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Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread VII: The Fan-base Awakens

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Comments

  • #602
    sydthebeat
    Subscribers Posts: 42,869 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    maybe we should just ban adjectives here..

    such that making a statement that hes 'a starter for ireland at 12' is an nonequivocal fact...
    but making a statement that hes 'a nailed on starter for ireland at 12' is completely arguable ??


  • #603
    sfbdqc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 323 ✭✭sfbdqc


    Leinster XVnext season?

    1. Jack McGrath
    2. Richardt Strauss
    3. Tadhg Furlong
    4. Ross Molony
    5. Devin Toner
    6. Rhys Ruddock
    7. Sean O'Brien
    8. Jamie Heaslip
    9. Luke McGrath
    10. Jonathan Sexton
    11. Luke Fitzgerald
    12. Robbie Henshaw
    13. Garry Ringrose
    14. Isa Nacewa
    15. Rob Kearney


  • #604
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,019 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    former total wrote: »
    Well, see this is the problem underpinning the whole discussion.

    People are comparing McCloskey's performances in the Pro12 with Henshaw's performances at international level, and coming to the conclusion that McCloskey is the better 12. That's bananas.

    Likewise, you can't say that because Henshaw is much better at 13 on the basis of his showings there with Connacht, because it's a quantum leap downwards in quality and intensity compared to international level.

    This sort of rubbish actually wrecks my head.

    1. People are saying the Henshaw Payne partnership is insipid. Forget about McCloskey, mentioning his name just gives people a convenient wall to hide behind when it comes to this discussion.

    People are saying that this partnership offers nothing in attack. In every single game they have played this has proven to be the case, yet people still deny it.

    2. You can't say Henshaw is better at 13/15 becaues he has spent his entire career in these positions? Pull the other one former total. This idea that how a player players in Europe or the pro12 doesn't matter is actually nonsense. This one is well on the way to becoming the next "because systems".


  • #605
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    awec wrote: »
    I've missed all those games where Henshaw and Payne have been tearing it up.

    Just because he has played there to date is no indication that this is where his future is. The centre options at Ireland are growing on a yearly basis, the odds of Henshaw shifting out one position must be very decent.

    We're all very aware of your disdain for Jared Payne but the simple truth is that Robbie Henshaw is certainly going to be playing for Ireland at 12 against England and it seems quite likely that he will sign for Leinster to play 12 long-term inside Ringrose. There's no evidence that Henshaw is being looked at elsewhere for Ireland. Ireland's problems in attack aren't the fault of our midfield either, if it's even relevant to this topic.

    He'll be wasting nothing at 12 so long as his 10 and his coaches utilise him correctly and put him into space. In fact Henshaw inside Ringrose could be the best center partnership at club level rugby so long as Ringrose develops as expected.

    Is it possible he might play another position? Sure. Is it likely? Not at Leinster. I'd actually think it's more likely he'd move to 15 for us.


  • #606
    Buer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Sure by that reasoning Jamie Roberts and Fofanna are also wasted?

    Roberts is a good example.

    He started out life as a winger and sometimes full back and he was pretty bloody good. Gatland tried him at 12 in a summer test away to the Boks despite him never having played there for Cardiff and that was it. He was an inside centre henceforth. When he went back to the Blues, he slotted into the 12 slot and went on to become one of the best inside centres around.


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  • #607
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    awec wrote: »
    This sort of rubbish actually wrecks my head.

    Its a valid opinion and it's a discussion forum.


  • #608
    awec
    Administrators Posts: 55,019 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Its a valid opinion and it's a discussion forum.

    You are correct, that was harsh on my part. Sorry total former! :)


  • #609
    former total
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,536 ✭✭✭former total


    awec wrote: »
    This sort of rubbish actually wrecks my head.

    1. People are saying the Henshaw Payne partnership is insipid. Forget about McCloskey, mentioning his name iust gives people a convenient wall to hide behind when it comes to this discussion.

    People are saying that this partnership offers nothing in attack. In every single game they have played this has proven to be the case, yet people still deny it.

    2. You can't say Henshaw is better at 13/15 becaues he has spent his entire career in these positions? Pull the other one former total. This idea that how a player players in Europe or the pro12 doesn't matter is actually nonsense. This one is well on the way to becoming the next "because systems".


    The post I was responding to explicitly said that McCloskey is an excellent 12, Henshaw a good one. And yet in my response I should somehow forget about McCloskey? I see.


  • #610
    BoardsMember
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,609 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    former total wrote: »
    Well, see this is the problem underpinning the whole discussion.

    People are comparing McCloskey's performances in the Pro12 with Henshaw's performances at international level, and coming to the conclusion that McCloskey is the better 12. That's bananas.

    Likewise, you can't say that because Henshaw is much better at 13 on the basis of his showings there with Connacht, because it's a quantum leap downwards in quality and intensity compared to international level.

    I think that's a bit disingenuous.

    The impression I get is that regarding McCloskey, some would like to see him at 12 for Ireland based on his Pro12 performances.

    They'd like to see more attacking from AN Irish centre partnership and perhaps see Henshaw with Ireland in a position which give him more space and more opportunity to mirror the attacking form he displays at club level. Again, that is not comparing the standard of Pro12 and International.

    Whether the Ireland system, or international rugby would actually result in Henshaw having more space or more impact on the game in a wider channel is debatable. But its fair to say McCloskey is playing well and could possibly do the job that Henshaw does at 12 for Ireland, and that Henshaw might be better utilised in a position that gives him more space.


  • #611
    Clegg
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,600 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    What's stopping Henshaw from becoming a top class 12? He'll need to become more than just a bosher, but I'm confident that Leinster would do all they can to encourage his passing game. I very much doubt he'll be a Kevin Maggs 2.0


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  • #612
    Zzippy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,166 ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    sydthebeat wrote: »
    maybe we should just ban adjectives here..

    such that making a statement that hes 'a starter for ireland at 12' is an nonequivocal fact...
    but making a statement that hes 'a nailed on starter for ireland at 12' is completely arguable ??

    Indeed. And I should have replaced the word "wasted" with "incompletely utilised"... :o


  • #613
    former total
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,536 ✭✭✭former total


    Pat Lam claims he doesn't know where Henshaw is going:
    http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2016/0216/768436-connacht-in-dark-over-henshaws-next-club/


  • #614
    Zzippy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,166 ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    former total wrote: »
    Pat Lam claims he doesn't know where Henshaw is going:
    http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2016/0216/768436-connacht-in-dark-over-henshaws-next-club/

    Whether a contract has been agreed yet or not, the protocol is always to plead ignorance until the IRFU/province issues the press release confirming it. I wouldn't read anything into it.


  • #615
    stephen_n
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,920 ✭✭✭✭stephen_n


    former total wrote: »
    Pat Lam claims he doesn't know where Henshaw is going:
    http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2016/0216/768436-connacht-in-dark-over-henshaws-next-club/

    Maybe he should ask some of his squad members, they do.


  • #616
    Sanjuro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,241 ✭✭✭Sanjuro


    Well, it's official. Henshaw to Leinster!

    https://twitter.com/IrishRugby/status/699608525379649537


  • #617
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,633 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Three year deal, delighted.


  • #618
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,633 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Another international who will only play 10 games per season on the books :)


  • #619
    thomond2006
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Leinster Rugby and @IrishRugby are happy to announce that @henshawrob will join the province from 2016/17.

    Leinster Rugby's tweet. Love it. :pac:


  • #620
    Zzippy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,166 ✭✭✭✭Zzippy


    thomond2006 wrote: »
    Leinster Rugby's tweet. Love it. :pac:

    Does that suggest it's not a central contract?


  • #621
    Clegg
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,600 ✭✭✭✭Clegg


    Can't say I'm not over the moon with this signing.

    I hope he's used in a similar way to Te'o at 12. Yes he boshes it up on occasion, but he gets plenty of scope to look for gaps. Maybe we can try to develop a greater passing threat in the centres as that isn't something Te'o brings.

    Henshaw/Ringrose next season boys.


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  • #622
    jm08
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,301 ✭✭✭✭jm08


    Zzippy wrote: »
    Does that suggest it's not a central contract?

    From the statement it seems to be a central contract as Nucifora is quoted as well as Leo.

    very disappointing for Connacht.


  • #623
    Mahatma Geansai
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,668 ✭✭✭Mahatma Geansai


    Sad moment for Irish rugby, but a fantastic bit of business by Leinster. That must be one of the only poaches of a front line internationals by any of the provinces ever.


  • #624
    Buer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,258 ✭✭✭✭Buer


    Zzippy wrote: »
    Does that suggest it's not a central contract?

    Wouldn't think so. Announcement was made on IRFU site with Nucifora's comments and Henshaw thanking the IRFU.

    The slant is very much that this was Henshaw's move though and the IRFU wanted him to stay where he is.


  • #625
    sfbdqc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 323 ✭✭sfbdqc


    Henshaw wanted to leave. Hardly a poach.


  • #626
    LostArt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,848 ✭✭✭LostArt


    Delighted with that signing. Finally some adequate cover for Ringrose.


  • #627
    DGRulz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭DGRulz


    Possibly our best signing of the last few years?


  • #628
    sfbdqc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 323 ✭✭sfbdqc


    DGRulz wrote: »
    Possibly our best signing of the last few years?

    wouldn't be hard


  • #629
    aimee1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,290 ✭✭✭aimee1


    sfbdqc wrote: »
    Leinster XVnext season?

    1. Jack McGrath
    2. Richardt Strauss
    3. Tadhg Furlong
    4. Ross Molony
    5. Devin Toner
    6. Rhys Ruddock
    7. Sean O'Brien
    8. Jamie Heaslip
    9. Luke McGrath
    10. Jonathan Sexton
    11. Luke Fitzgerald
    12. Robbie Henshaw
    13. Garry Ringrose
    14. Isa Nacewa
    15. Rob Kearney

    Some decent guys behind that XV too. Big areas lacking are 2nd row (especially if triggs goes) and half back.

    I wonder is Kirchner around next season.


  • #630
    errlloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,633 ✭✭✭✭errlloyd


    Btw also announced some 17 contract renewals, included are

    SOB,
    Nacewa
    Ross
    McGrath
    Ruddock

    And a whole loads more, but those two are the most interesting to me.


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  • #631
    S12b
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,166 ✭✭✭S12b


    Mahatma Geansai wrote: »
    Sad moment for Irish rugby, but a fantastic bit of business by Leinster. That must be one of the only poaches of a front line internationals by any of the provinces ever.

    All this talk is miles off. He hasn't been poached by Leinster. He hasn't been forced to leave by the IRFU. He has chosen to move to Leinster for his own personal reasons.

    He has a long term girlfriend who he has seen once a week for the last 3 years, if he remained with Connacht it would be another 3 years. Majority of his family and friends are based in Dublin too. I believe Dublin is simply where he wants to live his life. Add in the fact that he gets on well with a lot of the Leinster lads.

    I certainly don't begrudge him the move.


This discussion has been closed.
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