Claire Byrne show. Her name was Clodagh

autumnbelle · 26-02-2019 12:29am #1

Just watching the programme her sister and mother are so dignified. How have the school not given them answers? Tragic

franklyon · 26-02-2019 12:39am

Horrific ordeal these poor people have had to endure. So brave of them to go on national tv and speak about it.

26-02-2019 12:43am

Very poignant stuff. The school, the councillor, the INTO and AGS seem to be united in denying those women closure. If it's true that your man had never been diagnosed with depression by his GP in all those decades, it also makes the conclusion of the inquest open to further questions.

JupiterKid · 26-02-2019 12:44am

Watched this myself. Clodagh’s mother and sister were very brave and dignified in telling her story. Heartbreaking.

It sheds a little more light on this horrific and shocking murder-suicide, and I am of the opinion that Alan Hawe was a very insecure, domineering and controlling individual who callously premeditated and plotted the heinous and barbaric slaughter of his family.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:03am

What was this thing that your man was covering up?

26-02-2019 1:05am

The fact that there may be quite a few people out there that have the answers that this family so deserve and are entitled to imo is sickening. Its like they are supporting a dead murderer and letting the family suffer on unnecessarily without the last few bits of the puzzle is just wrong,someone needs to tell them the full story.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:05am

The porn addiction was clearly a central issue.

Why was he seeking counselling fro it?

retro:electro · 26-02-2019 1:08am

One of the most upsetting things I’ve ever watched. I’m glad we finally got to see a true representation of the man, a vile, abusive and narcissistic bully; and not the sympathetic portrayal that flooded the media in the aftermath. It didn’t even reference how he took his own life because who actually gives a shlt about what he did to himself. To take their lives is one thing, but what he did was overkill and savage slaughter. How anyone can take a hatchet to someone they claim to love, and he moved furniture weeks prior shows he had been planning it for a while. If there’s a hell I hope he’s rotting. Depression my hole. How insulting to many people who struggle with depression every day and don’t manage to annihilate their whole family.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:09am

autumnbelle wrote: »

Just watching the programme her sister and mother are so dignified. How have the school not given them answers? Tragic

I'm putting 2 + 2 together here.

He had a porn addiction that he had been seeking professional help for.

There is clearly a problem in his professional life that isnt being disclosed or discussed. A profession that involves interaction with kids

Do you see where this is pointing?

Zeek12 · 26-02-2019 1:09am

orourkeda1977 wrote: »

What was this thing that your man was covering up?

Addiction to porn.

Apparently he was caught masturbating at a school computer where he was a teacher

Immortal Starlight · 26-02-2019 1:10am

I watched it too. It was heartbreaking. Clodagh's mother and sister are so strong and brave. It's an absolute disgrace that they have not gotten any answers from anyone. It was terrible and horrific hearing what that evil depraved man did to poor Clodagh and her three beautiful boys.

Ginger83 · 26-02-2019 1:11am

Deleted User wrote: »

Very poignant stuff. The school, the councillor, the INTO and AGS seem to be united in denying those women closure. If it's true that your man had never been diagnosed with depression by his GP in all those decades, it also makes the conclusion of the inquest open to further questions.

What cllr

Zeek12 · 26-02-2019 1:14am

Ginger83 wrote: »

What cllr

He was seeing a counselor wasn’t he?

kittensmittens · 26-02-2019 1:14am

He was an evil, evil piece of self absorbed inhuman filth. Depression my ar5e.
All he cared about was himself.
I'm agnostic but if there is a hell I hope he is roaring in it.

That poor family. Absolutely heartbreaking

Edit
I remember at the time when this happened and there was some serious questions on the thread that was here in relation to this case about him being buried with those week kids. Im delighted they had him exhumed.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:19am

Zeek12 wrote: »

Addiction to porn.

Apparently he was caught masturbating at a school computer where he was a teacher

The mother mentioned that he told his wife about this.

I know that the incident at the computer would have been the source of humiliation but he could have overcome that. Why would this be kept quiet for so long?

I wouldnt call it trivial but given the circumstances how can keeping it quiet be justified? At worst he would have lost his job

I just feel that there is more to this

MintyMagnum · 26-02-2019 1:20am

Looks like his school has circled the wagons, are they afraid of being sued or something

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:21am

Deleted User wrote: »

The fact that there may be quite a few people out there that have the answers that this family so deserve and are entitled to imo is sickening. Its like they are supporting a dead murderer and letting the family suffer on unnecessarily without the last few bits of the puzzle is just wrong,someone needs to tell them the full story.

The obvious question is why this is happening?

Whats the big secret and why the cover up?

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:22am

MintyMagnum wrote: »

Looks like his school has circled the wagons, are they afraid of being sued or something

If he was just masturbating in front of a computer how could they be sued?

Unless he did it in front of students? Thats potentially criminal

TheDriver · 26-02-2019 1:24am

addicted to porn doesn't make you kill people.
Being disgraced at work doesn't make you kill people.
Being depressed doesn't make you kill people.
Going for counselling doesn't make you kill people.

Being a nutjob/psycho/very unstable person can lead to killing people.

I don't think they're going to find out anything more than they already know to be honest. He's clearly the person we all think he is.

TheDriver · 26-02-2019 1:26am

orourkeda1977 wrote: »

If he was just masturbating in front of a computer how could they be sued?

Unless he did it in front of students? Thats potentially criminal

I think its probably the fact that its a professional file in a workplace that can't just be given out to anyone who asks. Its her family want it, not his family. And even at that, its a professional file that contains competency/grievances etc. I assume Gardai have checked and found nothing factual to report

donkeykong5 · 26-02-2019 1:27am

Evil sick murdering bastard. I'm so glad that the murderer is not buried with the poor innocents that he brutally murdered. Hope he rots in hell.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:28am

TheDriver wrote: »

addicted to porn doesn't make you kill people.
Being disgraced at work doesn't make you kill people.
Being depressed doesn't make you kill people.
Going for counselling doesn't make you kill people.

Being a nutjob/psycho/very unstable person can lead to killing people.

I don't think they're going to find out anything more than they already know to be honest. He's clearly the person we all think he is.

Then if he was seriously mentally ill and proved to be a mass murderer why wasn't this flagged?

I understand that he was being counselled for addiction but what happened?

He was working in a school after all.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:29am

TheDriver wrote: »

I think its probably the fact that its a professional file in a workplace that can't just be given out to anyone who asks. Its her family want it, not his family. And even at that, its a professional file that contains competency/grievances etc. I assume Gardai have checked and found nothing factual to report

Why didnt the gardai tell the family this if it is true

TheDriver · 26-02-2019 1:32am

orourkeda1977 wrote: »

Why didnt the gardai tell the family this if it is true

I got the impression that the Gardai talked to the family, they just didn't give them the case file to look through.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:33am

TheDriver wrote: »

I got the impression that the Gardai talked to the family, they just didn't give them the case file to look through.

Then why are the family seeking an inquest or inquiry?

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:37am

Heres an irish times article from earlier.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/clodagh-hawe-s-sister-we-don-t-know-what-the-truth-is-1.3806024

It mentions a dispute with a colleague but offers little info as to what the dispute centred around.

Theres also mention that he was wearing articles of womens clothing

Lackey · 26-02-2019 1:38am

There was porn found on his work laptop which never left school grounds.

He discussed an undisclosed issue he was having with a colleague

He then cancelled all his appointments with the councillor at the start of the summer and began planning the murders, moving furniture to clear his attack route
Blowing the ‘psychotic break’ bullish!t excuse out of the water.

Then murdered Clodagh and her sons the night before he was due back to work and ‘face the music’ apparently.

Clodaghs family should be given any files/information they want

Leaving them to find out details of the murders from the papers was so wrong and no access the his letters for 16 months was just cruel.

tretorn · 26-02-2019 1:39am

orourkeda1977 wrote: »

Then if he was seriously mentally ill and proved to be a mass murderer why wasn't this flagged?

I understand that he was being counselled for addiction but what happened?

He was working in a school after all.

Watching adult porn isn’t a crime though and the counsellor wouldn’t have had to report Hawe because he wasn’t a threat to the children he taught. If he was accessing child porn and admitted it then the counsellor would presumably have had to report that.

Was he addicted to porn though, did this come out at the inquest.

How could he watch porn in the school, surely it would be blocked on school computers. Also how thick would you have to be to get caught masturbating.

retro:electro · 26-02-2019 1:41am

In fairness I don’t think it’s fair to penalise innocent co workers who may not have known anything. They didn’t do anything wrong here. It could be as simple as, he was caught jacking off and was dreading going back knowing his former reputation would be in tatters and he would be the butt of some jokes. He was a narcissist. Narcissists have an idealised image of themselves, and when this is threatened, they catastrophise and act irrationally, sometimes in ways that are completely at odds and disproportionate to the issue at hand. I don’t think it’s fair to assume the co workers knew any more than the rest of us. He seems like he controlled his image to a T.
We must not forget who the real person at fault is here, we can’t assume his colleagues have the answers.

MintyMagnum · 26-02-2019 1:42am

autumnbelle wrote: »

Just watching the programme her sister and mother are so dignified. How have the school not given them answers? Tragic

I think Clodagh's mother / the boy's grandmother is right to ask WHAT it was that her daughter and her grandsons Died For. He said in his 5page letter that the truth was all going to come out. Those in the know are giving him exactly what HE wanted - protection from being shown up / exposed / embarrassed / found lacking somehow, shown to be less than the ideal he presented as.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:44am

tretorn wrote: »

Watching adult porn isn’t a crime though and the counsellor wouldn’t have had to report Hawe because he wasn’t a threat to the children he taught. If he was accessing child porn and admitted it then the counsellor would presumably have had to report that.

Was he addicted to porn though, did this come out at the inquest.

How could he watch porn in the school, surely it would be blocked on school computers. Also how thick would you have to be to get caught masturbating.

Thats a valid point. I hadnt thought of that.

orourkeda1977 · 26-02-2019 1:45am

MintyMagnum wrote: »

I think Clodagh's mother / the boy's grandmother is right to ask WHAT it was that her daughter and her grandsons Died For. He said in his 5page letter that the truth was all going to come out. Those in the know are giving him exactly what HE wanted - protection from being shown up / exposed / embarrassed / found lacking somehow, shown to be less than the ideal he presented as.

Why? I dont get it.

political analyst · 26-02-2019 1:59am

MintyMagnum wrote: »

I think Clodagh's mother / the boy's grandmother is right to ask WHAT it was that her daughter and her grandsons Died For. He said in his 5page letter that the truth was all going to come out. Those in the know are giving him exactly what HE wanted - protection from being shown up / exposed / embarrassed / found lacking somehow, shown to be less than the ideal he presented as.

It's already out - he was caught "pleasuring himself" and watching porn on a computer at the school.

It's possible that data protection law prevents the authorities from releasing information about Alan Hawe without permission from his parents and brothers.

padd b1975 · 26-02-2019 2:04am

JupiterKid wrote: »

Watched this myself. Clodagh’s mother and sister were very brave and dignified in telling her story. Heartbreaking.

It sheds a little more light on this horrific and shocking murder-suicide, and I am of the opinion that Alan Hawe was a very insecure, domineering and controlling individual who callously premeditated and plotted the heinous and barbaric slaughter of his family.

Spot on in your discription of him.

My sister would have been in St. Pat's College around the same time as them, they were a couple back then in the mid nineties.
St. Pat's is a small college where everyone knows everyone else and their business.

Clodagh and himself would have been what you would call a "golden couple" on campus, at least that's what a casual observer would see.
Unfortunately even in his late teens there was obvious signs of his controlling behaviour.

A tragic case.

MintyMagnum · 26-02-2019 2:10am

political analyst wrote: »

It's already out - he was caught "pleasuring himself" and watching porn on a computer at the school.

It's possible that data protection law prevents the authorities from releasing information about Alan Hawe without permission from his parents and brothers.

What about victim protection or justice?!
These people also benefitted financially from the murders, they've been awfully quiet. Seems the mental psychosis excuse provides great cover for AH. Funny how methodical, organised, well thought out and no pun intended executed his actions were. Weapons at the ready. Couch rearranged weeks ahead of schedule, final holiday completed, last visit to granny where he appeared perfectly normal, letters written, note to not come in on the door all completed by someone who suddenly snapped? It's an insult to the mentally ill.

political analyst · 26-02-2019 2:14am

MintyMagnum wrote: »

What about victim protection or justice?!
These people also benefitted financially from the murders, they've been awfully quiet. Seems the mental psychosis excuse provides great cover for AH. Funny how methodical, organised, well thought out and no pun intended executed his actions were. Weapons at the ready. Couch rearranged weeks ahead of schedule, final holiday completed, last visit to granny where he appeared perfectly normal, letters written, note to not come in on the door all completed by someone who suddenly snapped? It's an insult to the mentally ill.

They haven't committed a crime. They were unaware that he had murder in mind. What they do with the "benefit" is a matter of conscience for them. They're not Eamon Lillis, you know!

MintyMagnum · 26-02-2019 2:20am

political analyst wrote: »

They haven't committed a crime. They were unaware that he had murder in mind. What they do with the "benefit" is a matter of conscience for them. They're not Eamon Lillis, you know!

Well if his family are the reason that her family can't get answers I just don't know what to say.

Airyfairy12 · 26-02-2019 2:34am

I didnt see the show but read about it in the Irish times, it said that he'd watched porn in school and was getting counselling because he liked to watch porn, surely this cant be a genuine reason for murdering your whole family? - not that theres any good reason to do such a thing but as excuses go, that's fairly out there. Surely theres more shame associated with being a cold blooded murderer than watching a bit of porn? I get it was inappropriate to say the least, watching porn in school, but theres no logic to this at all. Was it illegal porn? Its just so messed up, that poor family and those poor kids falling victim to a psychopath who they trusted. Its scary to think how psychopaths like him can come across so normal, he was described as a pillar of the community if I remember correctly. Its f'ed up beyond belief.

wingsof daun · 26-02-2019 2:47am

I didn't see these unfortunate women, so, I don't want to be called the devils advocate nor do I want to be insensitive to the family. I think the guy could have reformed himself if he had got the right help from the right sources. Have any of you had a serious porn (or other) addiction? Do you know the damaging effects of porn addiction? I think it is overlooked as a problem in the modern world. It is a "trap" that is not difficult to fall into, and many begin viewing this "scourge" at a very young age. I say scourge because I think this country is far too oblivious to the danger of porn addiction.

Sam Quentin · 26-02-2019 2:53am

Where do fook does anyone find time to fulfill a porn addiction nowadays.. they must be lazy bástards, doing nothing round the house... Reminds me of fitness freaks,the ones that are always at the gym or out cycling..you know the type!? :-))

shenanagans · 26-02-2019 2:54am

To suggest he had depression is an insult to people who suffer with it. He was a crazy f**ker.

It was premeditated and thought out. He was ashamed and too weak to face the consequences of his actions. To selfish to kill himself, he had to kill his family. Didn't want them living without him.

His wife sounds like she was a smart decent lady who could no doubt have moved on and been happy without him.

All documents should be made available to his wife's next of kin. Give these people answers and let them gain the closure they need to let Clodagh and her sons RIP.

I feel sorry for this things family. His parents and siblings must have gone through hell. Her family are victims but his family are too.

Andrew00 · 26-02-2019 2:54am

“In a suicide note he spoke of his shame and that “it was easier for them to die than to have to live with the truth of what he was doing”

The “truth” that hasn’t come out yet is something far more serious than having a **** on school grounds.

As another poster said, he was in the presence of children all day, do you not see where this is pointing towards? Just a thought.

bigpink · 26-02-2019 3:18am

Was it child porn or was he caught with a kid?

wingsof daun · 26-02-2019 3:20am

We should not let our emotions control our thoughts on this terrible event. It should be blatantly obvious that mental illness was the complete driving force here. I highly doubt if it was a woman who done the same thing to her family there would be the same hatred directed towards her. In this twisted modern world, a woman would get more consolation and less hatred if it were her that resorted to murder of her family. It is so easy nowadays to target men, and in America it's a racial hatred of white men that seems to be all too common.

freshpopcorn · 26-02-2019 3:37am

Here is a transcript of tonight's Interview!

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/transcript-of-clodagh-hawe-family-interviews-1.3805969

It's also available on the RTE Player.

https://www.rte.ie/player/series/claire-byrne-live/SI0000000325?epguid=IH000367740

mazwell · 26-02-2019 3:40am

MintyMagnum wrote: »

I think Clodagh's mother / the boy's grandmother is right to ask WHAT it was that her daughter and her grandsons Died For. He said in his 5page letter that the truth was all going to come out. Those in the know are giving him exactly what HE wanted - protection from being shown up / exposed / embarrassed / found lacking somehow, shown to be less than the ideal he presented as.

He murdered his wife and three sons. He couldn't be any further from the ideal

BettePorter · 26-02-2019 3:46am

wingsof daun wrote: »

It is so easy nowadays to target men, and in America it's a racial hatred of white men that seems to be all too common.

Oh for goodness sake it doesn't matter if he's man woman or beast. He wiped out the 4 people he was meant to love most in the must brutal And vicious way . And he didn't just flip one evening watching the telly. He timed it to save himself from exposure. Mental illness my eye. You insult people with genuine mental illness with your assertions.

Dontfadeaway · 26-02-2019 3:46am

No matter what he did at school, I don't know how he could've went through with what he did. I haven't read much about it until now and reading his oldest son most likely seen what he did to his brother and put up a fight is really sad.

freshpopcorn · 26-02-2019 4:02am

I posted a transcript and a link to tonight's interview a few posts back.
In the interview Clodaghs mother said she became aware that Alan was watching pornography earlier in the year and he was now seeing a councillor to deal with this and school issues
She said since his death she became aware he was wearing Clodaghs underwear and she said that Clodagh in her wildest dreams would have thought of that.
Her sister also spoke about him insisting on going shopping for her Brides maids dress for Clodaghs wedding.
They said he would never hit the kids but you could feel his presence from five feet away and the boys listened to him and obeyed him.
They also spoke about the boys like Lego and baking.
The mother also spoke about the evening before and how everything felt normal and that morning.
They haven't had contact with the school since and don't know what happened there.
They don't accept that he was depressed. He was seeing a doctor for years and she didn't pick up in it.
They are looking for answers and changes.
That's just a few points.

La.de.da · 26-02-2019 4:11am

Any confidentiality re records that c*nt had should be fully wavered to give Clodaghs family access to all documents.

The description of what happened was absolutely shocking, unimaginable. They deserve answers.

tabby aspreme · 26-02-2019 4:51am

In April 2016, new Garda Vetting legislation was put in place regarding established teachers, making it compulsory for all teachers to be Vetted by December 2017, before that established teachers did not need Vetting, only new entrants to teaching. There were also changes made to the Vetting procedure, where "Soft Information" could be used to deny Vetting, as in not a criminal conviction, where Gardai had concerns the somebody could harm a child due to there activities/ interests etc.
If some of his colleagues had concerns about his behavior, such as masturbation in school, they would have been obliged to disclose those concerns to the relevant authorities, which in turn could deny him Vetting, which would have meant him losing his job.

Claire Byrne show. Her name was Clodagh

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