Jewish group asks France to rename 'Death to Jews' hamlet

Kiwi in IE · 13-08-2014 08:44AM

extra gravy wrote: »

Where would it end though? Every time a religious group or organisation gets offended by a place name, should they be allowed to request a change? They should be more bothered with the actual genocide that's happening now instead of the name of a tiny French village that bears no threat whatsoever.

If the name of a town in Ireland had an Irish name that translated to 'Death to Protestants' and had been called that for a couple of hundred years, would you consider Protestant groups requesting that it be changed were being petty and should be focusing on more important world issues? The name bears no threat at the end of the day and there are much worse things happening to other people in other parts of the world.

I am certainly not one to give a rat's ass about the more petty claims to 'offence' that we frequently hear religious groups squawking about, but this is quite clearly hugely offensive. It's not reasonable to have a town named as a threat to any particular group of people. I'm amazed it hasn't been changed long before now.

jill_valentine · 13-08-2014 08:45AM

It's hardly a slippery slope. I mean, it's Death to Jews, It's not some wacky coincidental pronunciation or somebody's surname or something, it's literally the slogan "Death to Jews".

I don't think they should - or could - be forced to change it but they're douchebags if they don't.

pickarooney · 13-08-2014 08:58AM

It's literally two houses and a farm. There's no signposts and doesn't feature in anyone's address. Surprised it even registers on google maps.
If google renamed it to "l'amour aux juifs" that would be pretty much its official name.

comongethappy · 13-08-2014 09:15AM

extra gravy wrote: »

Where would it end though?

It ends rather easily.

Don't name a town/village/hamlet a call for the extermination of a faith....

c - 13 · 13-08-2014 09:19AM

Well we do have Killinaspick, Kilkenny. Offensive to Mexicans ?

whisky_galore · 13-08-2014 09:20AM

They only had since the 11th cent to write a strongly worded letter about it.

Guess elderly Nazis are getting thin on the ground, the SWC have to turn to something else.

extra gravy · 13-08-2014 09:21AM

Yes let's rewrite history every time some religious group chooses to be offended by a name. It should be changed to "juifs sont grands" immediately. Though that might offend the Muslims.

blackwhite · 13-08-2014 09:24AM

Candie wrote: »

You know that blaming all Jews for the actions of the Israeli government is a little weeny bit unfair, right?

A bit like blaming all Catholics for the actions of pedophile priests, or all Germans for the Holocaust or even all Muslims for Isis.

Or all Dubliners for that thing, that time, that some Dubliner did that wasn't very nice.

Not just unfair, it's racist - pure and simple.

blackwhite · 13-08-2014 09:24AM

Busted Flat. wrote: »

When they stop the genocide in Gaza, then it would be time to ask such trivial questions. Ho long has that town held that name ?.

You do realise that one country does not equate to all the members of a religious grouping?

Or do you hold the Palestinians responsible for the beheading of Christians in northern Iraq as well :rolleyes:

Kiwi in IE · 13-08-2014 09:40AM

extra gravy wrote: »

Yes let's rewrite history every time some religious group chooses to be offended by a name. It should be changed to "juifs sont grands" immediately. Though that might offend the Muslims.

It is hardly a religious group 'choosing to be offended'. Offence at a place name that quite clearly declares a wish for the death of all who belong to a particular religious group is not a petty gripe. It's not a random name that sounds like something else or that it translates badly into some other language (which would be petty gripes).

Anyway you havn't answered my earlier hypothetical scenarios. Would it be reasonable for Catholic groups/ people to complain and request that the name of a hypothetical town in NI named 'Death to Catholics' be changed, or would that be petty offence taking?

Wibbs · 13-08-2014 09:42AM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Yes I know it's mad, A name that's been around since the 11th century that has nothing to do with the modern day Jewish holocaust.

Well one could argue that such engrained hatred and scapegoating of Jews in much of Europe that ultimately led to the holocaust has a good example in this town/hamlet's name. Though being of a contrary mindset, if I was Jewish I'd be happier if they didn't change the name as it would show the depth of history behind such feelings.

Kiwi in IE · 13-08-2014 09:49AM

How are French Jews responsible for the actions of the Isreali Government? Stop being ridiculous!

Philo Beddoe · 13-08-2014 10:01AM

extra gravy wrote: »

Yes let's rewrite history every time some religious group chooses to be offended by a name. It should be changed to "juifs sont grands" immediately. Though that might offend the Muslims.

In what way are they asking for history to be rewritten?

pickarooney · 13-08-2014 11:15AM

I read in one paper (Le Figaro) that the former occupants of the hamlet were themselves "the Jews", called that because they used to charge a toll to pass through.

Which is obviously not only really believable but in no way anti-semitic :pac:

shruikan2553 · 13-08-2014 11:18AM

I'm usually the first person to laugh at the "offensive" the religious seem to think they are the victims of but in fairness, the place is called death to Jews. Its not something in French that just happens to sound like it or one of our Kilsomethings.

Fuhrer · 13-08-2014 11:29AM

Tallaght means plague pit, which seems oddly accurate.

Mountainsandh · 13-08-2014 11:32AM

Yeah but that's the back-end of nowhere. Nobody needs be offended or their sensitivities hurt unless they happen at complete random upon these 2 houses and farm some day, and pay attention to a sign that May or may not exist.

That's very different from if it was a town with places the public might have to frequent, delivery people work in, etc...

If their postman is ok with it (must check Figaro Pickarooney not coming up on address ?) then it's not as dramatic as everyone makes it out to be.

pickarooney · 13-08-2014 11:37AM

Mountainsandh wrote: »

If their postman is ok with it (must check Figaro Pickarooney not coming up on address ?) then it's not as dramatic as everyone makes it out to be.

Article here.

De mémoire locale, le nom du hameau loirétain s'expliquerait différemment: il y a plus de 600 ans, la ferme principale était longée par un chemin emprunté par les maquignons, qui devaient, se dit-il, payer un droit de passage. Ses habitants auraient été surnommés «les Juifs» parce qu'ils récoltaient ainsi beaucoup d'argent… Une explication plus éloignée de l'Histoire, mais non sans relents antisémites.

Thoie · 13-08-2014 11:42AM

A Primal Nut wrote: »

Kilkenny is offensive to people called Kenny.

And as for Killahore, well, I won't tell you what goes on there.

I have a friend who claims that Watergrasshill was named by asking someone to close their eyes, and then call out the first 3 things they saw when they opened them again. We're just lucky it's not called Gorse****cow.

Frank Lee Midere · 13-08-2014 11:46AM

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

How are French Jews responsible for the actions of the Isreali Government? Stop being ridiculous!

It isn't French Jews. It's a particular activist group in the US, the Simon Wiesenthal centre. The French didn't say nothing.

And while I agree that blaming Jews for the Gaza Strip as a whole is racist it may not be racist to target this group. They tend to be pro-Israeli.

Tony EH · 13-08-2014 12:47PM

whisky_galore wrote: »

They only had since the 11th cent to write a strongly worded letter about it.

Guess elderly Nazis are getting thin on the ground, the SWC have to turn to something else.

Bingo!

Trying SOOOO hard to generate any old shite to be "outraged" by.

Tony EH · 13-08-2014 12:53PM

Frank Lee Midere wrote: »

It isn't French Jews. It's a particular activist group in the US, the Simon Wiesenthal centre. The French didn't say nothing.

And while I agree that blaming Jews for the Gaza Strip as a whole is racist it may not be racist to target this group. They tend to be pro-Israeli.

The Simon Wiesenthal centre, like the ADL and the JDL care for nothing except their organisation's bottom line.

I couldn't give a toss what any of them have to say about anything.

DarkyHughes · 13-08-2014 12:55PM

the town was probably named that during the Vichy France. Should be renamed along tome ago.

Can you imagine a place being called "death to the pope",..........well maybe somewhere along the Shankill road in Belfast but still.

Tony EH · 13-08-2014 12:59PM

DarkyHughes wrote: »

the town was probably named that during the Vichy France. Should be renamed along tome ago..

Oh dear...didn't read the thread, did you.

DarkyHughes · 13-08-2014 12:59PM

c - 13 wrote: »

Well we do have [, Kilkenny. Offensive to Mexicans ?

Kilmichael is probably offensive to a person called Michael who got killed there in 1920.

DarkyHughes · 13-08-2014 01:00PM

Tony EH wrote: »

Oh dear...didn't read the thread, did you.

Nah what did I miss?

Tony EH · 13-08-2014 01:01PM

Everything.

DarkyHughes · 13-08-2014 01:03PM

Mackas_view wrote: »

See Israel it's France your real problem lys. Now leave all those innocent children you've been killing in Palestine (Gaza) alone..

Find it very hard to agree or take interest in anything a Jew has to say these days. That's shallow of me but I'm only being honest.

What about Chomsky or Finkelstien?

SeanW · 13-08-2014 01:07PM

Deleted User wrote: »

What an unusual name, are there any unusually named places places (in Irish or English) in Ireland that might need to be renamed as they could cause offence to someone?

I can't think of any..

Spain has its own version, "Camp Kill Jews" i.e. Castrillo Matajudíos.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2603164/Spanish-town-change-contains-phrase-Jew-Killer-local-slang-drinking-lemonade.html

Kiwi in IE · 13-08-2014 01:15PM

Whoever has raised the issue, the name of the town is appalling, offensive and should have been changed a long time ago. Never mind the American group, it should be changed out of respect for Jewish people living in France. I fail to see how any reasonable person cannot see that this is a genuine reason to be offended, even if the group who have drawn attention to it have very questionable ethics on other issues. It is vastly different for example, from pathetic cries of offence when a religion that wants the law to discriminate against LGBT people is called a homophobic religion!

Jewish group asks France to rename 'Death to Jews' hamlet

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