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Avoid Autoglass Letterkenny-Damaged my car

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  • 12-01-2015 1:18pm
    #1
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭


    Last November I'd my car bonnet and a couple of other body panels resprayed due to a small dent and stone chips.

    In December, I needed to get the windscreen replaced due to a growing crack. Autoglass in Letterkenny did the job and I signed off on it when I collected the car. When I collected the car from their depot, the guy who did the job guided me straight into the office to sign the paperwork off, he never once suggested that I check the job before signing it off. (I'm not sure I'd have noticed the damage right after the job was done anyway as I'd have been concentrating on the windscreen & not the bodywork).

    About 10 days later, just after Xmas, when I was getting the car ready for a long trip down the country (readjusting windscreen water nozzles and filling the wash tank with washer fluid), I noticed that there was a long scratch on the top edge of the bonnet on the drivers side which had started to rust badly. I looked at the passenger side too and could see the tell-tale signs of the paint being scratched too (it didn't start to rust on the passenger side as the scratch didn't go through to the metal). I only noticed it when the rust appeared which takes a few days of the metal being exposed to the elements.

    As soon as offices opened after the Xmas holidays on 5th January, I called the Letterkenny branch. They promised to call me back. They didn't.

    When I called them again later in the day on the 5th Jan, the guy who'd done the job told me that as I'd signed off on it there was nothing he could do.

    I told him that it was obvious he'd done the damage as I'd a) had the bonnet resprayed a month beforehand and b) the damage is at the top edge of the bonnet (ie closest part to the windscreen) and c) they are obvious scratch marks.

    He still said there was nothing that could be done as I'd signed off on the job. I asked if I could escalate the issue and he said that he was as far as it could go. I resolved to contact Autoglass head office.

    I tweeted their customer service and the UK representative directed me to the Irish twitter handle, to which I received no reply. I called their head office twice and was promised a senior person would call me back. I haven't heard back since.

    If you've had a similar experience could you let me know how you dealt with it? Thanks.
    Tagged:


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    #2
    whomitconcerns
    Registered Users Posts: 4,327 ✭✭✭whomitconcerns


    SilverCoin2100 wrote: »
    Last November I'd my car bonnet and a couple of other body panels resprayed due to a small dent and stone chips.

    In December, I needed to get the windscreen replaced due to a growing crack. Autoglass in Letterkenny did the job and I signed off on it when I collected the car. When I collected the car from their depot, the guy who did the job guided me straight into the office to sign the paperwork off, he never once suggested that I check the job before signing it off. (I'm not sure I'd have noticed the damage right after the job was done anyway as I'd have been concentrating on the windscreen & not the bodywork).

    About 10 days later, just after Xmas, when I was getting the car ready for a long trip down the country (readjusting windscreen water nozzles and filling the wash tank with washer fluid), I noticed that there was a long scratch on the top edge of the bonnet on the drivers side which had started to rust badly. I looked at the passenger side too and could see the tell-tale signs of the paint being scratched too (it didn't start to rust on the passenger side as the scratch didn't go through to the metal). I only noticed it when the rust appeared which takes a few days of the metal being exposed to the elements.

    As soon as offices opened after the Xmas holidays on 5th January, I called the Letterkenny branch. They promised to call me back. They didn't.

    When I called them again later in the day on the 5th Jan, the guy who'd done the job told me that as I'd signed off on it there was nothing he could do.

    I told him that it was obvious he'd done the damage as I'd a) had the bonnet resprayed a month beforehand and b) the damage is at the top edge of the bonnet (ie closest part to the windscreen) and c) they are obvious scratch marks.

    He still said there was nothing that could be done as I'd signed off on the job. I asked if I could escalate the issue and he said that he was as far as it could go. I resolved to contact Autoglass head office.

    I tweeted their customer service and the UK representative directed me to the Irish twitter handle, to which I received no reply. I called their head office twice and was promised a senior person would call me back. I haven't heard back since.

    If you've had a similar experience could you let me know how you dealt with it? Thanks.

    Is it not possible in the 10 days after the job they did..that someone else did the scracthes?

    Ive found autoglass very good on the occasions I have had to use them.


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    #3
    ironclaw
    Registered Users Posts: 8,004 ✭✭✭ironclaw


    10 days later? Could have been anything or anyone. You are at fault for not checking the work and by signing you actually stated legally that you were happy. I have no connection to AutoGlass but this is nonsense to brand them in a bad light for a fault so easily spotted had you taken the time to check. Can we stop being such a nanny state?


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    #4
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Hi whomitconcerns

    No, it's not possible that someone else did the damage. I live in a rural place with private parking. I didn't use the car much over the Xmas period after they did the job. It's very obvious from the location, shape and nature of the scratches that the damage was done when the windscreen was being replaced. It's either that or the fairies did it!

    I'm disappointed that they haven't accepted responsibility for it and haven't followed up with me after promising to do so.


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    #5
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,687 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    Agreed ten days later is too late


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    #6
    mickdw
    Registered Users Posts: 23,302 ✭✭✭✭mickdw


    I've had the same issue. Scratch along the top edge of the bonnet where some clumsy idiot caught the bonnet with his removal tool.
    I didn't see it as they had dabbed some black paint along the damage and I only noticed it about a week later when hand washing the car.
    I didn't go back as I figured they would just claim to know nothing about the damage at that stage.
    There is no doubt in my mind that they caused your damage though.


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    #7
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Perhaps on the surface of it 10 days later does sound too late. I hadn't used the car much in the intervening period and wasn't outside around the car much given that it's wintertime. I brought it my mechanic who said it was obvious that the damage had been done when the windscreen was being replaced and he said that he wouldn't have noticed it either had it not started to rust. So it wasn't that easy to spot at the time I signed off on the job.

    Ironclaw--it's nothing to do with being a nanny state. If you spent money having panels on your car repainted and a month later it gets damaged to the point of where those panels start to rust, wouldn't you complain too?

    It's as clear as day due to the nature, location and appearance of the scratches who did the damage and what caused it. It certainly wasn't 'anything' or 'anyone' as you suggest.


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    #8
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Thanks Mick. Sorry to hear you'd the same experience. My car is light blue metallic, so the exposed metal from the scratch wouldn't have contrasted greatly with the paintwork--until the rust appeared that it!

    After dropping off my car at their depot the mobile repairman (not the guy who did the job) gave me a lift back to my office in his Transit. On the dashboard were the moulded plastic panels that fit around some car wiper arms, along the bottom of the windscreen. I asked what they were for and if they did other car repairs other than glass repairs and he told me the other guy (the guy who did the job on my car) had damaged the panels on a lady's car and he was going out to her house with the new parts to replace them. So I know this guy has damaged other cars.


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    #9
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,666 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    Why did you sign to say you were satsfied with the work done without looking at the job thoroughly?

    I think doing that ruined any hope you have of compensation for any damage done - you essentially certified that there was none.


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    #10
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Yes, that was my mistake. Hindsight is a great clairvoyant.

    However, I do think it's worth making other people aware so they don't make the same mistake, and as the damage was so obviously caused by Autoglass I'll continue to follow up with them. Surely reasonable doubt comes into play when it's so obvious due to the nature of the damage that it happened when the windscreen was being replaced.


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    #11
    ironclaw
    Registered Users Posts: 8,004 ✭✭✭ironclaw


    SilverCoin2100 wrote: »
    Ironclaw--it's nothing to do with being a nanny state. If you spent money having panels on your car repainted and a month later it gets damaged to the point of where those panels start to rust, wouldn't you complain too?

    Apologises if it was offensive but having worked in retail, and I suggest everyone does so in their life, we get this all the time. Complaints and issues that are very clearly not our fault or extremely unlikely to be our fault. Repairs returned 6 months later on mechanical parts that are normally replaced or at the very least maintained every 6 to 9 months. And yet, we had to just bow our heads and repair them, at our costs. As unfortunately in this country, the customer is always right. It just gets tiring. Please, be realistic. A business is a business. 99% of them are out to do a good job and offer a decent service. And out of that 99%, 99% of them will be happy to go beyond the call of duty to put things right.

    But presenting a car, 10 days after a glass repair and claiming it was them without any doubt is nonsense. Could be caused by anything or anyone, both vandalism or pure accident. Its a car. Its exposed to the elements, dirt, grit and the general public. All of which cause damage.

    Had I dropped off my car for a windscreen repair, I'd make sure I inspect the entire repair. Why? Because that is the reason it was there. The seal, both inside and out and the entire front panel section. A cursory look over and then I'd sign some paper work. As a retailer, we always did this and explained the entire process and what was done. And yet, we still had people coming into us i.e. You touched it last, it must be your fault.

    I despair sometimes.


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    #12
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,271 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    SilverCoin2100 wrote: »
    Perhaps on the surface of it 10 days later does sound too late.

    It definitely is too late, especially after signing for the repair.

    Any business would have to be completely stupid to accept a customers word weeks later that a scratch or dent was their fault and that they have to pay for it, its just unrealistic to expect otherwise.

    Unfortunately you live in a country of chancers who would happily blame the windscreen guy for every little scratch if they thought they could get away with it. Companies are going to protect themselves against these chancers with policies like making you sign off on the work and not accepting any liability after that point, they just have to.


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    #13
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    ironclaw wrote: »
    Apologises if it was offensive but having worked in retail, and I suggest everyone does so in their life, we get this all the time. Complaints and issues that are very clearly not our fault or extremely unlikely to be our fault. Repairs returned 6 months later on mechanical parts that are normally replaced or at the very least maintained every 6 to 9 months. And yet, we had to just bow our heads and repair them, at our costs. As unfortunately in this country, the customer is always right. It just gets tiring. Please, be realistic. A business is a business. 99% of them are out to do a good job and offer a decent service. And out of that 99%, 99% of them will be happy to go beyond the call of duty to put things right.

    But presenting a car, 10 days after a glass repair and claiming it was them without any doubt is nonsense. Could be caused by anything or anyone, both vandalism or pure accident. Its a car. Its exposed to the elements, dirt, grit and the general public. All of which cause damage.

    Had I dropped off my car for a windscreen repair, I'd make sure I inspect the entire repair. Why? Because that is the reason it was there. The seal, both inside and out and the entire front panel section. A cursory look over and then I'd sign some paper work. As a retailer, we always did this and explained the entire process and what was done. And yet, we still had people coming into us i.e. You touched it last, it must be your fault.

    I despair sometimes.


    Ironclaw, you're not alone- Don't despair. You have tried to move the nature of this thread to a broadside on general customer complaint behaviour. My issue is very specific. I too am familiar with the retail industry and have dealt with customer complaints, returns etc--some genuine, others less so.

    You sound aggrieved with customers for coming back with issues after 6 months, and suggesting it's unfortunate that the customer is always right in this country and the fact you find the issue tiring and it makes you despair sometimes.

    Perhaps your feelings are justified. I don't know.

    What I do know is that the damage to my car was done from the windscreen being replaced. No 'ifs' no 'buts, no 'anyones' or 'anythings' or 'vandalism' or 'pure accident' or 'elements or 'grit' or 'general public'. The evidence is there on the car. It's literally as simple as that. Were you to see the scratches I don't think you'd claim my issue is 'nonsense'.

    It's my fault that I didn't inspect the whole windscreen repair & surrounding bodywork. I assumed that having taken my car to a well known, professional outfit that they'd do a proper job and not cause any damage and therefore I wouldn't need to inspect the car in detail. Sadly, I was wrong. The only thing I noticed on collecting the car was how nice and clear the new glass was. When I arrived at the Autoglass premises I was ushered straight into the office to sign off that the work had been done. There was no encouragement to take a 'cursory look over' and nothing about the process was explained to me. In hindsight I can understand why these things didn't happen/ weren't encouraged--simply because the individual knew he'd done damage to the car and wanted to ensure I signed off on it before I noticed it. Had he been honest he'd have put his hand up and said that he'd scraped the bonnet edge.

    It's unfortunate that it took 10 days before I noticed it. I didn't use the car much, it was December-the weather is bad outside-it was only when adjusting the washer spray nozzles that I noticed the damage. Had it been anything else that had caused the damage, I'd have been annoyed (having just had the bonnet resprayed) but would have had to bite the bullet on it and wouldn't have spent time posting to boards.ie.


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    #14
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    It definitely is too late, especially after signing for the repair.

    Any business would have to be completely stupid to accept a customers word weeks later that a scratch or dent was their fault and that they have to pay for it, its just unrealistic to expect otherwise.

    Unfortunately you live in a country of chancers who would happily blame the windscreen guy for every little scratch if they thought they could get away with it. Companies are going to protect themselves against these chancers with policies like making you sign off on the work and not accepting any liability after that point, they just have to.

    bucketybuck--I've covered the 10 day issue so won't repeat myself.
    Unrealistic? Perhaps. However, I'm talking about very specific type of scratches in very specific places which is like fingerprints on a crime scene. I'm not talking about a general dent/scratch that could have been caused by a branch etc. The only way those scratches could have got there is when removing/replacing a windscreen.

    Lastly, I'm not in the 'chancer' business. Unfortunately some individuals within companies are. As you suggest companies need to protect themselves against chancers, however, we as consumers also have to protect ourselves against those in companies who would try to pull a fast one on us. That is why I wrote my original post and at least one person on the thread had a similar experience to mine and I know they guy who did the job on my car damaged another customers car, so it's not beyond the realms of possibility that he also damaged mine.


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    #15
    iano.p
    Closed Accounts Posts: 817 ✭✭✭iano.p


    I had hassle with the one here. He closed down the bonnet with tools in it and the latch was stuck and the bonnet wouldn't open. Never said anything. Two days later I couldn't open the bonnet so long story short. Rang auto glass said they didn't do it. But when I got it open I found a screw driver and a cheese cutter type tool in there with a lads name on the handle. Had to go small claims in the end.


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    #16
    Miaireland
    Registered Users Posts: 4,063 ✭✭✭Miaireland


    Sometimes you get a better response if you write to the head of the company rather than just talking to someone there. When I say writing I mean a letter sent by registered post.

    Detail your complaint.

    Explain that you were not given the opportunity to inspect the car but was instead was lead into the office and asked to sign the form.

    Included pictures of the marks.

    I know some companies will dismiss complaints over the phone or in person and only take them seriously when they come in writing . Their attitude is that most people give up rather than putting their complaint in writing.


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    #17
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Thanks for sharing your experience. How long did the small claims process take?


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    #18
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 14,344 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Signing a sheet doesn't make it law-proof.

    If you sign a child over to me, it's not then automatically my child. Or for a more realistic one, if a delivery man delivers, for argument sake, a sofa, to your house, and you sign for it, saying it arrived in good nick, that doesn't mean it actually arrived in good nick.


    A judge won't tell you off for having signed the form. It will have no legal standing whatsoever (especially in the case of you not having been able to inspect the work).


    If it's so obvious that they did the damage, then I'd take photographs of the damage and contact their head office. In the letter explain that you're giving them X amount of time to rectify it, or you're going to the small claims court. Sent it by registered post.

    On the due date, if they haven't sorted it, bring them to the small claims court. If it's 'obvious' that it was their fault, as you say, then a judge will rule in your favour. Their insurance will cover it anyway, so at that point you most likely wouldn't have any more hassle or issues.


    The threat of the Small Claims Court alone may get them to acknowledge you. But I think it's less than €20 to attend the court so it's well worth doing. Re-sprays would be quite pricy.


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    #19
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Thanks KKV. I'll follow up with a letter with photos and mention the small claims court route. Re-sprays are pricey. I spend €550 on bodywork in November. The car was in good nick beforehand, unfortunately it just had a few small chips on several body panels--which made it expensive & which is why I want this to be resolved by those responsible for doing the damage.


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    #20
    iano.p
    Closed Accounts Posts: 817 ✭✭✭iano.p


    It cost 25 euro for the small claims. It took about 3 months from what I can remember was a few years ago now. Take loads of pictures and don't back down they offered me 100 euro and wiper blades. I almost chocked with laughing when he said that in the end I got just over a grand for the damage. I had 3 quotes. The judge done the rest.


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    #21
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,271 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    If you are going to go to court, can you tell us how you intend to prove that they did the damage?

    And I mean the word "prove". What is the proof, beyond "it must have been them"?


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    #22
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 14,344 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Well if he can get a professional in the industry (panel beater, mechanic, etc) to look at it and give a written statement saying that in their professional opinion, the damage could very likely be caused by carelessly replacing a windscreen, then a judge may look more favourably on his case..


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    #23
    bucketybuck
    Registered Users Posts: 18,271 ✭✭✭✭bucketybuck


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Well if he can get a professional in the industry (panel beater, mechanic, etc) to look at it and give a written statement saying that in their professional opinion, the damage could very likely be caused by carelessly replacing a windscreen, then a judge may look more favourably on his case..

    But that isn't proof, its just another opinion?

    I'm a professional in the industry, have been all my life, I could look at some scratches on a car and take a damn good stab at the cause, no problem at all. But its still just my opinion, worth not very much.

    You go to court, the garage will simply say that they did not damage the car. The OP will say that they did. One word against the another, except that the garage has a signed statement from the OP saying they are happy with the work done.

    I would genuinely like to know how that court case doesn't end in only one way?


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    #24
    Drummerboy08
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,102 ✭✭✭✭Drummerboy08


    Was the car parked in a public area un supervised after the screen was fitted for any amount of time?


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    #25
    colm_mcm
    Registered Users Posts: 73,417 ✭✭✭✭colm_mcm


    Drummerboy08 wrote: »
    Was the car parked in a public area un supervised after the screen was fitted for any amount of time?


    fc,550x550,orange.u1.jpg


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    #26
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Drummerboy08 wrote: »
    Was the car parked in a public area un supervised after the screen was fitted for any amount of time?

    Good question. No it wasn't. Apart from being at my private house in the countryside, the only car parks it was in after the windscreen was replaced was outside my office and at Tesco, both of which are patrolled by security guards and with CCTV cameras.

    Even if that wasn't the case they'd have to be very clever, specialised vandals to damage the car where the scratches are etc and make it look like it a coincidence that it was after the windscreen was replaced. There are plenty more visible places on the car for vandals to damage--and besides, it's a 2002 family estate with roof rack bars. Hardly a glamorous vandal magnet.


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    #27
    SilverCoin2100
    Registered Users Posts: 24 ✭SilverCoin2100


    Pippy Baby wrote: »
    I don't think it's realistic trying to fingerprints. No one is obliged anyway to allow you compare what you get from the car with their prints.

    Read what I said again: 'I'm talking about very specific type of scratches in very specific places which is like fingerprints on a crime scene.'

    i.e. the damage done is clearly scrapes from installing a windscreen....they are clues to what happened....similarly as fingerprints at a crime scene are clues to who committed the crime.
    I'm not asking anyone for their actual fingerprints....


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    #28
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 14,344 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    But that isn't proof, its just another opinion?

    But it adds weight to the OP's case. If a panel beater can say that "judging by the shape and curvature of the scraping/damage, as a panel beater with X amount of experience in the trade, i would believe it is entirely possible that this damage could likely be caused by inserting a new windscreen without due care.

    The level and formation of rust leads me to believe this damage may have occurred in the past X amount of days/weeks."


    It might be completely dismissed by a judge, but it might be the anecdotal evidence that swings things in his favour, either.


    If it were me, I'd be going mad if i just resprayed a car panel and then someone damaged it straight away again.


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    #29
    ba_barabus
    Registered Users Posts: 9,615 ✭✭✭ba_barabus


    bucketybuck wrote: »
    If you are going to go to court, can you tell us how you intend to prove that they did the damage?

    And I mean the word "prove". What is the proof, beyond "it must have been them"?

    If I'm not mistaken in the small claims court it's up to the business to prove their innocents. Its weighted in favour of the consumer to encourage small claims to be brought forward. The consumer makes the claim and the business has to go to the trouble of putting a defence which proves their innocence forward.

    My interpretation could be wrong but this is what I'm lead to believe.


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    #30
    Henry Ford III
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 17,666 Mod ✭✭✭✭Henry Ford III


    You signed a discharge/disclaimer saying you were happy with the repair OP. I reckon that absolutely skittles any hope you might have had of compensation.

    The only evidence in a potential legal case is the signed disclaimer, and a car that could have been damaged by almost anyone within the 10 days after the repair and before the damage was actually discovered.


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    #31
    ba_barabus
    Registered Users Posts: 9,615 ✭✭✭ba_barabus


    Henry Ford III wrote: »
    You signed a discharge/disclaimer saying you were happy with the repair OP. I reckon that absolutely skittles any hope you might have had of compensation.

    The only evidence in a potential legal case is the signed disclaimer, and a car that could have been damaged by almost anyone within the 10 days after the repair and before the damage was actually discovered.

    But if the work wasn't carried out correctly in the first instance it will have broken the sale and supply of services act which would mean the disclaimer the OP signed after the damage was done was void. Don't forget, any disclaimer won't carry any legal weight if the consumer acts themselves were broken by the company in the first place.

    OP, I'm not a legal expert however, maybe the legal forum might be more suited to this?

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=633


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