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revenue issues threat to every homeowner in the country.

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Comments

  • #392
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    There are very very few families bordering on poverty in Ireland.

    Well the mortgage arrears crisis would seem to indicate that there are many thousands of people in financial trouble.


  • #393
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    There are very very few families bordering on poverty in Ireland.

    There's close to 150k in mortgage arrears.

    Whats your advice to those people?

    Serious question.


  • #394
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    People who are refusing to pay this are the same people who protest about the USC, the health levy, the household charge, septic tank charges and every and any other scheme the government has used to raise revenue.

    Each and every time they've been on the end of their tether too?

    You don't hear them complaining about the government giving them mortgage interest relief too often. They're also fairly quiet when it comes to offering up areas to cut (with the exception of course of the usual calls to TAX THE RICH!!!11 and CUT POLITICIANS WAGES!!)

    Lots of 'not my problem' merchants when it comes to the awkward question of where to get the money to pay for services.

    And lots of little Government apologists too giving out the party spiel.


  • #395
    Yitzhak Rabin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,225 ✭✭✭Yitzhak Rabin


    SamHall wrote: »
    There's close to 150k in mortgage arrears.

    Whats your advice to those people?

    Serious question.

    In first instance try and cut out everything and anything that you can forgo, meals out, holidays, sky etc.

    If that fails renegotiate payments, go on interest only, payment holidays etc.

    If you still can't afford payments then you cannot afford the home you bought and you have to either sell your home, rent somewhere cheaper and pay off your mortgage, or if that is unfeasible then declare bankruptcy.

    What's not ok is to expect other taxpayers to carry the can.


  • #396
    mfceiling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,250 ✭✭✭✭mfceiling


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    There are very very few families bordering on poverty in Ireland.

    Really? Talk to someone who works for Barnardos or SVP.


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  • #397
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    In first instance try and cut out everything and anything that you can forgo, meals out, holidays, sky etc.

    If that fails renegotiate payments, go on interest only, payment holidays etc.

    If you still can't afford payments then you cannot afford the home you bought and you have to either sell your home, rent somewhere cheaper and pay off your mortgage, or if that is unfeasible then declare bankruptcy.

    What's not ok is to expect other taxpayers to carry the can    .

    While we pay back the biggest bailout in history, we're 'carrying the can' for the banks and (sorry if its a cliche, ) bondholders?

    People should essentially live a hermit/reclusive lifestyle in order to pay a Tax?


    I'm sorry, you're actually serious aren't you?


  • #398
    mfceiling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,250 ✭✭✭✭mfceiling


    Just out of interest....how many politicians will struggle to pay this new charge?


  • #399
    ilovesleep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭ilovesleep


    mfceiling wrote: »
    Just out of interest....how many politicians will struggle to pay this new charge?

    Mick the developer tax dodger might have problems. You know, he who decided to give up half of his approx 90,000 salary to revenue just to add another approx. 41,000 euro PA for expenses bringing his entire income into the 80,000's and thus he didn't give up half of his income at all.

    Brian Cowen is another guess. I believe he's studying in Harvert now so like he's probably not resident here anymore. And sure, why would he pay a tax on it considering Phil H (is it phil?) won't pay a property tax on his holiday home in spain because he doesn't live there or some excuse.

    Poor pets


  • #400
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    lob_sided wrote: »
    the only thing that shows is that a sizeable number of people are not paying their loans on time , thats a seperate issue from saying with certainty that people are in poverty

    So you think that 150k households have just decided they dont feel like paying?

    Do you have any idea what is really going on for people in this country or do you just like pontificating nonsense on the internet?


  • #401
    Yitzhak Rabin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,225 ✭✭✭Yitzhak Rabin


    mfceiling wrote: »
    Really? Talk to someone who works for Barnardos or SVP.

    What is your definition of poverty out of interest?


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  • #402
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    lob_sided wrote: »
    the only thing that shows is that a sizeable number of people are not paying their loans on time , thats a seperate issue from saying with certainty that people are in poverty

    I wonder if James Reilly is included in that 'statistic' then?

    Here's an RTE report from January.
    Over 1.5 million people have €50 or less left over at the end of the month after their essential bills have been paid, according to a survey.

    The latest 'What's Left' Tracker by the Irish League of Credit Unions also found that 90% of people have been negatively impacted by high energy costs and that 40% fear the impact of the property tax.

    This is the eighth tracker that has been carried out by the Irish League of Credit Unions since early 2011.

    It shows the number of people with little or no disposable income is continuing to rise.

    Nine out of ten people said that they have been negatively affected by rising energy costs.

    More than three quarters of adults are worried about not being able to pay their bills on time.

    However, there was a slight drop in the numbers saying they could not pay their bills.

    More than 40% believe the introduction of a property tax will have a significant impact on them.

    In what the credit unions describe as a worrying development, 17% of people were aware of moneylenders operating in their area.

    However, only 5% believe they were a viable option for borrowing.

    Speaking on RTÉ’s Morning Ireland, ILCU CEO Kieron Brennan said the financial squeeze on households is extraordinarily high.

    Mr Brennan said half of respondents cannot afford unexpected bills.

    He said: "There's a huge number of people, nearly half of the population, who are in the position of not being able to pay their bills, they must decide what will I pay this month, what will I leave until next month.

    "Unexpected items of expenditure, be it a visit to the GP, a car repair, replacing the clutch, washing machine breaks down, they just don't have that in their budget anymore."

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2013/0117/363141-credit-union-what-left/


  • #403
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 57,077 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    What is your definition of poverty out of interest?

    Someone who will drop their pants for food?


  • #404
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    lob_sided wrote: »
    a percentage of defaulters have decided not to pay

    can pay but wont pay

    up to now they have banked on the traditional culture here of incredibly low house possessions

    A percentage is not all, the percentage is considered to be 35% according to latest published papers - although this is widely disputed.

    Mortgage arrears are only one indicator of financial trouble, and currently the banks are not reporting people on interest only for financial reasons in the arrears data so arrears may be a lot higher than you think.

    On top of that is the numbers of people approaching VdeP for assistance, which has gone through the roof according to their reports.

    Its disgusting how blinkered people choose to be about the real situation in this country.


  • #405
    Yitzhak Rabin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,225 ✭✭✭Yitzhak Rabin


    tayto lover wrote: »
    Someone who will drop their pants for food?

    Heh heh. You got me there! :D


  • #406
    pitkan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 221 ✭✭pitkan


    To get back to the theme of this thread: revenue issues threat to every homeowner in the country, may I say that you either ignore the threat or act upon it.
    I've decided on the former as I , once again, see the bluff behind it.
    Revenue were recently bleeting on about the other databases, ie. ESB bills etc as part of their arsenal to bring us all to our senses. So, why, with all of the 'info' they claim to have on us are they even mentioning the already failed databases mentioned?
    Their entrapment is to issue us with some figure that we will surely argue over so as to blow our cover and then the game is up.
    I look forward to shreadding their assessment when it arrives without even giving it a quick glance other than to confirm that it is from Revenue.
    Yes, that is the way I will be dealing with this threat.


  • #407
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,370 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Geuze wrote: »
    My parents earn 50k and pay 2.5k in tax, that is 5%. That is way too low,

    Thats handy, only having to pay tax from income. How do they avoid all the other forms of tax?


  • #408
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    lob_sided wrote: »
    whats that got to do with anything

    You said:
    lob_sided wrote: »
    a percentage of defaulters have decided not to pay

    can pay but wont pay

    up to now they have banked on the traditional culture here of incredibly low house possessions

    And you said:
    lob_sided wrote: »
    the only thing that shows is that a sizeable number of people are not paying their loans on time , thats a seperate issue from saying with certainty that people are in poverty

    Reilly named in Stubbs for 'defaulting' on his loan.

    Classic example of your 'can, but won't pay' specimens.
    HEALTH Minister Dr James Reilly faces the embarrassment of being officially named this morning on a debt defaulters' list for failing to pay €1.9m.

    In an unprecedented development for a sitting cabinet member, he will be named this morning in the latest edition of the debt-monitoring magazine 'Stubbs Gazette'.

    Reilly's part of the problem so?

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/reilly-left-redfaced-as-hes-named-on-debtdefault-list-26874242.html


  • #409
    mfceiling
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,250 ✭✭✭✭mfceiling


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    What is your definition of poverty out of interest?

    Poverty is relative but I'd imagine a family that does without food at least one sitting per day. Also a family that can't afford to heat their home.

    My sister in law is a head teacher in Dublin as are both her sisters and her mother was also. The stories they've told me of kids coming to school starving as they'd no breakfast that morning (some of them having had no dinner the night before). This wasn't the 1950's they were talking about. My sister in law started a breakfast club in her school 3 years ago because of the kids coming in hungry....not kids bluffing to get a bit of free grub but embarrassed parents asking could their kids join in as well.


  • #410
    Yitzhak Rabin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,225 ✭✭✭Yitzhak Rabin


    pitkan wrote: »
    To get back to the theme of this thread: revenue issues threat to every homeowner in the country, may I say that you either ignore the threat or act upon it.
    I've decided on the former as I , once again, see the bluff behind it.
    Revenue were recently bleeting on about the other databases, ie. ESB bills etc as part of their arsenal to bring us all to our senses. So, why, with all of the 'info' they claim to have on us are they even mentioning the already failed databases mentioned?
    Their entrapment is to issue us with some figure that we will surely argue over so as to blow our cover and then the game is up.
    I look forward to shreadding their assessment when it arrives without even giving it a quick glance other than to confirm that it is from Revenue.
    Yes, that is the way I will be dealing with this threat.

    They won't be sending you anything. The register online is simply a guideline. It's up to you to value your own house and then pay the associated tax.

    If people refuse to comply then they are breaking the law, and hopefully revenue will pursue them with the full force of the law.


  • #411
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    If people refuse to comply then they are breaking the law, and hopefully revenue will pursue them with the full force of the law.

    Yes, I look forward to them pursuing me with the full force of the law. No income, no social welfare and no savings - good luck getting that pound of flesh out of me. Hope it costs many multiples of this tax to pursue me.


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  • #412
    pitkan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 221 ✭✭pitkan


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    They won't be sending you anything. The register online is simply a guideline. It's up to you to value your own house and then pay the associated tax.

    If people refuse to comply then they are breaking the law, and hopefully revenue will pursue them with the full force of the law.

    I'ma shakin' in ma boots man.


  • #413
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,849 ✭✭✭professore


    SamHall wrote: »


    Reilly named in Stubbs for 'defaulting' on his loan.

    Classic example of your 'can, but won't pay' specimens.



    Reilly's part of the problem so?

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/reilly-left-redfaced-as-hes-named-on-debtdefault-list-26874242.html

    Even on a ministers salary, 1.9 million is unaffordable.


  • #414
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »
    They won't be sending you anything. The register online is simply a guideline. It's up to you to value your own house and then pay the associated tax.

    If people refuse to comply then they are breaking the law, and hopefully revenue will pursue them with the full force of the law.

    We heard all this law breaking, and found & fined malarkey from the household charge fiasco, which I believe was merely the foundations being lain for this Tax, and when near 600k of the population refused to comply/bullied, to date no one, nobody, not homeowner not landlord has yet been prosecuted.

    Pardon me if I'm far from frightened.


  • #415
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,370 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Yitzhak Rabin wrote: »

    If people refuse to comply then they are breaking the law, and hopefully revenue will pursue them with the full force of the law.

    This boards really is the home of the flawless. Last time I asked a poster who said what you said there, if he ever broke a law, he actually said no.


  • #416
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,849 ✭✭✭professore


    pitkan wrote: »

    I'ma shakin' in ma boots man.

    Revenue will take it out of your salary/bank account/social welfare with hefty interest. TBH anyone who doesn't pay is an idiot.


  • #417
    Banjo String
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,380 ✭✭✭✭Banjo String


    professore wrote: »
    Even on a ministers salary, 1.9 million is unaffordable.

    It is widely accepted that Dr James Reilly is a multi-millionaire.

    You're hardly likely to bump into him in the noodle aisle in lidl.
    He has the toughest job in the Cabinet. James Reilly runs a Health Department that was famously described by Brian Cowen as "Angola'' and this week he had to announce how he proposes to slash his annual budget by a staggering €750m.

    But the ebullient minister will have plenty to fall back on if his late venture into the world of politics founders.

    At the age of 56, the man known as "Bottler'' -- due to his uncanny likeness to the comedian Brendan Grace -- is a person of no little means.

    He is owner of four homes, including a stately 13-bedroom mansion with its own disused airstrip, two farms, a shopping centre, two medical practices, various parcels of land and a collection of classic cars.

    Taking pride of place in the minister's mini-empire is the Loughton Estate, former ancestral home of the Trench family near Moneygall.

    Reilly became part of the Biffo gentry when he bought the 15,000 sq ft pile for close to €2m a decade ago. With its billiards room, servants' quarters, and wine cellars bigger than the average underground car park, it is the ideal pied à terre in which to unwind when the minister wants to escape the pressure cooker atmosphere of the less salubrious Hawkins House, where his ministry is based.

    "Bottler'' can rest his weary limbs in Loughton's King's Bedroom, a mammoth boudoir remodelled for the visit of King George IV in 1821. The monarch never slept in it, I am told, but it is there for the Dublin North TD, and his wife Dorothy.

    The previous occupant put in a swimming pool, tennis court, the grass airstrip and an aircraft hangar, but the busy minister has so far not been tempted to take to the skies. On the minus side, the ghost of a Cromwellian soldier is said to stand sentry in a tower house.

    Of course, any landed gent will tell you that a squire's lifestyle requires oodles of cash. The minister receives tax relief for his efforts to maintain his important architectural treasure, and as a result of this he opens the house to the public in the summer with an entrance fee of €5.

    The real source of Reilly's wealth is as a medical entrepreneur who ran two GP practices in north Dublin, and as landlord of the Lusk Town Centre and various other properties.

    Before he had to take a leave of absence from it, upon becoming minister, his GP practice was pulling in up to €340,000 a year from public patients. Since taking office, he has also announced the sale of a quarter share in a nursing home in Tipperary.

    Can pay, wont pay.

    http://www.independent.ie/lifestyle/the-life-of-reilly-26813751.html


  • #418
    ilovesleep
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,619 ✭✭✭ilovesleep


    mfceiling wrote: »
    Poverty is relative but I'd imagine a family that does without food at least one sitting per day. Also a family that can't afford to heat their home.

    My sister in law is a head teacher in Dublin as are both her sisters and her mother was also. The stories they've told me of kids coming to school starving as they'd no breakfast that morning (some of them having had no dinner the night before). This wasn't the 1950's they were talking about. My sister in law started a breakfast club in her school 3 years ago because of the kids coming in hungry....not kids bluffing to get a bit of free grub but embarrassed parents asking could their kids join in as well.

    I would very much believe this and what you wrote. God! Some people coming from a comfortable position can't, wouldn't or don't want to see that this is happening in Ireland 2013. I fear that things are going to get so much dire for so many more people.


  • #419
    username123
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,484 ✭✭✭username123


    professore wrote: »
    Revenue will take it out of your salary/bank account/social welfare with hefty interest. TBH anyone who doesn't pay is an idiot.

    Whats idiotic is a tax that takes no account of ability to pay. I wouldnt call someone who cant afford to pay an idiot, but I would call someone who thought the above an idiot.


  • #420
    Yitzhak Rabin
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 7,225 ✭✭✭Yitzhak Rabin


    SamHall wrote: »
    We heard all this law breaking, and found & fined malarkey from the household charge fiasco, which I believe was merely the foundations being lain for this Tax, and when near 600k of the population refused to comply/bullied, to date no one, nobody, not homeowner not landlord has yet been prosecuted.

    Pardon me if I'm far from frightened.

    Local Co. Councils were collecting that. They are ineffectual and toothless. The revenue is a far different animal, sporting great big shark-like jaws.


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  • #421
    pitkan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 221 ✭✭pitkan


    SamHall wrote: »
    We heard all this law breaking, and found & fined malarkey from the household charge fiasco, which I believe was merely the foundations being lain for this Tax, and when near 600k of the population refused to comply/bullied, to date no one, nobody, not homeowner not landlord has yet been prosecuted.

    Pardon me if I'm far from frightened.
    600k of the population is a wrong figure Sam. It's 600k households which in real terms is, based on joint mortgauge holders and either one of them being liable , equates to 1.3 million or more people who are boycotting this farce.


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