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Ireland vs England, Sunday 1st March 3pm; RTE/BBC

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    #932
    BoardsMember
    Registered Users Posts: 4,460 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    aimee1 wrote: »
    Scotland are just clueless. No leadership on the field.

    Absolutely, that's it in a nutshell.

    Not sure I have ever seen a team in such dire need of a win as them.


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    #933
    Teferi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,320 ✭✭✭Teferi


    I thought Healy was fairly mixed today tbh. He mixed some excellent, key game moments in with a good few sloppy ones. In his first few minutes he was overeager to hit something and it made him a little headless.


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    #934
    aimee1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,290 ✭✭✭aimee1


    BoardsMember wrote: »
    There was a second when I thought Jonny was done again, them exiting their 22 with Vinpola I think, Jonny took one to the head. Still not convinced he wasn't a bit dazed.

    i think he copped an accidental finger to the eye


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    #935
    metrosity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭metrosity


    Ireland are as tough as nails now, the way they need to be. That was a much harder win than it looked.

    Only 2 things: Murray is a bit too trigger happy with the boot. It worked great for the try as it often does, but sometimes he kicks away possession. I'm just saying. England aren't great and in my opinion simply can't win a world cup, not fairly at least. But if you kick that much possession away against the AB's, you're going to be punished. I appreciate that they were tired.

    Kearney is a shadow of his former self. I read online from another poster that used to be a fan of Kearney before he bulked up a bit more and lost his edge and I agree. His drop goal attempt from long distance today was poorly judged and obviously didn't work. Sure, we got away with it today but against a better team, you pay for that. I think he needs to focus more on his fitness and less on power to get back to being the 15 he once was.
    For the Henshaw try, he cut inside and hit a brick wall (as he often does these days). There were numbers out wide and there was no need to complicate things. It's like he's over thinking, and not being his more natural instinctive self. Just run. If it's a 1:1 situation I can understand the need to weigh up the situation a bit, but in open play just run if you're a 15!

    Wales next, and arguably the hardest test. But if Ireland play their best they can and will beat anyone this year - and what a year to be capable of that!!


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    #936
    Peregrine
    Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 26,399 Mod ✭✭✭✭Peregrine


    S12b wrote: »
    1) How good has our defence been? 23 points conceded in 3 games for an average of only 8 points per game. England have conceded 52 and Wales 57.

    Very similar to the 22 points conceded this time last year, albeit against different opposition in different venues. After round 3, we had conceeded 6 to Scotland, 3 to Wales and 13 to England. We went on to concede a total of 49 points in the championship.

    Edit: Apologies if that sounded like I was saying our defence is the same as last year. That wasn't what I meant.


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    #937
    aimee1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,290 ✭✭✭aimee1


    Teferi wrote: »
    I thought Healy was fairly mixed today tbh. He mixed some excellent, key game moments in with a good few sloppy ones. In his first few minutes he was overeager to hit something and it made him a little headless.

    I think we might see him start in cardiff. TOD and Jordi today were outstanding and with Ruddock also back in action we arent short in the backrow. Sextons hamstring is oh so important now though. The next in line are just so far off his level.


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    #938
    exgp
    Registered Users Posts: 126 ✭✭exgp


    Before the match the pundits said that the English pack would be dominant; they weren't. Wales are a minor hurdle and Scotland should be a walk over and my €160 should mean that they're will be meat on my table on St Patrick's day.


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    #939
    Baggy Trousers
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,816 ✭✭✭Baggy Trousers


    aimee1 wrote: »
    JS said sexton was just a twinge, and was precautionary.

    SOB they arent sure what happened but starts RTP tomorrow or tuesday. They thing it was clash of heads but nothing clear in video

    Looked more than a twinge. Without Sexton, Wales will dominate.


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    #940
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,687 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    exgp wrote: »
    Before the match the pundits said that the English pack would be dominant; they weren't. Wales are a minor hurdle and Scotland should be a walk over and my €160 should mean that they're will be meat on my table on St Patrick's day.

    Imo we opened the door for Wales to challenge seriously today for the title.
    They'll be well up for it.

    I still think we'll win though


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    #941
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 55,049 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    aimee1 wrote: »
    Scotland are just clueless. No leadership on the field.

    That doesn't mean that in Murrayfield they won't produce a game to really trouble us.They have upset us before. Folks seem to make out that we are somehow clearly superior to these teams.

    A lot of the time it's the bounce of a ball that separates a win from a loss. This almost "entitlement" to win I hear from some grates me. We have two away games for a slam. A big ask, and nowhere near to a certainty.

    Today we won because England stank, and were at 60 percent. That's the nonsense we have to listen to.


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    #942
    jacothelad
    Registered Users Posts: 5,921 ✭✭✭jacothelad


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    All Sexton. A genius....
    Larbre34 wrote: »
    He saw it, set it up and dropped it on a sixpence. Henshaw wonderful too of course
    bilston wrote: »
    Who'd have thought a back row consisting of O'Mahony, O'Donnell and Murphy would completely boss the English for 50 minutes?! I admit to being concerned about Murphy before the match but he was excellent and TOD was everywhere when he came on.

    McGrath was very good as well, I would keep him in the starting team for Wales, although Samson Lee will be a tough opponent for him. That was one of Best's best games for Ireland, he was sub human at times and Ross had a strong game too and continues to justify his selection.

    I thought Toner was very noticeable around the park and along with our legendary captain was part of a very strong lineout.

    Murray and Sexton controlled things well, the odd iffy kick, but if you kick that much it's bound to happen, however we absolutely need Sexton to be fit for Wales.

    Henshaw was rightly named man of the match, he was terrific. All the talk was of Joseph (was he even playing today!?) being the best centre in the championship to date, I think that debate has been put to bed now by Henshaw. His try was a great moment and I'll remember that for a long time. Hopefully the first of many for the young lad. Payne played very well, defensively solid but he ran bloody hard all day and while there were no line breaks he made yards every time he got the ball. People need to stop comparing these two to D'Arcy and BOD, they are completely different animals and are doing what they do very well.

    Bowe has had better days but still worked tirelessly, Kearney and particularly Zebo were excellent.

    The replacements all made their contributions.

    Our game definitely moved up a gear today, there were definitely a few more "Schmidt" set plays on show. The move off the scrum on their line when Murphy switched with Kearney and the little pop to Henshaw by McGrath being prime examples. I was staggered by some of the negativity on this thread during the game and can only assume it was WUMs on a mission. We can still get better, our accuracy can improve a bit, but it is closer now that it has been for a while. We are getting better all the time, is Joe going to have this side peaking in six months time. Can you imagine?

    Lads 10 wins in a row now. That is a great stat, however I feel the 11th will be the hardest. We may start praying that Sexton, SOB, Henshaw and Payne are fit. That said we have players who can come in for most of them. However Sexton is key! Neither Madigan nor Keatley are at his level, Jonny has to be fit.

    There was a very cruel but very,very funny comment about him by a poster in the Guardian report on today's game. He reckoned that the BBC should have to pixelate Samson every time the camera picked him up.


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    #943
    metrosity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭metrosity


    exgp wrote: »
    Before the match the pundits said that the English pack would be dominant; they weren't. Wales are a minor hurdle and Scotland should be a walk over and my €160 should mean that they're will be meat on my table on St Patrick's day.
    "Wales are a minor hurdle"

    Sure they are ... whatever you say .. Kearney is over-thinking and is not the speedy 15 he once was. He keeps doing the same thing right now - running into a brick wall. Murray kicks away possession to much.

    Great performance but could be better. England weren't and aren't anything special. As ever, they will win by cheating, kicking or muscle. That's about it... Let's not get too excited by beating them

    If Ireland kicked possession away that much against the AB's, or another SH team for that matter, they would be punished.


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    #944
    finatron
    Registered Users Posts: 270 ✭✭finatron


    walshb wrote: »
    That doesn't mean that in Murrayfield they won't produce a game to really trouble us.They have upset us before. Folks seem to make out that we are somehow clearly superior to these teams.

    A lot of the time it's the bounce of a ball that separates a win from a loss. This almost "entitlement" to win I hear from some grates me. We have two away games for a slam. A big ask, and nowhere near to a certainty.

    Today we won because England stank, and were at 60 percent. That's the nonsense we have to listen to.

    Ya very true Ireland keep on winning but struggling to score trys. Are half backs won the day Ireland played as a team England looked disjointed


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    #945
    Grandpa Hassan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭Grandpa Hassan


    Warren Gatland
    Just back from the pub. Three thoughts. In increasing order of importance

    Ireland's pack stood up and defied predictions of many

    Ireland's backs has more imagination

    But Ireland won, first and foremost, because of Schmidt. His interpretation of the refereeing was bang on. I have never seen a game with such a one sided penalty count in midfield. And that is down to Schmidts planning


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    #946
    Osborne
    Registered Users Posts: 310 ✭✭Osborne


    England fan here that was at the game.

    A thoroughly disappointing game from us. I'm too annoyed to elaborate.

    As for Ireland, I thought they wanted it more and were superior in all aspects of the game. I thought Murray was excellent and really stepped up. Henshaw was immense and I'm so glad he got his try as a Galway resident and Connacht fan.

    I must also mention the crowd. I've been to many Eng vs Irl games both home and away but where I was sitting today were the most passionate, vocal and loyal fans I have ever encountered. I haven't seen the game on TV yet but the atmosphere was electric and I'm sure the team benefited from it.

    So, all in all, the best team won and I don't feel the score reflects how much better Ireland were. I really hope you go onto win the GS and keep getting better before the WC.

    As for England...back to the drawing board.


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    #947
    metrosity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭metrosity


    Grandpa Hassan wrote: »
    Just back from the pub. Three thoughts. In increasing order of importance

    Ireland's pack stood up and defied predictions of many

    Ireland's backs has more imagination

    But Ireland won, first and foremost, because of Schmidt. His interpretation of the refereeing was bang on. I have never seen a game with such a one sided penalty count in midfield. And that is down to Schmidts planning

    Ireland were imperious at the breakdown - nothing wrong there. In defense they were imperious. In attack, a bit blunt and not enough to beat SA or NZ on that display, but still very very good in defense.


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    #948
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    Hagz wrote: »
    It's a load of crap to be honest. I wonder how much GAA these guys have actually player. Probably a couple of games at u13 level.

    Tbh I wouldn't pay much heed to the handling aspect of things but timing your jump for when a ball is dropping is a big thing and I think GAA helps things in that regard. It is overstated though.


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    #949
    bilston
    Registered Users Posts: 17,769 ✭✭✭✭bilston


    exgp wrote: »
    Before the match the pundits said that the English pack would be dominant; they weren't. Wales are a minor hurdle and Scotland should be a walk over and my €160 should mean that they're will be meat on my table on St Patrick's day.

    The pedant in me can't help but point out that St Patricks Day is four days before we play Scotland so don't be banking on that Irish stew just yet.


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    #950
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 55,049 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    finatron wrote: »
    Ya very true Ireland keep on winning but struggling to score trys. Are half backs won the day Ireland played as a team England looked disjointed

    Yes, but that is just it. England may have looked disjointed because we didn't let them play. We did what we had to do. They came here and tried and they could not beat us. Fore some rugby fans and pundits it's not enough that we beat a nation that has so much more resources and so much more Rugby history than us. We can't enjoy it, and we look for reasons and excuses for us winning. It's pathetic.

    I mentioned that Wales may well start favorites in two weeks and it was like I had said that Ireland should start favorites against Germany in Berlin in soccer. The official betting is a slight favorite to Ireland. Massive massive game for us to go there and beat the Welsh.

    One of the panelists today had zero credit to give to those lads on the pitch. Not a smige of praise. Couldn't even think of something positive to say for Henshaw's try. Lads that not only put their bodies on the line, but their lives.


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    #951
    aimee1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,290 ✭✭✭aimee1


    walshb wrote: »
    That doesn't mean that in Murrayfield they won't produce a game to really trouble us.They have upset us before. Folks seem to make out that we are somehow clearly superior to these teams.

    A lot of the time it's the bounce of a ball that separates a win from a loss. This almost "entitlement" to win I hear from some grates me. We have two away games for a slam. A big ask, and nowhere near to a certainty.

    Today we won because England stank, and were at 60 percent. That's the nonsense we have to listen to.

    Scotland are lacking serious leadership. 1 minute to go yesterday they had a penalty and instead of going for safety of guaranteed lineout the 10 went for distance and missed touch. It just wouldnt happen with Ireland. Madigan today put in 2 great touchfinders but he made sure he found touch.

    Then scotland gave away a needless penalty on halfway which gifted italy territory and a lineout, and the only way Italy would win the game was a lineout/maul/try

    Two away games, neither will be easy, but both are certainly winnable for this irish team.


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    #952
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 55,049 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    aimee1 wrote: »

    Two away games, neither will be easy, but both are certainly winnable for this irish team.

    Absolutely we can win. I always have confidence that on our day we can hang with the best, but let's be real here. There are 15 other men hell bent on winning from the opposing team. That is far often forgotten, and we have this entitlement attitude to beat X/Y and Z attitude.

    Wales on a bit of form will always be world class. It's their DNA. Scotland have upset us before, and with home advantage and them maybe wanting to avoid a wooden spoon, well, there you have it. Win/lose or draw I know our lads will make me proud.


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    #953
    metrosity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭metrosity


    walshb wrote: »
    Yes, but that is just it. England may have looked disjointed because we didn't let them play. We did what we had to do. They came here and tried and they could not beat us. Fore some rugby fans and pundits it's not enough that we beat a nation that has so much more resources and so much more Rugby history than us. We can't enjoy it, and we look for reasons and excuses for us winning. It's pathetic.

    I mentioned that Wales may well start favorites in two weeks and it was like I had said that Ireland should start favorites against Germany in Berlin in soccer. The official betting is a slight favorite to Ireland. Massive massive game for us to go there and beat the Welsh.

    One of the panelists today had zero credit to give to those lads on the pitch. Not a smige of praise. Couldn't even think of something positive to say for Henshaw's try. Lads that not only put their bodies on the line, but their lives.

    Ahh, don't be so dramatic - that might be your insecurity. This Ireland team knows they're better than England because they are , by some way I might add. They worked very hard today. People like Hook will always be complaining but the fact is, Ireland need to be better than that against the 2 teams still ranked ahead of us. That's the facts.

    Kearney- needs to stop running with no gamble, he's aimless, and cuts inside or misjudges plays, knocks on. Bowe knocked on too and had a pretty average day. Murray kicked away possession too much. I'm just saying. England were sub par, and they're really for the taking at this stage.

    SA and NZ would have capitaised on our mistakes today, big time. We need to keep things in perspective.


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    #954
    BoardsMember
    Registered Users Posts: 4,460 ✭✭✭BoardsMember


    English line speed was immense all day, formidable calm heads all round to handle/clear/recycle as well as we did. The breakdown really was something special today. And all our players played a part, some immense clear outs.


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    #955
    aimee1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,290 ✭✭✭aimee1


    walshb wrote: »
    One of the panelists today had zero credit to give to those lads on the pitch. Not a smige of praise. Couldn't even think of something positive to say for Henshaw's try. Lads that not only put their bodies on the line, but their lives.

    Pope and COS made the best point of all today. JS is getting the best out of the TEAM and when players come in [TOD] at the last minute before kick off or 20 minutes into the game and fit in seamlessly.


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    #956
    Gits_bone
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,345 ✭✭✭Gits_bone


    We won and I am delighted.

    However, the kicking is rancid. It's like Jose Mourinhos Inter Milan v Barcelona in the Champions League semi a few years ago. Very defensive but effective, ugly to watch unless you only care about the result.

    Last 20 mins of the game v France and now England have caused serious problems. We can't keep getting away with it like Pope said. We looked out on our feet as the commentators mentioned about Payne & Henshaw, so why does Murray give the ball to the opposition? It was the same v France when we were down to 14. Kicked it at every opportunity.

    It's an ugly spectacle, intense but ugly. Wales v England was the best match of the championship so far. Great tries scored. I doubt Bowe will add many more to his Ireland tally unless he's playing against minnows which is a shame.


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    #957
    S12b
    Registered Users Posts: 1,166 ✭✭✭S12b


    I'll just leave this here......did Joseph even touch the ball????

    http://www.sportsjoe.ie/rugby/ireland-england-robbie-henshaw-jared-payne/15159


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    #958
    metrosity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭metrosity


    BoardsMember wrote: »
    English line speed was immense all day, formidable calm heads all round to handle/clear/recycle as well as we did. The breakdown really was something special today. And all our players played a part, some immense clear outs.
    Yep, they were very good in defence, but indisciplined in broken play, coming in at the side etc. We killed them in the breakdown. We would have beaten them on a penalty count without tries.

    Kearney at full tilt, would have passed out to the right wing and we would have gone over. As it was, he cut inside, hit a wall of white and that allowed Murray to dink one over the top for Henshaw. It was a bit greasy with the rain, so that might have been a factor.


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    #959
    Whosthis
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,342 ✭✭✭Whosthis


    walshb wrote: »
    Yes, but that is just it. England may have looked disjointed because we didn't let them play. We did what we had to do. They came here and tried and they could not beat us. Fore some rugby fans and pundits it's not enough that we beat a nation that has so much more resources and so much more Rugby history than us. We can't enjoy it, and we look for reasons and excuses for us winning. It's pathetic.

    I mentioned that Wales may well start favorites in two weeks and it was like I had said that Ireland should start favorites against Germany in Berlin in soccer. The official betting is a slight favorite to Ireland. Massive massive game for us to go there and beat the Welsh.

    One of the panelists today had zero credit to give to those lads on the pitch. Not a smige of praise. Couldn't even think of something positive to say for Henshaw's try. Lads that not only put their bodies on the line, but their lives.
    :o


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    #960
    walshb
    Registered Users Posts: 55,049 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    metrosity wrote: »
    Ahh, don't be so dramatic - that might be your insecurity. This Ireland team knows they're better than England because they are , by some way I might add. They worked very hard today. People like Hook will always be complaining but the fact is, Ireland need to be better than that against the 2 teams still ranked ahead of us. That's the facts.

    Kearney- needs to stop running with no gamble, he's aimless, and cuts inside or misjudges plays, knocks on. Bowe knocked on too and had a pretty average day. Murray kicked away possession too much. I'm just saying. England were sub par, and they're really for the taking at this stage.

    SA and NZ would have capitaised on our mistakes today, big time. We need to keep things in perspective.

    Insecurity? No. Being realistic, yes. Knowing that at the top level in world sport you are bound to have very competitive matches. Ireland have never been firm favorites to beat the likes of France and England and Wales. Yes, Italy and Scotland we have had the consistent measure of, but look that the win/loss record vs. the other three since 6 N began. Very tight.

    SA and NZ are irrelevant. I am peaking about 6N. Since when have we ever been really expected to beat NZ and SA? Are we not allowed make rugby mistakes? Sure every team makes them. There has to be mistakes in sport for winners and losers.

    England were sub par, why exactly? Because we beat them? Is that why we beat them? Ok, let us imagine them on "top form," who wins? Why can't we juts celebrate a fantastic win over England, the home of rugby with 50 million people in their country. Sub par or not it's a fantastic achievement.


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    #961
    metrosity
    Closed Accounts Posts: 116 ✭✭metrosity


    Gits_bone wrote: »
    We won and I am delighted.

    However, the kicking is rancid. It's like Jose Mourinhos Inter Milan v Barcelona in the Champions League semi a few years ago. Very defensive but effective, ugly to watch unless you only care about the result.

    Last 20 mins of the game v France and now England have caused serious problems. We can't keep getting away with it like Pope said. We looked out on our feet as the commentators mentioned about Payne & Henshaw, so why does Murray give the ball to the opposition? It was the same v France when we were down to 14. Kicked it at every opportunity.

    It's an ugly spectacle, intense but ugly. Wales v England was the best match of the championship so far. Great tries scored. I doubt Bowe will add many more to his Ireland tally unless he's playing against minnows which is a shame.

    And it's not just Murray. Good 'ol Rob Keanrey has got too fond of garry owens. He's lost some if his mojo for sure.

    Today, Ireland: Brilliant in defense and the breakdown. A bit fortunate in attack and could do better, but then again it was greasy out there.


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