Companion free travel pass use when DART/Train station ticket office is closed.

Spanish Eyes · 13-03-2019 6:58pm #1

Hi,
Just wondered if anyone knows what a companion FTP holder should do if primary FTP holder cannot buy a ticket for the companion because the ticket office is closed?

Sorry for the long winded question.

I have sent a mail off to Irish Rail, but it takes several days for a response, so I thought someone here might know.

Thanks.

Jamie2k9 · 13-03-2019 8:50pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Hi,
Just wondered if anyone knows what a companion FTP holder should do if primary FTP holder cannot buy a ticket for the companion because the ticket office is closed?

Sorry for the long winded question.

I have sent a mail off to Irish Rail, but it takes several days for a response, so I thought someone here might know.

Thanks.

Get on the train, once you are with the pass holder for the journey you are covered.

XPS_Zero · 14-03-2019 2:13pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Get on the train, once you are with the pass holder for the journey you are covered.

As long as you are within the SHZ. Within the DART zone you just need tag the ticket. If you are going intercity you technically need a ticket, some will enforce that some not, but I'd not take the chance.

Curb Your Enthusiasm · 14-03-2019 2:40pm

XPS_Zero wrote: »

As long as you are within the SHZ. Within the DART zone you just need tag the ticket. If you are going intercity you technically need a ticket, some will enforce that some not, but I'd not take the chance.

But if there's no one at the office to buy a ticket, what are they supposed to do? Miss the train to go off and find a manned office because of Irish Rail's staffing decisions?

Jamie2k9 · 14-03-2019 2:45pm

If ticket office is closed you are covered. Revenue will know.

If you board a intercity train without a ticket and the office is open they are prefectly entitled to fine you.

Working class heroes · 14-03-2019 6:38pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

If ticket office is closed you are covered. Revenue will know.

If you board a intercity train without a ticket and the office is open they are prefectly entitled to fine you.

I'm curious. Has it ever happened? Genuine question.

Jamie2k9 · 14-03-2019 10:57pm

Working class heroes wrote: »

I'm curious. Has it ever happened? Genuine question.

Probably not!

Spanish Eyes · 15-03-2019 7:01pm

Thanks for comments. I'll post up the reply from IR when I get it eventually.

My main concern is DART or other stations within the SHZ that require you to tag the ticket and pass at the barrier. How does the companion get through the barrier at either or both ends if h/she has not got a ticket because ticket office is closed!

You'd have to be nimble and quick to follow the FTP holder through the barrier, and it doesn't sound right either!

Virtanen · 15-03-2019 7:09pm

From my experience, they keep the barriers open whenever there's nobody in the office, have traveled as a companion with two different pass holders and never had a problem

Was even told once when getting the tickets that we didn't need them, to just board the DART without them, but that was just the office saving time rather than a policy

Virtanen · 15-03-2019 7:11pm

Also you seem to think that the pass holder is able to get through the barriers with their travel pass, which is not the case. If the office is manned, you need to get two tickets: one for the pass holder, and one for the companion

Corca Baiscinn · 15-03-2019 8:25pm

Curb Your Enthusiasm wrote: »

But if there's no one at the office to buy a ticket, what are they supposed to do? Miss the train to go off and find a manned office because of Irish Rail's staffing decisions?

One piece of advice someone I know received was to get off in the middle to buy a ticket! Journey was Limerick Junction to Athenry. No ticket office office open and machines didn't have Athenry as an option even though you can travel straight through. Person asked ticket check man what to do and he said "get out in Limerick and buy a ticket to Athenry." The person declined. It would have meant lugging or leaving their luggage and besides they considered the situation so absurd they declined to go along with it. they figured if the train traveled form A to B the machine should provide a ticket from A to B

Curb Your Enthusiasm · 15-03-2019 8:58pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

One piece of advice someone I know received was to get off in the middle to buy a ticket! Journey was Limerick Junction to Athenry. No ticket office office open and machines didn't have Athenry as an option even though you can travel straight through. Person asked ticket check man what to do and he said "get out in Limerick and buy a ticket to Athenry." The person declined. It would have meant lugging or leaving their luggage and besides they considered the situation so absurd they declined to go along with it. they figured if the train traveled form A to B the machine should provide a ticket from A to B

That's ridiculous. I'd point blank refuse to do that also. It's not my problem if they don't staff an office and there's no alternative way of purchasing a ticket at the first station. IR should really cop themselves on.

Jamie2k9 · 16-03-2019 2:25pm

My main concern is DART or other stations within the SHZ that require you to tag the ticket and pass at the barrier. How does the companion get through the barrier at either or both ends if h/she has not got a ticket because ticket office is closed!

You'd have to be nimble and quick to follow the FTP holder through the barrier, and it doesn't sound right either!

If a ticket office is closed at least one barrier will be left open.

If you have a card and are traveling with somebody the barrier will only accept it once so you companion will either use the open barrier or staff will let them out.

Tarabuses · 16-03-2019 4:53pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Thanks for comments. I'll post up the reply from IR when I get it eventually.

My main concern is DART or other stations within the SHZ that require you to tag the ticket and pass at the barrier. How does the companion get through the barrier at either or both ends if h/she has not got a ticket because ticket office is closed!

You'd have to be nimble and quick to follow the FTP holder through the barrier, and it doesn't sound right either!

I had this experience at Tara Street, where there is no ticket office. I asked a staff member how I could get a ticket for my wife and he told me that we both had to get through the barrier together. There was no open barrier and he didn't offer to open one for my wife either. When we arrived at Malahide we had to do the same again to exit.

Fortunately there was a ticket office open in Malahide for our journey home. That is the one and only time I have taken my wife on the DART with my FTP.

vektarman · 16-03-2019 8:12pm

Virtanen wrote: »

Was even told once when getting the tickets that we didn't need them, to just board the DART without them, but that was just the office saving time rather than a policy

I would have to disagree with this. From the Irishrail site:

You must be in possession of your free travel pass when travelling on board all Iarnród Éireann services and you must present your free travel pass at the ticket office to receive a ticket to travel on all services except the DART.

Spanish Eyes · 16-03-2019 8:53pm

Tarabuses wrote: »

I had this experience at Tara Street, where there is no ticket office. I asked a staff member how I could get a ticket for my wife and he told me that we both had to get through the barrier together. There was no open barrier and he didn't offer to open one for my wife either. When we arrived at Malahide we had to do the same again to exit.

Fortunately there was a ticket office open in Malahide for our journey home. That is the one and only time I have taken my wife on the DART with my FTP.

That is EXACTLY the point I was trying to communicate. Thank you.

It doesn't sound very user friendly to me anyway and a tad embarrassing/dangerous also! Many passengers behind your wife probably thought she was trying to get on for free by just jumping in behind you. It has been known to happen with fare dodgers.....

I don't think it is good enough personally. But anyway, will await a response from IR.

Continued thanks for comments.

Jamie2k9 · 16-03-2019 9:13pm

Tarabuses wrote: »

I had this experience at Tara Street, where there is no ticket office. I asked a staff member how I could get a ticket for my wife and he told me that we both had to get through the barrier together. There was no open barrier and he didn't offer to open one for my wife either. When we arrived at Malahide we had to do the same again to exit.

Fortunately there was a ticket office open in Malahide for our journey home. That is the one and only time I have taken my wife on the DART with my FTP.

This is staff members not doing there jobs. I hope you reported both instances. No excuses for them not opening the barriers in both situations.

Jamie2k9 · 16-03-2019 9:17pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

That is EXACTLY the point I was trying to communicate. Thank you.

It doesn't sound very user friendly to me anyway and a tad embarrassing/dangerous also! Many passengers behind your wife probably thought she was trying to get on for free by just jumping in behind you. It has been known to happen with fare dodgers.....

I don't think it is good enough personally. But anyway, will await a response from IR.

Continued thanks for comments.

If there are staff there demand barriers are open. I never come across ones who refuse.

If they refuse use this number as there is a serious risk of injury to those who tailgate barriers

http://www.irishrail.ie/contact-us/emergency-contact-details

The control center won't be long getting the issue sorted and force action to be taken. They only way IE listen is if you really push the boundaries such as using this number.

If they make your life difficult, you do the same!

Spanish Eyes · 16-03-2019 9:34pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

If there are staff there demand barriers are open. I never come across ones who refuse.

If they refuse use this number as there is a serious risk of injury to those who tailgate barriers

http://www.irishrail.ie/contact-us/emergency-contact-details

The control center won't be long getting the issue sorted and force action to be taken. They only way IE listen is if you really push the boundaries such as using this number.

If they make your life difficult, you do the same!

Thanks. But I really think that number could be for someone falling on to the tracks or something terrible like that. Still, I have put it in my contacts in case I get stuck at the barrier following the FTP holder,and cannot get out!

Just being a tad lighthearted here, but honestly, it is just not good enough.

Anyway, if I get a reply from IR, it should be interesting to see what they say. But there is no getting away from having to double jump through the barrier. That is just not good enough in anyone's language really. And as you say could cause serious injury/embarrassment/delay etc.

OMG.

Jamie2k9 · 16-03-2019 9:41pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Thanks. But I really think that number could be for someone falling on to the tracks or something terrible like that. Still, I have put it in my contacts in case I get stuck at the barrier following the FTP holder,and cannot get out!

Just being a tad lighthearted here, but honestly, it is just not good enough.

Anyway, if I get a reply from IR, it should be interesting to see what they say. But there is no getting away from having to double jump through the barrier. That is just not good enough in anyone's language really. And as you say could cause serious injury/embarrassment/delay etc.

OMG.

Indeed its exactly what the number is for but sometimes drastic action is needed to get things done. Its just ridiculous if staff refuse to let people through barriers when they have valid documents.

Hilly Bill · 16-03-2019 10:03pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

This is staff members not doing there jobs. I hope you reported botyh instances. No excuses for them not opening the barriers in both situations.

They didn't need to open the barrier the pass holder can do it with the card.

Hilly Bill · 16-03-2019 10:05pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

If there are staff there demand barriers are open. I never come across ones who refuse.

If they refuse use this number as there is a serious risk of injury to those who tailgate barriers

http://www.irishrail.ie/contact-us/emergency-contact-details

The control center won't be long getting the issue sorted and force action to be taken. They only way IE listen is if you really push the boundaries such as using this number.

If they make your life difficult, you do the same!

That's a tad of an overreaction to be fair.

Hilly Bill · 16-03-2019 10:06pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Indeed its exactly what the number is for but sometimes drastic action is needed to get things done. Its just ridiculous if staff refuse to let people through barriers when they have valid documents.

That valid documents opens the barrier

Jamie2k9 · 16-03-2019 11:47pm

Hilly Bill wrote: »

That valid documents opens the barrier

A paper pass does not and a card will only open for one person even if a companion is traveling.

That's a tad of an overreaction to be fair.

I agree but it takes firm action for IE to listen.

They didn't need to open the barrier the pass holder can do it with the card.

As said above, yes they did.

Tarabuses · 17-03-2019 1:58pm

Tarabuses wrote: »

I had this experience at Tara Street, where there is no ticket office. I asked a staff member how I could get a ticket for my wife and he told me that we both had to get through the barrier together. There was no open barrier and he didn't offer to open one for my wife either. When we arrived at Malahide we had to do the same again to exit.

Fortunately there was a ticket office open in Malahide for our journey home. That is the one and only time I have taken my wife on the DART with my FTP.

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

This is staff members not doing there jobs. I hope you reported both instances. No excuses for them not opening the barriers in both situations.

In fact there were two other staff members at Tara Street listening to my conversation and neither contradicted the instruction I was given. There was no one in Malahide to open the barrier there. I assumed this was IR procedure and did not report the incident although I thought it was very unusual.

Jamie2k9 · 18-03-2019 11:10pm

Tarabuses wrote: »

In fact there were two other staff members at Tara Street listening to my conversation and neither contradicted the instruction I was given. There was no one in Malahide to open the barrier there. I assumed this was IR procedure and did not report the incident although I thought it was very unusual.

Of course fellow colleagues wouldn't point out an error!

Hilly Bill · 19-03-2019 1:41am

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

A paper pass does not and a card will only open for one person even if a companion is traveling.

I agree but it takes firm action for IE to listen.

As said above, yes they did.

You shouldn't have a paper pass at this stage.

Hilly Bill · 19-03-2019 1:42am

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Of course fellow colleagues wouldn't point out an error!

No error.

Jamie2k9 · 19-03-2019 3:15pm

Hilly Bill wrote: »

No error.

There was an error, I suggest you ask your manager and if he says your correct ask him why there are public safety notices warning against the same thing.

As for card/paper passed they are still in circulation and no offical end date yet.

Hilly Bill · 21-03-2019 10:49pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

There was an error, I suggest you ask your manager and if he says your correct ask him why there are public safety notices warning against the same thing.

As for card/paper passed they are still in circulation and no offical end date yet.

Nope, no error. I suggest to wait until you hear both sides of a story before criticising and being judgemental

Jamie2k9 · 21-03-2019 11:31pm

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Nope, no error. I suggest to wait until you hear both sides of a story before criticising and being judgemental

At no point should a staff member refuse to let passengers through barriers if they have a valid ticket.

Hilly Bill · 22-03-2019 1:36am

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

At no point should a staff member refuse to let passengers through barriers if they have a valid ticket.

It doesn't happen if they have a valid ticket.

Spanish Eyes · 22-03-2019 2:35pm

OP here.

This is the reply I got from IR and TBH I am none the wiser really! It doesn't clarify what happens at DART stations where there is no ticket office which is what I specifically asked about.

"Thank you, for contacting our Irish Rail, Customer Information Department.

Customers with a Free Travel Companion Pass must present their pass at the Booking Office before travel.

If the Booking Office is closed customers may board the train and present their pass to a staff member if requested.

Thank you, for taking the time to contact us.

Yours sincerely,

Thomas O'Leary.
Customer Information, Iarnród Éireann Irish Rail, Connolly Station, Dublin 1 D01 V6V6"

I happened to be passing by Pearse Station yesterday and asked this question at the information desk, the reply was that the companion just follows the card holder through the barrier!

Hilly Bill · 22-03-2019 3:38pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

OP here.

This is the reply I got from IR and TBH I am none the wiser really! It doesn't clarify what happens at DART stations where there is no ticket office which is what I specifically asked about.

"Thank you, for contacting our Irish Rail, Customer Information Department.

Customers with a Free Travel Companion Pass must present their pass at the Booking Office before travel.

If the Booking Office is closed customers may board the train and present their pass to a staff member if requested.

Thank you, for taking the time to contact us.

Yours sincerely,

Thomas O'Leary.
Customer Information, Iarnród Éireann Irish Rail, Connolly Station, Dublin 1 D01 V6V6"

I happened to be passing by Pearse Station yesterday and asked this question at the information desk, the reply was that the companion just follows the card holder through the barrier!

That's what you do but if the station in unmanned then a gate would or should be left open so you just walk through. There is plenty of time for both to pass through the gate if the first person doesn't decide to stop half way and block the other person.

punisher5112 · 22-03-2019 3:45pm

Should do away with the barriers and have inspectors on trains.

The amount that don't pay or validate their travel is astonishing.

Spanish Eyes · 22-03-2019 4:12pm

Hilly Bill wrote: »

That's what you do but if the station in unmanned then a gate would or should be left open so you just walk through. There is plenty of time for both to pass through the gate if the first person doesn't decide to stop half way and block the other person.

First person (FTP card holder) is disabled that's why they have a companion pass. Unfortunately cannot move that fast through the barriers.

There were no barriers left open at Pearse Station the other day, I was looking and doing my research! I do realise that there are different banks of barriers in that station, but honestly I saw no open barrier for the type of situation I was referring to at my exit point from the DART onto Westland Row..

Hilly Bill · 23-03-2019 12:03am

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

First person (FTP card holder) is disabled that's why they have a companion pass. Unfortunately cannot move that fast through the barriers.

There were no barriers left open at Pearse Station the other day, I was looking and doing my research! I do realise that there are different banks of barriers in that station, but honestly I saw no open barrier for the type of situation I was referring to at my exit point from the DART onto Westland Row..

Some assumption there. Plenty of companion pass holders are able bodied and travel alone

punisher5112 · 23-03-2019 12:17am

Free travel is open for so much now kids even have them.

I come across many school kids and they try and bring a friend.

Have many bring their companion and the card holder leaves and the one without continue on their journey.

Companion passes are for anyone over 70 and anyone under that age that need care such as a helper but this is being badly abused also the same as the spouse/cohabitation pass where the pass holder brings their mates or other family members etc.....

Corca Baiscinn · 24-03-2019 10:47pm

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Some assumption there. Plenty of companion pass holders are able bodied and travel alone

I understood the OP to be saying that the specific person for whom s/he is a companion is disabled and unable to move quickly through the barrier. I dont think s/he was making any comment re disabled people in general. And in his/her experience there wasn't a barrier open at the station she checked out so if the person for whom she is a companion had been travelling with her there would have been a problem

Spanish Eyes · 24-03-2019 11:04pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

I understood the OP to be saying that the specific person for whom s/he is a companion is disabled and unable to move quickly through the barrier. I dont think s/he was making any comment re disabled people in general. And in his/her experience there wasn't a barrier open at the station she checked out so if the person for whom she is a companion had been travelling with her there would have been a problem

Spot on thanks!

In fairness I didn't say that the primary FTP holder was disabled in OP. So my mistake there.

But everything else you said is correct.

To be fair there are many FTP +C holders who are fit and healthy, they get a companion pass for their spouse/cp/cohabitee under the rules.

The person to whom I am referring is single, and has a companion pass due to disability.

I did omit that fact in error, sorry.

Corca Baiscinn · 24-03-2019 11:19pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

To be fair there are many FTP +C holders who are fit and healthy, they get a companion pass for their spouse/cp/cohabitee under the rules..

Not the topic of your thread but I often think that the automatic pass for a partner is not really justified cost wise, though to be fair I dont know the actual cost. For a couple, once one of the parties gets a FT pass their PT travel costs disappear whereas if only the person who reaches 66 first got it the costs would halve in any case, until the other person reached 66 which still wouldn't be a bad deal imo. It means that for couples where there is an age discrepancy, the younger partner can enjoy several years of free travel. Not sure its justified in the context of all the needs out there

Hilly Bill · 26-03-2019 11:04pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

I understood the OP to be saying that the specific person for whom s/he is a companion is disabled and unable to move quickly through the barrier. I dont think s/he was making any comment re disabled people in general. And in his/her experience there wasn't a barrier open at the station she checked out so if the person for whom she is a companion had been travelling with her there would have been a problem

The op could have prevented the barrier from closing.

frogstar · 26-03-2019 11:13pm

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

First person (FTP card holder) is disabled that's why they have a companion pass. Unfortunately cannot move that fast through the barriers.

There were no barriers left open at Pearse Station the other day, I was looking and doing my research! I do realise that there are different banks of barriers in that station, but honestly I saw no open barrier for the type of situation I was referring to at my exit point from the DART onto Westland Row..

If you are going to pearse they always have someone manned at barrier to take tickets, queries etc.... Its too big a station to leave a barrier open as open to abuse.

Someone mentioned malahide. As far as I remember they have two exits. One would require a ticket and the other is the main entrance that would be manned or left opened

There will always be issues with tickets etc... So they are not going to leave you stuck at a station if you don't have one and they have no staff on. Its cheaper to leave open rather than man at quieter times.

ExoPolitic · 27-03-2019 12:27pm

Corca Baiscinn wrote: »

Not the topic of your thread but I often think that the automatic pass for a partner is not really justified cost wise, though to be fair I dont know the actual cost. For a couple, once one of the parties gets a FT pass their PT travel costs disappear whereas if only the person who reaches 66 first got it the costs would halve in any case, until the other person reached 66 which still wouldn't be a bad deal imo. It means that for couples where there is an age discrepancy, the younger partner can enjoy several years of free travel. Not sure its justified in the context of all the needs out there

I used to travel with somebody who presents as able bodied... they were registered blind and could only see six feet, so they couldn't read the destination blinds on the trains/buses and required somebody to be with them to aid this. They could walk down the pavement fine and appear to be normal, but had no hope in hell of using public transport. The cost to hire people to do this compared to just using a companion FTP doesn't even compare.

bluezulu49 · 27-03-2019 12:55pm

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

...and a card will only open for one person even if a companion is traveling.

I have had a FT + S pass for some years now and mainly use it on the DART. When I first got it I asked station staff how I should use it to let my wife through the barrier. I was told to have her approach the barrier first, tag on with my pass and follow her through the barrier. This has worked for us for the last five years on all DART stations we have used.

Corca Baiscinn · 27-03-2019 9:01pm

ExoPolitic wrote: »

I used to travel with somebody who presents as able bodied... they were registered blind and could only see six feet, so they couldn't read the destination blinds on the trains/buses and required somebody to be with them to aid this. They could walk down the pavement fine and appear to be normal, but had no hope in hell of using public transport. The cost to hire people to do this compared to just using a companion FTP doesn't even compare.

Yes, I agree. I mentioned 66 to show I was expressing an opinion re able-bodied "Pensioner" FTP not Disability based FTP who of course may need a companion

Companion free travel pass use when DART/Train station ticket office is closed.

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