Kerbal Space Program.

artanevilla · 19-08-2013 02:56PM

Successfully landed on the Mun last night. Not enought fuel to get off. RIP Jebadiah.

seamus · 19-08-2013 03:08PM

IRLConor wrote: »

Getting around the game is all about energy management. You want to minimise the amount of wasted effort at every stage of your flights. Here are some things you can do (roughly ordered from simple to complex):
Understand how to do gravity turns. This is how you'll get into orbit with enough fuel to do interesting things.

I'm loving this game, I've done about twenty launches, but I just don't have the time to read a pile of stuff. I think this will help most as this is exactly the mistake I've been making:

The least efficient gravity turn, regardless of the body the craft starts on, is to launch the craft and maintain a vertical heading, and once the craft is either outside of the atmosphere or above surrounding obstructions, turn to face horizontally, and burn to circularize the orbit. In this gravity turn, all fuel in the initial burn is spent resisting gravity

I've been scratching my head trying to figure out how the hell people were getting landers to Mun and back. I just about managed to get a satellite into an irregular Mun orbit before I ran out of all fuel. Any attempt to bring more fuel just made a slower launch, not a farther one. I think this gravity turn stuff will really help.

CrinkElite · 19-08-2013 03:33PM

Asparagus Staging is also VERY important.
It's surprising how small a lunar rocket can be once you understand the mechanics at play.
Keep practising and remember that sometimes less is more.

IRLConor · 19-08-2013 03:46PM

seamus wrote: »

Any attempt to bring more fuel just made a slower launch, not a farther one.

More efficient staging will also help a lot.

seamus wrote: »

I think this gravity turn stuff will really help.

Yup. Rough recipe (may need adjustment depending on target orbital height and/or vehicle characteristics):

Burn straight up until 10,000m.
Slowly tip over to a 45 degree angle pointing east.
When your apoapsis reaches your desired height cut your engines entirely and "coast" to the apoapsis.
Point at the eastern horizon and burn until your periapsis reaches your desired height.

Some good throttle control in step 1 and 2 can conserve a bunch of fuel too. Depending on your thrust budget you may not want to full throttle all the time.

I also like to make some of my more risky stage separations either in orbit or below 10,000m. If I need to jettison parts flying sideways in the atmosphere I tend to use Sepatrons to make sure the parts are flung well clear of my craft.

Mr Benevolent · 19-08-2013 05:32PM

Thinking about a Grand tour now, Kerbin > Mun > Minimus > Duna > Jool > Eeloo > Eve > Moho > Kerbin. Any ideas for a better route?

BonkeyDonker · 19-08-2013 05:32PM

CrinkElite wrote: »

Asparagus Staging is also VERY important.
It's surprising how small a lunar rocket can be once you understand the mechanics at play.
Keep practising and remember that sometimes less is more.

Playing around with that - finding the right amount is hard - too much is worse than too little

Mr Benevolent · 20-08-2013 12:09PM

Landed on Minimus as a test of my new Jool Explorer. Lots of dV available thanks to the 4 NERVAs but a bit unstable during launch (90 degree yawing), but even with that problem it still made it to the Mun, reversed its orbit to dock with the junked Kapollo Interplanetary Transfer Stage to steal all its fuel, went to Minimus and came back with plenty to spare.

The spacecraft itself is a 3 man capsule lander and a standard fuel tank, with 4 NERVAs radially attached with duct tape and the usual extras.

Docked to the bottom of the lander by a Clampotron Sr is a 'service module' with the KW service module engine, a standard fuel tank, RCS and (very important) 4 External Command seats for emergencies. When the main fuel tank is empty the RCS system is good for 400m/s dV, and it has 4 heavy duty Sepatrons which give another 70m/s dV.

Played around with getting Jeb into Minimus orbit by jetpack - great fun but killed him twice on landing! Thank feck for saves.

During Kerbin entry I experimented with capsule lift profiles, which worked well enough to reduce G and change landing point by a fair bit. Was able to reduce descent rates from 350m/s to 250m/s during the high speed part of entry (above 1000m/s) from a 35km periapsis.

I really recommend the KW Rocketry Pack, some really great engines, SRBs and fuel tanks there.

Adyx · 20-08-2013 04:25PM

Yeah, the KW pack is great. There's a mod just out which optimizes it too. It reduces the size from 400 + Mbyte to about 165 which really helps with start up times.

Akrasia · 20-08-2013 08:33PM

artanevilla wrote: »

Successfully landed on the Mun last night. Not enought fuel to get off. RIP Jebadiah.

Did he die,or is he just stranded?

If he's still alive, Go get him back

My name is URL · 21-08-2013 01:30PM

Mr Benevolent wrote: »

I really recommend the KW Rocketry Pack, some really great engines, SRBs and fuel tanks there.

Does that work okay in version .21.1? Also, is there any guide on how to properly install it for that version?

Mr Benevolent · 21-08-2013 02:39PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Does that work okay in version .21.1? Also, is there any guide on how to properly install it for that version?

Yep it works fine in 0.21.1, as for installation I can't remember, should be a normal install. The main advantage of KW is rockets that look far less homebuilt and a better range of engines.

CptMackey · 21-08-2013 04:15PM

Mr Benevolent wrote: »

Yep it works fine in 0.21.1, as for installation I can't remember, should be a normal install. The main advantage of KW is rockets that look far less homebuilt and a better range of engines.

Must find that myself. Would love more engines to play around with

My kerbalnoughts won't but they will learn to cope :pac:

artanevilla · 22-08-2013 02:11PM

Akrasia wrote: »

Did he die,or is he just stranded?

If he's still alive, Go get him back

Well I took off, then ran out before I got into orbit around Mun.

Akrasia · 22-08-2013 02:14PM

artanevilla wrote: »

Well I took off, then ran out before I got into orbit around Mun.

Poor Jeb

But at least he died the way he would have wanted, as a smouldering crater on the surface of the Mun

Mr Benevolent · 22-08-2013 02:35PM

I tried sending up a heavy duty interplanetary boost stage, but the boost stage is so heavy it breaks the rocket as soon as it loads on the pad. I think some struts are in order.

IRLConor · 22-08-2013 03:05PM

Mr Benevolent wrote: »

I tried sending up a heavy duty interplanetary boost stage, but the boost stage is so heavy it breaks the rocket as soon as it loads on the pad. I think some struts are in order.

More struts and more of the launch stabiliser things. I've plenty of vehicles that "bounce" quite aggressively when loading on the pad, but they do OK once they launch.

Mr Benevolent · 22-08-2013 04:04PM

IRLConor wrote: »

More struts and more of the launch stabiliser things. I've plenty of vehicles that "bounce" quite aggressively when loading on the pad, but they do OK once they launch.

Yeah, a pair of launch stabs on the offending stage is a good idea. Just remembered, I forgot to check the T/W of the new vehicle, it's probably less than 1! Oh well, a set of Thor SRBs should sort that out.

Mr Benevolent · 25-08-2013 09:49PM

Just finished a whistlestop tour of Eve and Duna. The aim was to get within reasonable visual distance of a planet and use gravity to slingshot the Jool Explorer to another planet, ideally getting to Jool. Had a problem with the interplanetary stage and couldn't dock, so ended up using JE's internal fuel to make the tour.

Ended with a rough 15G ballistic Kerbin entry and no fuel, but the lads survived to tell the tale. Great fun and didn't take too long.

Akrasia · 02-09-2013 11:26AM

Sounds fun

I had a productive but tragic weekend on KSP. I had two Kerbals lost in space that needed to be rescued. The first was stuck on a space station with a broken docking port. I managed to rendevous with the space station, my first successful rendevous in the game. Then I had to EVA Jebadiah from the space station to the rescue ship which was hairy because I found it really awkward to get him to grab onto the rescue ship or climb into the command module. We got there eventually and I managed to bring Jeb home safely

Bob was floating in orbit in a ship that had run out of fuel. I managed to rendevous with him too and eva'd him to the external seat on my ship. Everything looked like it was going well but on re-entry, when the parachute fully deployed, the jolt from the decelaration knocked the external seat off the command module and Bob plummetted to his death.

Firing the jets on the eva suit isn't powerful enough to slow down a free fall unfortunately.

After a suitable period of national mourning, we decided to launch our first proper functioning space station in two stages.

Got the first stage in orbit smoothly and then launched part two to dock with part 1.

It was touch and go, part two used the same launch vehicle but a little bit heavier because it needed some fuselage extentions to make it usable. We got to the rendevous with just enough fuel and I managed to complete my first ever docking manouver in KSP.

Now we have a lovely shiny space station with 8 free docking ports that I will use to hold large fuel tanks for a future mission to the outer planets or more complex trips to the moon (with a rover!!)

BonkeyDonker · 02-09-2013 04:48PM

Just finished my first complete space station. I say complete as one of my docking didn't work to well and destroyed my previous one. Luckily no Kerbals were hurt, as I tend to use the remote control rings to prevent un-necessary death and destruction.

Next stop is the Mun - going to go direct from the surface, keeping the space station for later missions to further out planets.

My name is URL · 02-09-2013 05:28PM

Is it possible to approach a moon in a from a clockwise orbit without things going very badly? I made it into Jool's SoI with ion engines and want to try getting into orbit around Laythe so I can map it but am headed in the wrong orbital direction.. ie: Laythe and the other moons are travelling counter clockwise.

Just don't want to fcuk it up.. took 14 years to get this far!

Mr Benevolent · 03-09-2013 11:05AM

My name is URL wrote: »

Is it possible to approach a moon in a from a clockwise orbit without things going very badly? I made it into Jool's SoI with ion engines and want to try getting into orbit around Laythe so I can map it but am headed in the wrong orbital direction.. ie: Laythe and the other moons are travelling counter clockwise.

Just don't want to fcuk it up.. took 14 years to get this far!

That's a tough one. Depending on how far out you are from Jool, I'd start experimenting with maneuver nodes. Objects approaching Jool pick up speed amazingly fast, so the earlier you make the maneuvers the better. If you're in Jool's SOI I suspect it's too late to make such a dramatic orbit shift to CCW with ion engines.

Personally I'd concentrate on getting into an equatorial Jool orbit just outside the furthest moon and experiment with gravity assists from various moons. It should be possible to use various moons to reverse your orbit, but I've never been to Jool, so don't take my word as gospel.

In Mr Benevolent's Space Program things have been a bit ... experimental. Last night was my first attempt at a really massive SSTO spaceplane, complete with 1 1/2 orange tanks on payload plus the various bits needs to make it go. After 2 hours it still hadn't got above 200 meters and 90% of the time it didn't get off the runway. Feck! Time to go back to my Jool Explorer.

Adyx · 03-09-2013 06:15PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Is it possible to approach a moon in a from a clockwise orbit without things going very badly? I made it into Jool's SoI with ion engines and want to try getting into orbit around Laythe so I can map it but am headed in the wrong orbital direction.. ie: Laythe and the other moons are travelling counter clockwise.

Just don't want to fcuk it up.. took 14 years to get this far!

If you're doing any actual mapping i.e with ISA or Kethane you'll have to go into a polar orbit anyway. You can't map from an equatorial orbit.

My name is URL · 03-09-2013 06:47PM

Adyx wrote: »

If you're doing any actual mapping i.e with ISA or Kethane you'll have to go into a polar orbit anyway. You can't map from an equatorial orbit.

Yeah but I'd need to get into an equatorial orbit around Jool before attempting to transfer to Laythe.

I think I'm screwed in any case. Currently orbiting Jool at over 150 million meters, with the ion engines I still don't have near enough burn time to change direction. I'd crash before the manoeuvre was even 20% completed.

Oh well, live and learn. It's a miracle I made it this far anyway!

Adyx · 03-09-2013 07:47PM

My name is URL wrote: »

Yeah but I'd need to get into an equatorial orbit around Jool before attempting to transfer to Laythe.

I think I'm screwed in any case. Currently orbiting Jool at over 150 million meters, with the ion engines I still don't have near enough burn time to change direction. I'd crash before the manoeuvre was even 20% completed.

Oh well, live and learn. It's a miracle I made it this far anyway!

Ah I think I initially misread your situation. Yeah, I don't bother with ion engines. If I am going for outer planets/moons with probes etc I tend to use a nuclear upper stage and decouple the probe itself once I'm in a stable orbit and then de-orbit the upper stage (all going well!).

I haven't been out that way in a long time though. I'm currently going through many, many revisions of my large shuttle. Engine selection is proving troublesome as is managing to land back at the runway without power.

Mr Benevolent · 04-09-2013 10:19AM

Adyx wrote: »

I'm currently going through many, many revisions of my large shuttle. Engine selection is proving troublesome as is managing to land back at the runway without power.

Shuttles are an inherently crap configuration for a launch vehicle, it ended up being designed by committee, hence all the compromises. On the first launch it was so badly damaged that John Young later said that if he'd known how bad the damage was he would have ejected. My point is that you're not the only one to have trouble with the configuration, and frankly it's more trouble than it's worth.

My space program is going a bit better, the spaceplane needed 100% more wing and 50% more fuel, but it's flying and is so far holding together under very high G (15+), payload or not. Tonight's task is to get it into orbit and deliver the payload to my unfuelled Jool Explorer in LKO.

The spaceplane is also designed with an abort system - decoupling the crew module and firing sepatrons to blast it clear of the disabled vehicle. This option can be used in orbit to reenter in an emergency too. I like having options.

madness98 · 05-09-2013 12:39PM

Theres some very inspiring stuff going on in this thread. I've been spending some time building a moonbase but now, I think its time to join the rest of you brave folk and head to other planets.

On a side note, i've also tried building flyable replicas of ships from other games and show such as a Viper from BSG and a Y-Wing from Star Wars using nothing but stock parts. They look hilarious but its a fun challenge trying to get something visually acceptable and functional.

BonkeyDonker · 08-09-2013 04:07AM

About to venture to minmus - any tips?

Mr Benevolent · 09-09-2013 10:16PM

Well, I finally got into LKO using Kerblon, my KSP version of Skylon. Payload is surprisingly good, 1 1/2 orange tanks plus bits. Sadly, the orange tank probe was unbalanced and wouldn't stabilise during the rendezvous burn. Back to the drawing board, but the idea is sound.

Mr. Tezza · 10-09-2013 10:16PM

Sorry if this was already asked, I just found out about this game yesterday! downloading the demo at the moment I hope its ready before I head to bed to I can play it but I was wondering can you buy the full version on a disk or is it download only?

I ask cos I really wanna play this but I mite be getting a new laptop in the next week or so, would I be able to download it again?

Kerbal Space Program.

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