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Israel - Palestine Conflict. **Mod note in OP - updated 1st August**

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Comments

  • #3572
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    bumper234 wrote: »
    Who everyone admits to never hearing of until that day and a claim that you have yet to.prove despite being asked for evidence of your allegations MANY times.

    Another link re Rense.com:
    According to Rense, Hitler's anti-Semitism was a legitimate response to a real threat posed by Jewish revolutionaries, and the Third Reich's anti-Jewish policies merely a reaction to hostilities initiated by Samuel Untermeyer of the World Jewish Economic Federation. Those gross perversions of history should be called what they are: pro-Nazi..

    http://adamholland.blogspot.ie/2010/05/rense-is-pro-nazi-website.html


  • #3573
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Your assertion that I did not provide proof Rense.com is a Jew-hating site is false.

    I haven't seen your evidence, maybe a link please?


  • #3574
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Nobody had a problem with it because the same facts are available, and were provided, from a shed load of other sources.
    So you can opt to deny a fact purely on the grounds that one of the multitude of sources quoting it may be something or other?

    Given that some links I've put up are challenged on a similar basis, why wouldn't I.


  • #3575
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    porsche959 wrote: »
    So here we have an article which states that two Israeli soldiers were found to be engaged in this activity and were sanctioned and demoted.

    And you are using this article in an attempt to prove that this was official sanctioned policy approved at the highest level?

    What, quite frankly, is the matter with you?
    He uses facts and logic. Confusing for some yes.
    So where is your counter claim, with any evidence at all besides IDF press release, that Hamas have an official or unofficial human shield policy?


  • #3576
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Another link re Rense.com:



    http://adamholland.blogspot.ie/2010/05/rense-is-pro-nazi-website.html

    So some random guys blog is deemed to be "evidence"?


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  • #3577
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Given that some links I've put up are challenged on a similar basis, why wouldn't I.
    You fail to understand. Again.
    It is not about the link. You have nothing EXCEPT pro-Israel websites and twitter feeds to source your waffle.


  • #3578
    NotASheeple
    Closed Accounts Posts: 424 ✭✭NotASheeple


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Sorry but my life doesn't revolve around posting answers to, mostly ridiculous and/or leading questions put to me in this thread.


    So highlighting your inability to reply to multiple posts and stand over a morally bankrupt argument is stupid? Yes, of course you'd think that. I logged in earlier, did some catching up and your behaviour is laughable. It's hard to count the amount of posts you hid from and didn't reply to. The fact that they expose you and your mindset, well I suppose it explains why you stick the head in the sand and hide. Do you have any self awareness? Most people with a lot of egg on their face, would just slip away and try and preserve some dignity. But you just keep coming back for more punishment. I'd almost feel sad, but the entertainment value you provide makes it almost addictive.


  • #3579
    Ardent
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,379 ✭✭✭Ardent


    tigger123 wrote: »
    Channel 4 News is carrying claims that the IDF were given direct orders/permission to fire on unarmed civilians, which constitutes a war crime

    The claim is made by an activist and relates this this incident:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENWTmfe4lMA


  • #3580
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    He uses facts and logic. Confusing for some yes.
    So where is your counter claim, with any evidence at all besides IDF press release, that Hamas have an official or unofficial human shield policy?


    His link reports that a small number of Israeli soldiers found to be engaging in that activity were suspended and demoted.

    Far from showing this was official policy, it seems to show the opposite.


  • #3581
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    porsche959 wrote: »
    So here we have an article which states that two Israeli soldiers were found to be engaged in this activity and were sanctioned and demoted.

    And you are using this article in an attempt to prove that this was official sanctioned policy approved at the highest level?

    What, quite frankly, is the matter with you?


    It was official policy until the Israeli high court ruled against it in 2005. It still occurs and a blind eye is often turned.

    Earlier you stated
    The IDF is - relatively - accountable as an institution. Few armies are as
    accountable..

    As these examples show, this is notoriously not the case.
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=91525813&postcount=1142
    Care to comment?


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  • #3582
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    NotASheeple wrote: »
    The fact that they expose you and your mindset, well I suppose it explains why you stick the head in the sand and hide.

    My mindset being opposition to terrorism? Whoah, you got me there. Yep, really showed me up. Well done!!


  • #3583
    Nodin
    Closed Accounts Posts: 46,938 ✭✭✭✭Nodin


    porsche959 wrote: »
    His link reports that a small number of Israeli soldiers found to be engaging in that activity were suspended and demoted.

    Far from showing this was official policy, it seems to show the opposite.

    Bit odd the IDF tried to appeal it then....
    http://www.haaretz.com/news/idf-to-ask-high-court-to-review-ban-on-human-shield-practice-1.171689


  • #3584
    dav3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭dav3


    porsche959 wrote: »
    So here we have an article which states that two Israeli soldiers were found to be engaged in this activity and were sanctioned and demoted.

    And you are using this article in an attempt to prove that this was official sanctioned policy approved at the highest level?

    What, quite frankly, is the matter with you?

    I'm helping you get started with your "research" as I have already stated. Seeing as this has all been pointed out to you multiple times, I can only come to the conclusion that you're struggling.

    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3154142,00.html
    According to defense officials, the Israel Defense Forces made use of the ‘human shield’ procedure on 1,200 occasions over the last five years

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_shield#Israel
    The IDF admitted it had used Palestinians as human shields; it acknowledged using human shields 1,500 times during the Second Intifada


    Below we have actually testimony from from former IDF soldiers that have had enough of the savagery and war crimes committed by the IDF.

    http://www.breakingthesilence.org.il/testimonies/database/?ci=143

    With the staggering numbers above, are you really going to dismiss all that evidence because it was not officially sanctioned at the highest level?

    With those numbers, does it really matter anymore?


  • #3585
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    porsche959 wrote: »
    If these Arab & Islamic states, with exception of Iran, are so peace loving and genuinely want a peaceful solution for Israel and Palestine, then can someone explain to me why it is that in the Arab lands that surround Israe, which are seemingly 600 times its size in land area, but somehow they can't find any room for Palestinian refugees?
    maybe because they feel that the palestinians have a right to be there which they do

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



  • #3586
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,613 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    porsche959 wrote: »
    His link reports that a small number of Israeli soldiers found to be engaging in that activity were suspended and demoted.

    Far from showing this was official policy, it seems to show the opposite.

    I'd like proof of that too seeing that the soldier who emptied his rifle into a 13 year old schoolgirl walked off without punishment.
    My link is below --

    http://www.theguardian.com/world/2005/nov/16/israel2


  • #3587
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    porsche959 wrote: »
    His link reports that a small number of Israeli soldiers found to be engaging in that activity were suspended and demoted.

    Far from showing this was official policy, it seems to show the opposite.
    Aaaand STILL waiting for your evidence that any Hamas agent AT ALL used human shields.
    Why was using human shields "banned" by the IDF if it wasn't a policy or at least a policy to allow?


  • #3588
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    porsche959 wrote: »
    My mindset being opposition to terrorism? Whoah, you got me there. Yep, really showed me up. Well done!!
    Aaaaand we're back to asking for a definition of terrorism that can differentiate between Hamas and the IDF.


  • #3589
    user2011
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,071 ✭✭✭user2011


    porsche959 wrote: »
    So here we have an article which states that two Israeli soldiers were found to be engaged in this activity and were sanctioned and demoted.

    And you are using this article in an attempt to prove that this was official sanctioned policy approved at the highest level?

    What, quite frankly, is the matter with you?

    Unless the Two IDF Soldiers used that disgusting tactic 600 times (1,200 times used see links) between them... There are a lot more of them that have abused Palestinians in this disgusting manner and have gotten away with it. Also it's laughable that that the IDF can use this tactic and then use the veil of court action as proof that they don't approve of it with "sanctions" wtf does that mean and a big whopper of a demotion democratic justice at play here. :rolleyes:
    -
    In 2009, Wikileaks published an Israeli government memo stating:
    Individual Palestinians also testified to IDF abuses such as looting, beatings, vandalism of property and the use of the local population as human shields. But by far the strongest reverbration in Israel was that created by the Israeli organization “Breaking the Silence”, which collected testimony from 26 unnamed IDF soldiers. All of the soldiers had been involved in Operation Cast Lead in the Gaza Strip, and testified to instances where Gazans were used as human shields, incendiary phosphorous shells were fired over civilian population areas, and other examples of excessive firepower that caused unnecessary fatalities and destruction of property.

    Links in the post!

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=91604254&postcount=3212


  • #3590
    user2011
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,071 ✭✭✭user2011


    Lets say for argument sake that Hamas has used human shield tactics.

    When both sides use/used this disgusting tactic I don't want to see anyone being on TV telling me the other side is using human shields when I know YOU have used it. You lose all morality when you have disgustingly stooped to your enemies level making you no better then them.


  • #3591
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    porsche959 wrote: »
    Re freeing Gaza, I agree. Free Gaza from Hamas.

    Most Hamas rockets landed in Gaza.

    https://twitter.com/afagerbakke/status/497427304277348352/photo/1
    hamas was democratically elected, so its free gaza from israel

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



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  • #3592
    bumper234
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,250 ✭✭✭✭bumper234


    On Channel 4 news now, even knesset member says he doesn't trust the IDF to investigate alleged war crimes that have been committed.


  • #3593
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    end of the road wrote: »
    hamas was democratically elected, so its free gaza from israel

    There was man in Germany in the 1930s who was also democractically elected....


  • #3594
    porsche959
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,499 ✭✭✭porsche959


    bumper234 wrote: »
    On Channel 4 news now, even knesset member says he doesn't trust the IDF to investigate alleged war crimes that have been committed.

    You say "even Knesset member" as though it is complete news that there is diversity of opinion in Israeli society and in the Knesset. As though they are all marching in step doing whatever Netanyahu orders.

    I agree that IDF investigations into themselves not a good way to go in general.


  • #3595
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,613 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    porsche959 wrote: »
    There was man in Germany in the 1930s who was also democractically elected....

    And his "brother" in Israel.


  • #3596
    RustyNut
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,427 ✭✭✭RustyNut


    At least we know for sure that the zionist idf think using children as human shields a good idea.

    The Israeli Defence Ministry will appeal against a supreme court ruling banning the use of Palestinian human shields in raids, officials said.

    I think all civilised people would find this disgusting.


  • #3597
    Sound of Silence
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,192 ✭✭✭Sound of Silence


    Netanyahu currently urging US lawmakers to "Help Israel to avoid War Crime charges" by the ICC. The Foreign Ministry has also not yet decided whether Israel should cooperate with a United Nations Human Rights Council commission that is expected to be set up in the coming days to investigate alleged war crimes in Gaza.

    Israel, as usual, answerable to no one.


  • #3598
    dav3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭dav3


    porsche959 wrote: »
    There was man in Germany in the 1930s who was also democractically elected....

    Otto Wels?


  • #3599
    user2011
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,071 ✭✭✭user2011


    porsche959 wrote: »
    There was man in Germany in the 1930s who was also democractically elected....

    I guess you know in all your wisdom what started this conflict off yes?

    If you don't do a bit off Goggling on Hamas/Fatah unity government, then the three Israeli boys went missing (if I was being a conspiracy nut) and it was used as a tool to raid hundreds of places in the West Bank (you know what happen there too yes) arrest without cause hundreds of people (8,9 dead as a result) then we have had the what 4 weeks of needless disaster going on.


  • #3600
    WakeUp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,823 ✭✭✭WakeUp


    RustyNut wrote: »
    At least we know for sure that the zionist idf think using children as human shields a good idea.

    The Israeli Defence Ministry will appeal against a supreme court ruling banning the use of Palestinian human shields in raids, officials said.

    I think all civilised people would find this disgusting.

    "The Israeli Defence Ministry will appeal against a supreme court ruling banning the use of Palestinian human shields in raids, officials said.
    Defence Minister Shaul Mofaz is prepared to make a personal appearance in court to defend the practice, ministry officials added.

    Human rights groups have frequently condemned the use of human shields.

    The Israeli military believes that the use of Palestinian civilians can often defuse a tense situation."

    that's disturbing. the brave IDF alright.


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  • #3601
    end of the road
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,712 ✭✭✭✭end of the road


    porsche959 wrote: »
    My mindset being opposition to terrorism? Whoah, you got me there. Yep, really showed me up. Well done!!
    terrorism from one side, you seem to be happy with the other side commiting terrorism

    I'm very highly educated. I know words, i have the best words, nobody has better words then me.



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