Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Note in OP, 1/09

LuckyLloyd · 26-10-2014 07:58AM

NukaCola wrote: »

Thats a big problem that you and a lot of people have here. Last season was phenomenal. But our level is to challenge for top 4. Too many are expecting too much because of last year.

We're in the ****? Us and a number of top teams I would argue are currently "In the ****" based on current form. I dont think its unrealistic to suggest that we will improve. As long as we are in the mix for top 4 I dont think anyone can complain. But they will. There is always something to moan about.

The point I am making is that we could be eliminated from realistic chase for top four by Christmas. We're hanging on at the moment and our form is abysmal. Plenty of dragons on the fixture list between now and then.

djPSB · 26-10-2014 08:05AM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Swansea (h) LC
Newcastle (a) EPL
Real Madrid (a) CL
Chelsea (h) EPL
Crystal Palace (a) EPL
Ludogorets (a) CL
Stoke City (h) EPL
Leicester City (a) EPL
Sunderland (h) EPL
Basel (h) CL
Man Utd (a) EPL
Arsenal (h) EPL

Christmas

Last season we were top of the table while tucking into the Turkey. This year our relevant season could be over and serious questions being asked over Rodger's long term viability at the club.

Make no mistake about it - we're in the ****.

Posts like this are making this thread unreadable. It's worrying how some people can be constantly so negative.

Devilman40k · 26-10-2014 08:18AM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The point I am making is that we could be eliminated from realistic chase for top four by Christmas. We're hanging on at the moment and our form is abysmal. Plenty of dragons on the fixture list between now and then.

Yes we "could" be out of the running for a top 4 spot. But just as easily be in the top 4 at Christmas.

Considering Arsenals result v Hull last week we've matched that. Should have bettered it but we didn't we move on. Those around us are just as inconsistent as we are this season and Chelsea are out on their own

We are unbeaten now in 4 in the league despite being terrible we just have to build on that.

LuckyLloyd · 26-10-2014 08:18AM

djPSB wrote: »

Posts like this are making this thread unreadable. It's worrying how some people can be constantly so negative.

Well read somewhere else so.

kryogen · 26-10-2014 08:19AM

The thing about going so close and finishing 2nd is that expectations get raised, that is natural in fairness. The expectations were low last year and the year before in all honesty, this year they are higher, you have to deal with that as a manager/players. A big player was lost, of course, but money was spent, a lot of money. Southampton were absolutely gutted of their top names, you can't use it as something to hide behind if you want to be taken seriously as a top competitor which is what Liverpool announced themselves as last season.

NukaCola · 26-10-2014 08:24AM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

The point I am making is that we could be eliminated from realistic chase for top four by Christmas. We're hanging on at the moment and our form is abysmal. Plenty of dragons on the fixture list between now and then.

We "could" be. You also said we "are" in the ****.

We "could" realistically also be in the next stages of the CL and in the hunt for top 4.

Nobody is ripping up the league at the moment (apart from Chelsea), and while I'm all for realism, the negativity is a bit much. It seems there is no middle ground anymore. Its either the worst case scenario or the best.

By christmas, if we are 6+ points off top 4 I will start to worry. As of now, we need to improve, no doubt about it. Lets not lose our minds though by trying to predict results of games months away.

NukaCola · 26-10-2014 08:32AM

kryogen wrote: »

The thing about going so close and finishing 2nd is that expectations get raised, that is natural in fairness. The expectations were low last year and the year before in all honesty, this year they are higher, you have to deal with that as a manager/players. A big player was lost, of course, but money was spent, a lot of money. Southampton were absolutely gutted of their top names, you can't use it as something to hide behind if you want to be taken seriously as a top competitor which is what Liverpool announced themselves as last season.

Liverpool squad is behind ManCity/Chelsea/Arsenal and probably on par with Utd (I'm not going to debate which is better lets just say for the sake of argument they are on par). ManCity/Chelsea/Arsenal also have settled squads at this point. Those are the facts. To expect to out perform them is unfair. We have the 4th/5th best squad in the league. While we should look to finish as high as possible some people need to be realistic. Top four challenge is the most likely outcome this season unless you want to dream.

klose · 26-10-2014 08:36AM

klose wrote: »

That berahino fella looks decent, can't wait to spend 20 million on him next summer

So it begins
http://dailym.ai/1wxKMkB

**** source i know but obvious player to be linked with is obvious.

kryogen · 26-10-2014 08:37AM

I get what your saying, simply pointing out that it is a natural thing to happen after a season such as last. Expectations and reality don't always match up. People expect you to keep pushing on, to at least consolidate, and to be perfectly honest finishing in the top four again would achieve that consolidation in my opinion, it will be much tougher this time around.

jesus_thats_gre · 26-10-2014 08:47AM

djPSB wrote: »

Posts like this are making this thread unreadable. It's worrying how some people can be constantly so negative.

Both extremes have that affect on threads. What I am finding considerably more irksome is an inability to impartially assess the opening quarter of the season.

Alan and Lloyd may have their own unique style but they are largely correct. The signing we have made are not working out and and our performances are extremely poor. In addition, BR seems to sticking relentlessly to tactics that aren't working.

We have taken a huge step back from last season - the team looks lost out there. It is the nature of our performances, not the results, that is driving this negativity.

So give the school yard bullying crap a break.

jesus_thats_gre · 26-10-2014 08:55AM

kryogen wrote: »

I get what your saying, simply pointing out that it is a natural thing to happen after a season such as last. Expectations and reality don't always match up. People expect you to keep pushing on, to at least consolidate, and to be perfectly honest finishing in the top four again would achieve that consolidation in my opinion, it will be much tougher this time around.

At the end of last season, I posted that we should immediately forget that we were contenders and focus on securing that top 4 position for seasons to come.

Any title run beyond that point is just a bonus - certainly shouldn't be an expectation.

We are doing just about enough to stay in contention for top 4. I expect that we will improve somewhat and maybe even make 3rd place a competition.

My worry is that we keep stumbling along and while we might still be in contention, it won't have been done with any control. I also fear getting torn apart a few more times this season.

What happens then becomes the question. BR has earned trust and time but if the performances continue to stagnate, something has to change - not necessarily him either.

whatawaster · 26-10-2014 08:58AM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Swansea (h) LC
Newcastle (a) EPL
Real Madrid (a) CL
Chelsea (h) EPL
Crystal Palace (a) EPL
Ludogorets (a) CL
Stoke City (h) EPL
Leicester City (a) EPL
Sunderland (h) EPL
Basel (h) CL
Man Utd (a) EPL
Arsenal (h) EPL

Christmas

Last season we were top of the table while tucking into the Turkey. This year our relevant season could be over and serious questions being asked over Rodger's long term viability at the club.

Make no mistake about it - we're in the ****.

The FA cup doesn't start until January

michael999999 · 26-10-2014 09:03AM

Oranage2 wrote: »

Could these poor performances be a hang up from how close they got last season?

It looks like a lot of players have lost heart or they don't believe anymore and I wonder how much that is because of emotional drain. Anybody in that position would find it hard to start all over with the same enthusiasm, imo.

Being an arsenal fan your well used to seeing teams not able to motivate themselves!

Talisman · 26-10-2014 09:15AM

kryogen wrote: »

I get what your saying, simply pointing out that it is a natural thing to happen after a season such as last. Expectations and reality don't always match up. People expect you to keep pushing on, to at least consolidate, and to be perfectly honest finishing in the top four again would achieve that consolidation in my opinion, it will be much tougher this time around.

It's a fair argument, but a certain Brendan Rodgers has done nothing to manage the expectation level this season.

A while ago he was thrown a life line by the media in a press conference by a suggestion that because of the large influx of players and the departure of a star player, the club would be in for a transitional season and the team would not be at the same level as last season.

Instead of agreeing with the journalist who asked the question, Rodgers delivered the ingenious answer that the former Southampton players all played in a similar setup to Liverpool so they would transition quickly. Every player signed is supposedly meticulously researched so that they are a good fit as a player on the pitch and their personality to adapt to the culture off of it. Liverpool 2014/15 would not be like Tottenham 2013/14, because Brendan Rodgers and his staff have done their homework.

In case you missed the press release, Brendan Rodgers is the smartest man in football, and Liverpool are very lucky that he signed a long term contract last season.

The truth is Brendan Rodgers talks more than his fair share of BS at times and rather than challenge him, the media swallow it, regurgitate it and feed it to the fans.

Last season he tried to manage expectations some what - if Chelsea were a little horse then Liverpool are a Chihuahua etc. There has been little of that this season, but we have seen some revisionism after the fact is his interviews.

5live · 26-10-2014 09:17AM

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Both extremes have that affect on threads. What I am finding considerably more irksome is an inability to impartially assess the opening quarter of the season.

Alan and Lloyd may have their own unique style but they are largely correct. The signing we have made are not working out and and our performances are extremely poor. In addition, BR seems to sticking relentlessly to tactics that aren't working.

We have taken a huge step back from last season - the team looks lost out there. It is the nature of our performances, not the results, that is driving this negativity.

So give the school yard bullying crap a break.

That is one way of putting it, alright:D.

As for the schoolyard bullying jibe, that applies in both directions eg the 'retarded' debate.

26-10-2014 09:44AM

Devilman40k wrote: »

Yes we "could" be out of the running for a top 4 spot. But just as easily be in the top 4 at Christmas.

Considering Arsenals result v Hull last week we've matched that. Should have bettered it but we didn't we move on. Those around us are just as inconsistent as we are this season and Chelsea are out on their own

We are unbeaten now in 4 in the league despite being terrible we just have to build on that.

Top 4 is wide open. If your a couple of points off 4th your still well in contention. As you say, only one team you can bank on for concistancy and that's Chelsea .

Regardless of how bad your actually playing if you can win badly at QPR etc then no reason why you shouldn't be challanging.

I would be concerned if you managed to get berehino in January. Great bit of stuff for west brom this season.

In the short term, I have no idea why Rodgers won't give borini a chance alongside Mario. I think you will get more from him with two up front and its not like borini can't score goals

slingerz · 26-10-2014 09:53AM

Is the swansea game on TV??

Rodgers needs to change up the system and where he's deploying players as it's not working

For Swansea

Mignolet
Manquillo Toure Lovren Enrique
Markovic Lucas Henderson Lallana
Lambert Balotelli

klose · 26-10-2014 09:57AM

Na swansea game isint on the telly, surely borini will get his game then?

jesus_thats_gre · 26-10-2014 10:02AM

5live wrote: »

That is one way of putting it, alright:D.

As for the schoolyard bullying jibe, that applies in both directions eg the 'retarded' debate.

Responses from a critical mass of frequent posters on this thread to their posts are prejudiced. No matter what point the guys make, in whatever style, the core of their point is lost immediately as someone jumps on them - very much attacking the poster.

The guys have been consistently posting on this thread years now - as I have been. The jibes fired in Alan's direction now actually give me a chuckle as he used to be accused of the complete opposite when he first joined the forum - I remember PM'ing him at the time asking him to tone down the positive bias towards everything Liverpool.

In terms of the whole 'retarded' stuff. I won't comment as I have used the term myself to describe view on here :P

In fairness to the guys. Both has come out and said that they were wrong about BR. That is a fairly bold thing to do when you are being shouted down every other post.

The core of what they are saying is correct through. It can be contested somewhat but the dismissals raise serious questions about the appetite for impartial analysis on this thread.

Mr Alan · 26-10-2014 10:08AM

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

It can be contested somewhat but the dismissals raise serious questions about the appetite for impartial analysis on this thread.

There's no real desire for impartial analysis from the majority of this thread.

Gbear · 26-10-2014 10:10AM

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Both extremes have that affect on threads. What I am finding considerably more irksome is an inability to impartially assess the opening quarter of the season.

We have taken a huge step back from last season - the team looks lost out there. It is the nature of our performances, not the results, that is driving this negativity.

Except I don't think I've seen anyone on the other extreme or, at least, the negative-for-the-sake-of-it posters far outnumber them.

Everyone is unhappy with how we're playing. I don't think anyone thinks that the squad is where it needs to be right now, even if you caveat that statement by saying we're a work in progress and we're at the start of virtually a new team.

But lots of posters are in absolute hysterics at the moment and they need to calm down and get a bit of perspective.
Thus far we've improved in the 2nd half of the season in Rodgers' time here, we've done no worse than our competitors for top 4 so far this season, we still have a very good chance at qualifying from the CL and for all the moaning about the signings, we have an extremely young side with a lot of talented young footballers.

We need to get the next couple of signings right, we need to pick up enough points and crawl into January within touching distance of our rivals and we do need to get fundamentally better when those new signings arrive (or Sturridge proves he can actually stay fit).

But none of those points are wildly unlikely. Despite what the tabloid mentality of today would suggest, we're not in crisis.

Agent Coulson · 26-10-2014 10:24AM

klose wrote: »

So it begins
http://dailym.ai/1wxKMkB

**** source i know but obvious player to be linked with is obvious.

This is the reason we will never win the league.

West Brom want £25 fcuking million. I'm not say we will go for him but more than likely we will go for someone like him young with potential for stupid money instead of paying the extra £10million to buy a proven player in his mid/late 20's.

ebbsy · 26-10-2014 10:26AM

klose wrote: »

Na swansea game isint on the telly, surely borini will get his game then?

Hopefully not bud.

Agent Coulson · 26-10-2014 10:26AM

Charlie19 wrote: »

What a captain.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/liverpool-boss-brendan-rodgers-makes-4509504

So this is why Gerrard isn't being dropped.

Playing every minute of every game is the rent price he is charging Rodgers :pac::pac::pac:

Bowlardo · 26-10-2014 10:27AM

We waited 5 years to get back to the champions league, where we were told we need to be in order to get be able to attract the best player. In my opinion there is no player we have bought in the two years that we could not have good regardless of been in the champions league or not. not one!

Heard that BR mentioned that he thought suarez was staying until the world cup bite. That is so naïve I can't get over it.
Hoping sturridge comes back soon and saves the day but it will be only a matter of time before he is injured again.
36 million on Ballotelli and Markovic....35 million could have got us a damn good striker.
As it stands I would have lambert starting every game and sterling off him
Coutninhon lalanna Gerard and allen.
People can say what they want about Ricky but he socres goals and sets up goal. Both of those points can not be said about ballotelli

super_furry · 26-10-2014 10:41AM

We have to stop buying average in-form Premier League players. From Charlie Adam to Stewart Downing to Lambert and Lovren, it's like we let the Match of the Day pundits pick our transfer targets.

MD1990 · 26-10-2014 10:42AM

Watching MOTD yesterday was very frustating. So many of the other teams signings are performing very well. Out of all our new signings I have been very disapointed in Markovic. His lack of courage to do anything is a major concern. He could still be a very good player in a few years but with Sterling & Ibe the signing wasn't necessary.

Mr Alan · 26-10-2014 10:44AM

Gbear wrote: »

We need to get the next couple of signings right, we need to pick up enough points and crawl into January within touching distance of our rivals and we do need to get fundamentally better when those new signings arrive (or Sturridge proves he can actually stay fit).

But none of those points are wildly unlikely. Despite what the tabloid mentality of today would suggest, we're not in crisis.

An example of how there's no desire for reasonable discussion here.

The post I'm quoting was essentially saying "yea things aren't going great but it should be easy enough to improve by Sturridge staying fit & us getting a couple of top signings in Jan who hit the ground running"

What should be clear after the last couple of seasons is that;

1) Sturridge is unlikely to stay fit

2) Rodgers is very very unlikely to get two top signings in 1 window who both hit the ground running. He has shown as a manager he's not very good in the transfer market to no honest.

Also to note FSG after forking out well over >£100m during the summer are unlikely to back another splurge in the transfer market. And to be totally fair, they couldn't be blamed for that.

So both points you say we need to get our season back on track are in fact the opposite of what you said, they are both wildly unlikely.

pmy.murphy · 26-10-2014 10:53AM

Hollister11 wrote: »

Jens Toornstra

Or

Paco alcacer

I like Toornstra, very good player

kevohmsford · 26-10-2014 10:58AM

I just can't see Rodgers getting more money from the owners. We need to bring in 2 quality players in January. Time will tell.

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Note in OP, 1/09

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