Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 13/8

dahat · 10-08-2014 11:06AM

Lord TSC wrote: »

Sky sports apparently reporting Fiorentina president has confirmed Cuadardo has asked to leave the club....

Barca v Utd face off then.

He seems more suited to 3-5-2 and 3-4-3 systems than Di Maria.

Larry Wildman · 10-08-2014 11:11AM

tupac_healy wrote: »

Shaw is a good deal IMO

That really remains to be seen.

He could be a Paolo Maldini type character (i.e. our left back for 15 years).

He could also be an Alan Hutton type character (i.e. crap).

He could be a Phil Jones type character (i.e. a case of "what might have been") - Admittedly Phil Jones has time to "make it".

DM_7 · 10-08-2014 11:12AM

dahat wrote: »

Barca v Utd face off then.

He seems more suited to 3-5-2 and 3-4-3 systems than Di Maria.

Is he any good at defending? I only saw him in the world cup and he looked more like Ronaldinho than Maldini.

General queation:

Have we heard anymore about United actually having an interest in buying him. All I have read so far is that the club would sell.

irishfeen · 10-08-2014 11:12AM

Live at the minute - I for one are very happy that this one got away for 15 million.

DM_7 · 10-08-2014 11:14AM

irishfeen wrote: »

Live at the minute - I for one are very happy that this one got away for 15 million.

He got a 5 year deal out if them as well, I doubt United would have offered that.

RobertKK · 10-08-2014 11:17AM

Graham Hunter when asked about Di Maria and Vidal to United, gave the very honest answer of "I don't know...yet"
Same as the rest of us, at least he didn't make it up.

beno619 · 10-08-2014 11:24AM

Larry Wildman wrote: »

That really remains to be seen.

He could be a Paolo Maldini type character (i.e. our left back for 15 years).

He could also be an Alan Hutton type character (i.e. crap).

He could be a Phil Jones type character (i.e. a case of "what might have been") - Admittedly Phil Jones has time to "make it".

I dont really understand this kind of argument.

Shaw is a good deal. £27m for a player at 19 and is already among the best in his position in the Premier league is good business.

If we signed Vidal for £40m most people would argue its a good deal, Vidal could go on to have trouble with is knee or only give us 5 years of service but that wouldn't take away from the fact the getting him for £40m was a good deal.

irishfeen · 10-08-2014 11:26AM

RobertKK wrote: »

Graham Hunter when asked about Di Maria and Vidal to United, gave the very honest answer of "I don't know...yet"
Same as the rest of us, at least he didn't make it up.

Ya not one journalist seems to know anything - it's like camp United has been totally shutdown and nothing is getting out - the difference from last year is remarkable.

beno619 · 10-08-2014 11:27AM

DM-ICE wrote: »

He got a 5 year deal out if them as well, I doubt United would have offered that.

Great deal for Arsenal and the player, he possibly wont even be first choice at Barca.

Whatsisname · 10-08-2014 11:29AM

Re. Cuadrado and Di Maria, do we think it's a matter of 1 or the other or would you say we are looking at both? I'd imagine Di Maria would signal a change to 4-3-3 while Cuadrado would surely 5-3-2 sticking

Larry Wildman · 10-08-2014 11:31AM

beno619 wrote: »

I dont really understand this kind of argument.

Shaw is a good deal. £27m for a player at 19 and is already among the best in his position in the Premier league is good business.

If we signed Vidal for £40m most people would argue its a good deal, Vidal could go on to have trouble with is knee or only give us 5 years of service but that wouldn't take away from the fact the getting him for £40m was a good deal.

My point is that it remains to be seen whether Shaw is a good deal.

If three years from now, he's playing for Sunderland having been let go for £7m, will we look back and say "well that was a good deal"?

Re Vidal, the same applies. If he turns out to be crocked a la Owen Hargreaves, he can hardly be called a "good deal".

bucketybuck · 10-08-2014 11:31AM

beno619 wrote: »

I dont really understand this kind of argument.

Shaw is a good deal. £27m for a player at 19 and is already among the best in his position in the Premier league is good business.

Probably because you have changed the argument. The original point was reference Uniteds transfers being underwhelming and the journalists view that "...Shaw's just a promising youth player."

Whether it was a good deal is a different matter, it could well represent good value in the long term but in terms of Uniteds transfer dealings this summer an 18 year old full back could easily be seen as underwhelming, especially considering our needs.

GSPfan · 10-08-2014 11:32AM

irishfeen wrote: »

Ya not one journalist seems to know anything - it's like camp United has been totally shutdown and nothing is getting out - the difference from last year is remarkable.

Or no one knows anything because nothing is happening. Woodward out, VanGaal out, Nike out.

Just kidding.

10-08-2014 11:33AM

Larry Wildman wrote: »

My point is that it remains to be seen whether Shaw is a good deal.

If three years from now, he's playing for Sunderland having been let go for £7m, will we look back and say "well that was a good deal"?

Re Vidal, the same applies. If he turns out to be crocked a la Owen Hargreaves, he can hardly be called a "good deal".

To be fair that applies to basically every transfer any team will ever make. You're always taking a risk, because the guy could get injured/homesick/not suit the premiership/become a degenerate gambler/decided to follow their dream of becoming a ballerina/whatever.

On the no leaks thing - there are always three parties involved in a transfer, being the two clubs and the player. I don't think Utd can just shut down all transfer talk by themselves. If there's no solid info coming from anywhere I'd be inclined to believe nothing is happening.

twam2008 · 10-08-2014 11:37AM

I think some people just won't be happy no matter who signs, there was an argument that Herrera has no premier league experience, same can be said of Hummels, should we pass on him so?

Strumms · 10-08-2014 11:38AM

Whatever about the midfield where we still need to strengthen the priority should be the defence especially if we will be playing 3 at the back. We have lost huge experience in terms of Rio and Vidic and also back up in numbers. Jones, Evans and Smalling have had more then their fair share if injuries over the last 24 months. Who is in reserve ? M. Keane I don't think will cut it. Blackett has no experience on a competitive premiership level... Going by the historical injury record of our first choice 3 centre backs we could be really screwed at some point this season without additions at the back...

The general consensus is that we are 4 players short.. Two defenders and two midfielders, one attacking and one defensive...

For me..

Hummels and Blind / Vidal & Di Maria

Out : Nani, Fellaini, Amos, Anderson, Cleverley.

I'd be surprised if we don't sign at least two players before the window shuts, we know via the confirmation of the Vermaelen interest that we are aggressively pursuing defenders anyway. As for Vidal... God only knows

Larry Wildman · 10-08-2014 11:38AM

Zoie Attractive Shortbread wrote: »

To be fair that applies to basically every transfer any team will ever make. You're always taking a risk, because the guy could get injured/homesick/not suit the premiership/become a degenerate gambler/decided to follow their dream of becoming a ballerina/whatever.

I see your point, but I disagree because the two examples in my post are very specific. Vidal does appear to have a knee issue which we're aware of. If he breaks down after we sign him, we're gonna look very silly.

And Shaw looks promising alright, but what has he actually achieved? Nothing. He looked the part in a pretty Southampton side with zero pressure on them to perform. He's on the fringes of the England setup. The leagues are full of guys who looked like the next big thing. We've essentially bought a quality young horse but it would be foolish to assume that we're gonna win the Derby. Only time will tell.

Tippex · 10-08-2014 11:41AM

He got a 5 year deal out if them as well, I doubt United would have offered that.

It was reported that we were offering 3 years + 1 yr option. (until we pulled out)

bucketybuck · 10-08-2014 11:41AM

Zoie Attractive Shortbread wrote: »

To be fair that applies to basically every transfer any team will ever make. You're always taking a risk, because the guy could get injured/homesick/not suit the premiership/become a degenerate gambler/decided to follow their dream of becoming a ballerina/whatever.

In fairness though, it a far, far greater risk for any 18 year old than a 23+ aged player.

tupac_healy · 10-08-2014 11:46AM

on these comments from LVG that we lack a 'Ronaldo or Di Maria' type winger... if we got Do Maria, where does he fit in in a 3-5-2? cause it's not at wing back!

Strumms · 10-08-2014 11:50AM

tupac_healy wrote: »

on these comments from LVG that we lack a 'Ronaldo or Di Maria' type winger... if we got Do Maria, where does he fit in in a 3-5-2? cause it's not at wing back!

Never imagine him as a wing back ..He can play up top a la Ronaldo or in behind... Or even one of the central 3 if he was with two defensively enough minded teammates say Fletcher and Herrera. He is that talented... He had an amazing season for Madrid last year a mystery why they want rid..

beno619 · 10-08-2014 11:53AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

Probably because you have changed the argument. The original point was reference Uniteds transfers being underwhelming and the journalists view that "...Shaw's just a promising youth player."

Whether it was a good deal is a different matter, it could well represent good value in the long term but in terms of Uniteds transfer dealings this summer an 18 year old full back could easily be seen as underwhelming, especially considering our needs.

Our needs a were a LB & CM.

I prefer Shaw over a 29 year old be that Baines or Felipe Luis.

Herrera also suits LVG's system better than Cesc imo.

10-08-2014 11:54AM

Larry Wildman wrote: »

I see your point, but I disagree because the two examples in my post are very specific. Vidal does appear to have a knee issue which we're aware of. If he breaks down after we sign him, we're gonna look very silly.

And Shaw looks promising alright, but what has he actually achieved? Nothing. He looked the part in a pretty Southampton side with zero pressure on them to perform. He's on the fringes of the England setup. The leagues are full of guys who looked like the next big thing. We've essentially bought a quality young horse but it would be foolish to assume that we're gonna win the Derby. Only time will tell.

Well you're right on Vidal, buying a guy with a known, possibly career-curtailing knee issue, for huge money, would be a bit nuts. IF he passed a medical and IF he was willing to sign I think Utd should throw money at Juve though.

With Shaw you're paying for the fact you mightn't have to spend another penny on the position for another decade I guess. I think you're being a bit unfair on Southampton also, it's not easy to do what they did last season.

yabadabado · 10-08-2014 11:55AM

tupac_healy wrote: »

Laporte is 20, though he may end up playing CB...

He is a CB,he played played LB back a handful of times last season.

bucketybuck · 10-08-2014 11:55AM

beno619 wrote: »

I prefer Shaw over a 29 year old be that Baines or Felipe Luis.

So do I, I'm happy with the choice of Shaw, but we have to have realistic expectations regarding him.

Paul Tergat · 10-08-2014 12:05PM

Just a reminder that Phil Jones is only 22

Adamcp898 · 10-08-2014 12:06PM

tupac_healy wrote: »

on these comments from LVG that we lack a 'Ronaldo or Di Maria' type winger... if we got Do Maria, where does he fit in in a 3-5-2? cause it's not at wing back!

Tbh I'm still sceptical as to whether 352 will turn out to be our main system.

I think LvG will happily go to 433, 451 if he gets the opportunity and that is why we are interested in the likes of Cuadrado and Di Maria. I think he's a bit frustrated right now with what he feels is a lack of flexibility that the current squad make-up has led to and will try to change all that in the next 12 months.

Lord TSC · 10-08-2014 12:10PM

If his long term aim is to move towards 4-3-3 as well, it's likely we wouldn't need 2 new CBs long term, just the one, right? As in, ideally, we'd move towards...

De Gea
Raf - Evans - New CB - Shaw
Herrera - Fletcher
Mata
Cuadardo

DiMaria
Rooney/RVP

....with Jones/Smalling as our backup defenders.

Adamocovic · 10-08-2014 12:11PM

It will be interesting to see who VG will sign next. Hopefully it will keep some of the pessimist happy for a bit ha.
I'm not panicing yet though.

The league may be starting next weekend but with 3 weeks left I'm still confident VG knows what he is doing and will bring in the necessary players.

Adamocovic · 10-08-2014 12:12PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

If his long term aim is to move towards 4-3-3 as well, it's likely we wouldn't need 2 new CBs long term, just the one, right? As in, ideally, we'd move towards...
De Gea
Raf - Evans - New CB - Shaw
Herrera - Fletcher
Mata
Cuadardo
DiMaria
Rooney/RVP

....with Jones/Smalling as our backup defenders.

That's a good point, still would like to see Jones finally giving the starting spot as CB though. Can't see him getting picked ahead of Evans though if it came down to one spot left.

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - Mod Note in OP, 13/8

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