DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

Kennyg71 · 09-09-2015 10:45AM

8 miles done this morning, 1.19 hrs 9.55 avg, 2 miles marginally
to fast, mile 2 &3 but over all good run, nice morning for running
Temp seems to be on up this week.

09-09-2015 10:49AM

I'm having garmin issues

I lost my beautiful Forerunner 220. Completely lost. Times like these I wish I ran solely by distance, but I don't, so I went and spent 130 bloody quid on a new one. Got the cheapest one I could get that did HR.

Got to park last night to do my run and the HR function wasn't working

Had to do the whole thing by pace and pretty much just guesswork. My lap function wouldn't work either, so I don't even know what my average pace was for each interval.

Grrrrrr.

I had a long run last night - 2hrs (was meant to be 1hr 57 but wanted to get over that last km mark :P) and my legs were dead when I got home. My calves were seizing up big time and actually really really hurting me (not in an injured way though), so I ran a bath and put a massive load of epsom salts in it and sat there for 10-15 minutes. When I got out my legs were perfect and this morning they don't feel like I ran much at all. Will be doing that more often.

aquinn · 09-09-2015 11:08AM

Deleted User wrote: »

I'm having garmin issues

I lost my beautiful Forerunner 220. Completely lost. Times like these I wish I ran solely by distance, but I don't, so I went and spent 130 bloody quid on a new one. Got the cheapest one I could get that did HR.

Got to park last night to do my run and the HR function wasn't working

Had to do the whole thing by pace and pretty much just guesswork. My lap function wouldn't work either, so I don't even know what my average pace was for each interval.

Grrrrrr.

I had a long run last night - 2hrs (was meant to be 1hr 57 but wanted to get over that last km mark :P) and my legs were dead when I got home. My calves were seizing up big time and actually really really hurting me (not in an injured way though), so I ran a bath and put a massive load of epsom salts in it and sat there for 10-15 minutes. When I got out my legs were perfect and this morning they don't feel like I ran much at all. Will be doing that more often.

Lost, oh no. Definitely lost and not forgotten at home/work/gym bag? Sorry to hear that.

betty swollox · 09-09-2015 11:11AM

Cant believe we have hit week 12 of the plan already, this is scary. I haven't been posting much in here but i've still been reading peoples lsr reports

Still to write an lsr report:o i promise i will for the race itself, if i'm honest i can hardly remember the first and last miles never mind everything in between

Training is going well, two 20 milers under my belt and looking forward to a smaller (16 miles is small wtf) run this weekend and the HM next week.
Fair play to you all i know the pain that you are going through but stick with it because the feeling at the end and actually throughout the DCM is worth the pain:)

Chops1234 · 09-09-2015 11:14AM

chrislad wrote: »

When should we expect the race packs for the half next week?

I've mine since before the 5 mile run (I registered for the 5/10/half and they all came together) but only received them a few days before the 5 mile race. So reckon you should get it in the next few days.

chrislad · 09-09-2015 12:24PM

Kennyg71 wrote: »

Got mine about month ago as well. But signed up early. If you
Signed up for series & have same number, I know people have
Collected on day.

I signed up ages ago, but I only signed up for the one race as I wasn't driving to Dublin for a 8k, 10k and 10 mile race. A co-worker got his in the post today so it might be there when I get home.

neilthefunkeone · 09-09-2015 12:38PM

So havnt been around for a few days.. Still not running.. Looks like I won't be racing the half marathon anyway.. And I'm in in doubt whether I'll keep going for the full.. Physio again tomorrow, was hopeful after the last session but not so much now...

Just a vent really!!!!

Pink11 · 09-09-2015 12:51PM

Thanks Clearier. Will stick to my plan so.

Sorry to hear about your watch whoopsadaisydoodles, what a pain! What model did you re-buy?

If you don't have your number by Friday I'd email them.
(I've seen on a few of the other runs in the series where they had to arrange collection on the morning for people so you need to give them time to double check post it on time?)

neilthefunkeone wrote: »

So havnt been around for a few days.. Still not running.. Looks like I won't be racing the half marathon anyway.. And I'm in in doubt whether I'll keep going for the full.. Physio again tomorrow, was hopeful after the last session but not so much now...

Just a vent really!!!!

You poor thing you must be so frustrated. Are you signed up to the big M? Hope all goes well with the physio

Just reading back over some posts I missed. Interesting discussion on the nausea. It was becoming a bit of a dose for every LSR for me too.

I've come back, barely able to move because I know I'll get sick and unable to eat or drink a damn thing. It lasts for around the same amount of time too (2 hours) which is interesting!! It's a loooooong 2 hours though. Feel like ass!!

I think it might have been the cold water actually. I drink room temp on the last two LSRs and have been fine touch wood!

Kennyg71 · 09-09-2015 01:27PM

neilthefunkeone wrote: »

So havnt been around for a few days.. Still not running.. Looks like I won't be racing the half marathon anyway.. And I'm in in doubt whether I'll keep going for the full.. Physio again tomorrow, was hopeful after the last session but not so much now...

Just a vent really!!!!

Sorry to hear that Neil, but you never know, if you can get back
to training over next week or so, maybe able to work towards
Full & see how you feel nearer time.

Hope news more optimistic after Physio. Best of luck.

This Fat Girl Runs · 09-09-2015 02:59PM

Just saw this come up on my FB feed. It's a good read!

Wondering what our mentors/advisors think? Anything to add? Anything to debate?

http://irishrunner.com/recovery-road/

aquinn · 09-09-2015 03:07PM

This Fat Girl Runs wrote: »

Just saw this come up on my FB feed. It's a good read!

Wondering what our mentors/advisors think? Anything to add? Anything to debate?

http://irishrunner.com/recovery-road/

More for taper time when you are all going mad. 47 days!

Dubgal72 · 09-09-2015 03:15PM

aquinn wrote: »

More for taper time when you are all going mad. 47 days!

Haha excellent and good point, something to keep ye lot distracted during taper time

actually am seriously thinking of calling in sick for taper time

aquinn · 09-09-2015 03:21PM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

actually am seriously thinking of calling in sick for taper time

DON'T BOTHER!

Dubgal72 · 09-09-2015 03:22PM

aquinn wrote: »

DON'T BOTHER!

You've passed the interview stage, I'd say you and your team are first in line....

diego_b · 09-09-2015 03:29PM

I read this earlier and I think the strategy is nuts.

I would maybe try it in reverse!

Just wondering what the mentors think of it?

aquinn · 09-09-2015 03:34PM

Since this is a paragraph they'll be asking for the link to be removed in case you try it.

'If you’re not sure that you can do a marathon in 4 hours, do a 10k race test (at least 5 days before the race). You should be able to run a 10k (about 6.2 miles) in less than 52 minutes, which is about an 8:23 per mile pace. If you finish between 52-55 minutes, you have a chance if you’ve done a lot of endurance training (long runs over 15 miles). If you had a 10k time of more than 55 minutes, you should be looking at a 4:15 or 4:30 marathon goal instead.'

Myles Splitz · 09-09-2015 03:40PM

diego_b wrote: »

I read this earlier and I think the strategy is nuts.

I would maybe try it in reverse!

Just wondering what the mentors think of it?

It looks as though this strategy was devised by someone based on a sample size of results rather than an understanding of marathon running.

You will find that many marathon runners especially in the +3.30 - 6 hour range will positive split in the marathon but it does not mean it is optimal. In most cases it is down to lack of endurance and tiring.

If you have an good base however you should aim to avoid this and try to level of very marginally negative split between first and second half.

Going out hard to "bank" time is a cardinal sin of marathon running that will usually end in tears.

Dubgal72 · 09-09-2015 03:41PM

diego_b wrote: »

I read this earlier and I think the strategy is nuts.

I would maybe try it in reverse!

Just wondering what the mentors think of it?

:eek: No, definitely would not recommend this strategy. Imo, you would be better served by starting up to 25 seconds slower than race pace for the first two miles or so, definitely not 30 seconds faster....

I would aim for even enough splits throughout and if you come out with a slight negative split (up to 5 mins), bonus. The paces described in this article are nearly like my experience last year (didn't go faster than PMP though) in that I probably slowed at these stages and that was very demoralising in itself.

Emsy 1 · 09-09-2015 03:45PM

chrislad wrote: »

When should we expect the race packs for the half next week?

Mine only arrived today so yours is likely to be on the way.

diego_b · 09-09-2015 03:49PM

I'm glad to see that my understanding on these things agrees with what you all say there. The 10K tempo run that aquinn flagged there had me going wtf to start with.
Was just planning my mp run for later and was doing a search on the pace for 4hr 15mins and stumbled across that article.
After the race on Saturday gone I might do the mp run tonight towards the slower end of my mp range which I view as between 4-4:15 at the moment.

For races themselves I normally try go with an even pace throughout and then at say 3 miles or so to go properly start to the empty the tank...if there's anything left at that point!

Dubgal72 · 09-09-2015 03:59PM

diego_b wrote: »

I'm glad to see that my understanding on these things agrees with what you all say there. The 10K tempo run that aquinn flagged there had me going wtf to start with.
Was just planning my mp run for later and was doing a search on the pace for 4hr 15mins and stumbled across that article.
After the race on Saturday gone I might do the mp run tonight towards the slower end of my mp range which I view as between 4-4:15 at the moment.

For races themselves I normally try go with an even pace throughout and then at say 3 miles or so to go properly start to the empty the tank...if there's anything left at that point!

Hey thanks for reminding me diego, you will still be recovering from the HM so you could scrap the pace run. The priority this week for those of you who have raced the HM is easy recovery miles this week.
If you *have to* do the pace run, leave the watch at home and do it by effort.

diego_b · 09-09-2015 04:08PM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Hey thanks for reminding me diego, you will still be recovering from the HM so you could scrap the pace run. The priority this week for those of you who have raced the HM is easy recovery miles this week.
If you *have to* do the pace run, leave the watch at home and do it by effort.

Aye aye captain, I will keep it easier for sure then and see how it goes.
I was slightly anxious about it being so soon after the race! I have planned a pretty much flat route so that will make life easier for me...tis not easy plan runs of say over 3-5 miles and avoid the hills that Kerry have. It's a huge advantage when it comes to races with hills in the though.

Sunny Disposition · 09-09-2015 04:53PM

Really noticing the training this week, pretty tired at work most afternoons, legs feel okay but pretty drained. Anyway, a rest day today and then 18 mile lsr tomorrow evening.

rovers_runner · 09-09-2015 04:59PM

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Really noticing the training this week, pretty tired at work most afternoons, legs feel okay but pretty drained. Anyway, a rest day today and then 18 mile lsr tomorrow evening.

Lucky you, to have the choice to do a LSR on a week night :pac:.
I remember those days.... having a toddler at home leaves only 7am on a Sat/Sun morning for a 3hr disappearing act, and even that's with an understanding other half.

Anyone else with children manage to do an LSR on a worknight? Fair play if so

betty swollox · 09-09-2015 05:04PM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

:eek: No, definitely would not recommend this strategy. Imo, you would be better served by starting up to 25 seconds slower than race pace for the first two miles or so, definitely not 30 seconds faster....

I would aim for even enough splits throughout and if you come out with a slight negative split (up to 5 mins), bonus. The paces described in this article are nearly like my experience last year (didn't go faster than PMP though) in that I probably slowed at these stages and that was very demoralising in itself.

Wow that's is exactly where i went wrong last year, do not i repeat do not follow that strategy

FeenaM · 09-09-2015 05:11PM

rovers_runner wrote: »

Lucky you, to have the choice to do a LSR on a week night :pac:.
I remember those days.... having a toddler at home leaves only 7am on a Sat/Sun morning for a 3hr disappearing act, and even that's with an understanding other half.

Anyone else with children manage to do an LSR on a worknight? Fair play if so

Yep, heading out for 19 miles as soon as the other half gets in the door :-0

Phoebas · 09-09-2015 05:14PM

rovers_runner wrote: »

Anyone else with children manage to do an LSR on a worknight? Fair play if so

The boards plan has an 11 miler today - that's longer than some of the LSRs early on in the plan!

rovers_runner · 09-09-2015 05:19PM

Phoebas wrote: »

The boards plan has an 11 miler today - that's longer than some of the LSRs early on in the plan!

Could probably manage 90 mins alright heading out late, but an 18m or more starting around 8pm would have me falling asleep out there.

menoscemo · 09-09-2015 05:32PM

diego_b wrote: »

I read this earlier and I think the strategy is nuts.

I would maybe try it in reverse!

Just wondering what the mentors think of it?

That's the worst advice article I have ever read!!
What it seems to be basing itself on is teh fact that most 3;59 runners go through half way in 1:52 so it wrongly assumes that is the optimum strategy. In fact most of those runners will have gone through half way in 1:52 because they are actually aiming for a 3:45-3;50 finish. They then go off the boil a little but manage to hang on for a secondary goal of sub 4.

If you are a runner for whom sub 4 is your best possible result then going through halfway in 1:52 will likely be your best possible HM race effort. That means if you do it you'll likely do the second half of the race closer to 3 hours than 2 and completely blow your sub 4 chances. You'll most liley end up with 4:30 or worse.

Mrs Mc · 09-09-2015 05:54PM

Sunny Disposition wrote: »

Really noticing the training this week, pretty tired at work most afternoons, legs feel okay but pretty drained. Anyway, a rest day today and then 18 mile lsr tomorrow evening.

Me too am knackered at work this week spending the afternoon yawning and struggled to keep eyes open on Monday at a meeting with about 20 people in a stuffy room. Trying to get to bed earlier but not managing it. Have a hen night in saturday so taking Friday off work to get LSR done.

DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

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