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Israel - Palestine Conflict. **Mod note in OP - updated 1st August**

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Comments

  • #1952
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    obplayer wrote: »
    Perhaps you would care to explain to the UN why they are wrong about who broke the ceasefire?
    Perhaps you would care to explain to us here now why we are wrong about the IDF not being on ceasefire at all?
    Alternatively just blurt out "Hamas did it!" and see if that works instead.


  • #1953
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    obplayer wrote: »
    Who proved it false? The UN?
    The IDF did when they admitted they weren't on ceasefire at all, still on military operations.
    Do keep up.


  • #1954
    user2011
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,071 ✭✭✭user2011


    obplayer wrote: »
    Using big letters and bold does not prove you correct. Just pointing this out.

    I've read a lot about the IDF's tactic's to know when someone starts using weapons being stored in schools, hospitals and the Hamas charter they are spewing propaganda themselves at the same time telling us that we've been taken in by propaganda.

    So lets call a truce and get down to the good stuff.. Like 17 calls by the UN that a school is full with Palestinians that the IDF moved from one place to next that ends up being bombed by the IDF??


  • #1955
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    obplayer wrote: »
    Who proved it false? The UN?

    The IDF said they were engaged in "activities on the ground", so how is that adhering to a ceasefire exactly?


  • #1956
    Mosby61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Mosby61


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    So the IDF were not part of any ceasefire. Thanks for agreeing.
    There's a few here won't be happy though...
    That isn't breaking a ceasefire.


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  • #1957
    ireland.man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,080 ✭✭✭ireland.man


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    Completely ignoring Hamas and the role they play in this? Hiding weapons in schools and hospitals and breaking ceasefires. Not to mention the atrocious Hamas charter.

    Is there an actual target audience for such propaganda? I can't imagine Irish people being so gullible as to be swayed by the constant repetition of the words 'Hamas', 'human shields', 'weapons in schools', 'Islamism', etc etc. There's no argument from Israel, there's only repetition of meaningless and out of context words and phrases, ad nauseum. It definitely works in America but as can be seen from the protests across the globe, almost every other nation rejects such stupidity.

    In this thread alone we've shown how it was Israel which started hostilities. Israel attacked Gaza first. Israel's blockade is against international law. Israel's expansion since 1967 is against international law. Settlers are stealing land, burning Palestinian farms down and stealing their businesses.

    Beyond the propaganda, what does Israel offer as a permanent, long term solution to this crisis?


  • #1958
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    obplayer wrote: »
    Who proved it false? The UN?

    Are you disappointed that the ceasefire was broken? Are you venting your frustration at the insanity of the situation and wishing the pointless slaughter would stop?


  • #1959
    I Heart Internet
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,678 ✭✭✭I Heart Internet


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Perhaps you would care to explain to us here now why we are wrong about the IDF not being on ceasefire at all?
    Alternatively just blurt out "Hamas did it!" and see if that works instead.

    Walking within range of Hamas fighters is not breaking a ceasefire, firing at a person is.

    Hamas are guilty as sin on this one lads. Take it on the chin.


  • #1960
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    That isn't breaking a ceasefire.
    Military activity destroying enemy positions on their territory is now part of a ceasefire?
    FFS, you couldn't make this sort of rubbish up.


  • #1961
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    I Heart Internet wrote: »
    Walking within range of Hamas fighters is not breaking a ceasefire, firing at a person is.

    You seem to have access to information, that no one else has, even the UN (who admit to be unable to verify what happened). I take you can provide the source, for your information where the IDF were fired upon by Hamas militants due to proximity alone?


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  • #1962
    miss tickle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 242 ✭✭miss tickle


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    You'll have to excuse me but it's late and I'm tired but having read the article and confirming the 5% figure as you stated,I'm curious then why the rocket attacks are causing no casualties? Is it because they have no warheads? Do they indeed have warheads and are causing structural damage but no civilian casualties as they are safe in the shelters? or are they causing no damage at at all because,although armed,are landing in the desert? It's not your job to answer my questions but if you have an answer it would be appreciated.
    Well, who is reporting the rocket attacks, where is the evidence that they are being intercepted at a rate of 87% by this Iron Dome defense?
    If it is as effective as they say, why are the national media not showing this?


  • #1963
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    I Heart Internet wrote: »
    Walking within range of Hamas fighters is not breaking a ceasefire, firing at a person is.

    Hamas are guilty as sin on this one lads. Take it on the chin.
    Ah, so you've opted for **** tactic #1: repeat the same thing and hope for a different outcome.
    The IDF weren't on ceasefire so Hamas could not break a ceasefire.
    Go on, parrot off your line again there like a good lad fer da laff.


  • #1964
    obplayer
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,190 ✭✭✭obplayer


    Tuisceanch wrote: »
    Are you disappointed that the ceasefire was broken? Are you venting your frustration at the insanity of the situation and wishing the pointless slaughter would stop?

    Of course I am disappointed that the ceasefire was broken! I am venting only in the sense that I am powerless to help and can only express myself on the internet.
    As for the actual breaking of the ceasefire? Who fired first? That is what matters and I will take the view of the UN before anyone else's.
    Going to bed now.


  • #1965
    user2011
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,071 ✭✭✭user2011


    I Heart Internet wrote: »
    Walking within range of Hamas fighters is not breaking a ceasefire, firing at a person is.

    Hamas are guilty as sin on this one lads. Take it on the chin.

    Yes because it's like a boxing match :rolleyes:

    They are both as guilty as sin I heart, Israel has it within it's power if it so chooses to end this f**king ****. Get back to the 67 borders and let both peoples get on with their lives.. But will they??????????????????


  • #1966
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    obplayer wrote: »
    Of course I am disappointed that the ceasefire was broken! I am venting only in the sense that I am powerless to help and can only express myself on the internet.
    Going to bed now.
    The ceasefire where the IDF kept on blowing stuff up by their own admission?


  • #1967
    Mosby61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Mosby61


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Military activity destroying enemy positions on their territory is now part of a ceasefire?
    FFS, you couldn't make this sort of rubbish up.
    Destroying terrorist positions is something we should all be wanting. I don't know why you would defend those tunnels.


  • #1968
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    miss tickle wrote: »
    Well, who is reporting the rocket attacks, where is the evidence that they are being intercepted at a rate of 87% by this Iron Dome defense?
    If it is as effective as they say, why are the national media not showing this?

    If the rockets had killed civilians or caused structural damage then it would have being reported. If the 'Iron Dome' is largely ineffective what happened to the other 95%. Even if the effectiveness was 87% then what about the remaining 13%. I can only conclude based on this logic that either there are no rockets or they are not armed.Well I knew this was murky but it's getting murkier by the minute.


  • #1969
    user2011
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,071 ✭✭✭user2011


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    Destroying terrorist positions is something we should all be wanting. I don't know why you would defend those tunnels.

    Why are Hamas not allowed or have a right to defend themselves against oppression?


  • #1970
    Mosby61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Mosby61


    ireland.man wrote: »
    Is there an actual target audience for such propaganda? I can't imagine Irish people being so gullible as to be swayed by the constant repetition of the words 'Hamas', 'human shields', 'weapons in schools', 'Islamism', etc etc. There's no argument from Israel, there's only repetition of meaningless and out of context words and phrases, ad nauseum. It definitely works in America but as can be seen from the protests across the globe, almost every other nation rejects such stupidity.

    In this thread alone we've shown how it was Israel which started hostilities. Israel attacked Gaza first. Israel's blockade is against international law. Israel's expansion since 1967 is against international law. Settlers are stealing land, burning Palestinian farms down and stealing their businesses.

    Beyond the propaganda, what does Israel offer as a permanent, long term solution to this crisis?
    What have you got against settlers? It happens in many European countries now. We just call it immigration. Another word for it.

    It's happened throughout history. On this island too. Don't see you complaining about 800k settlers living here.


  • #1971
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    Destroying terrorist positions is something we should all be wanting. I don't know why you would defend those tunnels.
    Sorry, maybe you're on catch up here. Anyway, we play this game with all you Zionist types where you have to come up with a definition of "terrorist" that doesn't also define what the IDF are doing. Wanna play?
    Defending the tunnels is immaterial to this question. There was no ceasefire if Israel were still in Gaza blowing them up.


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  • #1972
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    What have you got against settlers? It happens in many European countries now. We just call it immigration. Another word for it.

    It's happened throughout history. On this island too. Don't see you complaining about 800k settlers living here.
    Because it's illegal under international law? Not a problem for you?
    Settling somewhere is all well and good, but you generally don't declare the land you've settled on to be part of another country because that's sorta stealing.


  • #1973
    Tigerbaby
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 595 ✭✭✭Tigerbaby


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    Destroying terrorist positions is something we should all be wanting. I don't know why you would defend those tunnels.

    I agree. puts the IDF and the entire occupation in the firing line doesnt it? Terrorist entities supreme.


  • #1974
    Dan_Solo
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 10,087 ✭✭✭✭Dan_Solo


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    What have you got against settlers? It happens in many European countries now. We just call it immigration. Another word for it.

    It's happened throughout history. On this island too. Don't see you complaining about 800k settlers living here.
    BTW, this isn't up to even the most rudimentary IDF cyber propaganda division standard.


  • #1975
    Mosby61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Mosby61


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Because it's illegal under international law? Not a problem for you?
    Settling somewhere is all well and good, but you generally don't declare the land you've settled on to be part of another country because that's sorta stealing.
    You complain about Israeli settlers but not settlers here. Mainly in Northern Ireland. Hypocrisy or lack of knowledge?


  • #1976
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    What have you got against settlers? It happens in many European countries now. We just call it immigration. Another word for it.

    It's happened throughout history. On this island too. Don't see you complaining about 800k settlers living here.

    The settlers are there illegally, and are there as part of colonial project, which is also illegal, and an aggressive act of invasion. To compare the illegal Israel settlers to immigrants is absurd nonsense. Your defense of Israel violent expansion outside its borders is profoundly disturbing.


  • #1977
    Mosby61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Mosby61


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Sorry, maybe you're on catch up here. Anyway, we play this game with all you Zionist types where you have to come up with a definition of "terrorist" that doesn't also define what the IDF are doing. Wanna play?
    Defending the tunnels is immaterial to this question. There was no ceasefire if Israel were still in Gaza blowing them up.
    Zionist? Do you say that to everyone who isn't pro Palestine?


  • #1978
    Tuisceanch
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 735 ✭✭✭Tuisceanch


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    Because it's illegal under international law? Not a problem for you?
    Settling somewhere is all well and good, but you generally don't declare the land you've settled on to be part of another country because that's sorta stealing.

    Sorry wrong person.


  • #1979
    Mosby61
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43 ✭Mosby61


    wes wrote: »
    The settlers are there illegally, and are there as part of colonial project, which is also illegal, and an aggressive act of invasion. To compare the illegal Israel settlers to immigrants is absurd nonsense. Your defense of Israel violent expansion outside its borders is profoundly disturbing.
    So should the Orange settlers go home?


  • #1980
    wes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,749 ✭✭✭✭wes


    Mosby61 wrote: »
    You complain about Israeli settlers but not settlers here. Mainly in Northern Ireland. Hypocrisy or lack of knowledge?

    There is a peace deal in regards to the North that we all agreed to. The right and the wrongs of the past in regards to the North are completely irrelevant to the current topic.


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  • #1981
    ireland.man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,080 ✭✭✭ireland.man


    Dan_Solo wrote: »
    BTW, this isn't up to even the most rudimentary IDF cyber propaganda division standard.

    That's what I'm confused by.... is this standard Israeli propaganda or are these fools letting their side down? Again, I can't imagine too many well educated and well informed people being influenced by any, any single argument put forth by the pro-Israeli side on this thread so far.


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