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DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

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  • #392
    Clearlier
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,454 ✭✭✭Clearlier


    chrislad wrote: »
    Heh, badly worded. I meant that you should only increase by 10% a week versus the previous week. Obviously 100 miles per week is probably high enough :D

    I was giving numbers where the increase was 10% per week! It's surprising just how big an increase 10% is. IMO 10% per week is very aggressive - perhaps appropriate for a beginner building up from a very low base but not for even mid-mileage runners. Alberto Salazar (coach to Mo Farah) has talked about a maximum increase of 10% per month in a mileage building phase and that seems about right for high mileage runners. Perhaps you could do it every second week for somebody who is still finding their level of training easy to handle.


  • #393
    nop98
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭nop98


    bickymary wrote: »
    New 10K PB (WMM 2015) = 1:01:28 :)

    Decided I am going to do a half marathon Aug/Sept time to prepare for DCM so going to start training for that- starting this week.

    Congrats on the PB!!

    Consider doing the Race Series! There's a 10M in August and HM in September. Both are in the Phoenix Park and are well organized and have 1000s of runners. I did both last year, and LOVED them.

    The boards plan actually has these two races built in - you can't go wrong!


  • #394
    bickymary
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8 ✭bickymary


    nop98 wrote: »
    Congrats on the PB!!

    Consider doing the Race Series! There's a 10M in August and HM in September. Both are in the Phoenix Park and are well organized and have 1000s of runners. I did both last year, and LOVED them.

    The boards plan actually has these two races built in - you can't go wrong!

    Thanks, nop98!

    I would love to do the race series but I live in the west so don't know how possible it would be!


  • #395
    PJD
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 232 ✭✭PJD


    1.What is your athletics background? Have you run before? What other sports have you taken part in and at what level?

    I have always trained and cycled for general fitness, but during 2014 I began to run home from work- (Run Commute) and take part in St Anne's Parkrun. All recreational. Not competitive at all. Im a plodder not a fighter.

    2.Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)

    No races but my best 5km Parkrun is 22.57 in March this year. I have not done a competitive 10km but my Run Commute is that distance and the best time is 56.09 (note this is running home and includes stops at ped crossings and running with a backpack). I recently upped my kms and have a Sunday training run half marathon time of 2.10 which I did in April this year. I am signed up for the Event Series including the marathon so hope to refine some of these times by October.

    3.Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? (No problem if you do)

    No breaks, but recently got advice from an ultra running friend who told me told me to run faster for 9 mins and walk 1 min- Therefore increasing turnover.... He stated slow plodding wont help me?? I like plodding and feel that if I stop, I wont re-start..... Bit confused now as I thought I was doing well.....

    4.How much training do you currently do incl cross training? Distances, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.

    Currently I cycle to and from work twice per week. Two Run Commutes (public transport in - run home). A rest day. Parkrun on Saturday and either a long run or long cycle on Sunday.

    5.How many days a week do you run only?

    Three or four going by the above- 2 x 10km run commutes. 1x 5km Parkrun and a long run every second week.

    6.What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?

    The marathon is in response to my mid life crisis aged 42! I hope to complete it in 4.30 which means 6.24mins per km..... If this goes askew I really hope to finish under 5 hours.

    7.What marathon programme are you following/intending to use?

    This one! Obviously!... Have looked at Hal Higdon, Runners World, McMillan etc but any programme really has to fit with my Run Commute and Parkrun.


  • #396
    nop98
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭nop98


    bickymary wrote: »
    Thanks, nop98!

    I would love to do the race series but I live in the west so don't know how possible it would be!

    I guess I should have paid attention to: "Location: Sligo" ... :D Good luck finding an alternative, it will help with your preparation, no doubt.


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  • #397
    diego_b
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,383 ✭✭✭diego_b


    Any thoughts on training whilst suffering from a head cold/minor illnesses, nothing major but curious to see the thoughts on whether it's best to ease back for a few days rather than miss sessions....or is it best to go on how you truly feel?


  • #398
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I'm almost certain that every one of the race series days last year, there was a similar race in or around Sligo. I'll have a dig around, preetttty sure. Uh huh.


  • #399
    KingMambo26
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91 ✭✭KingMambo26


    diego_b wrote: »
    Any thoughts on training whilst suffering from a head cold/minor illnesses, nothing major but curious to see the thoughts on whether it's best to ease back for a few days rather than miss sessions....or is it best to go on how you truly feel?

    It may be a personal thing but I find running clears my sinuses specially when I have a head cold. Snot tash any one? :p

    Flu and stomach problems is a completely different issue though and I'd rather rest.


  • #400
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    diego_b wrote: »
    Any thoughts on training whilst suffering from a head cold/minor illnesses, nothing major but curious to see the thoughts on whether it's best to ease back for a few days rather than miss sessions....or is it best to go on how you truly feel?

    Tried and tested adage: above the throat, use common sense and listen to your body, below the throat: don't run, full stop.
    If you run with congestion in the chest it can very quickly morph into something more serious. (Usual disclaimers apply here :rolleyes: )


  • #401
    adrian522
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 16,357 Mod ✭✭✭✭adrian522


    I think the sensible thing to do is to rest while you are unwell and get back into training when you are back to 100%. Too many people seem to train through their illness and it seems to prolong things. Also you never train as well when you are ill as when you are 100% healthy.

    As above if it is really just a minor sniffles sort of cold you can probably get away with some easy running.


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  • #402
    spaceylou
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,451 ✭✭✭spaceylou


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Tried and tested adage: above the throat, use common sense and listen to your body, below the throat: don't run, full stop.
    If you run with congestion in the chest it can very quickly morph into something more serious. (Usual disclaimers apply here :rolleyes: )

    What about in the throat?* Totally agree with you about not running with any kind of cold on chest, and if not feeling too sorry for myself an easy run with blocked nose is doable but how precise is this above the throat /below the throat line? I.E. I have a sore throat

    *apologies for hijack seen as I have no intention of running DCM15 but do plan on following all you crazy brave folk


  • #403
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    spaceylou wrote: »
    What about in the throat?* Totally agree with you about not running with any kind of cold on chest, and if not feeling too sorry for myself an easy run with blocked nose is doable but how precise is this above the throat /below the throat line? I.E. I have a sore throat

    *apologies for hijack seen as I have no intention of running DCM15 but do plan on following all you crazy brave folk

    Haha no worries. Again, disclaimer etc but I have found that it depends on the type of cough... A dry or tickly cough can be ok but anything that thickens up (yeurgh) is usually moving down and should be watched. Sorry for not being more scientific, I'm only going from personal experience :o
    I imagine that people can generally tell what kind of throat lurgy they have and therefore where it seems to be going to (away or chest)?
    Resting heart rate is also a good indicator, all you Novices-to-be-Heroes should know your RHR. An elevated RHR doesn't mean you 'down tools', it's just another indicator of how you are along with temperature etc.


  • #404
    diego_b
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,383 ✭✭✭diego_b


    Thanks for that, head cold for me today so will take it easy tonight with circuits.
    Tomorrow is a rest day so hopefully it will pass and get back into it towards the end of the week.

    RHR....resting heart rate I take it, lying down it appears in the late 50's and sitting up it's in the late 60's so it seems for me.
    Do you put much merit into heart rate training? I try to monitor my pace using the monitor I have but a lot of my runs according to heart rate are possibly slightly too fast. My 10K pace is 8min/mi approx, I've ran half marathons without training specifically for them as I'm going to do with DCM so I'm not focusing on pace at the moment, just do the prescribed miles and see where things go.
    Easy runs I thought for me are 9:30-10min/mil but my HR monitor can sometimes class them as tempo runs...I think the severe wind/rain yesterday meant an easy 3mile took more effort than normal.


  • #405
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    diego_b wrote: »
    Thanks for that, head cold for me today so will take it easy tonight with circuits.
    Tomorrow is a rest day so hopefully it will pass and get back into it towards the end of the week.

    RHR....resting heart rate I take it, lying down it appears in the late 50's and sitting up it's in the late 60's so it seems for me.
    Do you put much merit into heart rate training? I try to monitor my pace using the monitor I have but a lot of my runs according to heart rate are possibly slightly too fast. My 10K pace is 8min/mi approx, I've ran half marathons without training specifically for them as I'm going to do with DCM so I'm not focusing on pace at the moment, just do the prescribed miles and see where things go.
    Easy runs I thought for me are 9:30-10min/mil but my HR monitor can sometimes class them as tempo runs...I think the severe wind/rain yesterday meant an easy 3mile took more effort than normal.
    Really quick reply, I'll dig out more links later but if anyone can link to clearlier's HRM testing on the graduates thread, that would be helpful too...
    This is interesting:
    http://www.runnersworld.com/race-training/heart-rate-monitor-how-tos


  • #406
    Myles Splitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭Myles Splitz


    diego_b wrote: »
    Thanks for that, head cold for me today so will take it easy tonight with circuits.
    Tomorrow is a rest day so hopefully it will pass and get back into it towards the end of the week.

    RHR....resting heart rate I take it, lying down it appears in the late 50's and sitting up it's in the late 60's so it seems for me.
    Do you put much merit into heart rate training? I try to monitor my pace using the monitor I have but a lot of my runs according to heart rate are possibly slightly too fast. My 10K pace is 8min/mi approx, I've ran half marathons without training specifically for them as I'm going to do with DCM so I'm not focusing on pace at the moment, just do the prescribed miles and see where things go.
    Easy runs I thought for me are 9:30-10min/mil but my HR monitor can sometimes class them as tempo runs...I think the severe wind/rain yesterday meant an easy 3mile took more effort than normal.

    Heart Rate training can be very useful but there are a few caveats.

    How HR is measured? - You need to establish you normal resting heart rate as well as maximum heart rate (not just the usual generic formula's as they are general guideline and while they might work for 70% of people you may have some underlying variant which excludes you from this (health, occupation, etc).
    If you are getting tested you have to also make sure that you are tested under near ideal conditions (well rested etc) for more accurate readings.

    Training at HR - There are so many things which can affect your HR from weather,sleep, hydration, occupation, stress levels, underlying illness, underlying health issues, alcohol/ drug consumption. Taking into account all these factors which can elevate base HR it's no wonder why paces don't always correlate with HR.

    Despite all these factors many people generally experience the same situation whereby at first they find they are running at slightly higher than expected intensities. Normally this feels easy due to a case of mental conditioning more so than physiological adaptation.

    (Sorry for the long winded answer)

    The Concise Version: Yes HR training is useful if done properly.


  • #407
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I have a pain in my face with HR training at the moment. All my runs are done by HR at the moment. I'm driven demented because my HR is so so high and so my runs are so so slow. I'll stick with it though, hopefully it'll pay off.

    I've just bought a garmin vivosmart, and I'm going to keep an eye on my HR fluctuations throughout the day too. Will see if that tells me anything!


  • #408
    Clearlier
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,454 ✭✭✭Clearlier


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Really quick reply, I'll dig out more links later but if anyone can link to clearlier's HRM testing on the graduates thread, that would be helpful too...
    This is interesting:
    http://www.runnersworld.com/race-training/heart-rate-monitor-how-tos

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=93034087&postcount=129

    N.B. These were a few ideas on how to get a max heart rate reading. As I said in the post the most important thing was not to work off too high a number.


  • #409
    Myles Splitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭Myles Splitz


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I have a pain in my face with HR training at the moment. All my runs are done by HR at the moment. I'm driven demented because my HR is so so high and so my runs are so so slow. I'll stick with it though, hopefully it'll pay off.

    I've just bought a garmin vivosmart, and I'm going to keep an eye on my HR fluctuations throughout the day too. Will see if that tells me anything!

    Weather at the moment will be a factor on that, wind as well as the down pours can mean the body is often fighting off infection but the heart has to work in order to pump blood (and white blood cells) around the body in order to fight these infections around the body.


  • #410
    chrislad
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,324 ✭✭✭chrislad


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I have a pain in my face with HR training at the moment. All my runs are done by HR at the moment. I'm driven demented because my HR is so so high and so my runs are so so slow. I'll stick with it though, hopefully it'll pay off.

    I've just bought a garmin vivosmart, and I'm going to keep an eye on my HR fluctuations throughout the day too. Will see if that tells me anything!

    Little things can push your heart rate up though! I did a nice 6 mile at the weekend. Felt very comfortable throughout, but due to new shoes, blistered a bit on my two arches. My suffer score (a Strava thing) was massive even though I felt great during and after.


  • #411
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Ok last question for a while I promise!!

    I get this weird taste/smell of gas after I run. It's kind of suffocating. That probably sounds weird. I can't explain it properly :o

    Anyone else have any idea what I'm on about?


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  • #412
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ok last question for a while I promise!!

    I get this weird taste/smell of gas after I run. It's kind of suffocating. That probably sounds weird. I can't explain it properly :o

    Anyone else have any idea what I'm on about?

    Yup, that's a weird one. Put it on the Random Running Questions and see what comes up there....


  • #413
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Oh good idea!


  • #414
    Myles Splitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭Myles Splitz


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ok last question for a while I promise!!

    I get this weird taste/smell of gas after I run. It's kind of suffocating. That probably sounds weird. I can't explain it properly :o

    Anyone else have any idea what I'm on about?

    What is your diet like? Would you eat many eggs?


  • #415
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Myles Splitz wrote: »
    What is your diet like? Would you eat many eggs?

    Eggs are most definitely a staple!

    Is it phosphorous I'm tasting? It's not just a taste, more a smell, a smell that I can also taste :pac:


  • #416
    Myles Splitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭Myles Splitz


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Eggs are most definitely a staple!

    Is it phosphorous I'm tasting? It's not just a taste, more a smell, a smell that I can also taste :pac:

    I am going to guess generally your diet would be relatively low carbohydrate or high protein?

    Without knowing the background my first thought's would be protein metabolism during your runs. If this is happening regularly I would probably take a look at the overall diet to see whether or not you are getting in enough carbohydrates.


  • #417
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Yep, generally a lowish carb, higher fat/protein diet. It happens quite regularly, any runs where I sweat pretty much!!

    Edit; I don't completely cut carbs or anything like that, but I don't eat too too many of them. I would eat quinoa at lunch say, and loooooads of fruit and veg, chick peas, kidney beans too!


  • #418
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    spider77 wrote: »
    What is your athletics background? Have you run before? What other sports have you taken part in and at what level? Started running in 2012. Been surfing for 8 years. Cycle a bit. Do weights training a bit too.


    Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!) 10k 47 ish mins, HM 1:47 in cork 2013, full 3:55 Limerick 2014


    Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? (No problem if you do) no


    How much training do you currently do incl cross training? Distances, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level. Have not run much recently due to injury. Back now at it. Will do 3 mid week runs and a long at wknd. Was doing weights a lot recently. Cycle and surf for cross training.


    How many days a week do you run only?
    4 when training

    What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time? Just finish number 1, if all goes ok would like to improve on my Limerick time but no big deal if I don't.


    What marathon programme are you following/intending to use? Followed Hal higdon one for Limerick so will go with that again.
    Hi spider77 welcome to the thread! You seem like you might be a little behind for jumping in to the plan on the 22nd but nothing to be too concerned about: just be cautious building the amount of your running days up for now. Which Hal Higdon are you thinking of, the N1 or N2?


  • #419
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    cailineile wrote: »
    Ok just read the first four pages and was undecided would I enter the sse race series. The posts have ,ade up my mind. First thing I will do when I get into work in the morning. Will fill out the questions then too. I know it's late and I think I'm mad but why not. The worst thing that can happen is that I will question my sanity. But I do that regularly so nothing new there. bring it on.

    Jump in :D


  • #420
    Dubgal72
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    bickymary wrote: »
    New 10K PB (WMM 2015) = 1:01:28 :)

    Decided I am going to do a half marathon Aug/Sept time to prepare for DCM so going to start training for that- starting this week.

    Well done! It was a foul day too. Let us know when you decide which HM and we can help you tweak your schedule if necessary. A HM at this time is ideal for marathon training and be incorporated into your marathon schedule as nop98 suggested :)


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  • #421
    Myles Splitz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,306 ✭✭✭Myles Splitz


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Yep, generally a lowish carb, higher fat/protein diet. It happens quite regularly, any runs where I sweat pretty much!!

    Edit; I don't completely cut carbs or anything like that, but I don't eat too too many of them. I would eat quinoa at lunch say, and loooooads of fruit and veg, chick peas, kidney beans too!

    :)

    Sounds like I may be on the right track with assumption so.

    The smell you are getting is Ammonia which will be excreted via your respiratory system as well as your sweat glands.

    It's usually an indication of not enough carbs and your body not being able to burn fat efficiently as an alternative. Solution is simply, consume more carbs. If you are worried about it from a weight perspective consult a sports nutritionist/ dietician.

    Long term during your marathon training till will actually aid recovery you are not losing muscle mass from exercise.


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