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How will you vote in the Marriage Equality referendum? Mod Note Post 1

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Comments

  • #8432
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,007 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    frostyjacks wrote: »
    If it can't be proved or disproved, what right do people have to call the No side liars?

    1 The referndum is not about cbhildren yet they persist in the lie that it is.

    2 Mother and Fathers matter have been proven to have lied and misrepresent the facts and findings of a UNICEF study

    3 The lie that there is no difference between marriage and civil partnership when there are distinctly 160 differences also if there was no difference why are they so determined to not allow SSM?


  • #8433
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    munchkin_utd wrote: »
    I'd actually argue completely the opposite.

    Marriage, the word and the meaning of it is 100% about children.
    It's possibily the greatest reason to vote yes, as the rights of children in many laws are linked to the word "married" and their parents being married. Kids of "same sex unions" are being discriminated against by not being the child of a "marraige".

    So, the rights of gay people are actually not going to be increased all that much by the vote, but kids of gay people will be much better off.
    (now, a referendum to change the constitution is not the ideal way to do this, but heck, it's what's on the table so that's what's being voted on)


    That doesn't really account for those who don't want children but still want to get married though.


  • #8434
    Not a NSA agent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 781 ✭✭✭Not a NSA agent


    frostyjacks wrote: »
    If it can't be proved or disproved, what right do people have to call the No side liars?

    If it can't be proved or disproved then how can someone claim it is true?


  • #8435
    jimdublin15
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 244 ✭✭jimdublin15


    jimdublin15 wrote: »
    Perhaps indirectly it is about the children, making sure we have established a sociality at least in the legal system were they can grow up and have equal opportunity to a civil marriage be they heterosexual or homosexual.

    :-) Wait a moment ..... Can i now put up posters with:

    Vote - Yes for the children
    Vote - Yes for the children rights
    Vote - Yes to protect the children

    lol.

    I apologise, I should not have said that about the posters it make me as silly as the ridiculous vote No posters that are all over the place.


  • #8436
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    munchkin_utd wrote: »
    Marriage, the word and the meaning of it is 100% about children.
    No it's not.
    Marriage, also called matrimony or wedlock, is a socially or ritually recognized union or legal contract between spouses that establishes rights and obligations between them, between them and their children, and between them and their in-laws.

    munchkin_utd wrote: »
    So, the rights of gay people are actually not going to be increased all that much by the vote, but kids of gay people will be much better off.
    Actually the rights of gay people will be be increased. Next of kin, taxation, inheritance etc etc.


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  • #8437
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    Not a NSA agent wrote: »
    If it can't be proved or disproved then how can someone claim it is true?

    They aren't they are stating an opinion


  • #8438
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    The trouble with using stock photography: http://www.irishexaminer.com/examviral/real-life/the-people-on-the-no-posters-are-in-favour-of-marriage-equality-328995.html
    So, there is a Marriage Equality vote in Ireland at the moment, and it has all got pretty heated. Posters like these have been circulated. Unfortunately, the image in the poster is a stock photo - which means anyone can buy it and use it for whatever purpose they so desire.

    As it turns out, the people in this photo are friends of my wife, and are appalled that their faces are being used, without their permission, to promote something they wholeheartedly disagree with. And yet there is nothing they can do about it.


  • #8439
    Not a NSA agent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 781 ✭✭✭Not a NSA agent


    gravehold wrote: »
    They aren't they are stating an opinion

    Where do the posters say this is just their opinion and has no backing?


  • #8440
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    gravehold wrote: »
    They aren't they are stating an opinion

    The referendum is not about children. It is about marriage. Whether gay people make good parents or not is not what the referendum is about. Whether gay people should be able to have children or not is not what the referendum is about. To state otherwise (opinion or not) is false.


  • #8441
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    Not a NSA agent wrote: »
    Where do the posters say this is just their opinion and has no backing?

    They don't need to they don't say they are fact either


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  • #8442
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    sup_dude wrote: »
    The referendum is not about children. It is about marriage. Whether gay people make good parents or not is not what the referendum is about. Whether gay people should be able to have children or not is not what the referendum is about. To state otherwise (opinion or not) is false.

    And the yes side are are saying yes equality but that's not what the referendum is about either cause it's not equality for all consenting adults to marry.


    Polygamous still are not equal after the vote. To state the referendum is about equality is false


  • #8443
    Not a NSA agent
    Closed Accounts Posts: 781 ✭✭✭Not a NSA agent


    gravehold wrote: »
    They don't need to they don't say they are fact either

    "She needs her mother for life, not just for 9 months Vote No"

    Im not seeing anything there to suggest it is an opinion. When it is saying "She needs" it sounds very factual, the groups campaigning claim that children need a mother and father, no mention of its just their opinion.

    Is it not misleading to discuss such "opinions" when these "opinions" have nothing to do with the referendum?


  • #8444
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    gravehold wrote: »
    And the yes side are are saying yes equality but that's not what the referendum is about either cause it's not equality for all consenting adults to marry.


    Polygamous still are not equal after the vote. To state the referendum is about equality is false

    Pologamy is not being voted on.


  • #8445
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    sup_dude wrote: »
    Pologamy is not being voted on.

    Yes so saying the referendum is about equality is a falsehood. As bad as the no posters


  • #8446
    bodice ripper
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,681 ✭✭✭bodice ripper


    Had I known how the No posters would be phrased, I would have gotten a few thousand "somebody needs to tell the heterosexuals" stickers done.


  • #8447
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,007 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    gravehold wrote: »
    Yes so saying the referendum is about equality is a falsehood. As bad as the no posters

    Are people born polygamous then?


  • #8448
    Yeah_Right
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,212 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    smash wrote: »
    The trouble with using stock photography: http://www.irishexaminer.com/examviral/real-life/the-people-on-the-no-posters-are-in-favour-of-marriage-equality-328995.html

    So that would make that poster a lie.


  • #8449
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    gravehold wrote: »
    Yes so saying the referendum is about equality is a falsehood. As bad as the no posters

    So it's not about equality at all? There isn't an equality problem there at all? Just because others may have equality problems, doesn't mean this isn't about equality...

    Also, how on earth is what is calling an equality issue (even if it's not every possible equality issue in existence) an equality issue as bad as what the No side are coming out with?


  • #8450
    ixoy
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 18,045 Mod ✭✭✭✭ixoy


    gravehold wrote: »
    Yes so saying the referendum is about equality is a falsehood. As bad as the no posters
    It's clearly in reference to equality for same sex couples to get married which is directly related to the issue being voted on.
    The No side posters are talking about surrogacy issues, adoption, etc which has nothing to do with the issue being voted on.
    A ridiculous claim to say they're as bad.


  • #8451
    SireOfSeth
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 340 ✭✭SireOfSeth


    gravehold wrote: »
    Yes so saying the referendum is about equality is a falsehood. As bad as the no posters

    Incorrect. Heterosexual couples can get married. Homosexual couples cannot. If the Ref gets passed, both couples can get married. That makes it about equality, as heterosexual and homosexual will be equal.

    Hope that helps.


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  • #8452
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    VinLieger wrote: »
    Are people born polygamous then?

    I Wouldn't know if someone elses sexuality was from birth or a choice, not for me or you to say


  • #8453
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    gravehold wrote: »
    I Wouldn't know if someone elses sexuality was from birth or a choice, not for me or you to say


    Well given your demonstratable level of knowledge on science on this thread, I would struggle to believe what you post on the matter anyway.


  • #8454
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    sup_dude wrote: »
    So it's not about equality at all? There isn't an equality problem there at all? Just because others may have equality problems, doesn't mean this isn't about equality...

    Also, how on earth is what is calling an equality issue (even if it's not every possible equality issue in existence) an equality issue as bad as what the No side are coming out with?

    It's about a marraige referendum, the referendum doesn't give equality to all consenting adults, to have posters saying yes equality for marraige is a falsehood


  • #8455
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    Doctor Jimbob wrote: »
    Science disagrees. Ah but sure that's all just opinion isn't it?

    Science agrees sexuality is a choice? That's not what most people think


  • #8456
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,555 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    gravehold wrote: »
    It's about a marraige referendum, the referendum doesn't give equality to all consenting adults, to have posters saying yes equality for marraige is a falsehood

    Did you read that post you quoted?


  • #8457
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,007 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    gravehold wrote: »
    I Wouldn't know if someone elses sexuality was from birth or a choice, not for me or you to say

    But polygamy definitely is a choice so equating it with something that you personally cannot determine is or is not a choice is disingenous.

    Also sexuality is not a choice


  • #8458
    gravehold
    Closed Accounts Posts: 912 ✭✭✭gravehold


    VinLieger wrote: »
    But polygamy definitely is a choice so equating it with something that you personally cannot determine is or is not a choice is disingenous.

    Why do you get to say it's a choice?


  • #8459
    SireOfSeth
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 340 ✭✭SireOfSeth


    gravehold wrote: »
    It's about a marraige referendum, the referendum doesn't give equality to all consenting adults, to have posters saying yes equality for marraige is a falsehood

    The referendum (if passed) gives equality to all consenting couples. Happy now?


  • #8460
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    gravehold wrote: »
    And the yes side are are saying yes equality but that's not what the referendum is about either cause it's not equality for all consenting adults to marry.

    Polygamous still are not equal after the vote. To state the referendum is about equality is false
    That's such a red herring. The vote is about equality for same sex couples. Not for multi partner polygamous relationships.


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  • #8461
    kylith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,739 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    gravehold wrote: »
    It's about a marraige referendum, the referendum doesn't give equality to all consenting adults, to have posters saying yes equality for marraige is a falsehood

    Because it's not about 'all consenting adults' it's about allowing people to marry 'without regard to their sex'. If you want to start campaigning for polygamous marriages there's nothing stopping you.


This discussion has been closed.
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