Ft857 /897/817 know issue (Ceramic Filters)

telecinesk · 15-11-2013 08:12PM #1

Hi,

Watty I think you have one of the 817s, my 857 threw up the static burst fault due to no dc blocking caps in the filters that yaesu fitted during manufacturing ,and after 5 yrs the radio died on my table last night. Annoying as its hardly used but was bought in 2008 when this apparently was happening in manufacturing.

Not only did the dreaded fault appears but both SSB & AM tx died also same time. FM was fine at 80W so I knew the filter issue was happening rather than blown finals.

Went online found how to do the mod and fitted the 2 x 0.01uF caps between the filter pins and had to do a jump resistor 4,7K as recommended , but what a nightmare to track cut & solder.

Unbelievable f$$$ hell is only printable words describing both the fault , and the circ repair.
Am not suprised people will rather pay the carriage and send the radios back to Yaesu for the fix. Incidentally after the repair SSB tx came back but AM tx is still not working. RX is nice and quiet so least thats solved, It looks I have to replace the 3 filters also as no doubt one of them has failed.

Am considering binning this radio and buying an ICOM, this is a pile of crap and was not cheap.
Anyone else have the same happen?

73s..

PauloMN · 15-11-2013 09:53PM

Just got my FT-897 back from Yaesu UK yesterday as you know. 3 x ceramic filters replaced. Now the question is, did they address the problem that caused the issue i.e. the lack of DC blocking caps? Or will I be sending it back again in 2 years time... suppose I won't know until it happens.

Parts were £3, labour £24 for half hour, which I was happy enough to pay tbh, as I wasn't going to start messing about with it (it's not a Superstar 360 lol). Carriage is a nightmare, but no option as I didn't know anyone suitable in Ireland to do the fix.

I have the part nos. for the filters if anyone wants them. Radio working fine now, no more static crashes and dead RX on UHF/VHF. My TX was never an issue though, so I'm not sure if you have a different issue to me.

Now to replace my antenna system! I'll get on the air sometime in the next decade....

PauloMN · 15-11-2013 10:00PM

Just to add, I've never owned, even used an Icom, but they always strike me as being expensive. My TS-50 is a super little radio, I'd buy another Kenwood in a heartbeat - certainly over a Yaesu.

telecinesk · 16-11-2013 11:58AM

I did more digging online,seems tx is affected alright when one or two of the filters die alright.
Ive mailed Yaesu so at least I get the correct parts. Given the kind of pcb it is,I dont want to drop in a wrong one and have to remove it afterwards. Nightmare etc.
SSB is fine tho, did some dxing earlier this morning on 12m .)

However once this is fixed I will dump it on ebay and get something else. Yaesu is the WKS100 of ham radio gear imo.

watty · 16-11-2013 09:23PM

I think Yaesu is pretty good. They are also helpful.

Icom are not so helpful and also their promotion of Dstar is a disgrace. Also Icom is I think overpriced. Well all Ham gear is over expensive due to it being a Niche Market. Kenwood seem OK, but never any models I fancied. The Alinco seem poor value and not as good as the other three.

But I wouldn't buy an FT857 or the equivalent from any brand. The FT897 makes more sense.

I doubt there there is any much difference between the Japanese makers at similar specs & price points.

I'm sceptical about the exact failure mode or problem as I've rarely ever seen ANY design put capacitors in series with ceramic or SAW filters. I've been designing RF gear for 30 years and first I have heard of this. I wonder is it the power level of drive on TX mode? In any case I have 100s each of full range of SM chip caps and they are easiest to "retro-fit" across a cut made in a track.

I have all the Mods listed on the usual sites (mods.dk) and Russian sites (but not for the last few years) and I don't remember seeing this one. Also of course some listed mods are pointless, only apply to US models or particular Serial Model Range or even make a set worse!

BTW I was just recently given a VX5R and a Standard C520 but both need new battery packs. Both seem OK on ext. PSU and appear to be European or German market.

Any ideas "best" place to get new batteries? Maybe Yaesu (Yaesu = Vertex = Standard).

Maybe the C520 pack can be refilled with NiMH?

I guess my FT817ND is about 7 years old? Never had any problem. I added a mod to have raw WBFM without de-empahsis on the Data socket (Band II WBFM uses a separate chip to the NBFM used other bands) so I could feed RDS & Stereo Subcarriers into external decoders.

humaxf1 · 17-11-2013 11:54PM

Same experience here.

Installed in the mobile for just over a year of not what I'd call extensive use/powered-on time and WHACK...horrible spatter on FM and SSB overnight in August. Additionally, use prior to installation in the mobile was very infrequent.

Very bad show by Yaesu in their design and the neck to advertise it as the ultimate mobile rig (in its time).

As an aside, the more you use it, the more you get to dislike the menu and the groupings of functions. There's no logical to the flow/sequence. Due to it's size there's no room as such for dedicated function buttons but you think they could have done a bit more thinking on the menus.

Anyway, rambling off topic here. I'll get the repair done and flog it because a ticking time bomb is of no use to me. Depending on budget, either a IC-7000 or IC-7100 seems a much better option albeit (7100) alot more expensive than the 857. After watching video reviews of the 7100, menu navigation is a whole lot easier, quicker and intutitive. The jog wheel is at a more ergonomic angle, soft keys for frequently used functions and the touchscreen make for a much better experience.

The ability to backup rig settings and record T/RX audio to SD card is a nice feature IMO. D-STAR...well that's another discussion.

The ceramic filter issue is abundant on the Internet with a substantial amount of disgruntled users and rightly so after shelling out ~~€600+

telecinesk · 18-11-2013 10:06AM

re watty:
" I'm sceptical about the exact failure mode or problem as I've rarely ever seen ANY design put capacitors in series with ceramic or SAW filters. I've been designing RF gear for 30 years and first I have heard of this. I wonder is it the power level of drive on TX mode? In any case I have 100s each of full range of SM chip caps and they are easiest to "retro-fit" across a cut made in a track."

Look I shouldnt have to make smc repairs to a rig that has had no more than 20 hours use and is kept in a laptop bag when not in use ie it looks new even thought its 5 yrs old. Yaesu have failed in QC and the fact they even charge for the repair says enough.
Ive 20yrs hands on with electronics in a professional capacity and this is simply not good enough.
TX drive, no radio was set for 40w on AM, also when I did do the cap mod,ssb tx came back. Go figure?

PauloMN · 18-11-2013 11:28AM

Mine was little used also. Wasn't planning on selling it, as it's in factory condition and I'd rather not get rid and have to buy a 2nd hand set - so will probably keep it.

As for it being a known issue - Yaesu know all about it - this is the reply to the original query I sent Yaesu UK about it:

Some units do have a problem with the 455Khz ceramic filter. This will affect FM operation only. This problem can sometimes be verified by tuning a few Khz off freq. If this improves the reception, the filter becomes a suspect. This 'trick' is not infallible and the filter may still be faulty if this test proves inconclusive.

We cannot arrange a collection because our insurers will not insure anything not packed here.

We do an estimate for 1/2 an hour's labour @ £24 + £20.20 (carriage) +vat (20%). If the repair takes longer than 1/2 hour, the estimate price is counted towards the cost of repair. My guess is that this repair will take an hour which includes a check on all major functions. We will have a better idea once we have seen the unit.

They charged me half an hour labour for the work, which is reasonable enough imo. The shipping to and from is the killer.

But I agree, I have 30 year old ****ty CBs that still work like they did when new. This is poor from a manufacturer of amateur radio equipment. The cases here all seem to be radios bought new and at around the same time (2007/2008-ish), and looked after without much use.

Just to add - they replaced three filters in mine. These ones:
LTM455EW
LTM455HW-AD
LTM455GW-A

watty · 19-11-2013 02:44PM

I wonder did they buy a duff lot of faulty filters?

telecinesk · 19-11-2013 08:16PM

Watty, you nailed it in 1.
Somehow they fitted wrong type or batch of filters and this is the end result.
Also, the FM receive is horrible and selectiviity is rank. So,looks like I had all 3 go.
Anyway Ive 3 on the way and hopefully this will put this matter to bed until something else fails?!
Glad to see it happened to a few of us with varying results.

watty · 24-11-2013 10:42AM

My FT817ND was purchased new from Netherlands in early 2006, so must be a later batch?

eiei0 · 10-12-2013 12:06PM

There was a bad batch of filters released in the late 00's 05-08ish

Kenwood TS2000's are also effected along with some of there VHF rigs,

I only found out after buying a Ts2000 with the filters gone bad in it

Ft857 /897/817 know issue (Ceramic Filters)

Comments