Don't know where else to post this

30-09-2015 10:54AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Reasonable cause is someone with a hoodie (not that they're illegal but it's a uniform for a certain type of person) is wandering around at 3am on a night where robberies had been reported.

Then the person refused to co operate.

And a person with a few drinks on them, although he says that he would have needed a lot more to get drunk.

Pat Mustard · 30-09-2015 10:56AM

Agent Smith wrote: »

Boom

Nope:

24.—(1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána finds any person committing an offence under a relevant provision...

One eyed Jack · 30-09-2015 10:59AM

Just what every person who wanted to be a Garda ever dreamt of when they signed up - some idiot breaking their balls at 3 o clock in the morning when they're trying to do what the State pays them to do.

OP for future reference - if you behave like an ass, you're likely to be treated like one. The way you're coming across here it's as though you wanted the attention, and you got more attention than you bargained for.

I've often been stopped by Gardaí at 3am in the morning when they were patrolling the town and I was making my way home on my own, I daresay I have that dodgy looking head on me, and the gammy hip makes me walk like I've had a few too many even though I could have been drinking minerals all night. I understand in my case why the Gardaí might treat my appearance and behaviour as a bit, well, for want of a better word - questionable.

I'll give them my name and address (I don't carry ID), and they're on their way. There's no drama, no headlocks, no choking me out nor throwing me in the doghouse. I'm able to get up the next morning and carry on about my business.

That's what every Garda wishes for when they're on the job too, to be able to do their jobs with no drama, no ball breakers nor time wasters. They have better things to be doing, and I consider it my duty to play my part in keeping my community safe so that I CAN walk home on my own at night without anything happening to me, like being mugged or robbed by one of our hoody wearing, casino frequenting, moderate drinking citizens who have no respect for the Gardaí, let alone yours truly.

Kev W · 30-09-2015 11:05AM

AudreyHepburn wrote: »

They had.

There was a robbery in the area and here they had a man with a large amount of cash on him, refusing to answer questions and acting decidedly shifty and dressed in such a way that it might appear he was trying to avoid being identified. A man who then went to pull god knows what from his pocket.

If that's not reasonable cause I don't know what it.

You don't know what is then.
They couldn't have known he had the cash on him so that's irrelevant.

Pat Mustard · 30-09-2015 11:08AM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

OP for future reference - if you behave like an ass, you're likely to be treated like one. The way you're coming across here it's as though you wanted the attention, and you got more attention than you bargained for.

Backchat isn't a good excuse for trained Gardai to choke somebody unconscious and throw them into a cell, last time I looked.

A bit of perspective wouldn't go astray.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 30-09-2015 11:12AM

If they called medics for a panic attack, I doubt they left him panned out unconscious. Like mentioned earlier, three sides to every story

asherbassad · 30-09-2015 11:13AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

"Sorry guard I don't feel like being searched"
Wtf?

Shouldn't get smart with them tbh, only brings trouble on yourself

Actually, I'm not so sure he has to consent to any searches. Isn't a warrant needed before a search is conducted?

Jawgap · 30-09-2015 11:14AM

Pat Mustard wrote: »

Backchat isn't a good excuse for trained Gardai to choke somebody unconscious and throw them into a cell, last time I looked.

A bit of perspective wouldn't go astray.

I'd imagine the fact he went to take something from his pocket led to him being taken down.

Bit of a dickhead move - I'd imagine a well trained Guard isn't going to wait and see if it is in fact a phone you're going for.

Gongoozler · 30-09-2015 11:15AM

Agent Smith wrote: »

Pretty sure you broke the "Criminal Justice Act" by refusing to give the guards your name.....

Pretty sure you can't break an Act.

asherbassad · 30-09-2015 11:18AM

Hank Scorpio wrote: »

Hi guys

Tonight I was in the local casino, went in at 9pm to play a tourney and left at like 3 am after playing some cash games. Afterwards I walked up a long way towards Macdonalds, only place open.

Had about 1K in my back pocket, won a bit. Squad with 3 guys pulls over beside me and asks me why I have a hood on. I explain to them it's cold and I'm going home but might get some food first.

One of them says there's been robberys around tonight recently and he wants to search me. I tell them I don't feel like being searched. I don't know the legality here, I had a wad of cash on me and I felt paranoid after being surrounded.

Then they ask for my name and I said I don't know if I have to give my name or not to you, and said I want to record this because I'm feeling intimidated. As soon as I take my phone out they put me in a choke hold while putting cuffs on me, I passed out on the ground and came around. I never resisted, I was confused. I had 4 bottles in the casino and it would take 10 or more before I'd become drunk.

I got brought to the station and got chucked in a cell, I asked them 4 or 5 during the period they were choking me and putting me in the cell why am I under arrest and they never told me, they just told me to shut up.

After an hour in the cell I pressed the button and told the female guard I want to go home, I'm not drunk nor have I done anything wrong. She laughed at me and said I'm not going anywhere. I got a panic attack and asked her could I leave after another hour or so, she never replied but medics did come. They took my blood pressure etc and said I should go to the hospital. I said I'm feeling better, I went back into the station and got the guys name who choked me.

Well I just wanted to get this off my chest, I'm 30 years old and never been in trouble in my life

Seek legal advice mate. If the cops see you with a hood up and decide they want to fcuk with you then they're going to say "there's been some robberies in the area". That's the catch all excuse for them to search you. There could have been 1000 burglaries or not a one in the area. It still doesn't give them the right to stop and search you.

So what if they only find a joint in your pocket? They're still going to do you for that...even though it has nothing to do with these so-called robberies...unless some stoner said his stash has been nicked. What are they looking for on your person anyway? A chandelier, a TV?

asherbassad · 30-09-2015 11:19AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

"Sorry guard I don't feel like being searched"
Wtf?

Shouldn't get smart with them tbh, only brings trouble on yourself

When did he get smart?

30-09-2015 11:19AM

Pat Mustard wrote: »

Backchat isn't a good excuse for trained Gardai to choke somebody unconscious and throw them into a cell, last time I looked.

A bit of perspective wouldn't go astray.

You are relying totally on the word of one party to obtain that perspective.

I suspect the Gardai may describe it differently to "choke somebody unconscious and throw them into a cell". They may say man with drink on him who was acting suspiciously and refusing to co operate, who admits to having panic attacks, was not "choked unconscious" by them, but was certainly placed in a cell.

30-09-2015 11:20AM

asherbassad wrote: »

Actually, I'm not so sure he has to consent to any searches. Isn't a warrant needed before a search is conducted?

Mother of Jesus.

It's laughable what people churn out about the law. A search warrant needed for a stop and search...:D:D:D

One eyed Jack · 30-09-2015 11:21AM

Pat Mustard wrote: »

Backchat isn't a good excuse for trained Gardai to choke somebody unconscious and throw them into a cell, last time I looked.

A bit of perspective wouldn't go astray.

You're right, it's absolutely not any sort of an excuse for Gardaí to behave like that with a citizen who is being cooperative with them when they are trying to protect said citizen from harm (if the OP had been relieved of his winnings by one lesser upstanding citizen, who would they expect should have protected them?).

That's why I'd love to be privy to the details of the incident from the Gardaí's perspective. You're right in pointing out that a bit of perspective wouldn't go amiss, but that's exactly what's missing here.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 30-09-2015 11:23AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

"Sorry guard I don't feel like being searched"
Wtf?

Shouldn't get smart with them tbh, only brings trouble on yourself

Your mentality is ripe for a totalitarian/police state. You're the governments best friend.

This is also victim blaming.

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Look, if they were in an unmarked car, I'd understand. But they pulled up in the squad car, and you wouldn't co-operate. You wouldn't allow them search you, you wouldn't give them your name and you got smart with them threathening to record them. What did you expect?? For them to be like "alright sham, off you go so"?

They put up with so much **** and nonsense from people with attitudes just like yours. How are they supposed to know you're not doing a drop for drugs, after breaking in somewhere etc? You're wandering around at 3am on a Tuesday night, of course that'll raise their interests.

Not to be harsh but you brought it on yourself

Criminals never stole Garda uniforms, or pretended to be Gardai, no? :rolleyes:

asherbassad · 30-09-2015 11:27AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Look, if they were in an unmarked car, I'd understand. But they pulled up in the squad car, and you wouldn't co-operate. You wouldn't allow them search you, you wouldn't give them your name and you got smart with them threathening to record them. What did you expect?? For them to be like "alright sham, off you go so"?

They put up with so much **** and nonsense from people with attitudes just like yours. How are they supposed to know you're not doing a drop for drugs, after breaking in somewhere etc? You're wandering around at 3am on a Tuesday night, of course that'll raise their interests.

Not to be harsh but you brought it on yourself

What the fuck is wrong with you?

He didn't get smart and he questioned why they wanted to search/detain him. He has every right to do that. And he has every right to record them. That's perfectly legal. If the cops have nothing to hide they've nothing to fear, right?

And I don't give a toss how much shit they put up with. That doesn't give them the right to give shit to anyone else. Especially law abiding citizens minding their own business.

We live in a free society. That means that there are rules, regulations and restrictions on public servants and agents of the state. You may prefer to have them do whatever they want and give them a pass to overstep their authority just because they "deal with shit" but that's not how everyone else feels.

30-09-2015 11:28AM

asherbassad wrote: »

What the fuck is wrong with you?

He didn't get smart and he questioned why they wanted to search/detain him. He has every right to do that. And he has every right to record them. That's perfectly legal. If the cops have nothing to hide they've nothing to fear, right?

And I don't give a toss how much shit they put up with. That doesn't give them the right to give shit to anyone else. Especially law abiding citizens minding their own business.

We live in a free society. That means that there are rules, regulations and restrictions on public servants and agents of the state. You may prefer to have them do whatever they want and give them a pass to overstep their authority just because they "deal with shit" but that's not how everyone else feels.

Tell us about the one where you thought a search warrant was needed for a stop and search!

Your funny stuff is far better than the sweary stuff.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 30-09-2015 11:28AM

Yeah, three thieves riding around in a squad car and uniforms.
If the victim complied with gardai there would have been no issue.

bucketybuck · 30-09-2015 11:30AM

Pat Mustard wrote: »

A bit of perspective wouldn't go astray.

Good advice for the OP there.

I'm quite happy for our police force to be stopping suspicious looking people wandering the streets on a Tuesday morning. A guy hiding his face and refusing to answer simple ID questions when asked? Proceed officer, do what you have to do.

Its laughable this idea that the cops are all power hungry losers looking for easy victims, instead of guys just trying to do their job like 99% of every other industry on the planet. I strongly suspect that had I been in the OP's shoes I wouldn't have ended up in a cell, because I would just have smiled, answered their questions and showed the cops that I had nothing to hide.

30-09-2015 11:30AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

Yeah, three thieves riding around in a squad car and uniforms.
If the victim complied with gardai there would have been no issue.

This crowd were particularly dangerous, they built a fake Garda Station!

JazzyJ · 30-09-2015 11:31AM

Pat Mustard wrote: »

Nope:

24.—(1) Where a member of the Garda Síochána finds any person committing an offence under a relevant provision...

Eh there is more to that section... so if you're suspected of committing an offence you can be asked for your name and address.

(2) Where a member of the Garda Síochána is of the opinion that an offence has been committed under a relevant provision, the member may—

(a) demand the name and address of any person whom the member suspects, with reasonable cause, has committed, or whom the member finds committing, such an offence, and

(b) arrest without warrant any such person who fails or refuses to give his name and address when demanded, or gives a name or address which the member has reasonable grounds for believing is false or misleading.

tonto24 · 30-09-2015 11:32AM

Jawgap wrote: »

I'd imagine the fact he went to take something from his pocket led to him being taken down.

Bit of a dickhead move - I'd imagine a well trained Guard isn't going to wait and see if it is in fact a phone you're going for.

He already said he had the phone in his hand.

kneemos · 30-09-2015 11:33AM

Jawgap wrote: »

I'd imagine the fact he went to take something from his pocket led to him being taken down.

Bit of a dickhead move - I'd imagine a well trained Guard isn't going to wait and see if it is in fact a phone you're going for.

The op says he went to take his phone out,but he say later he had it in his hand.Maybe that's what he meant.\○/.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 30-09-2015 11:34AM

asherbassad wrote: »

What the fuck is wrong with you?

He didn't get smart and he questioned why they wanted to search/detain him. He has every right to do that. And he has every right to record them. That's perfectly legal. If the cops have nothing to hide they've nothing to fear, right?

And I don't give a toss how much shit they put up with. That doesn't give them the right to give shit to anyone else. Especially law abiding citizens minding their own business.

We live in a free society. That means that there are rules, regulations and restrictions on public servants and agents of the state. You may prefer to have them do whatever they want and give them a pass to overstep their authority just because they "deal with shit" but that's not how everyone else feels.

What's wrong with me is, three gardai tried to do what they're paid to do and you have someone back answering, refusing to co operate and threathening to record them just doing their job. And we all know where that would end up, all over Facebook, even when it makes the person who took it look foolish (think during the water protests. Trying to goade gardai into reacting)

He could have been anyone. He could have had drugs on him. He could have had a gun on him. He could have had a knife. They did not know because he would not comply. Are they supposed to be mind readers?? If the OP
Was dodge and was on his way to shoot someone, the same gardai would be under fire for NOT detaining him.

asherbassad · 30-09-2015 11:37AM

kneemos wrote: »

It's when he went for his pocket that they used force,being smart just made them suspicious I'd imagine.

Why is everyone saying he got "smart"?

MonkeyTennis · 30-09-2015 11:37AM

Walking down a street late at night is not dodgy behaviour.

tonto24 · 30-09-2015 11:38AM

LexieOnRale wrote: »

What's wrong with me is, three gardai tried to do what they're paid to do and you have someone back answering, refusing to co operate and threathening to record them just doing their job. And we all know where that would end up, all over Facebook, even when it makes the person who took it look foolish (think during the water protests. Trying to goade gardai into reacting)

He could have been anyone. He could have had drugs on him. He could have had a gun on him. He could have had a knife. They did not know because he would not comply. Are they supposed to be mind readers?? If the OP
Was dodge and was on his way to shoot someone, the same gardai would be under fire for NOT detaining him.

Are you allowed record them? Is there a law against it?

KERSPLAT! · 30-09-2015 11:39AM

Mod

I'll take this opportunity to remind everyone to remain civil and attack the post and not the poster, fair warning for everyone.

30-09-2015 11:39AM

kneemos wrote: »

The op says he went to take his phone out,but he say later he had it in his hand.Maybe that's what he meant.\○/.

In fairness, he conceded he had drink taken, so some confusion is possible.

We are still missing one rather relevant aspect - the Gardai's version.

asherbassad · 30-09-2015 11:40AM

kneemos wrote: »

Do you honestly think they were going to stand there at three in the morning and debate with you as you recorded them?
I would have arrested you for just being annoying.

And that's the very reason why people like you shouldn't be in charge of anything.

Don't know where else to post this

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