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Another problem! It isn't 3.5 tonnes after all...

2»

Comments

  • #32
    corktina
    Closed Accounts Posts: 17,730 ✭✭✭✭corktina


    well if it needs the number stamped on, i can't see it would be illegal to stamp it on yourself.

    Fords often have two plates attached to the underbonnet area at the front,one witht he VIN number and the other with trim details and the paint colour "White" I guess in your case. It sounds to me that it is one of these plates you have found but there should also be a number stamped into the body itself, on the main structure.This is the important bit.

    CAB is a ford dealer in Cork


  • #33
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    corktina wrote: »
    well if it needs the number stamped on, i can't see it would be illegal to stamp it on yourself.

    Fords often have two plates attached to the underbonnet area at the front,one witht he VIN number and the other with trim details and the paint colour "White" I guess in your case. It sounds to me that it is one of these plates you have found but there should also be a number stamped into the body itself, on the main structure.This is the important bit.

    CAB is a ford dealer in Cork

    I hope to get over and take a good look myself. It is not the sort of vehicle that has a shady past really- it clearly was a bus for a council or charity, including wheelchair users.

    We did get a call from the RSA on Thursday and they sounded more positive as the whole thing was explained. He said he would speak to engineer and get back to us. Not heard as yet- and as we are hoping to downplate due to actual weigh bridge recorded weight (not done yet as we wait for this) I don't know what an engineer would need to say.

    May well get in touch with CAB, although we are a fair ways (and no way to drive the thing) so could only be useful for phone advice- they may know more where to look though!

    Hopefully we can find it otherwise may be looking for someone with 'stamps' closer to Dublin....

    Thanks for all the advice guys! Hopefully can reward youse with on the road success picture. :)


  • #34
    niloc1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    You don't want to get it down plated to the actual weighbridge weight. If you do this you will have no payload, that's what the vehicle can carry, the difference between the actual weight and the plated Gross Gross Vehicle weight.

    What you need to do is get the plated GVW revised down to 3,500kg. This means the vehicle can be driven on a B licence.

    If the vehicle weighs, for example 2,900kg on the weighbridge, you can then load it with 600kg of payload (people and 'stuff') and still be legal.


  • #35
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    niloc1951 wrote: »
    You don't want to get it down plated to the actual weighbridge weight. If you do this you will have no payload, that's what the vehicle can carry, the difference between the actual weight and the plated Gross Gross Vehicle weight.

    What you need to do is get the plated GVW revised down to 3,500kg. This means the vehicle can be driven on a B licence.

    If the vehicle weighs, for example 2,900kg on the weighbridge, you can then load it with 600kg of payload (people and 'stuff') and still be legal.

    I know, I meant we would actually be weighing it and the plate would reflect that- realize that's not what I said! Is unladen weight not part of the figures they use? Its unladen weight as a bus with wheelchair lift is 2800 it says on the side. Have pics of another weigh plate in there with the heavier weights. The guy who converted it used ridiculously heavy board but I think we'll still be ok...

    Couldn't find the VIN stamped into the body. :( The body is covered in various coatings and padding and perhaps it could be under there? We'll try asking around people who might know (Ford specialists, the co who did the bodywork back in 2001, anyone else??), or look into stamping.... Might be back...


  • #36
    niloc1951
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,091 ✭✭✭niloc1951


    outstation42 wrote: »
    I know, I meant we would actually be weighing it and the plate would reflect that- realize that's not what I said! Is unladen weight not part of the figures they use? Its unladen weight as a bus with wheelchair lift is 2800 it says on the side. Have pics of another weigh plate in there with the heavier weights. The guy who converted it used ridiculously heavy board but I think we'll still be ok...

    Couldn't find the VIN stamped into the body. :( The body is covered in various coatings and padding and perhaps it could be under there? We'll try asking around people who might know (Ford specialists, the co who did the bodywork back in 2001, anyone else??), or look into stamping.... Might be back...

    The UL (Unladen Weight) is one of the figures required for certain categories of vehicles as you have seen, but the figure is not required for 'motor caravans' and some other categories of vehicles.

    If the UL is noted on your vehicle, which is or will be re-categorised as a 'motor caravan', it is a left over from its previous life and is no longer officially required.

    An important figure for you to know, but it's not officially required, is the actual weight of the vehicle when fully loaded with every body on board, all your holiday stuff, food, clothing, bikes, etc. etc..
    This figure will confirm that the vehicle is still within its legal GVW (if it's over you would be liable for prosecution for using an overloaded vehicle and it could nullify your insurance) and you will know how much payload you have to bring back beer and wine from France :)


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  • #37
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    I just found it interesting in working out what it may weigh now. That's interesting that they don't look to note an unladen weight- do svtech I wonder, or is it up to us to decide how close to the new max its actual weight is? It is a registered motorcaraven and, rightly or wrongly, the paperwork suggests it is not over 3.5 currently...


  • #38
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    OK. Here is where we are at. New garage will accept the fact that there is no visible chassis VIN stamp as we provided other evidence that the vehicle is what it says it is. Therefore we cannot do as suggested below as we need the plate as part of that evidence. :rolleyes:

    Last we heard from RSA guy would speak to an engineer and get back to us. This was weeks ago and he did not call back (but basically that would be a 'yes', as I took it as it isn't an issue for an engineer given that it would be downplating, using actual weight and using the services of a recognised company). We are trying him again today...

    However we are concerned that as the CRW will show the weights as on the plate currently on it (indeed it is one of their personnel taking it to the weighbridge as we cannot drive it yet) the insurance will turn it down as they will see my partner has only the standard modern license....
    paddyp wrote: »
    In the end of the day its the plate under the bonnet that the police at home and abroad and doe testers will look at.

    The doe testers manual says

    "In the absence of a manufacturer’s plate showing
    maximum permitted axle weights and design gross vehicle
    weight, the owner/presenter must provide a letter from
    the manufacturer showing the VIN, axle permitted weights
    and DGVW"

    Often the chassis has been uprated from 3500kg in the case of motorhomes. You could get a letter from the manufacturer and make the plate disappear for the doe :cool:

    The svtech plate would cover you for police checks at home and abroad. To be honest the doe guys are not likely to notice that svtech plate is not a manufacturers plate as many motorhome some with two plate under the bonnet with one xxxed out. So it would probably cover you for that too.


  • #39
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    Any thoughts? My partner is convinced we won't get insured with CRW giving original plate weight, and DoE testers say they will always go on the original plates....


  • #40
    paddyp
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,927 ✭✭✭paddyp


    outstation42 wrote: »
    Any thoughts? My partner is convinced we won't get insured with CRW giving original plate weight, and DoE testers say they will always go on the original plates....

    I'm sorry you're having such a rigmarole with this, can you not just buy the plate from svtech, DOE tester will go on that and crw will be copied from that,


  • #41
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    paddyp wrote: »
    I'm sorry you're having such a rigmarole with this, can you not just buy the plate from svtech, DOE tester will go on that and crw will be copied from that,

    The DoE testers we are dealing with (and this is the second garage- first said the same) said that they will only go by weights on the original plate. The other issue is that as we can't drive it we need to pay the garage to take it to the weigh station and they will only do this on the way to their garage.... For the DoE (I suppose we could just have any associated work that it may need to pass and then have it brought home but obviously the driving will be costing us 100s). Not sure who else we could ask- but even if we did come up with someone to drive we can't find a garage that would go by new plate! :rolleyes: :confused:


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  • #42
    Del2005
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,108 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    outstation42 wrote: »
    The DoE testers we are dealing with (and this is the second garage- first said the same) said that they will only go by weights on the original plate. The other issue is that as we can't drive it we need to pay the garage to take it to the weigh station and they will only do this on the way to their garage.... For the DoE (I suppose we could just have any associated work that it may need to pass and then have it brought home but obviously the driving will be costing us 100s). Not sure who else we could ask- but even if we did come up with someone to drive we can't find a garage that would go by new plate! :rolleyes: :confused:

    For the amount of trouble you are having getting it replated would you not just get a C1, or C, licence?


  • #43
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    Del2005 wrote: »
    For the amount of trouble you are having getting it replated would you not just get a C1, or C, licence?

    The lessons, including vehicle hire, would be very expensive and take many weeks.

    I have found out, as far as I understand, that the vehicle would have been weighed as part of the 'engineer's report'. Engineer has just put '3.5' on everything and the conversion form now has more weight and mass info than it did in 2012. Its a shame we don't have that ticket!

    My partner is concerned also that the logbook will still say it is a cat C... But then the logbook also says it has 14 seats and it pays camper tax (and has had camper insurance too).


  • #44
    Greenmotors
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Greenmotors


    outstation42 wrote: »
    The lessons, including vehicle hire, would be very expensive and take many weeks.

    I have found out, as far as I understand, that the vehicle would have been weighed as part of the 'engineer's report'. Engineer has just put '3.5' on everything and the conversion form now has more weight and mass info than it did in 2012. Its a shame we don't have that ticket!

    My partner is concerned also that the logbook will still say it is a cat C... But then the logbook also says it has 14 seats and it pays camper tax (and has had camper insurance too).

    Hi, how did this story end up for you. I ask this as I need to down plate also


  • #45
    *Kol*
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,549 ✭✭✭*Kol*


    Greenmotors wrote: »
    Hi, how did this story end up for you. I ask this as I need to down plate also

    You might not get a reply. The OP hasn't posted in about 10 months or been online in the last 4 months.


  • #46
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,326 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Last I saw that van she needed 1/2 of the sub frame rebuilt.


  • #47
    Greenmotors
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Greenmotors


    Sir Liamalot wrote: »
    Last I saw that van she needed 1/2 of the sub frame rebuilt.

    I take it they never got it down plated then?


  • #48
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,326 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    No idea.


  • #49
    outstation42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 103 ✭✭outstation42


    I don't recall the details but it wasn't a problem for anyone... It was just an awful trip around bureaucracy for nothing. Basically we ascertained that RSA should not have a problem (although even they couldn't say this with any certainty!) certainly insurer and Gardai did not, my partner might recall more specifics.

    Liam, something bad happened and we had to abandon the van, it didn't even get a look at by a professional. Trying to buy another now if you have any leads? Needs to be cheap, sound, and lots of seatbelted seats, or potential for them....


  • #50
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,326 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    PM sent.


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