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Food and drink on long cycles

  • 26-10-2014 11:47AM
    #1
    Domane
    Closed Accounts Posts: 268 ✭✭


    While I'm fairly new to regular cycling (4 months now), I'm now doing a minimum of 100km each Saturday (too dark when I get home weeknights so I do 2 one hour long spinning classes during the week to compensate) and I also run, so I'm fairly fit. However I'm finding that I constantly hit the proverbial "wall" in the last 10km of my cycle each week and slow right down, despite what I think is good hydration and food intake on the ride.

    So I'd like some opinions if I'm way off the mark with what I think is a sufficient refuelling regime eg
    -I have a good carb intake the night before the cycle and I drink a litre of water before the cycle
    - I bring 1.5 litres of water with me in two bottles
    - I bring two bananas and two apples
    - I bring a "high energy" muesli type bar
    - I have one "gel"

    I average 27-28kph on the ride but this trails off to 20-22kph for the last 10km each week. Am I getting enough water and food or is it just a case of keeping at it until my fitness levels catch up? Btw, I'm mid forties and in good shape. My bike is a new Trek Domane carbon.

    Thanks for any advice


Comments

  • #2
    Keep_Her_Lit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 725 ✭✭✭Keep_Her_Lit


    I think you could comfortably consume a lot more calories than you're currently doing. Are you limiting yourself to water for some particular reason? I add High5 sachets to my water and I'd also consume 4-6 gels on a ride of that length. While I like a banana, I wouldn't bother with apples. I tend avoid foods that require any amount of chewing, as I don't like my mouth being half full when I'm breathing hard.

    Since you're only running out of steam near the end of your ride, you may well find that a moderate increase in your energy intake will solve the problem. Some trial and error should sort it out for you.


  • #3
    Buzwaldo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 740 ✭✭✭Buzwaldo


    Had similar fade myself last year and similar questions to you. With more cycling this year however, I can generally do 100 k at anything between 25 kph( hilly/rolling solo) to 30 kph ( flat/rolling in a group) with no food intake, or maybe one nutrigrain/ fig roll and plenty of water. Always good breakfast though.
    Not an expert by any means, just cycling 4 years, and closer to 50 than 40, not a natural athlete.
    Never tried gels.
    People vary, but may just be a question of building cycling stamina.


  • #4
    outfox
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 942 ✭✭✭outfox


    +1 on the electrolyte tabs in the water. Makes a huge difference.
    I'd stay clear of the gels - they only cause your sugar level to jump and down, which makes bonking more likely. On the basis of advice I got on the boards previously, I started eating LESS on rides. Took a few weeks/months to adapt, but worth it in the long term.


  • #5
    harringtonp
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,590 ✭✭✭harringtonp


    Nutrition may play a part but suspect it is a lot to do with general cycling fitness. First year on regular spins with a club I was always hitting a wall towards the end in spite of taking energy drink, sometimes gels, banana etc.

    Gone from this intake on 3 hr spins to just a single bottle of water but a very good breakfast beforehand. When racing though take energy drink and have jellies in back pocket but as these are usually the short side of 3 hours don't hit the wall.

    Looking back club spins for me a few years ago were probably like long races, hence the wall. Now they feel like training as they should be and that is down to extra fitness.

    So persevere and you probably won't hit the wall even if you neglect nutrition a bit.


  • #6
    butterworth
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 67 ✭✭butterworth


    Something similar happened to me in the last 20km of a 130km cycle. Just felt extremely run down with little notice, and I concluded that I hadn't drank enough fluids during. When I finally got home I put myself on the scales and I weighed around 2.5kg less than when I started, so I figured that was mostly water weight!


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  • #7
    slap/dash
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 648 ✭✭✭slap/dash


    Id agree that you could easily eat more on a long ride. Gels are fir emergency only for me unless your racing or have really run out of food. They make me crash around 35-50 mins later and so I'll only use when I know I can refuel again soon.
    I'd agree with the electrolyte tabs. I use hi5 ones that have no caffeine or calories.

    More protein might be something to think about. I generally try to bring some nuts and a savoury item like beef jerky or whatever really helps if your all the time eating sweet things.

    I also swear by beetroot or radish. Some bars have those ingredients.

    Finally, wrap a few dates or figs in tinfoil instead of gels: no wrapper to deal with.


  • #8
    boege
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 468 ✭✭boege


    I would agree with HarringtonP. It is probably a general fitness issue.

    27/28kmph at this time of year is steady pace for group riding. Doing it on your own after only 4 months suggests you may be pushing yourself too hard, (or you'r a natural).

    Ease up a bit and you should be Ok. Use a heart monitor and then train on heart rate to keep in the required training zone and avoid over extertion.

    Its unlikely to be a carb issue. 100km at this time of year for me would be one large bottle (maybe a small one also) and a bar (maybe one gel also). Often come back with bar/gel unused. My average on my own would be around 25/26kmph though and I'm your regular fred sportif rider.


  • #9
    Domane
    Closed Accounts Posts: 268 ✭✭Domane


    Many thanks to all for the advice. I've bought some High 5 tabs to add to my drinks to see if they help.

    I was doing a bit of research and part of my problem could be electrolyte imbalance through sweating. Someone suggested using "Diarrlyte" (the pick me up remedy after diarrhoea) as it's formulated to replace lost electrolytes. However I'll hold off to see if the High 5 tabs work.


  • #10
    Domane
    Closed Accounts Posts: 268 ✭✭Domane


    boege wrote: »
    I would agree with HarringtonP. It is probably a general fitness issue.

    27/28kmph at this time of year is steady pace for group riding. Doing it on your own after only 4 months suggests you may be pushing yourself too hard, (or you'r a natural).

    Ease up a bit and you should be Ok. Use a heart monitor and then train on heart rate to keep in the required training zone and avoid over extertion.

    Its unlikely to be a carb issue. 100km at this time of year for me would be one large bottle (maybe a small one also) and a bar (maybe one gel also). Often come back with bar/gel unused. My average on my own would be around 25/26kmph though and I'm your regular fred sportif rider.

    I'd agree that I'm probably pushing too hard but that's just the way I am😳. I sometimes go out with a mate for a 60-80km spin and we average 22kph and I feel like I could cycle all day at that pace. When on my own, I know I go too fast but with no one to pace me, it's hard to slow down. I went through a village yesterday that had one of those signs that tells you your speed and I was doing 43kph according to this sign😯


  • #11
    Pharma
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 50 ✭✭Pharma


    Test yourself, head out with one bottle of water, no food and see how far you get.

    I find I run out of fitness before I run out of food or energy.

    I did 165km yesterday at 30kph on one bottle of water and a coffee. Felt a bit strange after 130k but just gritted my teeth and drove on.

    It makes it interesting to see what cycling with low blood sugar feels like. Food tastes better when you get home. Dehydration and hypoglycaemia are great fun, it's like bring drunk on a bike.

    I don't understand why people take gels or bars with them, they are expensive, not very nice and horribly synthetic. Bananas, apples and nuts are a lot better.
    I suppose if you want to believe the marketing and "research then fair enough but unless you are a pro or semi pro there's no need for anything special.

    Personally I never bring any food with me no matter how long or how far, I like stop at a shop for a coffee and bananas or a cereal bar, sometimes I get an ice cream. Exploring the shops of the country is part of the enjoyment. I only ever drink water or coffee. No need for electrolytes, body is incredibly good at regulating salt despite what lucosade and powerade will have you believe.


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  • #12
    Domane
    Closed Accounts Posts: 268 ✭✭Domane


    I'm definitely missing "something" on these long rides as I felt "strange" when I got home, ie lifeless and I had a bit of a temperature for the evening, or at least I felt like I did. I go running up to 14km in distance but I've never felt like this before. While I'm no spring chicken anymore, I'd say I'm as fit as most guys half my age. So there must be that certain "something" I'm missing out on, whether it's more water, food, electrolytes or whatever. Guess I'll just have to use trial and error to see what works.


  • #13
    pprendeville
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,910 ✭✭✭pprendeville


    What's your diet like in general, mainly carbs, higher in fats/protein. I would suggest bringing some food containing protein/fat for spins like that. Carb loading the night before isnt the way to go IMO. See this thread for more info. Thread #548 proves you don't need many carbs for long rides. Messes with your blood sugar levels only and leads to bonking early.


  • #14
    ford2600
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,457 ✭✭✭ford2600


    pprendeville wrote: »
    What's your diet like in general, mainly carbs, higher in fats/protein. I would suggest bringing some food containing protein/fat for spins like that. Carb loading the night before isnt the way to go IMO. See this thread for more info. Thread #548 proves you don't need many carbs for long rides. Messes with your blood sugar levels only and leads to bonking early.

    OP, I think the most relevant thing in your post is your cycling 4 months. Getting strong takes time.
    If your smart with training/rest/diet/sleep that time will be shorter.

    What @pharma does works for me also, the only difference being he is a proper cyclist!


  • #15
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 16,141 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    As a pure leisure cyclist, on a long spin, I usually take bananas, crushed fruit type energy bars, and some Hi5 4:1 in the bottles. 175k yesterday, started with two slices of toast and a large mug of black coffee. Over the ride I had three energy bars, two large bottles with two scoops of 4:1, and one large bottle of lucozade and one of water. Two cans of Sombrero on arrival, and a big feed of roast chicken, spuds, and cake about an hour later. Still piling on the pounds, but hey, life is short ;)

    If I was serious about cycling, I'd certainly try ditching the carbs and giving the LCHF diet a go.

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  • #16
    Yarisbob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 127 ✭✭Yarisbob


    Pharma wrote: »
    It makes it interesting to see what cycling with low blood sugar feels like. Food tastes better when you get home. Dehydration and hypoglycaemia are great fun, it's like bring drunk on a bike.

    +1 on this - I'm Type 1 diabetic ... It happened me earlier this year when I was doing a recovery ride and got caught up in a whole racing match...!

    I was down to 6mph for about 3 or so miles - Passed a petrol station and pulled in to the next one. I could just about walk and all I could say to the girl was "feed me please"

    I was given a chair in behind the till and it took me about 6 proper sausage rolls, 2 cans of coke and 3 turkish delights to start coming around. It took me 3/4 hour to even consider the bike.

    My sugars were still only 8.2mmol 2.5 hrs later even after 270g of pure carbohydrates as detailed above.

    Lesson learned - If you are on a recovery ride dont get involved in any owl carry on !!

    The hypoglycemia you get off a gel is sudden just like a switch... I was told by my brilliant dietitician to stay away from gels... She recommended me not to eat for the first 50k or 3/4hr then a fig roll or 3 jelly babies every 20 mins depending on load

    A good breakfeast of porridge + golden syrup + bran flakes - Two bowls really works for me. And maybe an owl fryup if im really hungry.... !

    If I am on a long spin I'll check my levels at the food stop and cut my insulin dose in half starting from the night before until the following morning....! All a bit of a balancing act but this works for me and keeps me and others safe

    everybody is different and its a bit of trial and error


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