Eircom Phonewatch System installed - what are my options to 'cut the cord' ?

RoZZaH · 15-05-2013 11:19AM #1

Hi there - NEWBIE QUESTION
I am not at all familiar with alarm systems at all but I wonder if anyone can offer advice in relation to Phonewatch and landline/no landline communication (e.g. Long Range Radio).

Currently we have a bog standard GE Simon XT (Model 60-916) installed that dials out on a landline - I would LOVE to cut the landline (or at least not pay landline rental) and install something like Long Range Radio?

Is LRR compatible with GE/Simon systems or am I looking at a new Control Panel?

My suspicion is that between the cost of a compatible Control Panel + LRR unit and monitoring the cost will simply be prohibitive e.g. I'm really in for a new system...

Any advice would be appreciated?
I was thinking about VOIP dial out - risky I know - "NO!" I hear you shout - on the basis that most thieves are opportunists and don't go in for cutting telephone/power cables (I live in a cul de sac on a large estate in Wexford). Will my insurance company react badly to this? Or stay stum - so long as the monitoring company can be informed/and test integrity.

Many Thanks
RoZZaH

Thunderbird2 · 15-05-2013 02:15PM

How many sensors have you installed ?
The HKC quantum alarm kit comes with 2 Pirs , 1 shock sensor and 1 reed sensor along with a key fob and wireless external bellbox . The kit costs about €390 . Extra sensors are €55
The gsm Q for the panel costs €150 but the alarm will be able to text your phone and you can also text the system to turn the alarm on and off ..
You'll be amazed at the prices of the Simon xt alarm on eBay . €70
You could try get a GSM for the Simon but you'd be better off swapping it as not many installers carry parts ect for them .
I don't think radio will work with the XT and if it does then you won't be able to use an external bell .

RoZZaH · 15-05-2013 03:16PM

Thanks for the reply Thunderbird2

3 PIRs motion detectors x 2 door sensors front+back
So existing Phonewatch sensors wouldn't be compatible with a new Control Panel then?
and there was me thinking of XT = X10 = some sort of industry standard

So LRR would not activate a bell (why are they in series? internal alarm -> dials out -> external bell)

GSM-Q - that would be blockable with a jammer though wouldn't it?

sorry for all the questions - I don't know very much/anything!

Ross

Thunderbird2 · 15-05-2013 03:31PM

The Simon xt has the option to add two hardwired sensors or use an external bell . The LRR would be triggered by the outputs used for the external bell outside the house .. The inside bell will ring .

Monitoring for radio systems is expensive .

The existing sensors aren't compatible with any other panel as far as I'm aware .

Gsm jamming isn't a huge issue in residential homes and they would have to know if you were using a landline , gsm or ip setup. but how long will it be before long range Radio can be jammed.
All wireless signals can be jammed somehow .

RoZZaH · 15-05-2013 03:49PM

Thanks for v.comprehensive reply

TakeaBowSon · 16-05-2013 08:51PM

Thunderbird2 wrote: »

Monitoring for radio systems is expensive .

The existing sensors aren't compatible with any other panel as far as I'm aware .

Gsm jamming isn't a huge issue in residential homes and they would have to know if you were using a landline , gsm or ip setup. but how long will it be before long range Radio can be jammed.
All wireless signals can be jammed somehow .

Ah come on!!You have a lot of inaccuracies above...
1. Radio monitoring is no more expensive than GSM monitoring.Do some research.
2. How do you know GSM jamming is not a huge issue in residential homes?
3.Explain to me how radio can be jammed?You don't know enough about it to be claiming its getting jammed.

I have a vested interest in radio monitoring but some of your statements are plain wrong.

Thunderbird2 · 16-05-2013 09:06PM

1)I never said radio is getting jammed .... I said how long until it will be .

2)All wireless signals can be jammed .
Wifi. Gsm even wireless alarm sensors and radio .

3) if GSM jamming in residential homes was a HUGE issue it would be all over the news and Installers wouldn't be using them . They'd refuse to them.

Maybe you should do some research??
I've done plenty

KoolKid · 16-05-2013 11:03PM

Thunderbird2 wrote: »

3) if GSM jamming in residential homes was a HUGE issue it would be all over the news and Installers wouldn't be using them . They'd refuse to them.

Maybe you should do some research??
I've done plenty

The more reputable installers are refusing to use them & tell customers about the risks.
Other installers & some monitoring stations don't because they have not alternative to offer.
Radio is the most reliable option & it is more expensive than GSM.

Thunderbird2 · 17-05-2013 12:01AM

it may be the most secure now but it won't be for very long . Again all wireless signals can be Jammed . Reputable installers may not use them but all the big popular companies are . With technology going the way it is it won't be long until someone makes a small but powerfull transmitter to knock out the radio .

KoolKid · 17-05-2013 06:00AM

Technically it may be possible, but it can never be as cheap as a GSM jammer.
It will never be generic as a GSM jammer. All GSM signals world wide are the same. There are lots of different radio networks. You would need to know a lot of information about each given network to jam it effectively. It's would want to be one hell of a unit to jam multiple networks on the range needed to disable alarm monitoring.
I don't see it happening any time soon.

TakeaBowSon · 17-05-2013 09:48AM

There are plenty of installers who refuse to fit GSM devices and just because "all the big popular companies" use them doesn't make them safe.

KoolKid · 17-05-2013 10:06AM

I agree.
Worse still some companies are lying to customers about phone lines working just to promote their GSM service, without informing customers to the risks.

Thunderbird2 · 18-05-2013 09:41PM

TakeaBowSon wrote: »

There are plenty of installers who refuse to fit GSM devices and just because "all the big popular companies" use them doesn't make them safe.

I still fail to see your point ?
GSM units can be jammed just like radio units can. No pathway to monitoring stations is 100% safe .
again all wireless signals can be jammed.
Can you provide proof that radio systems cannot be jammed ? ?

KoolKid · 19-05-2013 08:21AM

There's one major thing your overlooking.
There is proof of GSMs being jammed. There is no proof that radio can be jammed.
If you have proof to the contrary let's have it. Otherwise your wild claims are unfounded.

Thunderbird2 · 19-05-2013 09:25AM

So are you trying to claim that because radio uses different frequencies to gsm units that the signal cannot be disrupted by a slightly stronger signal of the same frequency ? Have a little google of a subject known as RF collision .

KoolKid · 19-05-2013 10:58AM

What I am saying is GSM can be jammed cheaply & effectively. By technology that is widely available.
What I am say is GSM jammers will work on all GSM networks world wide as GSM is a worldwide protocol.
What I am saying is monitoring station radio systems are closed private networks.
What I am saying is the output you would need to jam just one of these networks is a hell of a lot more that a GSM jammer. Remember a GSM jammer is not technically jamming its just fooling the phone into thinking its connected to a cell tower.
Now while technically, with the right information,the right equipment and enough money you could jam any of these networks individually.A generic unit covering all frequency possibilities is both impractical and unlikely to be available at a cost anything like a GSM jammer.
There is many recorded cases of GSM digis being blocked by jammers.
Have you any examples of the same with radio?

Eircom Phonewatch System installed - what are my options to 'cut the cord' ?

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