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Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread V

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Comments

  • #8012
    .ak
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,308 ✭✭✭✭.ak


    The_Captain wrote: »
    Munster would rather have Tomas O'Leary back than Stringer and they're in a worse position for scrum halves than we are

    Yes but they're looking for a more permanent player.


  • #8013
    thomond2006
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 45,433 ✭✭✭✭thomond2006


    Stringer at worst would be a great asset to the Leinster dirttrackers.


  • #8014
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    The_Captain wrote: »
    Munster would rather have Tomas O'Leary back than Stringer and they're in a worse position for scrum halves than we are

    If Boss goes to the WC then we don't have a player to complete a matchday 23 with any pro12 experience at scrum half whatsoever.

    We've had to recall Cooney to fill the 23 the weekend just gone. That option will not be not available in September when he's a Connacht player.

    Who do you propose we have sit on the bench and offer McGrath some respite and cover?


  • #8015
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    If Boss goes to the WC then we don't have a player to complete a matchday 23 with any pro12 experience at scrum half whatsoever.

    We've had to recall Cooney to fill the 23 the weekend just gone. That option will not be not available in September when he's a Connacht player.

    Who do you propose we have sit on the bench and offer McGrath some respite and cover?

    If we're completely unable to find someone established to come in and play 9 (Leinster are actively recruiting for a 9 currently) then we'll be able to find a young player from the SH to come in.

    Stringer has a negative VORP.


  • #8016
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    If we're completely unable to find someone established to come in and play 9 (Leinster are actively recruiting for a 9 currently) then we'll be able to find a young player from the SH to come in.

    Stringer has a negative VORP.

    Gimme a name. Any name.

    Stringer has no definable VORP if there is nobody to compare him to. You're saying "Stringer is the worse option" but not completing the sentence.


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  • #8017
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Gimme a name. Any name.

    Stringer has no definable VORP if there is nobody to compare him to. You're saying "Stringer is the worse option" but not completing the sentence.

    Chris Smylie?


  • #8018
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Gimme a name. Any name.

    Stringer has no definable VORP if there is nobody to compare him to. You're saying "Stringer is the worse option" but not completing the sentence.

    VORP is the end of the sentence. It's a comparison to a fictitious player who represents the freely available replacements on the market.


  • #8019
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    VORP is the end of the sentence. It's a comparison to a fictitious player who represents the freely available replacements on the market.

    Who I'd asked you to name, given that Stringer was the only one mentioned at any stage prior. The other freely available replacements are .... ?
    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Chris Smylie?

    Good credentials. Is he up for a NH swap? Is he content to sit on the bench and babysit McGrath for 3 months but also good enough to cover a Reddan/Boss injury for a HEC game? (no idea, no knowledge of him whatsoever)


  • #8020
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Who I'd asked you to name, given that Stringer was the only one mentioned at any stage prior. The other freely available replacements are .... ?

    Sorry I posted twice, I didn't see the edit originally. I did respond to that.

    There are players out there from Currie Cup, ITM level who would offer us more value. But that's only if Leinster don't succeed in bringing in someone better than that.


  • #8021
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Good credentials. Is he up for a NH swap? Is he content to sit on the bench and babysit McGrath for 3 months but also good enough to cover a Reddan/Boss injury for a HEC game? (no idea, no knowledge of him whatsoever)
    I have no idea either but those'd be the questions Easterby can ask his management during negotiations. There are plenty of alternatives if he isn't interested in a pay rise and a year overseas.


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  • #8022
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    I have no idea either but those'd be the questions Easterby can ask his management during negotiations. There are plenty of alternatives if he isn't interested in a pay rise and a year overseas.

    Who else so? We've two named. Stringer and Smylie.

    Who are these plenty of available scrum halfs that can do the job we need? (Stringer in a limited capacity if even)

    Names? I'm nowhere near as confident that this list is either extensive, or available, or realistic. Admittedly, probably through ignorance.


  • #8023
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    Uh huh.

    None of this solves anything. If either Boss or Reddan fails to make the RWC squad and is therefore available, then having Stringer (or any short-term replacement) is a waste. Except we won't know who is going to be in the squad until the end of August and that's very late to be looking for options.

    We should be going shopping now and looking for good scrum-halves who can challenge for the first-team jersey IMO. Peter Stringer is not a good scrum half who can challenge for the first team jersey.


  • #8024
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    total former wrote: »
    Uh huh.

    None of this solves anything. If either Boss or Reddan fails to make the RWC squad and is therefore available, then having Stringer (or any short-term replacement) is a waste. Except we won't know who is going to be in the squad until the end of August and that's very late to be looking for options.

    We should be going shopping now and looking for good scrum-halves who can challenge for the first-team jersey IMO. Peter Stringer is not a good scrum half who can challenge for the first team jersey.

    Names? World Cup year so no internationals if possible.


  • #8025
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    Who else so? We've two named. Stringer and Smylie.

    Who are these plenty of available scrum halfs that can do the job we need? (Stringer in a limited capacity if even)

    Names? I'm nowhere near as confident that this list is either extensive, or available, or realistic. Admittedly, probably through ignorance.

    There are loads more at that level of player. Even slightly higher on the edges of the Super rugby teams (there's a young Chiefs 9 who is about 4th choice who looks good but I can't remember his name). I don't watch a huge amount of Currie/ITM rugby any more I'm afraid but there are Goodman-standard guys out there who can offer us cover who aren't 37 years old.

    Edit: is it Harrington at the Chiefs? I have only actually seen him once but a kiwi friend is a big fan.


  • #8026
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Names? World Cup year so no internationals if possible.

    I don't follow enough Super/NPC/Currie Cup to be throwing out names tbh, but I'm sure they're out there and my ignorance doesn't make Stringer a better option. Leinster have generally been very good in identifying SH talent that is a little bit below the radar so I'd hope they can do the same again.


  • #8027
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    Loads more asserted but as a group of rugby heads we can't name more than 2.

    My scepticism is tweaked and my worries not assuaged.


  • #8028
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Loads more asserted but as a group of rugby heads we can't name more than 2.

    My scepticism is tweaked and my worries not assuaged.

    What are you worried about?


  • #8029
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    total former wrote: »
    What are you worried about?

    That this ready supply of pro12 (and higher) standard scrum halves doesn't exist, and certainly not in a RWC year.


  • #8030
    irishbucsfan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,978 ✭✭✭✭irishbucsfan


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    That this ready supply of pro12 (and higher) standard scrum halves doesn't exist, and certainly not in a RWC year.

    Ross Cronje? I mean I'm not a professional so I dont have a list of these at hand but I'm pretty sure I could give you 5 candidates with some time.


  • #8031
    total former
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,784 ✭✭✭total former


    Deleted User wrote: »
    That this ready supply of pro12 (and higher) standard scrum halves doesn't exist, and certainly not in a RWC year.

    Again, I don't know enough to know who is out there, but Peter Stringer isn't of that calibre either. The only reason we're having this discussion is because he's an Irish legend but that shouldn't cut any ice.


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  • #8032
    Kenya Stocky Sextant
    Posts: 24,798 ✭✭✭✭ Kenya Stocky Sextant


    The only reason his name is on the page is because he's a senior scrum half that is not contracted for next season who is still fit enough to play.

    But that still puts him ahead of the 'loads' of other vague candidates for the position.


  • #8033
    vienne86
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,076 ✭✭✭✭vienne86


    Deleted User wrote: »
    The only reason his name is on the page is because he's a senior scrum half that is not contracted for next season who is still fit enough to play.

    But that still puts him ahead of the 'loads' of other vague candidates for the position.

    He could do nicely as WC cover. He really passes very well, but dammit, he's 37. I would favour a very short term contract, but another aging SH is not what Leinster need IMO.

    I suspect Stringe will go on to develop his TV career with BT, where he actually donesn't do too badly.


  • #8034
    Tox56
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,636 ✭✭✭✭Tox56


    Ross Moloney and Dan Leavy training with the senior squad going by the training pics, would be brilliant to see them get some gametime. Leavy particularly I think if he gets his injuries behind him and a few games under his belt could move up the ranks big time


  • #8035
    shuffol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,883 ✭✭✭shuffol


    Boss, McGrath and if needed Nick McCarthy should be enough during the WC. If heaven forbid Boss were to make the Irish squad then a short term replacement could be looked at.


  • #8036
    salmocab
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,795 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    If we are just looking for a SH for a few months as cover we could pick up someone playing Currie cup or NPC for cheap enough I would imagine, but if we are doing that as a real short term thing then Id be happy to see Stringer as cover. The reality is though we need a long term solution as we have 2 aging SH and a young one that despite being rated by people here doesn't seem to be getting much game time.


  • #8037
    MattD
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,013 ✭✭✭MattD


    I can't imagine that Stringer is the only option if we're looking for a short term deal for an experienced scrum half. I've thought he's looked good for Bath, but it just seems like the laziest link to make for Leinster.

    What is Chris Cusiter at these days?


  • #8038
    salmocab
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,795 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    MattD wrote: »
    I can't imagine that Stringer is the only option if we're looking for a short term deal for an experienced scrum half. I've thought he's looked good for Bath, but it just seems like the laziest link to make for Leinster.

    What is Chris Cusiter at these days?


    It is lazy alright but he doesn't take up a NIQ spot which would be a factor I imagine


  • #8039
    Hagz
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,257 ✭✭✭Hagz


    Look lads, the answer is simple. Give Bobby Holland a development contract. Sorted.


  • #8040
    padser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,375 ✭✭✭padser


    irishbucsfan wrote: »
    Ross Cronje? I mean I'm not a professional so I dont have a list of these at hand but I'm pretty sure I could give you 5 candidates with some time.

    I'm with Emmett in the skeptical camp on this one.

    In a World Cup year there are roughly 24 scrum halves unavailable during the World Cup (top 8 teams by 3 scrumhalves per squad).

    I assume that pro 12 standard means currently playing for a Pro12, Premiership, Top 14 or Super 15 team. I think that's a fair assumption, the notion that lower leagues are filled with players of that quality doesn't stack up to any serious analysis (and isolated examples to the contrary don't change this). That means roughly 55 teams.

    I'd assume that this means there are roughly 110 (2 per team) scrum halves in the world at the required standard. 11-16 of them will be injured (10-15% injury clause) and 24 will be away at the RWC (I admit there may be some overlap between these groups),

    So 110 scrumhalves at the required level, 35-40 unavailable, leaves 70-75 for the 55 teams that want them, and I'd imagine most teams would like 2.

    So, I'd be fairly surprised if anyone here can come up with a list 5 names at the required level and likely to be available. The World Cup just takes too many of them away,...


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  • #8041
    CIARAN_BOYLE
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,595 ✭✭✭✭CIARAN_BOYLE


    I'd add another 5 -10 each each for Currie cup and npc players of the rquired standard not playing ssuper rugby.

    As to a suggestion as a slightly longer term option than Stringer how about Nik Groom of South Africa. 23 years old around 30 super rugby caps and 60 currie cup caps. Contract expires 2015 sure we would probably have to buy him out of a few months early.

    Could make a good option if we want a potential project.


This discussion has been closed.
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