Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Note in OP, 1/09

SlickRic · 01-09-2014 10:37AM

honestly, not that bothered about Falcao to Utd unless the rest of their spine, and the pace of their play, significantly improves.

joe123 · 01-09-2014 10:38AM

Lads is there any Deadline day stream/radio station etc that I could listen to while at work?

Talisman · 01-09-2014 10:39AM

OwaynOTT wrote: »

I would say that Ridgers 56 wins from 100 is more impressive than Rafa's and Dalglish. Both of those started out in stronger positions than Rodgers.

Crazy talk.

2004/5 - Benitez inherited a bunch of Houllier's misfits.

Dudek - dodgy keeper
Kirkland - made of glass
Henchoz - crocked defender
Traore - bambi on ice??
Kewell - crocked star player
Biscan - ??
Diao - ??
Diouf - ??
Cisse - ??
Owen - he who had already lined up a move to Spain

Five of those won a European Cup against all the odds but that does not mean they were good players.

Building blocks Benitez had to work with:
Finnan, Hyypia, Carragher, Riise, Hamann, Gerrard

Benitez left Rodgers in a better position:
Reina, Agger, Skrtel, Johnson, Carragher, Gerrard & Lucas
Future prospects:
Kelly, Flanagan, Robinson, Shelvey, Suso & Sterling
Dalglish added these:
Enrique, Coates, Henderson & Suarez

There is a world of difference between the quality of the squad and the youth players that Rodgers inherited and that which Benitez started with.

Harry Palmr · 01-09-2014 10:42AM

joe123 wrote: »

Lads is there any Deadline day stream/radio station etc that I could listen to while at work?

Talksport spending most of the day on this.

http://talksport.com/radioplayer/live/?rpSt=talksport&rpSrp=1.0

Dickerty · 01-09-2014 10:42AM

SlickRic wrote: »

honestly, not that bothered about Falcao to Utd unless the rest of their spine, and the pace of their play, significantly improves.

I think it's fair to say that with Mata, Di Maria, Rooney and Falcao, they will improve on the attacking front. But he needs to dump the back 3 idea, firm up the defence on the wings, to have any chance of winning games regularly..

viper006 · 01-09-2014 10:44AM

SlickRic wrote: »

honestly, not that bothered about Falcao to Utd unless the rest of their spine, and the pace of their play, significantly improves.

How many more times are we going to say this every time united sign someone. Falcao and Di Maria are absolutlely amazing sigings of them. They are slowly upgrading almost every area of their team.

I would have much rathered Falcao than ballotelli to be honest. Having said that im happier falcao is going to united and not arsenal.

segadreamcast · 01-09-2014 10:45AM

gafferino wrote: »

Jaysus that was out of left field! Well they can afford him and his wages in fairness. Apparently its because RVP requires surgery.
Anyway it still doesnt address their CM or defensive issues. Hopefully they will continue their form for the next few weeks at least which might leave them with too much to do.

Great team performance yesterday. It could have been more than 3 and only the one real chance for Spurs. What was great to see (and in the first half versus City) was some of last years form coming through. If we can keep that going and get the new lads settled we should be able to keep pace at the top. These are our upcoming PL fixtures to Nov 1st:

Villa (H)
West Ham (A)
Everton (H)
West Brom (H)
QPR (A)
Hull (H)
Newcastle (A)

We need to build momentum up over the next 2 months and its as good a fixtures schedule as we'll get.

Yeah, found myself turning to the fixture list for the first time last night since Spurs - hadn't looked ahead of GW3 until now, not sure why!

Anyway, this is a fantastic run-in, and even allowing for an outlier loss of points (there's generally always one!), 16-18 points would be realistic, with a draw against Everton and then a surprise loss/draw somewhere along the way. Now, you never know, anything can happen, but as long as we go above 14 in the period, we'll start to build up a nice head of steam anyway.

rob316 · 01-09-2014 10:47AM

GBX wrote: »

Its a serious bit of business if the pull it off. They need to invest in other areas IMO. Why didnt Liverpool take a chance? Too expensive loan deal? Or doesnt fit with the plans for youth going forward?

I'd imagine his €10m net wage demands were the problem.

segadreamcast · 01-09-2014 10:48AM

viper006 wrote: »

How many more times are we going to say this every time united sign someone. Falcao and Di Maria are absolutlely amazing sigings of them. They are slowly upgrading almost every area of their team.

I would have much rathered Falcao than ballotelli to be honest. Having said that im happier falcao is going to united and not arsenal.

Meh, I'm honestly not too bothered about Falcao - and it's not sour grapes. He's 28, dodgy knee, has been on the wane for a while, might bang in some goals for them, but will have to be starting every week too. Balotelli - again, I wasn't a huge fan of the signing - gives us options. He's 24. Wasn't crazy expensive. Has impressed me so far.

Falcao wanted 10m in wage a year, Balotelli is presumably on closer to 5m (I'm ignoring the claims that he took half his wages as it's murky, we know he was on 5m, so I'll stick with that). Significant difference. Especially when you add up their strikeforce wages and ours - Rooney is on around 15m a year, RVP 12.2m, Falcao 10m. Sturridge? 3.3m in 2012, was "set to double" at end of season gone, so presume it's around 7m now. LFC strikeforce costs us 12m per year, MUFCs costs 37.2m per year - and they can't even play all three of them at once! It's insane.

Now, Di Maria on the other hand, I'd snap your arm off for. But ultimately United have spent upwards of £100m this summer, and for what? 2 points and an early cup exit.

whatawaster · 01-09-2014 10:52AM

Talisman wrote: »

Crazy talk.

2004/5 - Benitez inherited a bunch of Houllier's misfits.

Dudek - dodgy keeper
Kirkland - made of glass
Henchoz - crocked defender
Traore - bambi on ice??
Kewell - crocked star player
Biscan - ??
Diao - ??
Diouf - ??
Cisse - ??
Owen - he who had already lined up a move to Spain

Five of those won a European Cup against all the odds but that does not mean they were good players.

Building blocks Benitez had to work with:
Finnan, Hyypia, Carragher, Riise, Hamann, Gerrard

Benitez left Rodgers in a better position:
Reina, Agger, Skrtel, Johnson, Carragher, Gerrard & Lucas
Future prospects:
Kelly, Flanagan, Robinson, Shelvey, Suso & Sterling
Dalglish added these:
Enrique, Coates, Henderson & Suarez

There is a world of difference between the quality of the squad and the youth players that Rodgers inherited and that which Benitez started with.

Benitez inherited a team with a terrific spine to it – Hyypia, Henchoz, Carragher, Finnan, Hamman, Gerrard, Owen (albeit sold in Rafa’s first summer)

Sure, Rodgers inherited some good players too – Suarez in particular, but in the main he inherited a bloated, overpaid, ageing squad. Our attack was creaking with Bellamy, Kuyt, Maxi, Carroll not performing.

He has completely transformed the profile of the squad, where we are now the youngest team in the league, playing some of the best football in the league.

The three seasons before Rafa came in Liverpool’s average position was 3rd/4th.
The three seasons before Rodgers came in Liverpool’s average position was 7th.

Rafa did a great job at Liverpool, but I think it’s fair to say he came in to a slightly better position than Rodgers.

rob316 · 01-09-2014 10:52AM

viper006 wrote: »

How many more times are we going to say this every time united sign someone. Falcao and Di Maria are absolutlely amazing sigings of them. They are slowly upgrading almost every area of their team.

I would have much rathered Falcao than ballotelli to be honest. Having said that im happier falcao is going to united and not arsenal.

I'd be happier he went to City to be honest, a team I know we wont finish ahead of so it wont make a jot of difference to us. DiMaria and Falcao are serious signings, they have a good manager he will get them playing eventually, I just hope we are far out in front by the time he does.

Underpaid Mike · 01-09-2014 10:58AM

Just watched the MOTD highlights (check out mostar lfc on twitter for link) and I have to say I have no idea how we managed to keep a clean sheet yesterday. Lovern and not sakho for me was at fault numerous times in that first half and made a shocking decision for the Chadli chance. That was a sitter and it should have been 1-1 at that stage. Lovern also pulled Ade jersey in the second half and it was more of a peno that the one we got. Mingolet looked very shaky at times.
Despite all of that we should have scored 5+ again. We were mesmerising on the break and Henderson for me was the man of the match. He won the ball for the penalty. He assisted for Sterling. He was literally everywhere. Full backs were also quality, Moreno looks like a faster ashley young and is definitely not afraid to tackle. His goal was the icing on the cake. Sturridge also had two great long range efforts that later in the season he will probably score.
Endless positives, a clean sheet and 21 very winnable points coming up
Our first 10 games could see us with 9 wins and a loss to City. Last season we had 2 losses and 2 draws in our opening 10 games. Dreamland stuff I know but the fixtures posted above by gafferino should all be winnable

Harry Palmr · 01-09-2014 10:58AM

Not bothered as Falcao is effectively replacing RvP who is going under the knife and given his history you'd wonder how long he will be out and then if he can stay fit, while they are bringing a player who is himself on his third knee op at 29 - in the premier league with players like Robert Huth and Ryan Shawcross.

Knex* · 01-09-2014 10:58AM

SlickRic wrote: »

honestly, not that bothered about Falcao to Utd unless the rest of their spine, and the pace of their play, significantly improves.

Yeah, its certainly a weird one though. Its like their obvious weaknesses have been pointed out, but Van Gaal is putting his fingers in his ears and going, "La la la lala, I can't hear you".

Falcao, while obviously a great player, doesn't change it enough to give anything different to what RVP, Rooney and Mata are showing when on the pitch together.

They need pace, and something different in midfield. That defence is shaky as hell, as well.

However, they do have a lot of players to come back into the team following injury, and that will make a huge difference to them. Both in terms of the system they are employing now, pace of play, and effectiveness.

United won't give a full season with performances as they stand. When those players come back in, I'll start to worry, for sure.

cunnifferous · 01-09-2014 10:58AM

I wouldn't be so dismissive of Utd, they have strengthened massively even if not in every position they need, but we showed last season that with a good enough attack you can compensate for a weak defense.

They will get better as the season goes on, so it's important that we build up as big a gap as possible while they are still in chaos.

ebbsy · 01-09-2014 11:03AM

Loan Fee of 12m +200k per week.

Somebody saw Utd coming............

Dickerty · 01-09-2014 11:07AM

Talisman wrote: »

2004/5 - Benitez inherited a bunch of Houllier's misfits.

There is a world of difference between the quality of the squad and the youth players that Rodgers inherited and that which Benitez started with.

You are forgetting a major factor - the league was less competitive then.
City and Spurs were nowhere. Rafa finished behind Everton and ahead of Bolton on GOAL DIFFERENCE. Even with the team he inherited, he should have been top 4.

But like Rodgers, he got a season to fix it. I would say they are not far apart at the moment. Rodgers got lucky in having Suarez already at the club, and Sterling already coming though, but he deserves huge credit for how we play and his handling of players. And Rafa got credit as a tactical genius, he found a way to beat almost every great we came across, particularly in Europe...

rossie1977 · 01-09-2014 11:10AM

The falcao signing really blows a hole in the silly excuse (used here often) that you need to be in the champions league to attract top players.

Underpaid Mike · 01-09-2014 11:10AM

Guardians perfect description of Sterlings mazy run yesterday.

Barely There · 01-09-2014 11:11AM

Falco?

Don't see him suddenly turning around Man Utd's fortunes.

They have bigger problems in other areas of the pitch.

I also think what's been missed by many is the attitude of their opponents in matches these days. I didn't rate their 2012/2013 title-winning side at all. Far too many teams turned up at OT, rolled over and had their bellies tickled.

Now teams are targeting games against Man Utd for a result if not a win. It's refreshing to see.

Will they stay this bad for much longer? Probably not unfortunately, but I'm going to enjoy this while it lasts. We've already opened up a bit of a gap and gotten 2 tricky away fixtures and a potential home banana-skin out of the way. Hopefully by the time they click we'll be out of sight, or at least difficult to catch.
They must have a massive wage bill at this stage - how sustainable will that be if they miss out on Europe again this season?

Underpaid Mike · 01-09-2014 11:12AM

Tony Barrett on Twitter: Liverpool have lined up a move for Victor Valdes but are prepared to wait until the autumn in order for the free agent to prove his fitness.

Dickerty · 01-09-2014 11:12AM

ebbsy wrote: »

Loan Fee of 12m +200k per week.

rossie1977 wrote: »

The falcao signing really blows a hole in the silly excuse (used here often) that you need to be in the champions league to attract top players.

And there is the reason. United are still a huge draw, with huge resources.
But he's coming because of the piles of cash being thrown his way...

jesus_thats_gre · 01-09-2014 11:13AM

osnola ibax wrote: »

I didn't appreciate Rodgers laughing at the Balo and Sterling misses, found it a little disrespectful to the opposition abd we nearly lost the league on gd last year

Wow!

Complete opposite in reality. Obviously a very healthy dynamic going on within the dressing room and it was, in my opinion, an insight into why certain players are playing so well, i.e. allowed and encouraged to go out to express themselves, allowed to make mistakes and enjoy there football on the condition that they work hard for the team.

Disrespectful my arse to be honest. Criticise BR for any number of things but this angle is a dead end.

Harry Palmr · 01-09-2014 11:14AM

rossie1977 wrote: »

The falcao signing really blows a hole in the silly excuse (used here often) that you need to be in the champions league to attract top players.

Circumstances are what matters sometimes - Di Maria was booted out of Real against their managers wishes, at 60 million quid only one club who wanted him could afford him - Utd. Di Maria needed to play somewhere so that was a perfect marriage of convenience.

Falcao to Utd is more interesting as City could have gone for him, Real were expected to go for him but for whatever reason both have passed, Monaco have to get rid as the project is collapsing due to the owner getting rinsed in a divorce.

rob316 · 01-09-2014 11:14AM

Dickerty wrote: »

You are forgetting a major factor - the league was less competitive then.
City and Spurs were nowhere. Rafa finished behind Everton and ahead of Bolton on GOAL DIFFERENCE. Even with the team he inherited, he should have been top 4.

But like Rodgers, he got a season to fix it. I would say they are not far apart at the moment. Rodgers got lucky in having Suarez already at the club, and Sterling already coming though, but he deserves huge credit for how we play and his handling of players. And Rafa got credit as a tactical genius, he found a way to beat almost every great we came across, particularly in Europe...

That's a brilliant point, the league was nowhere near as competitive back then. I don't like to compare both managers but I'll just say both will go down in our history as key figures.

The one thing I will hold against Rafa is it took us 5 seasons to get anywhere near a title challenge and Rodgers did it in 2 and it was a much more sustained challenge than 2009.

It remains to be seen though if Rodgers can provide us with the same type of CL glory we experienced under Rafa.

Charlie19 · 01-09-2014 11:14AM

Suarez at Melwood today.

Dickerty · 01-09-2014 11:16AM

Underpaid Mike wrote: »

Tony Barrett on Twitter: Liverpool have lined up a move for Victor Valdes but are prepared to wait until the autumn in order for the free agent to prove his fitness.

Rodgers strongly suggested that we'd bring in 1 more, which looks like it's definately a keeper. I wonder if Jones will move today, or sit as 3rd choice and maybe move down later, since the Aussie league starts in Oct?

rob316 · 01-09-2014 11:17AM

Underpaid Mike wrote: »

Tony Barrett on Twitter: Liverpool have lined up a move for Victor Valdes but are prepared to wait until the autumn in order for the free agent to prove his fitness.

That's us done so, after selling Suarez it really has been an exceptional window, one I believe will shape the team for the next 3-5 years.
Well done to Ayre, Rodgers and the board. Its so refreshing to actually have a decent squad for once.

x43r0 · 01-09-2014 11:17AM

Charlie19 wrote: »

Suarez at Melwood today.

I don't get it??

Tipsy McSwagger · 01-09-2014 11:19AM

It's great not to be involved on deadline day and just watch the other clubs panic buy.

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2014 - Mod Note in OP, 1/09

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