Pubs Closing Down Rural Ireland

hurler32 · 12-02-2018 4:23pm #1

Particularly in rural Ireland pubs have closed hand over fist in the past 7-8 years with those remaining in many cases hanging in there unless they've a substantial food business.Whats to blame , probably a number of things including

More and more people on minimum wage with no money

Depopulation of rural Ireland to Dublin and abroad

Young people spending their disposable income on illegal drugs as opposed to beer

Gardai over the top antics on elderly people in particular driving the following day ( as opposed to real crime - catching burglars - drug dealers etc )

Obviously it's cheaper go to Lidl but in rural pubs the pint is circa 4 euro for last ten years and even some tuborg- carling offers are cheaper . I'd prefer to pay a bit more to have a chat with neighbours than drink a can on my own looking out the window at home , or do younger folk only want to be on their phones rather than engage with members of their community ?

El Weirdo · 12-02-2018 4:26pm

Can't see this going well. After Hours loves to have a go at pubs and publicans.

seamus · 12-02-2018 4:27pm

The three main factors are young people not living in rural areas, vastly improved attitudes in relation to drink-driving, and an overall reduction in alcohol consumption.

You say it like it's a bad thing. But if there's no demand, there's no demand. So be it.

Cina · 12-02-2018 4:27pm

hurler32 wrote: »

Gardai over the top antics on elderly people in particular driving the following day ( as opposed to real crime - catching burglars - drug dealers etc )

Nailed it. It's not the crazy alcohol prices, drunken eejits, poor standards, filthy toilets, or awful service that have put me off going to rural pubs over the years, it's the possibility that the next day the Gardaí might be up to their old no good antics!

Next time you're about to go the pub, STOP, and think "is it worth meddlin' with those pesky Guard's tomorrow?"

the beer revolu · 12-02-2018 4:27pm

hurler32 wrote: »

Gardai over the top antics on elderly people in particular driving the following day ?

So you approve of people driving over the alcohol limit??

Are you from Kilgarvan?

hurler32 · 12-02-2018 4:46pm

the beer revolu wrote: »

So you approve of people driving over the alcohol limit??

Are you from Kilgarvan?

No im not but Gardai ..Ban Gardai in particular seem to specialize in bagging honest law abiding sorts ( in many cases teetotaler ) in the morning time.....seem to like scaring the elderly into been afraid to have a drink at all or venture out.....
Where as when these elderly are been broken into by travellers etc theres no guards to be found...Probably a broader piece on guards picking the handy catchs as opposed to tackling some of the evil scumbags outthere....

Super-Rush · 12-02-2018 4:50pm

hurler32 wrote: »

No im not but Gardai ..Ban Gardai in particular seem to specialize in bagging honest law abiding sorts ( in many cases teetotaler ) in the morning time.....seem to like scaring the elderly into been afraid to have a drink at all or venture out.....
Where as when these elderly are been broken into by travellers etc theres no guards to be found...Probably a broader piece on guards picking the handy catchs as opposed to tackling some of the evil scumbags outthere....

Anyone drink driving is an evil scumbag.

seamus · 12-02-2018 4:51pm

So the Gardai (and female ones in particular) are out on the roads arresting teetotallers in the morning to try and scare the elderly?

LOL.

And if your meaning of "bagging" is "testing them", then what's the harm? How is a Garda supposed to identify a teetotaller from anyone else?

The inanity of your statements speak for themselves.

Personally I'd prioritise road safety and saving lives above stopping some scumbags from stealing someone's cash and trinkets, but that's just me.

Luckily the Gardai who do the breath tests and the ones who catch burglars are in two different departments so we don't have to debate over what they *should* be doing.

Spanish Eyes · 12-02-2018 4:52pm

Doesn't matter. Sooner or later everyone will be living in Dublin anyway, you know where there are loadsa jobs, plenty of pubs, great public transport and cheap housing. :P

Who'd want to live in the country anyway, where everyone either knows or wants to know your business. Would kill me.

topper75 · 12-02-2018 5:00pm

A premium PER drink isnt' much e.g. Can 2.50 Pint 4.20.

But if you are binging - the premium over the course of a night fairly mounts and people are all too aware of this difference in their pocket.

Not that I'm advocating binging. But it is a popular pursuit amongst any pub's potential clients, is it not?

McGrath5 · 12-02-2018 5:08pm

OP, your ramblings look like something from the journal.

You haven't given any compelling reasons for as to why the "rural pub" is the sacred cow you make it out to be.

If these pubs are closing down, then so be it, it is simply the free market taking it's course of action.

12-02-2018 5:13pm

There are plently of rural pubs thriving too. I have a few locals that do a great trade and nothing to do with food. A good pub with good pints will attract business.

ohnonotgmail · 12-02-2018 5:37pm

hurler32 wrote: »

No im not but Gardai ..Ban Gardai in particular seem to specialize in bagging honest law abiding sorts ( in many cases teetotaler ) in the morning time.....seem to like scaring the elderly into been afraid to have a drink at all or venture out.....
Where as when these elderly are been broken into by travellers etc theres no guards to be found...Probably a broader piece on guards picking the handy catchs as opposed to tackling some of the evil scumbags outthere....

why would a teetotaler worry about being tested for drink driving?

MilesMorales1 · 12-02-2018 5:38pm

The pubs are closing down rural Ireland? Where did they get the authority to do that?

Gunmonkey · 12-02-2018 5:45pm

MilesMorales1 wrote: »

The pubs are closing down rural Ireland? Where did they get the authority to do that?

Vinters Association have their fingers in all the pies.....

hatrickpatrick · 12-02-2018 5:46pm

hurler32 wrote: »

I'd prefer to pay a bit more to have a chat with neighbours than drink a can on my own looking out the window at home , or do younger folk only want to be on their phones rather than engage with members of their community ?

You do realise that people can invite their friends to congregate at their home, right? Drinking at home and drinking alone are entirely different concepts.

michaelm · 12-02-2018 5:47pm

Ok - my tuppence worth: Firstly, stating the obvious; massive change in rural Ireland in recent years, if rural pubs are to survive they have to reinvent themselves ("keep doing what you're doing and you'll keep getting what you've got"). If everyone that replied to this thread had one positive suggestion as to how pubs can survive that would be great. My suggestion: I recently attended a film night in a cafe in Limerick - it was a huge success. Everyone had a drink on arrival, watched the film, interval with tea/coffee/drinks and treats. €20 x 20 people and some stayed on after for a drink. This will not of course suit most pubs, but if one benefited it would be great! Any other ideas?

donegaLroad · 12-02-2018 5:48pm

An increase in insurance costs over the last few years, and an increase in council rates dont help.
Also, more people are drinking at home now.

If I wanted to go for 3 pints it would cost me over 25 euro. Taxi to the pub, €7... 3 pints €12 ... taxi home €7.

One 6 pack of beer in Lidl (500ml) €8

Vronsky · 12-02-2018 5:48pm

seamus wrote: »

The three main factors are young people not living in rural areas, vastly improved attitudes in relation to drink-driving, and an overall reduction in alcohol consumption.

You say it like it's a bad thing. But if there's no demand, there's no demand. So be it.

I'd also add that there are more things to do, and more ways to socialize without going to the pub.

lawred2 · 12-02-2018 5:48pm

hurler32 wrote: »

No im not but Gardai ..Ban Gardai in particular seem to specialize in bagging honest law abiding sorts ( in many cases teetotaler ) in the morning time.....seem to like scaring the elderly into been afraid to have a drink at all or venture out.....
Where as when these elderly are been broken into by travellers etc theres no guards to be found...Probably a broader piece on guards picking the handy catchs as opposed to tackling some of the evil scumbags outthere....

How do you bag a teetotaler for driving over the limit?

Crea · 12-02-2018 5:50pm

I live in a rural area. I won't drink and drive so I don't go to the pub.

McGrath5 · 12-02-2018 5:54pm

Also - and this goes not just for rural pubs, the selection of drinks available tends to be quite poor. If you wish to drink something apart from Guinness, Heineken or Bulmers, you'll quickly find that your choice is very limited.

At least in the likes of Lidl or Aldi, I can try something different each week and for a more reasonable price too, rather than having some overpriced Diageo slop thrown at me in a smelly pub.

enricoh · 12-02-2018 5:59pm

Margins in farming are non existent in many cases nowadays. Young lads aren't sticking around to work for buttons.
A friend of mine was in a group that walked across Ireland 20 years ago. He said they would pop into a pub for a pint and often stay for a session as the craic was so good.
They did a 20 year reunion walk last year and was saying nearly all the pubs we're closed or just open Friday n Saturday night.

blue note · 12-02-2018 6:04pm

seamus wrote: »

The three main factors are young people not living in rural areas, vastly improved attitudes in relation to drink-driving, and an overall reduction in alcohol consumption.

You say it like it's a bad thing. But if there's no demand, there's no demand. So be it.

These three points are spot on, but I would say that it's not an entirely good thing. The problem being that the pub hasn't been replaced by anything for a lot of the people who would have used it. You can argue that it's their own fault and they should go and take up a hobby, but I don't think too many people would be without sympathy if it was their elderly father who used to go down to the pub each night for two pints who now has lost his social outlet.

The pub culture in Ireland is dying and it's largely a good thing. But it's not without a bit of collateral damage.

Also, I used to enjoy meeting my friends for an occasional midweek pint. But with the culture change (I don't think it's to do with getting older, there were plenty of people ten years my senior when I used to go for midweek pints) we rarely do it now. We keep in touch over WhatsApp mainly and do arrange get togethers, but it's a pity we don't meet in town for a pint more often.

pauliebdub · 12-02-2018 6:05pm

Most of the pubs that closed down in my local town were horrible kips,run down places frequented by old men. Along with better attitudes to drink driving, most of the customers have died off with no younger generation to replace them.

12-02-2018 6:06pm

I've seen pubs in a town change things up. Quiz one night, darts another, pool another. One pub has a bit of an annex that's even used for a prayer group. Another place has (possibly had) a knitting group.

Noveight · 12-02-2018 6:11pm

There are 3 pubs (formerly 4) in my village where 1 would now suffice for the amount of drinking that’s done.

As already mentioned, the pub is no longer the lynchpin of social life in rural Ireland. There are now cheaper, healthier, more enjoyable alternatives to meet up with friends.

sideswipe · 12-02-2018 6:15pm

Ban Gardai- there’s a term you don’t hear nowadays. Op over 60?

The Backwards Man · 12-02-2018 6:24pm

Do you know why rural pubs are fcuked?

Because people aren't happy with being misreable anymore.

Now they want to be entertained, they want gimmicks, they want 27 types of Ginger, they want a dozen beer taps in a pub that was struggle to gross three kegs a week, they want to enjoy themselves, they have unrealistic expectations.

Pubs used to a refuge from the misreable monotony of your own four walls, somewhere your could find solace in the knowledge that everyone else there was as misreable as you.

Pubs should stop pandering to punter's desires and tell them to shove their expectations up their holes if they want any chance at survival.

For Forks Sake · 12-02-2018 6:26pm

sideswipe wrote: »

Ban Gardai- there’s a term you don’t hear nowadays. Op over 60?

Probably drunk.

blue note · 12-02-2018 6:27pm

Noveight wrote: »

There are now cheaper, healthier, more enjoyable alternatives to meet up with friends.

What are you thinking of? In rural Ireland if you want to meet up with friends after you finish work for the day and have your dinner eaten what alternatives are there? In particular what cheaper, healthier more enjoyable alternatives? And then what about if you don't have friends you can call on but you were able to go down, sit at the counter and chat to the barman and whoever else happened to be doing the same that night?

And even in Dublin, where do you go to meet up with and chat to friends? If I'm trying to do it after my day is done the pubs are convenient and not terribly expensive if you're going down for 2 or 3 pints. If I'm going earlier I can go to a café / restaurant, but they're certainly not cheaper and not necessarily healthier. And unless they're very quiet they'll want their table back once your food and drink is consumed.

And even for the younger generation - I know it starts much younger, but I do worry about how actual social interaction is being pared back more and more. I think youngsters are staying in on social media as an alternative to meeting friends in a pub. It's good that they're not drinking, but bad that they're not interacting with real people.

The pub culture has been a curse to Ireland and overall it's a good thing that it's fading away. But I don't like people pretending that there was nothing positive about it. Used responsibly, it was a lovely thing.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 12-02-2018 6:29pm

You'd be surprised just how prevalent drunk driving still is the sticks.

wakka12 · 12-02-2018 6:32pm

So what, you can't force demand. Its either there or it isn't, and I don't think we should be trying to enforce demand for pubs anyway. If its loss of community you're worried about, maybe we should thinking about opening other social outlets in its place like a cafe or library or gym.

BattleCorp · 12-02-2018 6:33pm

Layne Rotten Shackle wrote: »

A good pub with good pints will attract business.

Location, location, location.

If they are in an area that isn't well populated, forget about it.

ohnonotgmail · 12-02-2018 6:34pm

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

You'd be surprised just how prevalent drunk driving still is the sticks.

sure eating a big meal can be as bad.

seachto7 · 12-02-2018 6:35pm

I hear foreigners who are used to café culture giving out about cafes that close at 5 on a Saturday or aren’t open on Sundays. They don’t want to go to the pub.
Maybe the cafes close to force people into a pub to socialise? I know you can go to a pub and get a coffee or mineral, but I can see their point sometimes.
I’m not sure if drink driving is the cause of rural pubs closing. What about 20 or 30 years ago. There were probably less cars about so people still had to get a lift to the pub if they didn’t own a car no?
Were people less cultured years ago? All they could think of as a form of entertainment was drink?

somesoldiers · 12-02-2018 6:39pm

Don't go out much but my local sells multi pack Bulmers cans singley for 4.50, having the "do not expect to pay and more than €2 for this can" label on it hasn't stopped him either.
Says a lot when it is cheaper for him to buy retail than through whoever supplies to pubs

PTH2009 · 12-02-2018 6:39pm

The costs of having Sky/BT sports in pubs and the fact cheap alternatives such as Kodi, Android boxes etc exist for homes. Personally love been the pub for big matches for the atmosphere

Health issues, drink driving

Locals been too old to go/dying off, can't get lifts etc

The sheer bordem of heading out to find it's only yourself and the barman in the place

blue note · 12-02-2018 6:51pm

I think we exaggerate our problem with alcohol at times in this country. Our consumption has gone right down in recent years and we're still trying to convince ourselves that we need to be more like continental Europe. Ourselves, France, Germany, Spain, Denmark, Belgium, Finland are all fairly similar in consumption levels. We do tend to binge more than those countries, but I'm pretty sure all types of drinking has gone down over the last few years.

We still have some way to come, but we've been going in the right direction for some time and we're not the nation of drunks that you'd think we are from reading about our relationship with drink.

seachto7 · 12-02-2018 6:54pm

Well coffee culture isn't moving in on pubs. Take Malahide for example. Nowhere really to sit outside to have a coffee. We don't have squares/piazzas/plazas to take advantage of this. Weather dependent too I suppose....

Staplor · 12-02-2018 6:57pm

Dirty pints and dirty toilets are 2 massive issues. Pubs seem to expect a trade, that they're doing you a favour to let you drink there. So they don't bother cleaning the lines from the keg, they barely clean or dry the glasses, and because there's no toilet seat you can't even take a dump in comfort.

Grab All Association · 12-02-2018 7:16pm

I never see AGS checkpoints in my area. Thurles traffic Corp only enforce the law in urban areas. You never see them outside the urban areas of Thurles and Nenagh. I’d say 60% of drivers on this back road after 12am are intoxicated. I assume this is why the rural pubs here do very well. I was in Borrisoleigh at 1am and you could see the GAA heads and farmers struggling to walk to their cars and jeeps. My gf at the time called Templemore station and they didn’t even respond to it.

whisky_galore · 12-02-2018 7:26pm

A neighbour of mine tried his hand at running a public in a rural village. One of his regulars used piss at the counter, he couldn't really bar him though.

buried · 12-02-2018 7:33pm

Broken Glass everywhere
People Pissing at the counter you know they just don't care
I can't take the smell, can't take the noise
No barista in the village so I got no choice

hurler32 · 12-02-2018 8:27pm

There is no doubt the social interaction in the pub where a twenty something would have a chat with his 50 year old neighbour or even chat about the weather with your mates granddad at the counter was a social glue that kept a community spirit and was good for all .....
Now with pubs closing in many rural spots , there ain't many alternatives and creates social isolation which our Dublin Fine Gael buddies wouldn't be familiar with ....
Sad for the elderly , nowhere to socialise .. sit at home and hope the travellers don't break in and beat you up ... modern rural Ireland is a sad place ...

The Rape of Lucretia · 12-02-2018 8:52pm

hurler32 wrote: »

Whats to blame , probably a number of things including :

- more variety of and better quality of options available to people these days.
- a more enlightened view and progress in people desire to gain a higher sense of enjoyment and fulfilment from their spare time than spending it drinking alcoholic beverages
- fewer people living remotely in borderline subsistence agriculture and a lonely lifestyle that can go with it
- improved knowledge of the health damage that frequent drinking causes
- improved roads and car ownership : people can go further than the 'local' to engage in social and recreational activities

Pubs closing down in a dramatic sign of progress in Irish society. Great news indeed.

seamus · 12-02-2018 9:56pm

BattleCorp wrote: »

Location, location, location.

If they are in an area that isn't well populated, forget about it.

I dunno. Ever been to the Strawberry Hall? It's in Dublin, but it's in the backarse of nowhere in the strawberry beds. Can't take the M50 to get there, can't walk there, and it's a 10 minute drive in all directions before you hit civilisation.

But the place is rammed. Because it's got atmosphere, it's got heart. It's a place where people want to go.

There are few places even in rural Ireland that are more than 15 minutes from the nearest town or village. Get a few local taxis on board, sell more than just a fireplace and Guinness, and you'll find more people willing to frequent.

enricoh · 12-02-2018 9:57pm

"Pubs closing down in a dramatic sign of progress in Irish society. Great news indeed."

Really? People are just drinking at home instead nowadays. I think it's pretty grim sitting at home half watching TV n flicking through Facebook, boards etc while drinking.
Plus people are drinking more at home as well, if a couple had 60 quid to spend on a Saturday night, that'll get them 10 drinks n a taxi home. No big deal.60 quid in Tesco's gets a bottle of vodka and a slab of cans.

BattleCorp · 12-02-2018 10:10pm

seamus wrote: »

I dunno. Ever been to the Strawberry Hall? It's in Dublin, but it's in the backarse of nowhere in the strawberry beds. Can't take the M50 to get there, can't walk there, and it's a 10 minute drive in all directions before you hit civilisation.

But the place is rammed. Because it's got atmosphere, it's got heart. It's a place where people want to go.

There are few places even in rural Ireland that are more than 15 minutes from the nearest town or village. Get a few local taxis on board, sell more than just a fireplace and Guinness, and you'll find more people willing to frequent.

Two huge differences.

Taxis are available in Dublin. Good luck getting one in rural Ballygobackwards. No busses either.

And rural Ballygobackwards won't have 50k people only 10 minutes away.

PTH2009 · 12-02-2018 10:12pm

Me and my dad's local is a 10 min walk away from the house but the interesting thing is there are 3 pubs on our street and around the corner 4 others but it's the city rather than a rural village

From passing the pubs on the street the mid week trade looks very bleak but the weekends they seem busy enough. It's the locals who keep them going tbh

Noveight · 12-02-2018 10:52pm

blue note wrote: »

What are you thinking of? In rural Ireland if you want to meet up with friends after you finish work for the day and have your dinner eaten what alternatives are there? In particular what cheaper, healthier more enjoyable alternatives?

In my own rural area you could get stuck in to the GAA, a walking/jogging club, dance lessons, weight classes, music lessons, genealogy workshop or the Tidy Towns. I think they even had painting classes going for a while. Each of the above take place at least once a week in the village and are relatively inexpensive if not cost free. Of course not every rural area would have such a decent variety but cheaper, healthier alternatives to the pub do indeed exist. Are they more enjoyable? Depends what you're into I suppose, sometimes all I'd want after the day is a quiet pint and a bag of Taytos by the fire.

blue note wrote: »

But I don't like people pretending that there was nothing positive about it. Used responsibly, it was a lovely thing.

Indeed there were many positives about it.

Pubs Closing Down Rural Ireland

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