How will you vote in the Marriage Equality referendum? Mod Note Post 1

haveringchick · 26-04-2015 02:01PM

shruikan2553 wrote: »

What you are saying is no, you're just basing the whole communist thing on 1 random person.

That's good news anyway. Was getting worried by gay people with Russian accents.

See this is it here. You don't have any way to deal with any even mild criticisms (and God knows im harmless) withour resorting to what amounts to pretty bad attempts at sarcasm.
Is there any other questions you want me to answer?

haveringchick · 26-04-2015 02:02PM

osarusan wrote: »

Earlier in the thread, you said you hadn't been convinced by the Yes argument. That is what you posted.

But you said you are voting No because a person you met suggested a link between LGBT groups and communism. As far as I can see, you seem to be admitting that you don't have any evidence to support this - not from the no side, or from the yes side.

I don't think my post was condescending or patronising at all. You said it was up to the Yes side to persuade people to vote for them - I am trying to persuade you that the reasons you have given for voting No are based on groundless concerns.

Will it make you reconsider how you plan to vote?

No

folamh · 26-04-2015 02:03PM

haveringchick wrote: »

In particular any articles written by people raised by SS couples that don't reflect favorably on the authors experience are scoffed at and dismissed

Can you link such an article or articles and I promise not to comment on them? I'd like to see them for my own purposes.

osarusan · 26-04-2015 02:04PM

haveringchick wrote: »

No

Do you still have faith in your reasons for voting No, even though you don't have any evidence to support them?

shruikan2553 · 26-04-2015 02:05PM

haveringchick wrote: »

See this is it here. You don't have any way to deal with any even mild criticisms (and God knows im harmless) withour resorting to what amounts to pretty bad attempts at sarcasm.
Is there any other questions you want me to answer?

I wouldn't consider your conspiracy theory as criticism.

For someone who was commenting on not being convinced you are easily convinced.

walkingshadow · 26-04-2015 02:07PM

I was delighted to see that todays opinion poll shows almost three quarters of people support gay marriage, although I do fear that there may be a bigger no vote on the day itself- I've spoken to some people who when in a group say they have no problem with gay marriage, but put in front of a ballot paper I find it hard to see these same people vote yes.

galljga1 · 26-04-2015 02:13PM

sup_dude wrote: »

In fairness, why are you making claims if you can't back them up? I understand that this is what the majority of the No side are doing. You claimed that the Yes side want religion banned. It wasn't just osarusan who asked you to back it up. Now you're saying you can't, and shouldn't have to. That's like me saying that the No side want to murder all homosexuals. I know that's not true, you know that's not true, but by your logic, I shouldn't have to back up that claim. Evidence for claims adds a lot to a discussion.

There has been one post made about a woman who was raised by a SS couple. The post ignored the second article that was wrote along side it, and also ignored the fact that the first article was giving out mostly about divorce than SS couples.

I am voting yes.
I want religion banned from schools.
I am not gay and I do not want communism.

Does that count for anything? Confused.

folamh · 26-04-2015 02:16PM

Today's opinion poll was carried out by Red C for the Sunday Business Post. It reportedly shows that 78% of people are in favour of same-sex marriage and 22% of people against. One third of people have significant doubts about the proposal. I'd like to see who was polled, methodology used and specific questions asked. I went onto Red C's website and the full report doesn't seem to have been published yet.

alroley · 26-04-2015 02:18PM

RobertKK wrote: »

Voting no, it is not about equality, it doesn't allow polygamy or bigamy. It doesn't cater for bisexuals who may want to marry a person from both sexes.
If people want marriage redefined, why not allow multiple husbands or wives?
We are told it is about love and equality, but then prevents a woman from having both a husband and wife, or more, or a man having both a husband and wife or more if he wanted.
Does this referendum want bisexuals to have people whom they are married to and a mistress or another man involved in the marriage whom they are not married to?

Surely the current wording doesn't go far enough for the LGBT lobby groups? It doesn't cater for bisexuals.

Voting no as I would rather a whole new system of marriage without state involvement.

You know that bisexual means attracted to both men and women, not that they have to be in a relationship with both a man and a woman at the same time, right?

folamh · 26-04-2015 02:42PM

RobertKK, I would agree that in an ideal world marriage would be an independent institution from the state. However, I am voting yes to same-sex marriage because in this world I don't think it's fair that gay couples aren't entitled to the same legal and financial benefits as straight couples who can choose to get married. It's easy to be an ideological purist when you're not the one being denied hospital visitations to your ill spouse.

LookingFor · 26-04-2015 02:48PM

I think the nirvana fallacy applies, RobertKKK. If marriage would still not be perfect for you post-marref, it can still be better and more inclusive. Also, bisexual people don't require to be able to be married to two people at once. Bisexuality simply means someone is attracted to or could fall in love with a person of either sex. They do not require to be married to two of either gender any more that you or I may require to be married to two of a particular gender that we might find attractive or fall in love with.

ch750536 · 26-04-2015 03:33PM

Was in the car driving, 3 kids in the back, 10, 8 & 7. One spots a sign.

C10 - Why is there a sign saying 'All kids deserve a mother and father'?
Me - There is a vote soon. At the moment gay people are not allowed to get married.
C10 - Why not?
Me - Its a church law that Ireland kept. Because they can't get married they cant be a family.
C7 - Thats really unfair.
C10 - And stupid.

So, since it is their future we're voting on, they have decided for me.

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 03:38PM

i will be voting no. it is against my religion to accept homosexuality & bisexuality.

WoolyJumper · 26-04-2015 03:45PM

folamh wrote: »

Today's opinion poll was carried out by Red C for the Sunday Business Post. It reportedly shows that 78% of people are in favour of same-sex marriage and 22% of people against. One third of people have significant doubts about the proposal. I'd like to see who was polled, methodology used and specific questions asked. I went onto Red C's website and the full report doesn't seem to have been published yet.

I don't know how reliable this is but yesterday the Journal posted the results of that poll and said that 78% believed it was a matter of fairness and equality, though only 68% intended to vote yes, 22% no and 10% undecided. It has published that 67% disagreed that in was inappropriate for same sex couples to raise children.

walkingshadow · 26-04-2015 03:47PM

blades1982 wrote: »

i will be voting no. it is against my religion to accept homosexuality & bisexuality.

Sounds like a great religion.

Zubeneschamali · 26-04-2015 03:48PM

blades1982 wrote: »

it is against my religion to accept homosexuality & bisexuality.

You won't actually have to have gay bum sex ater the referendum is passed.

And your religion will not be required to marry same sex couples, either.

If you mean it is against your religion to recognize the civil marriage of a same sex couple, I strongly doubt that, since no religion ever considered such a question to my knowledge, until recently. Perhaps you can quote the commandment or religious text which states that for us.

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 03:51PM

isnt it great how the yes'ers jump on my statement because i have an opposing view ? i dont have to justify my oppinion, the title of this thread is how will you vote. not, dont answer honestly as the opposing side will bellitle your view and call into question your religion.

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 03:54PM

We also sent Lut : He said to his people : "Do ye commit lewdness such as no people in creation (ever) committed before you? For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds." Qur'an 7:80-81

What! Of all creatures do ye come unto the males, and leave the wives your Lord created for you? Nay, but ye are forward folk." Qur'an 26:165

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 03:56PM

Abd al-Rahman, the son of Abu Sa'id al-Khudri, reported from his father: The Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: "A man should not see the private parts of another man, and a woman should not see the private parts of another woman, and a man should not lie with another man under one covering, and a woman should not lie with another woman under one covering.

Ave Sodalis · 26-04-2015 03:57PM

blades1982 wrote: »

isnt it great how the yes'ers jump on my statement because i have an opposing view ? i dont have to justify my oppinion, the title of this thread is how will you vote. not, dont answer honestly as the opposing side will bellitle your view and call into question your religion.

You had two people comment on it. One of them was asking where in your religion it stated what you believe.

This is a discussion forum. Fair enough if you have your own reasons but when you come onto a discussion forum, it's generally expected that you engage, as opposed to just one line posts. There's a report post button if you don't like what was in the posts. This, of course, is assuming you didn't know this

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 03:58PM

ok ive posted, please see above.

Links234 · 26-04-2015 04:00PM

blades1982 wrote: »

isnt it great how the yes'ers jump on my statement because i have an opposing view ? i dont have to justify my oppinion, the title of this thread is how will you vote. not, dont answer honestly as the opposing side will bellitle your view and call into question your religion.

You're perfectly entitled to your religion, we have a problem if you're forcing your religious morals onto everyone else, and voting on a matter that has nothing to do with your religion in the first place. Your religion is against homosexuality? That's fine. But voting no is pushing the state to be against marriage for same sex couples, and that's not fine. Do you not see a distinction?

folamh · 26-04-2015 04:00PM

blades1982 wrote: »

isnt it great how the yes'ers jump on my statement because i have an opposing view ? i dont have to justify my oppinion, the title of this thread is how will you vote. not, dont answer honestly as the opposing side will bellitle your view and call into question your religion.

I don't agree with your religion nor your opposition to equity for homosexuals.

Bannasidhe · 26-04-2015 04:00PM

blades1982 wrote: »

isnt it great how the yes'ers jump on my statement because i have an opposing view ? i dont have to justify my oppinion, the title of this thread is how will you vote. not, dont answer honestly as the opposing side will bellitle your view and call into question your religion.

Isn't it great how people whip out the I'm being victimised card when they want to use their religion as an excuse for discrimination.

You might feel hard done by having your view 'belittled' but gay people are having their lives belittled so really, suck it up.

And I am not belittling your view or your religion by the way. I support your right to vote in keeping with your conscience. I am belittling your immediate cries of victimhood and claims that one doesn't need to discuss things on a discussion forum.

As a matter of interest... did you actually join boards just to not discuss your views as I can't help notice your extremely low post count?

WoolyJumper · 26-04-2015 04:00PM

blades1982 wrote: »

isnt it great how the yes'ers jump on my statement because i have an opposing view ? i dont have to justify my oppinion, the title of this thread is how will you vote. not, dont answer honestly as the opposing side will bellitle your view and call into question your religion.

Umm what did you expect when you came on a public discussion forum? I don't think anyone asked to justify your beliefs either.

To your main point, this is a civil issue not a religious one. We don't live in a theocracy. You can allow gay people to live their lives and get married while also believing they are going to hell for doing so.

If this was a vote to allow gays to get married in your particular religion then i'd understand you voting no, but this has nothing to do with your particular religion.

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 04:02PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Isn't it great how people whip out the I'm being victimised card when they want to use their religion as an excuse for discrimination.

You might feel hard done by having your view 'belittled' but gay people are having their lives belittled so really, suck it up.

And I am not belittling your view or your religion by the way. I support your right to vote in keeping with your conscience. I am belittling your immediate cries of victimhood and claims that one doesn't need to discuss things on a discussion forum.

As a matter of interest... did you actually joint boards just not to discuss your views as I can't help notice your extremely low post count?

i just joined 10 minutes ago, stumble on it from adverts.

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 04:07PM

WoolyJumper wrote: »

Umm what did you expect when you came on a public discussion forum? I don't think anyone asked to justify your beliefs either.

To your main point, this is a civil issue not a religious one. We don't live in a theocracy. You can allow gay people to live their lives and get married while also believing they are going to hell for doing so.

If this was a vote to allow gays to get married in your particular religion then i'd understand you voting no, but this has nothing to do with your particular religion.

you dont have to understand. there is no law except the word of god in my view. and as such, it have everything to do with my faith no, i dont have to allow gays to get married. ill be voteing no.

Annasopra · 26-04-2015 04:15PM

blades1982 wrote: »

you dont have to understand. there is no law except the word of god in my view. and as such, it have everything to do with my faith no, i dont have to allow gays to get married. ill be voteing no.

So you dont support any state laws at all?

LookingFor · 26-04-2015 04:18PM

blades1982 wrote: »

i will be voting no. it is against my religion to accept homosexuality & bisexuality.

We live in a republic, not a theocracy. Civil marriage is common ground. It allows you, currently, agency to engage in marriage per your values. It does not give agency to some others with regard to their values. To continue to deny that agency requires strong justification. Religious tradition is not good enough to do that. There are many religious people in this country who want to see same sex marriage legalised. The state cannot pick and choose 'relgious sides' without good cause. Marriage is not a finite resource - the extension of this agency to others will not impact on the agency of any other with regard to their marriage values. Where is the respect for conscience and values if it's not a respect for, where possible, a diversity of values and conscience?

I'm not jumping on you, by the way. I'm just putting it out there if you really want a state that would rationalise public policy based on religious views alone.

blades1982 · 26-04-2015 04:19PM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

So you dont support any state laws at all?

if they are just and fair and not counter to gods law then yes, but support and obey are different thing wouldnt you agree ? if the yes side wins there is nothing i can do, i dont marry people anyway so i woundnt be in a position to refuse a gay marrage.

How will you vote in the Marriage Equality referendum? Mod Note Post 1

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