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Better Call Saul ***Spoilers***

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Comments

  • #1352
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,822 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The drawn out scenes usually don't bother me because there is something being told but Mike staking out Mr. Salamanca was 5 minutes longer than it needed to be.


  • #1353
    johnpatrick81
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,752 ✭✭✭johnpatrick81


    I doubt the whole "staking" over the 2 episodes amounted to even 3 minutes in total.


  • #1354
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Unearthly wrote: »
    You have never in your life thought a season of TV was poor or an episode was filler? :confused:

    Why would you bother watching a season of "poor" TV?


  • #1355
    Custardpi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,807 ✭✭✭Custardpi


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    Why would you bother watching a season of "poor" TV?

    I'd imagine it's common enough for some people, particularly if the first few episodes of a series have been good but then the quality deteriorates (at least according to the subjective opinion of an individual viewer). It's kind of a sunk cost fallacy - I've spent 5 hours of my life watching this already so I might as well stick with it & find out what happens at the end.


  • #1356
    dr.kenneth noisewater
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,842 ✭✭✭dr.kenneth noisewater


    Custardpi wrote: »
    I'd imagine it's common enough for some people, particularly if the first few episodes of a series have been good but then the quality deteriorates (at least according to the subjective opinion of an individual viewer). It's kind of a sunk cost fallacy - I've spent 5 hours of my life watching this already so I might as well stick with it & find out what happens at the end.

    Lost :rolleyes:


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  • #1357
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,164 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    Why would you bother watching a season of "poor" TV?

    No idea why you are asking a question that has an obvious answer but here it goes.

    Maybe they enjoyed previous seasons? Maybe they think it will get better? There are plenty of examples of shows that had a poor season and recovered.

    At the end of the day people will say if they liked/disliked an episode or season and that's the reason for discussion forums.


  • #1358
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,386 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    el diablo wrote: »
    If I thought a show was that bad I'd probably stop watching. Life's too short.
    +1. Especially as its on TV, its not like they have bought a boxset and feel they have to get value from it. Or paid into a cinema and not want to leave.

    If you paid for or made a meal and don't like it you might finish it so it does not go to waste, if you are at a buffet you do not continue eating something you find horrible, try something else!

    Some of the BB haters were hilarious, allegedly "sufferring" though 3-4 seasons of "complete and utter shite" before giving up. I don't think any posters here have said BCS is total crap though.
    dr.kenneth noisewater wrote: »
    Lost :rolleyes:
    Lost was a bit different since people wanted to find out what the whole thing was about.


  • #1359
    dr.kenneth noisewater
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,842 ✭✭✭dr.kenneth noisewater


    rubadub wrote: »
    Lost was a bit different since people wanted to find out what the whole thing was about.

    Heroes, even worse :o


  • #1360
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,822 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    Why would you bother watching a season of "poor" TV?

    Why are comic book films booming


  • #1361
    frozenfrozen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,677 ✭✭✭frozenfrozen


    I like every second of it na na na na na :D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D


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  • #1362
    StupidLikeAFox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,826 ✭✭✭StupidLikeAFox


    Cantstandsya wrote: »
    I enjoyed this episode. It was interesting to see Chuck motivate himself to get into HHM. I'm not sure if he did it just to get at Jimmy/Kim or if he was simply doing it to save a huge contract for HHM. We do know that he's dedicated to his work and to HHM so, while I accept it looks bad, I wouldn't automatically jump to the conclusion that his motivation was purely malicious.

    I think the ongoing battle in Chucks mind is that Jimmy is a shyster, a pretender, a hustler whereas he feels himself as a noble man of the law. Yet Jimmy has become a lawyer and this disgusts Chuck. So Chuck deciding to go in and reclaim the MV deal explains the lengths he will go to put Jimmy in his place and show him who is boss.

    Also, I think "Saul" is definitely coming out more and more. Kim asked him to stop the nonsense and the gimmicks directly when they were eating the pie (and he made the drug dealer guy make the video), he still resorted to gimmicks for the nursing home advert, and he is back doing it again now by altering the MV files. What I like about it is that his heart is in the right place. For instance, he didnt take the bribe from the Kettlemans in season one, he put it down to expenses. Obviously he is sailing close to the wind by altering these files, but his heart is in the right place, he is only doing it because he is desperate for Kim to succeed (even though she would prob be disgusted by these actions if/when she finds out)


  • #1363
    pickarooney
    Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 36,198 Mod ✭✭✭✭pickarooney


    And the test is once again to see how long the viewer will make excuses for his bending the rules.


  • #1364
    serfboard
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,708 ✭✭✭serfboard


    StupidLikeAFox wrote: »
    I think the ongoing battle in Chucks mind is that Jimmy is a shyster, a pretender, a hustler whereas he feels himself as a noble man of the law. Yet Jimmy has become a lawyer and this disgusts Chuck.
    velo.2010 wrote: »
    Just watched it now. Was that a look of regret from Jimmy - after Chuck said he would take care of him too if the roles were reversed - almost as if he wanted to undo the changes he made to the Mesa Verde files?
    Thought that look of regret thing was fantastic - he knows that Chuck could be a good person and would indeed probably do the right thing and look after Jimmy if needed. Chuck however cannot get over his "the law is scared" thing and is determined to stop Jimmy (and what he presumes is a partnership practice with Kim) - Jimmy knows this and so his look is slightly regretful, but not enough to change the files back again as he knows that Chuck's actions are sabotaging Kim.

    Have to say I think Michael McKean is absolutely excellent in this - hard to believe this is David St. Hubbins!

    The other thing with Mike - I'm wondering if he becomes responsible for Hector ending up in a wheelchair?


  • #1365
    gormdubhgorm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,504 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    serfboard wrote: »

    The other thing with Mike - I'm wondering if he becomes responsible for Hector ending up in a wheelchair?

    I thought this myself. Because his health is going to deteriorate very quickly. Plus it looks like that Mike's stinger will cause some damage.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • #1366
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    Unearthly wrote: »
    No idea why you are asking a question that has an obvious answer but here it goes.

    Maybe they enjoyed previous seasons? Maybe they think it will get better? There are plenty of examples of shows that had a poor season and recovered.

    At the end of the day people will say if they liked/disliked an episode or season and that's the reason for discussion forums.

    Nope, don't get it.
    if you're sitting there not enjoying something, watch/do something else.
    why sit there fuming? is it optimism? because you've invested so much?

    was watching a t.v series*, and had an epiphany that it was complete shyte.
    deleted all the episodes saved. but I didnt continue to watch it and complain it wasn't rubbish.


    *Arrow. I know...


  • #1367
    gormdubhgorm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,504 ✭✭✭✭gormdubhgorm


    Custardpi wrote: »
    I'd imagine it's common enough for some people, particularly if the first few episodes of a series have been good but then the quality deteriorates (at least according to the subjective opinion of an individual viewer). It's kind of a sunk cost fallacy - I've spent 5 hours of my life watching this already so I might as well stick with it & find out what happens at the end.

    I agree I watched "Dexter" first couple of seasons were great then it just went silly. But I stayed watching it.
    I saw a a few episodes of "Sons of Anarchy". It was OK until they started getting American actors in doing the funniest/worst versions of Irish accents that you ever heard. They were supposed to be IRA men! Then all the silly posturing and going around in biker costumes started to annoy me too. I could not take it seriously at all and stopped watching it. It turned into an unintentional comedy with bad acting.

    I can understand why people could be getting bored of "Better Call Saul". It's pacing in very slow. Added to the fact that we already know how a lot of the main characters turn out in "Breaking Bad".

    But for me I enjoy the pacing of BCS. It has a real life kind of pacing to it. It is not like a soap opera where the people are the unluckiest in the world and the worst things imaginable happen them in succession. Also unlike in soap opera's BCS keeps you guessing is this the moment he breaks bad? For want of a better phrase!
    The characters are fairly nuanced and subtle in Better Call Saul. Where it can be argued there are two sides to the argument of the person's action's.
    Even Mike's daughter in law Stacey? Why did she say the house was unsafe and there were gun shots. When Mike knew there was not?

    There is no completely good or evil characters in Better Call Saul. Well arguably maybe Tuco. But even he showed a real caring side for his grandmother in season 1 of BCS. It was shown how he cared for his uncle Hector "Tio", in Breaking Bad.

    Guff about stuff, and stuff about guff.



  • #1368
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,164 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    Roger Hassenforder wrote: »
    Nope, don't get it.
    if you're sitting there not enjoying something, watch/do something else.
    why sit there fuming? is it optimism? because you've invested so much?

    was watching a t.v series*, and had an epiphany that it was complete shyte.
    deleted all the episodes saved. but I didnt continue to watch it and complain it wasn't rubbish.


    *Arrow. I know...

    Well we are agreed about Arrow. I gave up near the end of season 2.

    Saul has something Arrow doesn't, it's a spin-off from one of the greatest shows of all time. People won't give up that easily on Saul cause they know what the creater is capable of.

    And I doubt people are fuming, just don't find it the greatest show ever as some do, and they are entitled to say so.


  • #1369
    Roger Hassenforder
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,555 ✭✭✭Roger Hassenforder


    its not i wont brook criticism of it, everyone is entitled to their opinion.
    just cant understand why someone will continue to watch something they're not enjoying!


  • #1370
    _Kaiser_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 29,471 ✭✭✭✭_Kaiser_


    I don't get this criticism about the show being so slow.. it's not Breaking Bad, and the whole premise is how Jimmy McGill becomes Saul Goodman - not "the zany adventures of Saul". Maybe it's the "I want everything NOW" phenomenon that's pretty much everywhere these days?

    With the exception of Kim, I like pretty much everything about this show, especially Mike and Jimmy himself. As for the "nothing happens" argument, there's a massive amount of backstory and character development along with some great humor. If you want a "pretty much nothing happens" show I'd suggest The West Wing... that one I gave 3 seasons but besides people-talk-really-fast-during-the-crisis-of-the-week, there was very little else to recommend it** (with the exception of Martin Sheen himself of course!)

    ** Just my opinion mind :)


  • #1371
    ixoy
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 18,052 Mod ✭✭✭✭ixoy


    To those who find it too slow: Did you find season one too slow? Or is it that you expected pacing to pick up and this season is as equally slow?
    'Rectify' is very much a slower show - they literally had people watching paint dry in one episode...And yet it's still great TV.

    I think the pace of BCS doesn't matter when you've got such great characters and humour. Definitely think that when he becomes Saul it will be the show's end - it's all about the journey, not the destination.


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  • #1372
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,164 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    ixoy wrote: »
    To those who find it too slow: Did you find season one too slow? Or is it that you expected pacing to pick up and this season is as equally slow?
    'Rectify' is very much a slower show - they literally had people watching paint dry in one episode...And yet it's still great TV.

    I think the pace of BCS doesn't matter when you've got such great characters and humour. Definitely think that when he becomes Saul it will be the show's end - it's all about the journey, not the destination.

    Well for me slow is not a problem but you need to like the characters. I could name about 8 characters in Rectify who I like.

    But when it's slow, and a character you have no interest in such as Kim it can drag. There was a scene a few episodes ago where it showed her on the phone ringing people. Groan

    I could watch Mike all day though


  • #1373
    HamsterFace
    Closed Accounts Posts: 832 ✭✭✭HamsterFace


    pickarooney wrote: »
    And the test is once again to see how long the viewer will make excuses for his bending the rules.

    What are you referring to?


  • #1374
    ThisRegard
    Closed Accounts Posts: 27,833 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    Unearthly wrote: »
    . There was a scene a few episodes ago where it showed her on the phone ringing people. Groan

    And you actually think there was no point to those scenes?


  • #1375
    -=al=-
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,306 ✭✭✭-=al=-


    I'm sure the colour of the post-it notes she was using even meant something! After how intricate BB was, I'm pretty sure almost everything is there for a reason.

    The ice-creams from the driver in the last episode springs to mind, or even the spider crawling out from the tie in the intro at the start of the episode.

    Edit: Actually, after posting this I had a quick look back at the intro and there is something written on the stick from the ice-cream...

    KhBh6E0.png
    Awesome Microsoft paint skillz*

    Which means "From our family to yours"

    Which is the slogan we hear in the Pollos Hermanos ads!


  • #1376
    Patty O Furniture
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,133 ✭✭✭Patty O Furniture


    rubadub wrote: »

    Lost was a bit different since people wanted to find out what the whole thing was about.

    Oh god, i gave that up after S01 & like a good book, i looked at the end/finale to see if there was a happy ending :p
    dr.kenneth noisewater wrote: »
    Heroes, even worse :o

    Sadly i watched all of that, as it had great actors, but less interesting characters & less can be said about the new show :(

    Anyway as someone said, "It's more about the Journey, not the Destination"


  • #1377
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,164 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    And you actually think there was no point to those scenes?

    No

    I don't like Kim, and have no interest in her scenes.


  • #1378
    Bounty Hunter
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 23,135 Mod ✭✭✭✭Bounty Hunter


    Unearthly wrote: »
    No

    I don't like Kim, and have no interest in her scenes.

    not liking doesn't exactly equal no point though, for example those scenes show how she is a contrast to Jimmy and how she will do the long and non glamorous work even if she doesn't know if it'll pay off something Jimmy wouldn't do as he is the cut corners type. It's all character development but who knows there may have been a small detail in a scene like those that although not important now will suddenly become important later.

    ---

    I think 2 things are happening here with the idea of BCS being slow too

    1) Breaking Bad was slow paced so to expect BCS to be anything but that is silly

    more importantly imo 2) BB despite being similarily paced was always going to have more action as it is about a chemistry teachers decent into a meth dealing criminal and what lenghts he will go to earn sh!t tonnes of money and keep it not about a Lawyer's decent into being a dodgy criminal lawyer.

    The Meth Dealing criminal kingpin is always going to have more action packed scenes in his life than the lawyer.


  • #1379
    squonk
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,300 Mod ✭✭✭✭squonk


    All this talk about 'if you don't enjoy a show, stop watching' is niggling me. A show can have a bad season. SoA was mentioned here before and, boy, was Season 3 bad but I stuck with it even though I had no particular interest in what was going on. The point being that I knew there was still potential there and if they reharnessed that potential, the show could get back on track. That happened subsequently but the show was damaged after that dodgy season I'll readilly admit. You can't just drop a show just because a particular season isn't going the way you like.

    Rectify is up there as one of the greatest shows ever IMHO so I do love slow paced shows however I'm starting to wonder about BCS myself. My main problem is that one of the lynchpins of the show is pushing 70 so they realy can't drag the show out forever. Looking at things as they stand, there can't be 12 or 18 months elapsed since the series started. If they drag things out to the beginning of BB then you could be looking at 10-12 seasons and, while I don't see that as being realistic, it has to be a concern for Jonathan Banks availability. I wish the man long life but working on any show is a touch job and doing it in your 70s can't be especially easy. There may come a time soon when he just can't keep doing it.

    At this point I accepted that Season 1 would be slow. BB Season 1 was slow but it moved a bit quicker after that. Now, nearing the end of Season 2 of BCS, I'm looking back wondering how all that time was spent on so little actually happening. That's not a problem per se but the Banks factor is for me a worrying factor. Rectify has a cast who are far younger and I'm happy to exist in that world because I know it can continue. Right now there's no indication of how many seasons are planned for BCS. It's like being on a journey not knowing when you'll arrive or where you are in terms of the length.


  • #1380
    Unearthly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 8,164 ✭✭✭Unearthly


    Lads to clarify for third and final time

    I'm not saying there was no point to them, I just didn't like the scenes cause I'm not invested in her character as say Mike and Saul (although he is getting dragged down by Kim and Chuck)


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  • #1381
    FreudianSlippers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,396 ✭✭✭✭FreudianSlippers


    Unearthly wrote: »
    Lads to clarify for third and final time

    I'm not saying there was no point to them, I just didn't like the scenes cause I'm not invested in her character as say Mike and Saul (although he is getting dragged down by Kim and Chuck)
    That's how stories work... usually there are external forces which result in the end status quo. It can't be just all Mike and Saul running around as they are in BB. This is showing how they become those characters. We are about to see what happens to Kim/Chuck that eventually turns Jimmy into Saul.


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