Same Sex Marriage Referendum Mega Thread - MOD WARNING IN FIRST POST

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 04:13PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

I'm very clear that no-one has given me a reason to vote for this proposition.Well, what I'm trying to find out is if it is relevantWell, I'm clear about what I'm interested in, which is what a putative yes vote entails.

And I do find the reluctance ye have in addressing the point interesting.

What reluctance?

It's totally irrelevant so no one cares about it. It's just you desperately trying to find some other reason to pretend is good enough to vote no because of.

You're talking utter nonsense over multiple threads for weeks at this stage. No one valid point raised. It's boring.

Ave Sodalis · 10-05-2015 04:14PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

I'm very clear that no-one has given me a reason to vote for this proposition.

May possibly be due to the fact you've repeatedly demonstrated that you don't actually care what the reasons for voting yes are, or for the refutation of your points.

GCU Flexible Demeanour · 10-05-2015 04:19PM

Not a NSA agent wrote: »

You mistake reluctance for suspicion.

feel free to point out somewhere I didn't address the point.

So you doubt that there's the differences between civil partnership and marriage matter?

MrWalsh wrote: »

What reluctance?

It's totally irrelevant so no one cares about it. It's just you desperately trying to find some other reason to pretend is good enough to vote no because of.

You're talking utter nonsense over multiple threads for weeks at this stage. No one valid point raised. It's boring.

sup_dude wrote: »

May possibly be due to the fact you've repeatedly demonstrated that you don't actually care what the reasons for voting yes are, or for the refutation of your points.

It's more revealing that Yes voters don't want to defend their own material.

If that changes, do let me know.

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 04:20PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

So you doubt that there's the differences between civil partnership and marriage matter?It's more revealing that Yes voters don't want to defend their own material.

If that changes, do let me know.

GCU you've been given the answer. You're just trolling now.

Ave Sodalis · 10-05-2015 04:22PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

It's more revealing that Yes voters don't want to defend their own material.

If that changes, do let me know.

Okay, this will be my last post on this point. There is absolutely no point to replying to your posts because you refuse to actually acknowledge their point. It's not that we don't want to defend it, it's that you don't care whether or not they're defended but pretend you do to prove some unknown point. However, to do this, you have to twist words.

GCU Flexible Demeanour · 10-05-2015 04:24PM

MrWalsh wrote: »

GCU you've been given the answer. You're just trolling now.

No answer has been given. And you are refusing to defend the material supplied by Yes voters.

But I agree there's no point in pursuing this, once we've established yes voters simply don't want to admit they cannot defend the point.

eviltwin · 10-05-2015 04:27PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

No answer has been given. And you are refusing to defend the material supplied by Yes voters.

But I agree there's no point in pursuing this, once we've established yes voters simply don't want to admit they cannot defend the point.

The differences are small and probably don't make much of an impact in the day to day life of a gay couple but is that really the point anymore?

One eyed Jack · 10-05-2015 04:28PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

I'm very clear that no-one has given me a reason to vote for this proposition.

You've been given plenty of reasons to vote in favour of the proposed referendum. You simply choose to dismiss those reasons as irrelevant.

Well, what I'm trying to find out is if it is relevant

Of course it's relevant, because it shows the differences between Civil Partnership, and Civil Marriage.

Well, I'm clear about what I'm interested in, which is what a putative yes vote entails.

It's very clear that you're not interested in what a yes vote entails, because you've dismissed as irrelevant all the reasons for a putative yes vote. Any issue you take with any of the differences on that page are already applicable to Civil Marriage, that's the whole point of everyone being treated as equal by the State.

And I do find the reluctance ye have in addressing the point interesting.

Across numerous threads you have refused to acknowledge the benefits of the proposed referendum to everyone in society, and you now find it "interesting" that people just couldn't be arsed entertaining you?

I can't really say I'm surprised myself. You simply seem to enjoy winding people up for your own amusement.

GCU Flexible Demeanour · 10-05-2015 04:30PM

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Across numerous threads you have refused to acknowledge the benefits of the proposed referendum to everyone in society, and you now find it "interesting" that people just couldn't be arsed entertaining you?

As I said, interesting that they won't defend their own material.

Why are you dragging this out?

osarusan · 10-05-2015 04:34PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

So you doubt that there's the differences between civil partnership and marriage matter?

.

It is your disingenuous posting, typified by this piss poor strawman argument, that makes posters think there is no point in engaging with you.

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 04:34PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

As I said, interesting that they won't defend their own material.

Why are you dragging this out?

It's already been answered. Saudi Arabia. Women drivers. Fallacious logic by you.

Smiley92a · 10-05-2015 04:41PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

As I said, interesting that they won't defend their own material.

Why are you dragging this out?

You know, last night I was afraid for a moment I might have unfairly said you were totally ignoring every yes argument and only playing at being reasonable.

I'm glad to see I was right the first time.

Not a NSA agent · 10-05-2015 04:45PM

GCU Flexible Demeanour wrote: »

So you doubt that there's the differences between civil partnership and marriage matter?It's more revealing that Yes voters don't want to defend their own material.

If that changes, do let me know.

there we go. Trying to make up things that were said. Shall I create a flow chart explaining when to use the list?

Gay people can't marry their partners. Civil partnership is not marriage. There are differences between the 2. The list exists to point out that civil partnerships are not the same to marriage. The fact that gay people can't marry their partner would be an issue if there was no difference between the 2 or if civil partnership never existed.

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 04:47PM

Not a NSA agent wrote: »

there we go. Trying to make up things that were said. Shall I create a flow chart explaining when to use the list?

Gay people can't marry their partners. Civil partnership is not marriage. There are differences between the 2. The list exists to point out that civil partnerships are not the same to marriage. The fact that gay people can't marry their partner would be an issue if there was no difference between the 2 or if civil partnership never existed.

It's better to report the trolling. You're just being wound up. We all are.

Blogatron52 · 10-05-2015 04:52PM

What's likely to happen if the No vote wins? :-|

Not a NSA agent · 10-05-2015 04:56PM

MrWalsh wrote: »

It's better to report the trolling. You're just being wound up. We all are.

Oh I doubt anyone think's he is serious. Better to show him for what he is than let him continue posting pages of crap about how people will die or something.

Blogatron52 wrote: »

What's likely to happen if the No vote wins? :-|

We'll have this vote again in a few years or when the EU make it a standard. Until that point any couples adopting will have to adopt as a cohabiting couple or civil partnership to the dismay of people who voted no.

Blogatron52 · 10-05-2015 05:22PM

Not a NSA agent wrote: »

We'll have this vote again in a few years or when the EU make it a standard. Until that point any couples adopting will have to adopt as a cohabiting couple or civil partnership to the dismay of people who voted no.

Just chatting to my friends who were away for the weekend and said they saw mainly 'no' posters outside of the cities. They've a few sad stories too about things they've heard.

It's kind of hitting home now that outside of my bubble of yes.. There is a lot of 'no' and 'don't know so will vote no'?!

In terms of how we're seen globally..will there be any affect? Also, does a certain time have to pass before another referendum can be held on the same topic ?

Zubeneschamali · 10-05-2015 05:25PM

MrWalsh wrote: »

You're talking utter nonsense over multiple threads for weeks at this stage.

The GCU was over in the Iona vs. Panti thread more than a year ago, wondering why this issue was worthy of a referendum, and whatabout all sorts of other issues.

Not actually arguing for a No vote, just for no vote on this particular subject at this time, as they say.

Zubeneschamali · 10-05-2015 05:33PM

Blogatron52 wrote: »

Also, does a certain time have to pass before another referendum can be held on the same topic ?

We reran Nice and Lisbon after just a year and a half.

But we had 10 years between divorce referendums, and it only squeaked through second time.

I think this one is more like Divorce than like Nice or Lisbon - if the Caveman Catholic vote is still high enough to reject this, we'll just have to wait a few years for some of them to die off before rerunning it.

Not a NSA agent · 10-05-2015 06:04PM

Blogatron52 wrote: »

Just chatting to my friends who were away for the weekend and said they saw mainly 'no' posters outside of the cities. They've a few sad stories too about things they've heard.

It's kind of hitting home now that outside of my bubble of yes.. There is a lot of 'no' and 'don't know so will vote no'?!

In terms of how we're seen globally..will there be any affect? Also, does a certain time have to pass before another referendum can be held on the same topic ?

Globally there will be somone who view us negatively no matter what the result is. Either will will be seen as religious conservative and against gay people or we have been taken over by the liberals and gay agenda.

I would guess 5-10 years before another vote although it has been within 2 years before.

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 06:05PM

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

We reran Nice and Lisbon after just a year and a half.

But we had 10 years between divorce referendums, and it only squeaked through second time.

I think this one is more like Divorce than like Nice or Lisbon - if the Caveman Catholic vote is still high enough to reject this, we'll just have to wait a few years for some of them to die off before rerunning it.

What I always find bizarre about the divorce referendum is how it barely squeaked through yet there were not massive lobby groups afterwards to get rid of it.

They made SO much noise to not let it in, but then just disappeared off the face of the earth.

I suspect this will go the same way.

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 06:09PM

Not a NSA agent wrote: »

I would guess 5-10 years before another vote although it has been within 2 years before.

I agree. I also think a No vote will have a terrible effect on any movement towards an abortion referendum. As well as making Ireland look like a backwards religious society in the eyes of the world. Not that that really matters to me, I remember when working in America on my J1 visa I was viewed with fascination by Americans when I told them there was no abortion, no divorce and contraception had only recently been legalised. Backwards and in a stranglehold by the Church.

But it won't go away. It will be legal in my lifetime

Not a NSA agent · 10-05-2015 06:09PM

MrWalsh wrote: »

What I always find bizarre about the divorce referendum is how it barely squeaked through yet there were not massive lobby groups afterwards to get rid of it.

They made SO much noise to not let it in, but then just disappeared off the face of the earth.

I suspect this will go the same way.

Im sure some of them who write for newspapers will have a piece about how they are now being oppressed and that doom will befall it all.

Then they can get on with their lives.

Nodin · 10-05-2015 06:41PM

Smiley92a wrote: »

You know, last night I was afraid for a moment I might have unfairly said you were totally ignoring every yes argument and only playing at being reasonable.

I'm glad to see I was right the first time.

Yep.

lazygal · 10-05-2015 06:49PM

Blogatron52 wrote: »

What's likely to happen if the No vote wins? :-|

Well we've considered moving abroad whIle our children are young because of the ridiculous patronage system in education which allows schools to discriminate and treat our children badly when in school. A no vote will really make us reconsider staying in a country where people didn't think gay people deserve equal rights and whether we want our children growing up here. The current abortion law makes me queasy and unsure about having another child here.

gladrags · 10-05-2015 06:56PM

For what its worth,I am voting yes.

I can understand arguements on both sides,I am not sure that it is a simple yes/no issue.

But I feel that the marriage of two people,has if's and but's no matter what way you look at it.

Who am I to say no,to other peoples choices.

Good luck all.

Smiley92a · 10-05-2015 06:59PM

MrWalsh wrote: »

What I always find bizarre about the divorce referendum is how it barely squeaked through yet there were not massive lobby groups afterwards to get rid of it.

They made SO much noise to not let it in, but then just disappeared off the face of the earth.

I suspect this will go the same way.

Makes me think of the time I read up on the defence of prop 8 in California. A lot of the same arguements being used by the no side were deployed there, and they got taken apart because when a judge asks you to explain how gays marrying will harm hetro marriage, you have to answer.

I'd say something similar happened with divorce, the stupid arguments that nearly killed it would have been destroyed in court.

We really need stricter regulation of what you can say when you're campaigning in referendums. I mean, are you allowed to outright lie? Because they have.

10-05-2015 06:59PM

lazygal wrote: »

Well we've considered moving abroad whIle our children are young because of the ridiculous patronage system in education which allows schools to discriminate and treat our children badly when in school. A no vote will really make us reconsider staying in a country where people didn't think gay people deserve equal rights and whether we want our children growing up here. The current abortion law makes me queasy and unsure about having another child here.

Jaysus, moving abroad? I have to say that I'd consider it a very real setback if the No side prevailed, but I think abandoning the place would be a bit much.

Mind you, I lived here when Ireland was a hell of a lot more conservative than it is now, so maybe I've a bit of a "rose-tinted glasses" view of the place.

MrWalsh · 10-05-2015 07:07PM

Smiley92a wrote: »

We really need stricter regulation of what you can say when you're campaigning in referendums. I mean, are you allowed to outright lie? Because they have.

+1

Outright lies and misleading unconnected nonsense.

There's a huge amount of it here on boards.ie, woodpecker style repetition of completely unrelated issues.

lazygal · 10-05-2015 07:42PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Jaysus, moving abroad? I have to say that I'd consider it a very real setback if the No side prevailed, but I think abandoning the place would be a bit much.

Mind you, I lived here when Ireland was a hell of a lot more conservative than it is now, so maybe I've a bit of a "rose-tinted glasses" view of the place.

We'd simply add it to how we feel about Ireland and raising and educating young children here. Right now, as parents raising children without religion, the education system and its dominance by religious orders is a huge concern to us. Having schools teaching that gay marriage isn't right or indeed that being gay is a disorder isn't a system we want our children educated by. If my children are gay I don't want to have to put their education against religious run schools.

Same Sex Marriage Referendum Mega Thread - MOD WARNING IN FIRST POST

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