-09-2018 6:22am

realitykeeper wrote: »

Wolves lived in the wild in Ireland until about 250 years ago. Their numbers are growing in mainland Europe today and there is talk of a cull. Should reintroducing wolves to Ireland be considered instead? It would save a few wolves on the continent and help to restore Ireland`s natural fauna. I would be in favour of it.

They'd only hunt them into oblivion

corks finest · 02-09-2018 6:23am

realitykeeper wrote: »

Wolves lived in the wild in Ireland until about 250 years ago. Their numbers are growing in mainland Europe today and there is talk of a cull. Should reintroducing wolves to Ireland be considered instead? It would save a few wolves on the continent and help to restore Ireland`s natural fauna. I would be in favour of it.

They'd only hunt them into oblivion dunno,think of the grants they'd apply for, fencing,drainage,loss of stock etc etc

mzungu · 07-09-2018 9:14pm

Fathom wrote: »

Wolves good to reduce rabbits. Or rely on foxes?

Great for reducing the deer population. However, it looks highly unlikely that it will happen.

Fathom · 09-09-2018 6:32pm

mzungu wrote: »

Great for reducing the deer population. However, it looks highly unlikely that it will happen.

There is a species threshold. Below they fail. That minimum number would probably be shot away if reintroduced in Ireland.

mzungu · 11-09-2018 8:40pm

Fathom wrote: »

There is a species threshold. Below they fail. That minimum number would probably be shot away if reintroduced in Ireland.

Most likely, not to mention its been well over 200 years since they were here. The amount of pitfalls puts the kibosh on any plan.

Fathom · 12-09-2018 3:15am

mzungu wrote: »

Most likely, not to mention its been well over 200 years since they were here. The amount of pitfalls puts the kibosh on any plan.

Another species (locally) bites the dust.

Black Swan · 15-09-2018 3:28pm

mzungu wrote: »

Most likely, not to mention its been well over 200 years since they were here. The amount of pitfalls puts the kibosh on any plan.

Species local extinction. Sad.

Seth Brundle · 15-09-2018 3:33pm

Given that many attempts to reintroduce breeding populations of birds if prey are thwarted by poisoning, I can't see a reintroduction of wolves being welcomed by all.

Pretzill · 15-09-2018 3:38pm

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Given that many attempts to reintroduce breeding populations of birds if prey are thwarted by poisoning, I can't see a reintroduction of wolves being welcomed by all.

Agree - unfortunately. I don't think wolves would be a good idea because we don't have enough open space for them to roam without falling foul of the farmers gun. However, I'd have no problem letting beavers onto our rivers - clean it up and help with flooding - also might encourage more native tree growing.

TheBoyConor · 15-09-2018 3:43pm

Beavers? Are you joking?
We've enough invasive species making **** of our rivers without introducing beavers. FFS.

Fathom · 15-09-2018 5:10pm

The Last Wolves of Ireland. Mount Leinster in County Carlow, 1786.

Pretzill · 15-09-2018 6:40pm

TheBoyConor wrote: »

Beavers? Are you joking?
We've enough invasive species making **** of our rivers without introducing beavers. FFS.

Not joking no. They aren't an invasive species btw and were native to the British Isles at one stage and have been reintroduced in the UK with some success. But don't hold back your feelings there -

Fathom · 15-09-2018 8:46pm

"Ireland has a long relationship with wolves, with these creatures having been there since at least 34,000 BC, according to the latest carbon dating on remains."

Avatar MIA · 16-09-2018 9:10am

Fathom wrote: »

"Ireland has a long relationship with wolves, with these creatures having been there since at least 34,000 BC, according to the latest carbon dating on remains."

We also had bears, which apparently polar bears are descended from.

mattser · 16-09-2018 9:36am

I have enough problems with dangerous dogs and their irresponsible owners while I'm out for a jog.

On the other hand you might get less grief from an unattended wolf, and they're far prettier than some of the other brutes.

archer22 · 16-09-2018 9:36am

Our treatment and disregard for the wildlife we already have is appalling...bringing Wolves here would be only bringing them to short lives of pain and misery.

mzungu · 17-09-2018 9:58pm

Fathom wrote: »

"Ireland has a long relationship with wolves, with these creatures having been there since at least 34,000 BC, according to the latest carbon dating on remains."

Amazing to think that it's really only in the last 100-150 years that the habitat they would have thrived in has mostly disappeared.

Fathom · 22-09-2018 6:13pm

mzungu wrote: »

Amazing to think that it's really only in the last 100-150 years that the habitat they would have thrived in has mostly disappeared.

Question? Can you import a wolf as a pet in Ireland? Restrictions? I would imagine so. To have a wolf as a pet would require loads of space and they would be really difficult to train.

Avatar MIA · 22-09-2018 6:16pm

Fathom wrote: »

Question? Can you import a wolf as a pet in Ireland? Restrictions?

Same if you wished to import a Great White Shark or Tiger as a pet I would think.

Fathom · 22-09-2018 6:21pm

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Same if you wished to import a Great White Shark or Tiger as a pet I would think.

In some US states you can. Wild animal restrictions apply. Friend had one. Had to be "introduced" to wolf by owner. After that, no problems.

John_Rambo · 22-09-2018 9:16pm

Fathom wrote: »

Question? Can you import a wolf as a pet in Ireland? Restrictions?

There was someone on boards.ie that ran a shelter, she had a cross and it was very very unsuitable as a regular pet.

Regarding reintroduction, unfortunately the natural habitat for the Irish wolf is gone and livestock predation couldn't be avoided.

Interesting that our ancesters had a mutual respectful relationship with the wolves. The English wiped them out.

This is incredible.

https://www.yellowstonepark.com/things-to-do/wolf-reintroduction-changes-ecosystem

Fathom · 23-09-2018 2:05am

John_Rambo wrote: »

Interesting that our ancesters had a mutual respectful relationship with the wolves. The English wiped them out.

Sad.

mzungu · 23-09-2018 9:17pm

Fathom wrote:

Question? Can you import a wolf as a pet in Ireland? Restrictions?

I would imagine so. To have a wolf as a pet would require loads of space and they would be really difficult to train. I would imagine quarantine would come into it and that would be a good few months. All in all, I don't think it would be a runner.

John_Rambo · 23-09-2018 9:42pm

mzungu wrote: »

Question? Can you import a wolf as a pet in Ireland? Restrictions?

I would imagine so. To have a wolf as a pet would require loads of space and they would be really difficult to train. I would imagine quarantine would come into it and that would be a good few months. All in all, I don't think it would be a runner.

Not sure on the laws on unsuitable wild animals as pets. But unfortunately there's no law against idiocy. No amount of space and training will be enough to contain, control, stimulate and satiate a wolf without a pack unless you're looking at a social pack in a massive contained area with indigenous forestation, an abundance of natural prey and room for offspring break up packs.

catrat12 · 23-09-2018 9:47pm

I know this sounds stupid and to be honest it was probably a Fox
But I thought I saw a wolf in glencullen chasing sheep one evening few weeks back from my window

catrat12 · 23-09-2018 9:48pm

It was more grey than red and much bigger than fox

John_Rambo · 23-09-2018 9:58pm

catrat12 wrote: »

I know this sounds stupid and to be honest it was probably a Fox
But I thought I saw a wolf in glencullen chasing sheep one evening few weeks back from my window

Huskies have a strong chase instinct and they became incredibly popular in a very very short amount of time in Ireland because of nothing to do with their traits and everything to do with their looks.

There's a lot of unwanted ones in various rescue centres around the country which usually means there's lots of uncared for huskies not being looked after properly. They're a high maintenance, high energy dog that need plenty of play time, exercise, stimulation and attention. A lot of people that dropped a cool 1k on their Malamute or Siberian husky were very unprepared and unable to keep up with the demands of such a dog.

It's not unknown for people to dump dogs in rural areas thinking they'd "fend for themselves".

Foxes don't really chase sheep. Not in the manner dogs do. They'll hang around for dead lambs or the afterbirth. I've seen foxes casually walk through fields of sheep without a bat of an eyelid from the flocks.

Fathom · 24-09-2018 12:41am

8 times zones west wolf news... The gray wolf (Canis lupus) is a native species that was likely extirpated from California in the 1920s. The gray wolf is now returning to California on its own by dispersal of individuals from populations in other states. The California Department of Fish and Wildlife (CDFW) is working to monitor this recovering endangered species.

The Pheasant2 · 24-09-2018 12:48am

I like the idea, but in practice the habitat for them simply does not exist.

Tragically we're one of the most deforested countries in Europe and most of us don't seem to give a ****.

Tuco88 · 24-09-2018 1:49am

Plenty of space in dail eireann.

The Irish Wolfhound is another thing thats not really "Irish" you could say the Harp also?

No wounder our ancestors had such respect for the Wolf. Like the native Irish it too was hunted into smaller regions of the country by eh... "outsiders"

In truth the Wolf is a shy mystic creature... Nothing at all the the old tales. Still to be respected.

Wailin · 24-09-2018 2:05am

Complete fairy tale stuff lads this talk of wolves in Ireland. The country is basically one giant farm with absolutely no wilderness. Sheep are everywhere, up in the mointains and no way of preventing re-introduced wolves in taking easy prey. They'd be hunted to extinction again in no time. We'd need a national park 3 or 4 times the size of the Wicklow mointains with no farmers livestock, just impossible in this country.

Fathom · 26-09-2018 4:53am

Wailin wrote: »

They'd be hunted to extinction again in no time.

That summarizes it.

Teyla Emmagan · 26-09-2018 11:17am

What about the Blaskets? Or are they used for sheep? You'd think we'd have one unpopulated Island that we could put a few wolves on. Look at the wallabies on Lambay, they are thriving. Though they are herbivores I guess.

Avatar MIA · 26-09-2018 12:10pm

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

What about the Blaskets? Or are they used for sheep? You'd think we'd have one unpopulated Island that we could put a few wolves on. Look at the wallabies on Lambay, they are thriving. Though they are herbivores I guess.

Well, you'd need some sheep or such to be on the island

But, probably way to small an area for a wolf.

mzungu · 26-09-2018 12:18pm

Teyla Emmagan wrote: »

What about the Blaskets? Or are they used for sheep? You'd think we'd have one unpopulated Island that we could put a few wolves on. Look at the wallabies on Lambay, they are thriving. Though they are herbivores I guess.

Yep, there is still a population of sheep on the Blasket Islands. Those numbers would soon dwindle if predators were introduced.

Not sure if there are other animals inhabiting them, but there would be smaller mammals like rabbits and mice etc.

Space wise, I doubt it would be a runner. Ireland 200 years ago would be perfect, now, not so much.

lalababa · 26-09-2018 12:22pm

Fathom wrote: »

In some US states you can. Wild animal restrictions apply. Friend had one. Had to be "introduced" to wolf by owner. After that, no problems.

Was it a handshake or a quick howerya and and a nod, or what? Tell us more.

lalababa · 26-09-2018 12:44pm

Wailin wrote: »

Complete fairy tale stuff lads this talk of wolves in Ireland. The country is basically one giant farm with absolutely no wilderness. Sheep are everywhere, up in the mointains and no way of preventing re-introduced wolves in taking easy prey. They'd be hunted to extinction again in no time. We'd need a national park 3 or 4 times the size of the Wicklow mointains with no farmers livestock, just impossible in this country.

French wolf packs reportedly need around 220km2 per pack. Wicklow park has that, we could extend Donegal from 170 to 220, and Killarney to 220. Reduce the livestock units per hectare down to minimum for BPS etc. with a very little extra 'wolf payment ' 'coz livestock farming is only breaking even a.t.m. We could tie this scheme into the eagle projects!
So we could have 3 packs, and every so often we could mix them up a bit for genetic diversity. They could eat the deer and bits and bobs. Locals could run airbnbs for the wolf/ deer /eagle tourists. Twould be a boon to the tourist industry'coz God knows we don't get enough tourists.
In other news......

Fathom · 27-09-2018 2:12am

lalababa wrote: »

Was it a handshake or a quick howerya and and a nod, or what? Tell us more.

They have a sign. Backyard door in 8 ft fence. "Trespassers will be eaten." I wouldn't challenge that. Wolf owner took me by hand. Walked me slowly over to couch. We sat. He continuously talked to wolf. Reassured I was friend. Hugged me. Called him to come over. He approached. Ears perked. I did not give him eye contact. I held out my hand with owners together. Sniffed me. Then closed against me and I could pet him. After that I could go to my friend's house and enter. No problems. I guess I was a part of the pack. Not sure if this wolf ritual was common. Worked for this wolf.

mzungu · 27-09-2018 6:31pm

Fathom wrote: »

They have a sign. Backyard door in 8 ft fence. "Trespassers will be eaten." I wouldn't challenge that.

Wolf owner took me by hand. Walked me slowly over to couch. We sat. He continuously talked to wolf. Reassured I was friend. Hugged me. Called him to come over. He approached. Ears perked. I did not give him eye contact. I held out my hand with owners together. Sniffed me. Then closed against me and I could pet him. After that I could go to my friend's house and enter. No problems. I guess I was a part of the pack. Not sure if this wolf ritual was common. Worked for this wolf.

I'm kinda fascinated by this. What does your friend feed him? Does he need acres of roaming space etc?

Fathom · 01-10-2018 6:46pm

mzungu wrote: »

I'm kinda fascinated by this. What does your friend feed him? Does he need acres of roaming space etc?

I'll ask him.

mzungu · 01-10-2018 11:25pm

Fathom wrote: »

I'll ask him.

Thank you

Ardillaun · 06-02-2019 11:33pm

We’ll have to wait for the farmers to die out first.

Graces7 · 18-06-2019 6:50pm

Fathom wrote: »

Question? Can you import a wolf as a pet in Ireland? Restrictions?

I would imagine so. To have a wolf as a pet would require loads of space and they would be really difficult to train.

It is only a few years ago as I was driving in an area that was vast acres of forestry that a wolf ran across the narrow lane ahead of me.
When i asked my landlord, a local man, he looked at the ground and admitted that a man nearby had a wolf and sometimes let it roam.

I asked a govt official, and yes, it is allowed, but they have to be licensed and are not allowed to roam.
He had good space where he lived but... I never saw it again so word will have got back to him.

also many years ago here on boards, there was talk of someone in Leitrim literally living with wolves, but no exact location was given.

On the same theme a couple of weeks ago there was a news item re a large black catlike critter running loose and it may just be a matter of time before escapees from private collections in a wild area ...

Graces7 · 18-06-2019 6:53pm

Avatar MIA wrote: »

Well, you'd need some sheep or such to be on the island But, probably way to small an area for a wolf.

surely wolves can swim?

LionelNashe · 17-07-2019 12:23pm

Here's an article about reintroducing a small number of bears and wolves in an enclosed forest in the UK.

Native bears and wolves will live side by side for the first time in more than 1,000 years in a patch of ancient British woodland.

European brown bears, which are thought to have disappeared in the Middle Ages, will roam beside grey wolves, the last of which were hunted to extinction in the 17th century, in a wood near Bristol.

The project, called Bear Wood, will give visitors the chance to see how these animals would have coexisted in the woodland that used to cover much of Britain.

If we had a large area of enclosed forest, which I presume we don't, that might be a way to do it.

Should wolves be reintroduced to Ireland?

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