video of an Irish teen performing 24 sex acts for a free cocktail gone viral

eviltwin wrote: »

Consequences should fit the act. The witch hunt that goes with the release of these videos is way over the top. Some people will think tough if she loses her job, is disgraced and forever known as that girl in the video but really lets look at it with a bit of logic, its not the worst thing an 18 will do, its just unfortunate its ended up going viral She doesn't deserve to forever more defined by this one moment of stupidity. There are far worse things going on that we should be saving our outrage for.

Do you have a moral compass? Do you understand people have different ones?

You don't get to decide what does and doesn't become viral. People were shocked at this and that's why it became so popular. If you have anything you feel that's worse, feel free to post it and maybe we'll get it viral too.

Colinf1212 wrote: »

Do you have a moral compass? Do you understand people have different ones?

You don't get to decide what does and doesn't become viral. People were shocked at this and that's why it became so popular. If you have anything you feel that's worse, feel free to post it and maybe we'll get it viral too.

Of course I do but I don't force it on other people. I don't judge anyone for their actions just because I personally don't agree with it. What is the point in that? Shaming someone for doing something they clearly felt was okay at the time serves no purpose.

As for posting something else up why would I do that? So you can ruin the life of another person, no thanks. That might be how you get your kicks but I'll pass.

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

The point is there shouldn't be any such consequences, and instead of telling people to pander to society's taboos for fear of persecution, we should be telling everyone else that it's unacceptable to judge someone and attack them in this manner for a harmless consensual action.

i feal sorry for the girl , her family - but is it harmless consensual behaviour for an 18 year old to indulge with over 20 adults for a ****ing drink - call me square but something is not right , think questions need to be asked of the bar, dj and society as a whole -

thebaz wrote: »

i feal sorry for the girl , her family - but is it harmless consensual behaviour for an 18 year old to indulge with over 20 adults for a ****ing drink - call me square but something is not right , think questions need to be asked of the bar, dj and society as a whole -

Can you specifically outline why you find it problematic? They all seem to have enjoyed it and until I see evidence to the contrary I'm assuming that the only aspect of this which anyone involved is upset about is the reaction of the wider public to it.

EDIT: Also: Once again we have the word "girl", and this specific sentence: "but is it harmless consensual behaviour for an 18 year old to indulge with over 20 adults"

That should read "for an adult to engage with over 20 other adults". I put it to you again, if the genders were reversed would you be implying that an 18 year old man is a "boy"?

Wishiwasa Littlebitaller wrote: »

Indeed and seems she went back the following night too. So zero to suggest that she regretted it what she did, let alone felt degraded and humiliated, as so many seem to wish was the case.

I'll give it about 15 minutes before someone says "It's because of internalized misogyny that she feels she has to do it to fit in" or something like that.
Anything to avoid discussing the possibility that she just enjoys it. :rolleyes:

Magaggie wrote: »

I think it appears that she doesn't have much time for herself to get that physically intimate with 24 strangers, in public, with all the dangers attached, and only because the club/pub said there might be a holiday in it for her. I don't think that looks like doing something because of enjoyment/really wanting to. I think she was unwise to do it too.
Sure, I only think it - but that's what this forum is for, expressing opinions.
I think most people who are posting that it's fine don't really think that, because they're then thanking posts that say she was used and abused by the club and by the guys who she sucked off (I'd apply that to the club all right, not so much the guys though - why are people viewing them as worse?) and contradicting themselves in other posts by actually pointing out downsides.
People are also lumping in people who see the downside to what she did with the scum who filmed/uploaded it and the disgusting online witch-hunting of her, which is pretty narrowminded by these apparently open-minded people.

I think people are afraid to post the negatives in case they look like "prudes" which is, to me, the other side of the coin as viewing sex as dirty and wrong.

It's possible to be extremely non prudish and see the negatives in this and to be of the view that she could do better for herself. As Candie says, talking about sexual liberation and sexual enjoyment is irrelevant anyway, seeing as a pub offering a holiday for it cancels liberation out. Anyone I know who's very sexually liberated and experimental reckons she has a distorted view of sex and feel bad for her that she feels resorting to same is doing herself any justice. It's disingenuous to say she's a grown woman etc at 18 too. She's a teen. 18 isn't what it was 50 years ago.

People who harm themselves/engage in self destructive behaviour - it's fine to talk about it being a bad thing when it's food, exercising, alcohol/drugs (all good things, even when over-indulged every so often)... but sex... oh no you can't be saying anything about an unhealthy view of sex.

How patronising. I can assure you I'm not trying to look cool by saying I don't have a problem with it. I'm saying that because I don't have a problem with it. Everyone is equally to blame here if you want to play the blame game. Bar shouldn't have had such a promotion but then if people were outraged no one would have volunteered to take part. She wasn't forced, the guys involved weren't forced, they all knew it was being filmed so they can't say they were taken advantage of there either. 18 is not a child, I have a 17 year old, they are far from naive, they are a lot more savvy for the most part than we were at their age.

Its only unhealthy if she does it all the time for some sort of validation but we don't know that. This was a group of people on holidays who went a bit mad, it happens. I doubt she or the lads would do anything like that in their hometowns but we all let our guard down to some extent on holidays. If its a one off then so what just like going on a binge one day is not that big a deal if you are taking care of your health and eating well 99% of the time.

Magaggie wrote: »

But you have also pointed out negatives to it. I am not saying you should be appalled and outraged by it either btw, or that I think you approve of it. I'm not outraged by it - I just see a downside to her doing that to herself, that's all.

Yeh I thought I knew it all at 18 too. 18 is not a child but it's not an adult either.

Is it an either/or thing Magaggie? Do I have to be either totally okay with it or completely outraged? I'm neither. I don't like that these things go on but they do and I'm not going to lose the head over it. What young people get up to on holiday doesn't bother me once its legal and no one gets hurt.

Magaggie wrote: »

Eh I just said you don't.

This is what I mean by people saying one minute they're fine with it, the next minute they see the negatives.

But what if they're getting wasted on alcohol to the point of blacking out every night. They're not hurting anyone else, but people are hardly unreasonable to see the negatives.

Of course there are negatives. Like most things. People do things all the time that have negatives but its their choice. My main concern with this is that if these games become the norm some guy or girl may feel pressured into doing something they don't really want to and that they later regret to look cool but we don't know if that is the case here, the fact she went back the following night suggests she didn't. Bottom line is they all did this and they should have been allowed to go back home and get on with their lives without anyone dragging their names through the mud. This girl wasn't wasted on alcohol, I'd be worried of course if any young person was doing that but there is no evidence she was doing that, if anything she looked quite coherent on the clip and didn't appear to be drunk.

The guys are dumb, The girl is dumb. Do they deserve to be splashed all over the internet? Sure, why not!? It was a public place..why would you do that in public? This is one of the reasons you don't do this kind of crap outside the walls of your own house. Lesson learned.

Will their lives be ruined? I doubt it will long term.

The Club owners should be looked at. Is it exploitation if the people are all drunk?I'm not sure.

It's mad she did it for free booze in a place where the booze is likely very cheap anyways. I'd guess she just wanted to be the center of attention

nm wrote: »

I wonder if this lad caught on video in Dublin this morning will be having as much of a mare

<snip>

I would guess, yes!! WOW!!

Wasn't there a picture floating around for a while of a lad who stuck his knob into an exhaust pipe. I saw that two or three times on twitter...so, yes, that kind of thing does get a lot of exposure too!

Magaggie wrote: »

I think it appears that she doesn't have much time for herself to get that physically intimate with 24 strangers, in public,

Why?

with all the dangers attached

Such as? Presume you're talking of STIs here, just to clarify

and only because the club/pub said there might be a holiday in it for her.

Again, why?

I don't think that looks like doing something because of enjoyment/really wanting to.

Well I can only speak for myself, but if I was told I might win a holiday for going down on a bunch of women in a club, I wouldn't do it unless I was also into the idea of going down on them all. Just as in general I wouldn't enter a competition to win a prize if I genuinely disliked what I had to do to win. Now obviously that's just me, but you're making the assumption that she didn't enjoy it. The evidence on video would suggest otherwise.

I think she was unwise to do it too.

Fair enough, but specifically why? Because of the inevitable backlash against her by the general public?

Sure, I only think it - but that's what this forum is for, expressing opinions.

Absolutely, same as myself.

I think most people who are posting that it's fine don't really think that,

Again making assumptions about others' viewpoints and beliefs without actually asking them. I can only speak for myself, but I do in fact think it's fine, so there's one person who doesn't fit your profile. Others will obviously have to explain their own views, I'm sure some have a problem with the promiscuity while at the same time believing the backlash was OTT. I personally don't agree with those people and I'll debate that viewpoint as that's what forums are for

because they're then thanking posts that say she was used and abused by the club and by the guys who she sucked off (I'd apply that to the club all right, not so much the guys though - why are people viewing them as worse?)

Haven't seen any of this, but I suspect part of that is the infantilizing sexist double standard whereby people claim guys know what they're doing and are more mature than women. You can see that based on everyone referring to her as a "girl", "naive teenager" etc even though she's over 18, even though the males are "men" and "adults". Insidious double standard both because of the unfair responsibility it places on men and because of the unfair denial of agency to women.

and contradicting themselves in other posts by actually pointing out downsides.

People can believe there are downsides without believing something is wrong. Smoking causes cancer and I'd point that out, but I would never get behind any campaign to ban people smoking privately. Their body, their rules.

People are also lumping in people who see the downside to what she did with the scum who filmed/uploaded it and the disgusting online witch-hunting of her, which is pretty narrowminded by these apparently open-minded people.

Agreed. There are several categories of opinion here. I'm of the "anything consensual is automatically fine, punishing someone for consensual decisions in any capacity is vile" camp myself.

I think people are afraid to post the negatives in case they look like "prudes" which is, to me, the other side of the coin as viewing sex as dirty and wrong.

Of course. The negative I can see is the possibility of getting HPV. The only other negative is the backlash, but that's not a consequence of the act but of very vile busybodies in society, and I certainly wouldn't be of the "she shouldn't have done it because of the backlash" any more than I'd tell a gay person not to come out because their family of friends might judge them.

It's possible to be extremely non prudish and see the negatives in this and to be of the view that she could do better for herself.

This is where we have a fundamental disagreement. By using a phrase like "doing better for herself" you imply certain things about sexuality and imply that she should believe the same things about it that you do. That's what I disagree with. If she's someone who loves oral sex with groups of strangers, then I put it to you that the only way she could do better would be to do it with a bigger group but you're making the assumption that she didn't do it because she enjoys it.

As Candie says, talking about sexual liberation and sexual enjoyment is irrelevant anyway, seeing as a pub offering a holiday for it cancels liberation out.

Why does it cancel liberation out? Sexual liberation should mean you do whatever you want as long as you don't hurt a non consenting third party.
Question, how do you feel about prostitution where the prostitute in question is in the trade entirely by choice?

Anyone I know who's very sexually liberated and experimental reckons she has a distorted view of sex and feel bad for her that she feels resorting to same is doing herself any justice.

Here we have the words "resorting" and "doing herself any justice", again making assumptions about how she views sex. If she views it as meaningless fun, then neither of these words apply to her, and since neither of us know her, we can't make these assumptions about her.

It's disingenuous to say she's a grown woman etc at 18 too. She's a teen. 18 isn't what it was 50 years ago.

This is complete BS in my view. There's absolutely no chance whatsoever that a man in her position would be infantilized in this way if he was over 18. No chance whatsoever. Sexist double standards abound.

People who harm themselves/engage in self destructive behaviour

Bolded this part because you've betrayed your own prejudice with these words. It's only self destructive to those who view sex as a special thing. Not everyone does. I could name many people who don't, who I know personally. It's also not "harm" in any way whatsoever.

it's fine to talk about it being a bad thing when it's food, exercising, alcohol/drugs (all good things, even when over-indulged every so often)... but sex... oh no you can't be saying anything about an unhealthy view of sex.

Excess food will make you fat. Exercising too much will make you too thin and prone to injuries. Abusing alcohol/drugs will make you sick.

Having too much sex? It carries the possibility of contracting an STI but that's it. And I'm pretty sure contracting an STI by oral sex is harder than by intercourse, although I could be proven wrong. Besides, to be honest I don't agree with judging people for drinking, drugs, obesity etc - if they're not harming a non consenting third party, they can do exactly as they like.