Cork woman severely injured after attack by Pitbull Mastiff

oppenheimer1 · 27-01-2016 02:30AM #1

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/pitbull-mastiff-put-down-after-attacking-woman-in-cork-1.2511010

Just after reading this story of an horrific attack by a pitbull mastiff on a young woman on Cork. Stories like this would make me think that the restricted breeds list ought to become a banned list.

At the very minimum keepers of these breeds should have to justify the need for them to keep them to the authorities.

Thoughts?

the_syco · 27-01-2016 02:44AM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

Thoughts?

We'll never know what the woman did.

jacknife · 27-01-2016 02:48AM

oppenheimer1 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/pitbull-mastiff-put-down-after-attacking-woman-in-cork-1.2511010

Just after reading this story of an horrific attack by a pitbull mastiff on a young woman on Cork. Stories like this would make me think that the restricted breeds list ought to become a banned list.

At the very minimum keepers of these breeds should have to justify the need for them to keep them to the authorities.

Thoughts?

What is a pitbull mastiff

oppenheimer1 · 27-01-2016 02:50AM

the_syco wrote: »

We'll never know what the woman did.

Other sources have said she was restraining him from chasing a cat.
http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/dog-viciously-mauled-young-woman-7252491

kupus · 27-01-2016 03:09AM

looks like The boyfriend brought it from outside the country. poor girl i hope she keeps her hand, she has only been living in ireland for a few months

Pitbull Mastiffs are a crossbreed between pitbulls and mastiff and can vary in size depending on the type of pitbulls and mastiff which are bred. They are usually used a guard dogs.
Popular with the drug dealer type on the continent.

Flippyfloppy · 27-01-2016 03:15AM

Do journalists not have to have a basic level of grammar?? That Irish times article is dire!

Nelson Muntz · 27-01-2016 03:17AM

kupus wrote: »

Pitbull Mastiffs are a crossbreed between pitbulls and mastiff and can vary in size depending on the type of pitbulls and mastiff which are bred. They are usually used a guard dogs.
Popular with the drug dealer type on the continent.

What type of Mastiff are they supposed to be bred with? I've never heard of a pitbull mastiff, only a bullmastiff which is a proper breed.

Axwell · 27-01-2016 03:22AM

kupus wrote: »

looks like The boyfriend brought it from outside the country. poor girl i hope she keeps her hand, she has only been living in ireland for a few months

The dog belonged to her and her boyfriend when they lived in Croatia previous to this, it arrived in Ireland last Friday. She is here since Christmas and the boyfriend arrived last summer.

PucaMama · 27-01-2016 03:38AM

Nelson Muntz wrote: »

What type of Mastiff are they supposed to be bred with? I've never heard of a pitbull mastiff, only a bullmastiff which is a proper breed.

It's likely they have no idea what type of dog it was and went with what some local guard said it was. What pitbull/mastiff mix is used as a guard dog??? Could they be talking about the bully kutta.

kupus · 27-01-2016 03:40AM

Nelson Muntz wrote: »

What type of Mastiff are they supposed to be bred with? I've never heard of a pitbull mastiff, only a bullmastiff which is a proper breed.

My neighbors brother has one, he not a drug dealer:pac: and i remember him saying that it was a pitbull mastif mix. Hes not allowed bring it round so i only ever saw photos of his one. But Ive seen others on travels around. they are more squatter and broader than this guy....

its a doga and is also popular in balkan region

Nelson Muntz · 27-01-2016 03:44AM

PucaMama wrote: »

It's likely they have no idea what type of dog it was and went with what some local guard said it was. What pitbull/mastiff mix is used as a guard dog??? Could they be talking about the bully kutta.

I'd say you're right. The Fila Brasileiro can be owned by scumbags at times but unlikely.

More likely it was the usual - looked a bit like a staffy but bigger so must be pitbull mastiff

NIMAN · 27-01-2016 04:04AM

I think its time for authorities to begin planning for the eradication of certain dangerous dogs. There has been too many stories like this.

Not putting them down immediately, but stop all breeding and letting nature phase them out.

NIMAN · 27-01-2016 04:04AM

I think its time for authorities to begin planning for the eradication of certain dangerous dogs. There has been too many stories like this.

Not putting them down immediately, but stop all breeding and letting nature phase them out.

topmanamillion · 27-01-2016 04:40AM

kupus wrote: »

Pitbull Mastiffs are a crossbreed between pitbulls and mastiff and can vary in size depending on the type of pitbulls and mastiff which are bred. They are usually used a guard dogs.
Popular with the drug dealer type on the continent.

Sounds a bit like breeding Petrol with Fire and being surprised when your house burns down.

27-01-2016 04:57AM

I used to be afraid of pits, my post history will even show that, but then I got to know Buju, a Pitbull with a Pitbull temperament. The only thing that kept Buju sweet and nice was his owner's very good control over the dog. I will always say that a Pitbull is a lovely dog in the right hands.

Unfortunately we all know, without stereotyping, that most of this bull terrier types, are in the wrong hands.

27-01-2016 04:58AM

I used to be afraid of pits, my post history will even show that, but then I got to know Buju, a Pitbull with a Pitbull temperament. The only thing that kept Buju sweet and nice was his owner's very good control over the dog. I will always say that a Pitbull is a lovely dog in the right hands.

Unfortunately we all know, without stereotyping, that most of this bull terrier types, are in the wrong hands.

Nody · 27-01-2016 10:20AM

NIMAN wrote: »

I think its time for authorities to begin planning for the eradication of certain dangerous dogs. There has been too many stories like this.

Not putting them down immediately, but stop all breeding and letting nature phase them out.

There are no dangerous dogs breed as much as there are incompetent and ignorant owners who does not socialize or train their dogs (and it does not matter if that's a Mastiff or a cute "toy" breed...). Fix the owners and you fix the problem; remove certain breeds and all they move is to the next one down the list and the problem still persist. It's like suggesting we should ban BMWs from the road because they cause a lot of accidents with boy racers and think that's somehow would fix the problem of boy racers...

topmanamillion · 27-01-2016 10:24AM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I used to be afraid of pits, my post history will even show that, but then I got to know Buju, a Pitbull with a Pitbull temperament. The only thing that kept Buju sweet and nice was his owner's very good control over the dog. I will always say that a Pitbull is a lovely dog in the right hands.

Unfortunately we all know, without stereotyping, that most of this bull terrier types, are in the wrong hands.

The same can be said about guns but the big difference between a gun and a dog is a dog is mobile and relies on instinct to function. The breeding history of dogs on the restricted list is they have been bred for centuries as attack/fighting/guard dogs. While all dogs have the propensity to attack these classes of dogs have an extra insentive to do so.
The problem with "the right hands" is its rarely them who are attacked as its usually some innocent bystander or relative that happpened to be on the wrong side of the dogs nature as happened in this case. Even "the right hands" are liable to lapses in judgememt and with these particular dogs any lapse in judgement can have catastrophic consequences,

Nody · 27-01-2016 10:32AM

topmanamillion wrote: »

The same can be said about guns but the big difference between a gun and a dog is a dog is mobile and relies on instinct to function. The breeding history of dogs on the restricted list is they have been bred for centuries as attack/fighting/guard dogs. While all dogs have the propensity to attack these classes of dogs have an extra insentive to do so.
The problem with "the right hands" is its rarely them who are attacked as its usually some innocent bystander or relative that happpened to be on the wrong side of the dogs nature as happened in this case. Even "the right hands" are liable to lapses in judgememt and with these particular dogs any lapse in judgement can have catastrophic consequences,

Do you know the most common breeds that cause bites in Ireland? Collies and terriers and neither is on the RB list; Papillons and Pekingese are also in the top 10 list of biters who are small cute dogs while the Staffordshire Bull Terrier is among the least likely to bite as per actual statistics; so how about we stick to the actual facts and the simple reality that the RB list is meaningless?

TG1 · 27-01-2016 10:33AM

Nody wrote: »

It's like suggesting we should ban BMWs from the road because they cause a lot of accidents with boy racers and think that's somehow would fix the problem of boy racers...

I love this analogy, it's spot on. The problem with the breeds on the rb list is that they are some of the more powerful breeds around. If you got between my border collie and a cat I wouldn't guarantee he wouldn't bite, and likewise if you got between my friends yorkies and a cat I wouldnt say you'd be safe, but collies and yorkies are not likely to do as much damage as something crossed with a mastiff.

Dogs are dogs, and have the potential do to damage, but so do cars. If you suggested stopping production on anything over a 1.2l engine to stop the potential for loss of life there would be uproar. And that's over a car not over a live animal.

These stories always make the news and then days later the story suddenly mentions an incidental moment where the owner put themselves in harm's way. It's sad but the reporting of these cases should concentrate on teaching people how to interact safely with their animals rather than stirring up emotions and causing the calls for banning breeds.

Nody · 27-01-2016 10:48AM

TG1 wrote: »

These stories always make the news and then days later the story suddenly mentions an incidental moment where the owner put themselves in harm's way. It's sad but the reporting of these cases should concentrate on teaching people how to interact safely with their animals rather than stirring up emotions and causing the calls for banning breeds.

The above is the truth and is once again backed up by actual studies:

Third, the study found a strong relationship between encroaching on a dog's territory and bite incidents. In nearly every case, the person bitten was doing something active, such as entering the dog's property, playing with the dog or trying to catch the dog. In only 2.2% of cases, the victim was not doing anything connected with the dog. This stresses the point that human actions are almost always significant in dog bite incidents: if humans can be taught to behave differently, many dog bites can be prevented.

Which once again goes back to my original point; the issue is not the breed but the owner...

jacknife · 27-01-2016 11:14AM

Today's irish independent said the dog was a Staffordshire Bull Terrier then it described it as a cross breed

It's badly researched articles like this that tarnish dogs with a bad reputation

borderlinemeath · 27-01-2016 11:24AM

I hate stereotyping, I really do.
But, a hell of a lot of eastern europeans are fond of using prong collars and choke chains rather than pain free options such as harnesses. I meet all sorts of people with their dogs, I've pleaded with an Eastern European on the local beach to stop hitting his dog with a chain lead because it wouldn't come back. I've had dogs arrive here with prong collars and choke chains that I've immediately told the owners I wouldn't use. They don't see anything wrong with using them and probably use them as an easy way out of lead training. I've never seen a prong collar for sale here, but they're probably ready available in Eastern Europe.

Even if this dog was treated like the family pet (which seems to be the case judging by the photos in the paper), if the owners used a painful method of restraint, it is fairly conceivable to imagine that the dog was possibly in pain or was at the end of their patience with getting pinched.

There's also so many different versions of the same story in the papers, yesterday the dog was a bullmastiff (he's clearly wasn't) and some papers are today saying it's a staffie. He's a guard dog in one paper, the next line says he's a family pet...Nobody will know exactly what happened, who knows whether the dog was in pain, whether he was unsettled in a new home, whether the woman did something to startle him. She may have done something completely unaware that triggered something with the dog.

seamus · 27-01-2016 11:24AM

jacknife wrote: »

Today's irish independent said the dog was a Staffordshire Bull Terrier then it described it as a cross breed

Right, so the times thinks it's a "pitbull mastiff" (whatever the fnck that is) and the Indo thinks it's a Staffie.

I would put good money on a bet that this is actually a labrador and between the Gardai and the journalists they're all just complete idiots.

Anyway, whatever kind of dog it's pretty clear that the owners are at fault. The dog has moved country in the last four days and likely spent a good 12-18 hours highly stressed while travelling, then got put somewhere completely unfamiliar except for the people it was with.

Lots of people make the mistake of forgetting to take account of a dog's emotional state. It was likely highly stressed and agitated after the move, but the owners were carrying on like it was business as usual. Any breed could act the same in the same circumstances.

muddypaws · 27-01-2016 11:52AM

NIMAN wrote: »

I think its time for authorities to begin planning for the eradication of certain dangerous dogs. There has been too many stories like this.

Not putting them down immediately, but stop all breeding and letting nature phase them out.

Thats what they have been doing with pit bulls in the UK for the last 10+ years. Hasn't worked at all, there are now probably more pits in the UK than there were before the legislation.

topmanamillion wrote: »

The same can be said about guns but the big difference between a gun and a dog is a dog is mobile and relies on instinct to function. The breeding history of dogs on the restricted list is they have been bred for centuries as attack/fighting/guard dogs. While all dogs have the propensity to attack these classes of dogs have an extra insentive to do so.
The problem with "the right hands" is its rarely them who are attacked as its usually some innocent bystander or relative that happpened to be on the wrong side of the dogs nature as happened in this case. Even "the right hands" are liable to lapses in judgememt and with these particular dogs any lapse in judgement can have catastrophic consequences,

Not quite true. German Shepherd Dogs - clue in the name. Rottweilers were originally drover dogs.

MayoAreMagic · 27-01-2016 11:56AM

Nody wrote: »

Do you know the most common breeds that cause bites in Ireland? Collies and terriers and neither is on the RB list; Papillons and Pekingese are also in the top 10 list of biters who are small cute dogs while the Staffordshire Bull Terrier is among the least likely to bite as per actual statistics; so how about we stick to the actual facts and the simple reality that the RB list is meaningless?

Ya but to be fair collies are by a long way, the most common breed, and terriers are very common also. Also, you need to take into account the kind of damage that can be done if a particular dog turns on someone. A terrier can be aggressive, but generally you might get a nip on the heel. What is a pitbull, or any mix thereof going to do? It is the same logic that allows people to buy an air-rifle but not a rocket launcher.

I appreciate that with the right owner, a dog will be ok, but then with the right owner, a rocket launcher would also, wouldn't it? The reality is you cant guarantee that, so it isn't a reasonable resolution.

DBB · 27-01-2016 12:00PM

muddypaws wrote: »

Thats what they have been doing with pit bulls in the UK for the last 10+ years. Hasn't worked at all, there are now probably more pits in the UK than there were before the legislation.

This is the crux of the problem... Banning breeds has not worked in any country where it has been introduced.
On the contrary, banning breeds makes them more desirable to scumbags, the kudos of having a "Trophy Dog" is a major motivator to owning one.
Banning breeds drives their production underground, thus further reducing any chance of socialisation or half-decent training that they might otherwise have got. Therefore, banned breeds become more dangerous.

If it's true that the owner was trying to restrain the dog from chasing a cat, then the bites she got weren't aimed at her, as such, rather they resulted from the frustration of not being able to follow through with the cat. They're called redirected bites. Unfortunately, despite these redirected bites not being anything personal, they do tend to be severe and damaging. I hope the lady makes a full recovery.

PucaMama · 27-01-2016 12:12PM

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Ya but to be fair collies are by a long way, the most common breed, and terriers are very common also. Also, you need to take into account the kind of damage that can be done if a particular dog turns on someone. A terrier can be aggressive, but generally you might get a nip on the heel. What is a pitbull, or any mix thereof going to do? It is the same logic that allows people to buy an air-rifle but not a rocket launcher.

I appreciate that with the right owner, a dog will be ok, but then with the right owner, a rocket launcher would also, wouldn't it? The reality is you cant guarantee that, so it isn't a reasonable resolution.

A nip on the heel? I still have a painful lump under a bite from a small terrier before Christmas. She didn't even mean to bite me I was seperating a fight.

MayoAreMagic · 27-01-2016 12:12PM

DBB wrote: »

If it's true that the owner was trying to restrain the dog from chasing a cat, then the bites she got weren't aimed at her, as such, rather they resulted from the frustration of not being able to follow through with the cat. They're called redirected bites. Unfortunately, despite these redirected bites not being anything personal, they do tend to be severe and damaging. I hope the lady makes a full recovery.

Fair enough.

Is that acceptable in society though? I would say it isn't. It is fanciful in the extreme to suggest that every person on the street will understand concepts like redirect bites when the times comes that they encounter them. To continue with the gun analogy, the above is basically like having a weapon that can potentially go off on it's own accord, and your reasoning is that the people around it simply need to understand that and be able to deal with it. Remove the emotion connected to dogs for a second and it begins to sound quite different.

MayoAreMagic · 27-01-2016 12:17PM

PucaMama wrote: »

A nip on the heel? I still have a painful lump under a bite from a small terrier before Christmas. She didn't even mean to bite me I was seperating a fight.

I am sure there are instances where a terrier has done more damage, that is why I said generally.

May I ask what kind of state do you think you would be in if it had been a bullmastiff?

PucaMama · 27-01-2016 12:21PM

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

I am sure there are instances where a terrier has done more damage, that is why I said generally.

May I ask what kind of state do you think you would be in if it had been a bullmastiff?

The kind of state I was seconds from when the dog that attacked my small terrier tried to get me by the face. It's what started the fight in the first place she was defending me. Don't assume I havnt been in the situation.

Cork woman severely injured after attack by Pitbull Mastiff

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