DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

chrislad · 07-06-2015 06:51PM

Well done. I kicked off my LSRs this week with an 8.7 mile. Did 15 miles recovery running this week before ramp up the week after next.

hot buttered scones · 07-06-2015 07:25PM

Posted on this thread a couple of weeks back so I just thought I check in. I ran my first marathon on Monday in Cork in 3:49:27 which I'm thrilled with. AS for a training plan - I'm still undecided. Myasics served me well for Cork, so maybe I'll stick with them. I'll have to have another look at the boards plan, but I still think 4 days running a week is enough for me, and its difficult to fit around 12 hour shifts and night shifts at times. I still have a week or so to decide.

This Fat Girl Runs · 07-06-2015 07:27PM

hot buttered scones wrote: »

Posted on this thread a couple of weeks back so I just thought I check in. I ran my first marathon on Monday in Cork in 3:49:27 which I'm thrilled with. AS for a training plan - I'm still undecided. Myasics served me well for Cork, so maybe I'll stick with them. I'll have to have another look at the boards plan, but I still think 4 days running a week is enough for me, and its difficult to fit around 12 hour shifts and night shifts at times. I still have a week or so to decide.

Well done on the marathon! How are you feeling now?

Also, your boards name makes me drool like Homer Simpson!

Mrs Mc · 07-06-2015 07:29PM

adrian522 wrote: »

Very quiet in here, what running have the novices being doing this weekend?

Did an 8 mile today having some Achilles trouble but a visit to the physio this week and some stretching has improved it but still a bit of a niggle will have to keep stretching and keep an eye on it. But a lovely day for a run today.

07-06-2015 07:54PM

adrian522 wrote: »

Very quiet in here, what running have the novices being doing this weekend?

No running for me. I had an easy week with no long run planned, but with my tendon still tender my running dude told me not to run on it and not to worry because it was an easy week. This week I'm increasing back to 4 runs. I'm away at the minute so will have to find some pretty places to run over here which I'm looking forward to. Ankle feels fine again.

ratracer · 07-06-2015 08:01PM

This week I ran as follows: Sun 6.5k, Mon rest, Tues 6.5k, Weds 3k and gym/ core, Thurs rest, Fri 6.5k, Sat 6k. Today I was cycling instead of running, but what was supposed to be a handy 120km sportive turned into a balls out effort for 3.5 hrs at average pace of 32km/h. Tomorrow will be core and stretching, maybe a light 3km jog.

chinguetti · 07-06-2015 08:04PM

Hello to all. Just coming on here to wish all you first timers the best of luck between now and the big day. I'm sure you'll get and have got loads of advice from all on here. A few things that I would throw into the mix are the following (if they've been already said, apologises):

- get a full health check out before you start fully into a plan. Its just the sensible thing to do.
- you'll have bad days and disappointments so don't get too disheartened and remember the good days and good training runs.
- you'll make loads of mistakes in your training but learn from them, that's the important thing.
- don't make the marathon the be all and end all. Some of you will get injured and can't get to the start line but remember, there's loads of marathons to run in the world and to wait a year isn't a disaster.
- vary your training, don't over train and don't try and catch up on miles that you couldn't do during the week.
- rest when your body wants to. It will thank you.
- get used to running up hills when you're tired. Its a feeling that you'll need to know you have conquered come the big day.
- get a sport massage about once a month. Your legs will thank you.
- eat healthy as much as you can.
- do one target race a month, its takes the boredom out of training and you'll see the improvement you're making and learn important race prep for the big day.
- try and do your lsr with a group or someone else. It will keep you sane and is a great help to know that someone is training for it too.
- get used to the smell of tiger balm, the feel of vaseline in certain areas and the ability to eat all round you and still be hungry.
- try and do some of your runs on grass or wood trails as its good for the feet.
- to hell with anyone who says you're mad/crazy/daft/etc to do a marathon. Yes you are but so what.
- toenails are over rated
- pain will be your new best friend. Embrace it.
- don't give up however bad you feel, keep moving one step at a time if it comes to that.

Enjoy it all folks and good luck. Dublin is a great place to do your first marathon in.

long_b · 07-06-2015 08:23PM

adrian522 wrote: »

Very quiet in here, what running have the novices being doing this weekend?

None. Fortunately toe doesn't look like it's broken.
Did half hour swimming Saturday and nearly an hour cycling today.
Very jealous of anyone who got a nice LSR in today.

nop98 · 07-06-2015 11:34PM

adrian522 wrote: »

Very quiet in here, what running have the novices being doing this weekend?

had a nice, steady week, clocking in just over 30 miles, mostly slow and uneventful. Some nice hilly trails today, and likely a day of rest tomorrow! :cool:

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 10:32AM

Morning Novices

Bit of a hiccup yesterday, my PC died (and maybe the updated boards plan too but let's rest our hope in the power of auto save...). Back to business today:

This week I want you all to focus on checking your form when running. This is something you will need to practice so it becomes second nature when the going gets tough on DCM day...It's very easy to switch off, especially on long runs. So when out this week look for:

- Posture: is your torso straight but relaxed? Run tall
- Shoulders: keep your shoulders down and relaxed
- Chin: keep your chin slightly tucked in and your jaw relaxed - tense jaw = tense everywhere else :eek:
- Hands and elbows: no chicken flapping, keep your elbows relaxed and your fingers and thumbs resting lightly, not clenched
- Ankles: keep your ankle motion smooth and relaxed for an efficient turnover
- Cadence: don't over stride, keep your turnover shorter rather than long for general running. We'll talk more about cadence/rhythm later

Theme here? Relaxed

You might need to set an alarm on your watch for this (every five minutes) or plan in advance at which markers you do a form check (mile markers...or km markers if you insist :rolleyes:

), lap points etc.

Let us know how you're getting on with this and what works for you. Happy formful running!

diego_b · 08-06-2015 10:34AM

Copied from my training log....this is how the last week went

Week starting 1st Jun
Day/Goal/Actual/Pace/Notes
Mon, 3m easy, 3.13m in 29:49 @ 9:30min/mi
Tue, 75min circuits, 4.43m (incl 4x hill repeats) in 43:02 @ 9:42min/mi
Wed, Rest
Thur, 3m easy, 3m in 28:25 @ 9:24min/mi
Fri, Rest
Sat, Parkrun, 3m in 23:16min @ 7:49min/mi (equaled my parkrun PB, I was happy of course as I ran on feeling without focusing too much on time, felt a lot better than previous week)
Sun, 6.5m easy, 6.5m in 1:03:53 @ 9:48min/mi (really enjoyed this run and felt I could have sustained that pace to run a lot longer also, helped that it was a stunning day out and I had a nice view of the atlantic whilst running a good bit of it.)
Total for the week 20 miles.

Completed day 14 of the 30 day challenge yesterday also, the pigeon pose is working well for me I think. Finding the Lateral Hip Stretches hard to do but will keep plugging away at them.

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 10:38AM

hot buttered scones wrote: »

Posted on this thread a couple of weeks back so I just thought I check in. I ran my first marathon on Monday in Cork in 3:49:27 which I'm thrilled with. AS for a training plan - I'm still undecided. Myasics served me well for Cork, so maybe I'll stick with them. I'll have to have another look at the boards plan, but I still think 4 days running a week is enough for me, and its difficult to fit around 12 hour shifts and night shifts at times. I still have a week or so to decide.

Hi hot buttered scones. Well done in Cork, fantastic time and especially in those conditions

Hope you're recovering well and don't even think of starting a plan for at least four weeks after Cork. You have banked some training and your body deserves a break. Let us know when you plan to start (ie early July at the earliest

) and we can help you transition into a plan if you like. Keep the recovery runs going in the meantime.

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 10:41AM

Mrs Mc wrote: »

Did an 8 mile today having some Achilles trouble but a visit to the physio this week and some stretching has improved it but still a bit of a niggle will have to keep stretching and keep an eye on it. But a lovely day for a run today.

Hi Mrs Mc fingers crossed for you. Disclaimer: I am not giving medical advice but heel drops are miracle workers for my Achilles and calves, have you been recommended these for your niggle?

Myles Splitz · 08-06-2015 10:42AM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Morning Novices Bit of a hiccup yesterday, my PC died (and maybe the updated boards plan too but let's rest our hope in the power of auto save...). Back to business today:

This week I want you all to focus on checking your form when running. This is something you will need to practice so it becomes second nature when the going gets tough on DCM day...It's very easy to switch off, especially on long runs. So when out this week look for:

- Posture: is your torso straight but relaxed? Run tall
- Shoulders: keep your shoulders down and relaxed
- Chin: keep your chin slightly tucked in and your jaw relaxed - tense jaw = tense everywhere else :eek:
- Hands and elbows: no chicken flapping, keep your elbows relaxed and your fingers and thumbs resting lightly, not clenched
- Ankles: keep your ankle motion smooth and relaxed for an efficient turnover
- Cadence: don't over stride, keep your turnover shorter rather than long for general running. We'll talk more about cadence/rhythm later

Theme here? Relaxed

You might need to set an alarm on your watch for this (every five minutes) or plan in advance at which markers you do a form check (mile markers...or km markers if you insist :rolleyes: ), lap points etc.

Let us know how you're getting on with this and what works for you. Happy formful running!

Funny this came up this week.

I know The Run Hub in Ashtown are actually putting on a form clinic on Wednesday with Nick McCormack. (British distance Olympian in 2012)

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 10:42AM

long_b wrote: »

None. Fortunately toe doesn't look like it's broken.
Did half hour swimming Saturday and nearly an hour cycling today.
Very jealous of anyone who got a nice LSR in today.

Great news!

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 10:46AM

Myles Splitz wrote: »

Funny this came up this week.

I know The Run Hub in Ashtown are actually putting on a form clinic on Wednesday with Nick McCormack. (British distance Olympian in 2012)

Aaah thanks MS, on boards? Missed that. Can you link to it please?

Myles Splitz · 08-06-2015 10:50AM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Aaah thanks MS, on boards? Missed that. Can you link to it please?

Saw it on the book face.

https://www.facebook.com/events/1669756039919284/?ref=98

Brian_Dart · 08-06-2015 11:03AM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Morning Novices Bit of a hiccup yesterday, my PC died (and maybe the updated boards plan too but let's rest our hope in the power of auto save...). Back to business today:

This week I want you all to focus on checking your form when running. This is something you will need to practice so it becomes second nature when the going gets tough on DCM day...It's very easy to switch off, especially on long runs. So when out this week look for:

- Posture: is your torso straight but relaxed? Run tall
- Shoulders: keep your shoulders down and relaxed
- Chin: keep your chin slightly tucked in and your jaw relaxed - tense jaw = tense everywhere else :eek:
- Hands and elbows: no chicken flapping, keep your elbows relaxed and your fingers and thumbs resting lightly, not clenched
- Ankles: keep your ankle motion smooth and relaxed for an efficient turnover
- Cadence: don't over stride, keep your turnover shorter rather than long for general running. We'll talk more about cadence/rhythm later

Theme here? Relaxed

You might need to set an alarm on your watch for this (every five minutes) or plan in advance at which markers you do a form check (mile markers...or km markers if you insist :rolleyes: ), lap points etc.

Let us know how you're getting on with this and what works for you. Happy formful running!

Don't know if this would be of any help to anyone, but I read an article on Runnersworld at the weekend, called "running-air-breathing-technique", about changing your breathing technique when running and how it can help prevent some injuries, it was pretty interesting.

Phoebas · 08-06-2015 11:38AM

chinguetti wrote: »

- vary your training, don't over train and don't try and catch up on miles that you couldn't do during the week.

I understand the risk of injury of over training, but If I have a week where I know in advance that I won't be able to train on my five scheduled days - because of work or family commitments or whatever, is it better to just drop off a day completely or should I try to spread (some of) the mileage over the other days?

Clearlier · 08-06-2015 11:42AM

Phoebas wrote: »

I understand the risk of injury of over training, but If I have a week where I know in advance that I won't be able to train on my five scheduled days - because of work or family commitments or whatever, is it better to just drop off a day completely or should I try to spread (some of) the mileage over the other days?

Keep the sessions/long run. Move things around so that you drop an easy day. As a general rule just drop the run, don't bump up other runs. One missed run won't have any serious impact on your fitness.

RonanP77 · 08-06-2015 12:21PM

Dubgal72 wrote:

This week I want you all to focus on checking your form when running. This is something you will need to practice so it becomes second nature when the going gets tough on DCM day...It's very easy to switch off, especially on long runs. So when out this week look for:

I did 10 mile yesterday and my shoulders are a bit stiff today, I zoned out for a while and then copped that I was doing odd circular motions with my arms. I'm only guessing that that's the cause. I suppose when we really up the distances posture/form is going to be seriously important.

slingerz · 08-06-2015 12:55PM

RonanP77 wrote: »

I did 10 mile yesterday and my shoulders are a bit stiff today, I zoned out for a while and then copped that I was doing odd circular motions with my arms. I'm only guessing that that's the cause. I suppose when we really up the distances posture/form is going to be seriously important.

when i did my first half marathon a couple years back i hadnt much training done and noticed around mile 11 that my shoulders were tired and aching so much so that i found myself running along with my arms limp just trying to get some relief. I imagine its something that will improve with more training and more time on your feet running really

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 01:23PM

slingerz wrote: »

when i did my first half marathon a couple years back i hadnt much training done and noticed around mile 11 that my shoulders were tired and aching so much so that i found myself running along with my arms limp just trying to get some relief. I imagine its something that will improve with more training and more time on your feet running really

Yes, arm shaking/shoulder dropping is something you will see quite frequently in more experienced athletes when they are attempting to relax and/or recover between intervals or hard efforts.
The relaxed jaw is pretty important here. Try raising and tensing your shoulders. It's very hard to relax your jaw and tense your shoulders and vice versa. Keep your jaw relaxed and the relaxation should follow all the way down your torso. When you're tired/zoning out/straining and increasing effort it is very easy to tense up so focus on relaxing from the jaw down (jaw, shoulders, elbows, thumbs, hips, ankle)

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 01:25PM

Brian_Dart wrote: »

Don't know if this would be of any help to anyone, but I read an article on Runnersworld at the weekend, called "running-air-breathing-technique", about changing your breathing technique when running and how it can help prevent some injuries, it was pretty interesting.

Don't suppose you can link to this please?

Dubgal72 · 08-06-2015 01:27PM

Clearlier wrote: »

Keep the sessions/long run. Move things around so that you drop an easy day. As a general rule just drop the run, don't bump up other runs. One missed run won't have any serious impact on your fitness.

+1 to this, the long runs and sessions are your building blocks.

KingMambo26 · 08-06-2015 01:44PM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Don't suppose you can link to this please?

Here

http://www.runnersworld.com/running-tips/running-air-breathing-technique

Brian_Dart · 08-06-2015 03:17PM

Thanks KingMambo26. I wasnt allowed to add the link in my post for some reason.

Mrs Mc · 08-06-2015 06:44PM

Dubgal72 wrote: »

Hi Mrs Mc fingers crossed for you. Disclaimer: I am not giving medical advice but heel drops are miracle workers for my Achilles and calves, have you been recommended these for your niggle?

I got dry needles on my calf some stretches to do on my calves as that's what is causing the niggles and then she recommended a sorbothane in sole for both my runners which I have been easing in this week. Started spending a bit more time on stretching after my runs. Hopefully this will sort it out.

mobfromcork · 08-06-2015 08:24PM

Some good reading in the last few pages and good points about running form and the breathing article was interesting. Good week of running for me and the knee injury seems to be doing ok. I read up a lot more about pacing over the last few weeks based on recommendations on this thread and I have being running far too fast in most training runs over the past 6-8 months. Based on my most recent race (half marathon in February) I should only be running at a 9.07 minutes per mile for my easy runs or 5.40 minutes per km. I was generally running my easy runs at around 5.00 minutes per km and long runs at around 5.15 - 5.20 minutes per km on average.

This week I slowed down a bit. I did last week's LSR on Monday. I was in Ardmore for the weekend and did runs on both mornings as it was so nice. Took the second morning really easy and enjoyed the views and sunshine. Probably a bit much in one week for this stage but really enjoyed running somewhere different, especially next to the sea which makes a big change from my city/park routes.

Monday 9.5 miles @ 8.31 minute per mile average pace. 1hr 21
Wednesday 3.1 miles @ 8.30 minute per mile average pace
Thursday 7.2 miles @ 8.32 minute per mile average pace - this included 5 x 15 second strides
Saturday 9.83 miles @ 8.30 minute per mile average pace
Sunday 8.66 miles @ 8.46 minute per mile? average pace.

Total mileage - 38.3 miles

I am also trying to make the changeover to measuring in miles rather than km. I now spend most of my runs manipulating fractions.

This week I plan to do two easy 3 or 4 mile runs and one faster 6 mile session session in between. Will go for around 10-11 miles this weekend for my LSR. I have been reading about the VDOT values which were linked to earlier in the thread and have treated myself to a new Garmin Forerunner with a HRM during the week. A friend kindly lent me his watch for a few months but I took the plunge myself last week. I'm going to stick on the HRM for the runs this week to see what shape my ticker is in during and after my running.

I got a heart rate app from Runtastic which measures your heart rate using the camera flash light on your phone. I have been using it on and off for a few months, mainly for resting heart rate. My HR during the middle of the day at work etc is usually between 48-55 bpm. Mornings are around 43- 47 bpm. I didn't use the app during or after running as it's a bit unwieldy to use when moving but hopefully the Garmin HRM will give me that information now. It'll be interesting to see how my HR corresponds to my current pacing for both easy and faster runs.

Hope everyone's training is going well. Looking forward to starting the plan in a few weeks,

Mob

denis b · 08-06-2015 08:41PM

Back in the saddle again. Did something not so good to my back 9 days ago out of the blue. Rested and followed physio advice and managed a very comfortable 5km run this morning.

On reflection I think that I definitely over-trained for Belfast. I used my down week and bought and read Advanced Marathoning. I think that too many of my sessions were run too quickly as I was feeling so good initially. I was constantly feeling quite cold and was sleeping very very poorly for a combination of reasons. That was probably my undoing. I also got hit with 3 low grade chest colds/sinus type infections over the 18 weeks. There is every likelihood that these events were linked and that I got gradually worn down. That seemed to increase my resolve to work harder for the next session and so on...

Have rested and now appreciate that it is an integral part of training and I will just continue to build up mileage slowly to match my initial plan needs. I cannot recommend the Kinetica Revolution 30 day challenge enough so thanks for the heads up on that folks. Balance, core, flexibility, form and strength are all improving.

The LSR issue: I was following the Hal Higdon Intermediate and was running the LSR way too fast following a MP run the previous day. I think that, along with the above, just proved to be too much. Not surprised but hey you live and learn.

DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

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