Why cinemas can go to hell, and I will pirate [ MOD WARNING IN OP ]

Duggy747 · 24-07-2012 10:08AM

krudler wrote: »

Between 1997 and 2005 Limerick only had one actual cinema, now we have three, there used to be quite a few and some of them were lovely, proper old style theatre cinemas. If I ever had the money I'd open a cinema with a small number of screens, art deco styled, catering for movie fans who are sick of the multiplex experience.

Up until a year or 2 ago, Co. Roscommon didn't have a cinema for about 20 years. We had to make do with ancient, dusty cinemas in Mayo or drive all the way to Carrick-On-Shannon / Athlone to get our fix.

As regards to Camrips, I don't know how people can watch them. Even Telesyncs, with a direct audio line in can't compare, especially if the movie has dark scenes in it then you're just staring at nothing.

I do enjoy the Club Orange "ladies and their bits" ad in the cinema, though, always pisses the GF off :pac:

podgemonster · 24-07-2012 10:47AM

Went on Friday night to an IMC Dun Laoghaire for TDKR. 2 Tickets €15.60 (gf got a student card ftw), couples combo €9, maltesers in tesco €1.50, free parking. 4 ushers on hand to show people to there seats.

All seats full before film started while 3 trailers and about 5 minutes of ads played. Love those club orange ads, genius! Everyone very well behaved. A lovely way to spend an evening.

puffishoes · 24-07-2012 11:44AM

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

I genuinely think it's one of the most harmful, hypocritical things a film fan can do.

I think part of the problem here is they're not really "fans"

for most people it's close to picking up womans own for an hour. If people had 0.1% of the interest in film as you show in your posts, the landscape of Irish cinema would be very different.

I think we have to keep this in mind for most it's just cheap throw away entertainment.

e_e · 24-07-2012 12:41PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I went to the Lighthouse to see TDKR

10.30 showing
16 euro for two student passes + booking fee (19 without student rate)
Bar open (Staropramen @ 4.50 - not bad)
Cinema absolutely stuffed
No ads at all
2/3 trailers
Most of the audience aged 25+

Why? Because it's a cinema. It doesn't have toy machines or slot machines. It's clean crisp and I would say the local scummers would walk up to cineworld. As long as The Lighthouse stays open and is reasonably priced, I won't go to another cinema if I can help it. It's so nice to be treated like an adult in a cinema.

This, 1000 times this.

More people in this thread should flag up the good experiences they've had instead of acting like spoiled children overreacting.

krudler · 24-07-2012 12:59PM

e_e wrote: »

This, 1000 times this.

More people in this thread should flag up the good experiences they've had instead of acting like spoiled children overreacting.

Showtime in Limerick for me then, genuinely can't praise them enough , tickets are €9 for adults, food is ok, 3D glasses are €1, you can keep them to bring again and there's no extra charge for 3D showings themselves so if I have to see something in 3D I'll go there.
The screens are all huge, digital and have 7.1 surround in all of them,even the adverts beforehand look stunning, and they play a cool dolby surround tech demo thingy beforehand (I'm a geek for that stuff) and a luxury screen with leather reclining seats which is €2 more a ticket. Have gone there since they opened a few months ago and the only technical hitch was Spiderman not starting for about 5 mins the screen just went dark, and someone came in to apologise so at least we weren't just left sitting there, minor issue really. They seem to take a harsh stance on messers as well, a friend was there when some teens were being a pain, one person went out to complain and they were all turfed out straight away, no warnings, the way it should be.

Its easy to have a fantastic cinema experience if you go at the right times i.e not on Sundays, daytime during the weekends when it'll be full of kids etc.

jaykhunter · 24-07-2012 12:59PM

Just personal experience but i'm finding the Savoy crowd much more behaved (ie perfect) than Cineworld and also the Vue (which i'd deem the worst). Obviously enough never heard a peep out of the Light House patrons.

d@rk l0rd · 24-07-2012 01:12PM

I don't think highlighting bad manners and behaviour in cinemas is overreacting like spoiled children. That sort of comment sounds like you haven't had a bad experience because if you have had you wouldn't say something so silly like that.
My worst experience was a cinema screen full of skangers throwing stuff at each other, shouting, using phones. Thankfully most of my experiences are fine but I don't think highlighting bad behaviour is overreacting like spoiled children.
I like reading both the good and bad experiences of cinema goers as it helps me decide which cinemas to go to and which to avoid.

Fysh · 24-07-2012 05:01PM

e_e wrote: »

More people in this thread should flag up the good experiences they've had instead of acting like spoiled children overreacting.

I agree that highlighting good experiences is important in terms of retaining context, but I think it's pretty arrogant to dismiss people commenting on what sound like fairly frustrating cinema outings as "children overreacting". Vue have a pretty patchy rep in the UK for actually managing their cinemas (I've had mails from them where they've outright lied to me about the reason for merging food/concession sales with ticket sales at one of their busier cinemas, which had a substantial negative impact on queue lengths and waiting times, for example) and from what I've read here they're even worse back home. Given the price of cinema tickets, I think it is legitimate to get frustrated if there's antisocial behaviour going on and the cinema management do nothing to prevent it (and no, I don't think you should have to go out to the central foyer to get someone, there should be ushers checking on each screening hall regularly as part of the daily routine).

On the plus side, I'm very lucky to have a whole bunch of excellent cinemas to choose from - by living in Kilburn I'm basically up the road from the Tricycle, which I really can't praise enough. I've also got a decent Odeon nearby at Swiss Cottage, and then there are the Curzon cinemas in central London and the inimitable Prince Charles.

johnny_ultimate · 24-07-2012 05:12PM

The Prince Charles is a nice ol' cinema. Saw quite a few films there over a very short space of time as part of a festival (six films over 48 hours or so) and wouldn't have a bad thing to say about it. Also the screen downstairs has the most unusual but effective seating gradient I've ever seen

I'd like to see a cinema with that sort of distinctive character over here. Late night triple-bills, cult screenings, a constant flow of classic films, offbeat films alongside the blockbusters, extremely reasonable pricing for the centre of London etc... Something like the Prince Charles is decidedly lacking in Ireland: The Screen or Lighthouse are relatively close, but not on the same scale as the PC.

e_e · 24-07-2012 05:34PM

d@rk l0rd wrote: »

I don't think highlighting bad manners and behaviour in cinemas is overreacting like spoiled children. That sort of comment sounds like you haven't had a bad experience because if you have had you wouldn't say something so silly like that.

I've had several bad experiences but I've never arrogantly used them as an excuse to slam the entire moviegoing experience or justify illegally downloading. Sorry if it came across as insulting but I struggle to understand how the utterly illogical and misguided rant of the OP continues to get support, and I do find their viewpoints genuinely harmful.

krudler · 24-07-2012 05:40PM

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

The Prince Charles is a nice ol' cinema. Saw quite a few films there over a very short space of time as part of a festival (six films over 48 hours or so) and wouldn't have a bad thing to say about it. Also the screen downstairs has the most unusual but effective seating gradient I've ever seen

I'd like to see a cinema with that sort of distinctive character over here. Late night triple-bills, cult screenings, a constant flow of classic films, offbeat films alongside the blockbusters, extremely reasonable pricing for the centre of London etc... Something like the Prince Charles is decidedly lacking in Ireland: The Screen or Lighthouse are relatively close, but not on the same scale as the PC.

something styled like these and not just your standard dull room with seats in it multiplex look:

e_e · 24-07-2012 05:42PM

Fysh wrote: »

I agree that highlighting good experiences is important in terms of retaining context, but I think it's pretty arrogant to dismiss people commenting on what sound like fairly frustrating cinema outings as "children overreacting". Vue have a pretty patchy rep in the UK for actually managing their cinemas (I've had mails from them where they've outright lied to me about the reason for merging food/concession sales with ticket sales at one of their busier cinemas, which had a substantial negative impact on queue lengths and waiting times, for example) and from what I've read here they're even worse back home. Given the price of cinema tickets, I think it is legitimate to get frustrated if there's antisocial behaviour going on and the cinema management do nothing to prevent it (and no, I don't think you should have to go out to the central foyer to get someone, there should be ushers checking on each screening hall regularly as part of the daily routine).

Well let me just be completely clear in saying that I think people should complain and try to do something if their cinema isn't up to snuff, my post was a response to the people who were generalizing and misguidedly ranting against an entire industry when said things could simply being ignored by going to a different cinema. A cinema is like anywhere that offers a service, if you have a bad experience in one place you go to another next time and if more people did this the good cinemas would have a reason to continue offering a higher standard of quality.

OMARS_COMING_ · 24-07-2012 05:43PM

The joys of getting old!

Complaining about cinemas,remember when you were a child and you just went to the cinema and enjoyed it no matter what the experience?

These days things have to be perfect!

rednik · 24-07-2012 05:49PM

Good Experience.:)

I have used the Savoy for 40 years and will continue to do so. I am going to TDKR tomorrow afternoon with the family and at 6.70 each in screen 1 that to me is great value in the middle of Dublin City.

the_syco · 24-07-2012 06:12PM

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

- 3 trailers, all cartoons WTF

For a 12A film; what did you expect? Guts and violence?

Theboinkmaster wrote: »

- full of knackers

Blame the halting site down the road.

=-=

Was in Screen 4 at Vue for TDKR. No aircon, but luckily the sound was good, and not many people were talking. Dislike having to pay an extra euro for no scumbags an over 18's screening, but it meant I could watch the film better.

Deleted User wrote: »

I went to the Lighthouse

Meaning to go there myself. Will probably go watch "Ted" there.

Cruel Sun · 24-07-2012 06:19PM

Sanjuro wrote: »

At one point I lost my patience and futilely yelled 'GET ON WITH IT' into the darkness.

LOL

Fysh · 24-07-2012 08:48PM

Tangentially related to this thread - we've been talking about the presence of unskippable ads on DVDs as something that frustrates most of us (and which some view as a justification for pirating o_O). While I'm pretty firmly opposed to the OP's stance, I'm not 100% on the side of angels as, for example, I'm in the middle of extended project to rip all the household DVDs to my HTPC for ease of viewing - which under UK & Irish law alike is a no-no, albeit one that at least the UK looks set to address in the near future. I have also been bold on occasion where there was no legitimate way to watch something (as in, not available to buy, rent, or watch in the cinema anywhere in my country of residence at the time), though I strive to spend money on those films if and when they become available. A Film With Me In It is a particularly good example of this - I saw it at the Tricycle when it first came out, waited ages for the DVD, which was only released on R4 for ages, emailed the production company to ask about an R2 release and didn't even get a response, eventually sourced a Naughty Copy in frustration. Several years later they release an R2 DVD, and express surprise at the relative lack of demand, then drop the price. I paid about £5 for my copy, but I would have happily paid £10 several years back if the silly twunts had thought to put the bloody thing out on R2...

However, there are some good moves in the right direction of late - not just the arrival of Netflix in the UK & Ireland, but also the availability of things like Film4OnDemand and Curzon On Demand - I tried out Film 4 OD recently to catch The Awakening as I missed in the cinema when it was out last Christmas, and I have to say the experience was pretty good. Easy to get set up - the only issue I hit was not having Silverlight installed on the HTPC, which was easily remedied - and mostly reasonable prices. Plus they are sensible and offer you the chance to download for offline viewing at a later point, which I haven't tried but which is a good idea if it works as described.

This isn't really relevant to cinema, as such but it does relate to "the industry", at least enough to prove that any generalisation about "the entire industry" is likely to be wrong in at least some cases.

I'll be trying the Curzon On Demand service soon, as I've been very happy to see that a number of smaller independent/arthouse films I've wanted to see in the last year or so and missed are available to stream, and all at pretty decent prices.

johnny_ultimate · 24-07-2012 09:40PM

Still the best cinema I've ever been to. Shame it's 1000s of kilometres away. Interval cookies were bitchin' though. Would totally go to Cineworld more if I got homemade cookies.

Fysh · 24-07-2012 10:35PM

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Still the best cinema I've ever been to. Shame it's 1000s of kilometres away. Interval cookies were bitchin' though. Would totally go to Cineworld more if I got homemade cookies.

Where's that? It looks great

marienbad · 24-07-2012 10:44PM

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

As in a utopian society where all art is free, and the artists are rewarded appropriately for their contribution to society? That would be wonderful. I'd like to think everyone who downloads is a staunch advocate of borderless art and transmission, but I'm not exactly convinced having a read through this thread.

Personally, as someone starting off in the film industry (I do have a livelihood to worry about), a passionate cinephile, and an enthusiastic supporter of world and independent cinema, unfortunately that utopian ideal, while admirable, has little to no grounding in contemporary reality. Also I don't want to see the cinema as a concept disappear - perhaps not quite as militant as Germaine Greer when it comes to the ritual of the darkened theatre, but militant nonetheless Also as a poor student it's increasingly rare I'm able to pay top dollar, but having just watched my pristine Blu-Ray copies of Sansho Dayu / Gion Bayashi, rest assured it was worth every cent I pulled together for it.

The are so many issues and contradictions involved in this whole piracy business it is hard to know where to begin , so I will just through out some thoughts as they come to me .

-There has always been piracy of intellectual property. Hollywood is founded on this very notion when all the film makers upped and left for the west coast and not just for the sunshine but to escape the copyright enforcement agents of Edison. On top of all that the USA were the greatest pirates of the 19th century knocking off sheet music, operas etc and damn the copyright holder. No less an institution that The New York Metropolitan Opera were the first the break the copyright on Parsifal by Wagner and more or less threw down the gauntlet to come and get us if you can (or dare)

The only thing that has changed is the USA is now the main producer and cries foul - well too late kiddo.

- All the major media producers in films- music-books ( and probably games , but I don't know much about this area) really don't care about their customers and just see them as sheep to be fleeced. Numerous examples

A classical music cd used to cost anything uo to 50 pounds ( boxed opera set) and the average price would be around 20 to 25, and the money rolling in . Next along comes Naxos and no cd more that a fiver and next the classical music industry is in crisis . Crisis my arse - they just had to get real but alas it may be too late and they have nobody to blame but themselves.

Kindle is going to go the same way ,the book de jour 50 shades of grey is 10 pounds on kindle and 15 pounds paperback - how is that possible ?
No raw material,production ,storage,shipping costs and only a fiver in the difference ? The original notion was that the middle men ( and all those jobs) would be dispensed with and only the artist and the delivery mechanism would remain and books would 3 or 4 quid . How is that working out for you ? And we don't even have all those lost jobs - just the high prices.

I could give other examples- Itunes , why is it (last I looked) 99c us , 99cEuro and 99 p Uk for the same track ? That a 50% price spread ?

Why are they trying to limit the number of machines you can play a tune on ? I believe thay are trying the same with games and would like to eliminate the 2nd hand games market.

Why have all the different regions ?

We know why of course , to maximise profits at the expense of their customer base. When you behave like that expect no loyalty.

And now we come to the oft quoted argument that piracy is killing the movie industry - absolute rubbish . If anything is killing the movie industry it is the movie industry killing the movie industry . Profits for all the major movies are at an all time high. The latest Batman leaked online before release and it had no effect what so ever. Batman enjoyed the greatest opening week-end ever.

It is a just not correct to assume that a download represents a lost sale. The very people that download the most are the first in the queue for the movie release and go more than once to those movies .

As for independant cinema - outside of dublin and possibly Cork it is virtually impossible to see an independant or foreign film at its time of release, there are simply no screens available and never will be , the Hollwood mafia and their cinea chain mates have long ago seen to that.

That is what is killing diversity in cinema - if the artist has no forum he may as well have no art. Just endless remakes of batman spiderman and superman - a 10 year old's idea of heaven but hell to everyone else- but they do pack those cinemas . Who cares if some French auteur has to go with the begging bowl to his government or John Cassavetes spend his time acting to pay for the priviledge of inventing independant Us cinema

But true art will always find away and the pirate sites may turn out to be the best vehicle yet.

johnny_ultimate · 24-07-2012 11:01PM

Fysh wrote: »

Where's that? It looks great

Rural New Zealand :pac:

It's great though: the Paradiso in Wanaka. If anyone's ever round those neck of the woods, pop in! It's an experience. The locals have even made amateur ads to show before the film, which is a particularly nice touch.

Headshot · 25-07-2012 05:35PM

Iv had another negative cinema experience today. Person behind me kept hitting my seat

Its mostly people that ruin it for me. Be it on their phones, chatting, kicking seats going in and out of their seats

phasers · 25-07-2012 06:25PM

For a bit of balance, here's a positive cinema experience!

I went to see TDKR in IMC Tallaght yesterday afternoon
€7 tickets (also I noticed it's only €4.50 for the unemployed, great idea!)
Big comfy seats
Reasonably priced food (€4.80 for a large popcorn! I almost keeled over. Vue charge nearly double that!)
The usual crappy ads but they don't bother me (except that Jennifer Lopez one)
And most importantly, everyone shut the hell up when the film started.

Great cinema experience, I'll definitely be going more often!

I'd barely get a ticket in Vue for what I paid for a ticket and large popcorn in Tallaght. The clientele seemed a bit better than Vue as well, but that may have been down to the time of day.

Thwip! · 25-07-2012 09:38PM

Headshot wrote: »

Iv had another negative cinema experience today. Person behind me kept hitting my seat

Its mostly people that ruin it for me. Be it on their phones, chatting, kicking seats going in and out of their seats

Why not just turn around and roar in his face "OOH BABY YEAH KEEP DOING THAT, ITS TURNING ME ON"

G-Money · 25-07-2012 09:47PM

One option is that the film companies could release films to watch online or via PPV at the same time as in the cinema. This could be done via something like Netflix or Sky Box Office. That way you can pay to see it via Netflix or PPV in your home, or go to the cinema to see it. If you don't have access to some sort of legal online streaming or Sky, then just go see it in the cinema.

My own theory about illegal downloading is that a large percentage will continue to do it until/unless they are given access to the content they want, when they want. That's just the way society has gone, people want stuff on demand now and the infrastructure is pretty much at the point where it can deliver that. Of course there will always be a percentage who will download illegally regardless, but that's to be expected.

One example is that I almost always buy stuff from iTunes now where I wouldn't have done so before. If it's available and priced reasonably, I don't have much qualms about buying these things online. It's when they're not available, often for what seems like stupid reasons, that I look elsewhere.

25-07-2012 09:52PM

phasers wrote: »

For a bit of balance, here's a positive cinema experience!

I went to see TDKR in IMC Tallaght yesterday afternoon
€7 tickets (also I noticed it's only €4.50 for the unemployed, great idea!)
Big comfy seats
Reasonably priced food (€4.80 for a large popcorn! I almost keeled over. Vue charge nearly double that!)
The usual crappy ads but they don't bother me (except that Jennifer Lopez one)
And most importantly, everyone shut the hell up when the film started.

Great cinema experience, I'll definitely be going more often!

I'd barely get a ticket in Vue for what I paid for a ticket and large popcorn in Tallaght. The clientele seemed a bit better than Vue as well, but that may have been down to the time of day.

In Dundalk it's 3.80 in the daytime if you're on the dole. Excellent idea because it's 6 quid for the large popcorn and drink so the whole lot comes in under a tenner and feels like you're not getting rip off and they get their income from the popcorn.

speedboatchase · 26-07-2012 10:41AM

G-Money wrote: »

One option is that the film companies could release films to watch online or via PPV at the same time as in the cinema. This could be done via something like Netflix or Sky Box Office. That way you can pay to see it via Netflix or PPV in your home, or go to the cinema to see it. If you don't have access to some sort of legal online streaming or Sky, then just go see it in the cinema.

My own theory about illegal downloading is that a large percentage will continue to do it until/unless they are given access to the content they want, when they want. That's just the way society has gone, people want stuff on demand now and the infrastructure is pretty much at the point where it can deliver that. Of course there will always be a percentage who will download illegally regardless, but that's to be expected.

One example is that I almost always buy stuff from iTunes now where I wouldn't have done so before. If it's available and priced reasonably, I don't have much qualms about buying these things online. It's when they're not available, often for what seems like stupid reasons, that I look elsewhere.

This has came close to happening on a few occasions with big budget releases but the problem is that cinema chains threaten to boycott the film completely and not screen if it the studios do so. Also the costs they seem to want to charge are crazy.

Have a read of this - the Eddie Murphy and Ben Stiller comedy was meant to be released on PPV for $60 (!) three weeks after its cinema release but the National Association of Theater Owners in the US threatened a boycott. It'll probably happen eventually.

http://www.screened.com/news/how-tower-heist-could-have-changed-the-way-you-watch-movies-but-wont/3014/

Arcee · 26-07-2012 11:09AM

www.volta.ie is the only legal site I've found in Ireland where you can see PPV films at the same time as they're in the cinema. It's not all films but they had Knuckle, Route Irish and Into The Abyss at the same time as the cinema release and they have one coming up tomorrow - a new Irish film called Silence. Good if you're into indie/arthouse/Irish film rather than blockbusters.

Discostuy · 26-07-2012 01:53PM

johnny_ultimate wrote: »

Rural New Zealand :pac:

It's great though: the Paradiso in Wanaka. If anyone's ever round those neck of the woods, pop in! It's an experience. The locals have even made amateur ads to show before the film, which is a particularly nice touch.

I was there for the opening weekend of Peter Jacksons King Kong. We were walking past one day and some lady nabbed us and persuaded us to buy tickets for the opening night.
We didn't know what to expect but it turned out to be one of the best cinema experiences ever.

They had the film a week before the world opening due to the PJ/NZ connection.

We'd a whole sofa to ourselves and they served wine and wild salmon finger food before it

The half time interval was tonnes of home baked nibbles. It was a bizarre experience at the time but looking back it was one of the highlights of our trip.

Antar Bolaeisk · 26-07-2012 01:59PM

phasers wrote: »

€7 tickets (also I noticed it's only €4.50 for the unemployed, great idea!)

Slight derailment here but why do you think it's a great idea? Fair enough not all who are unemployed are so by choice but certainly quite a few 'round here have never worked a day in their life.

Why should they get cheaper tickets then me simply because I work and they do not. Surely if they're short of cash they've better things to be spending the money on anyway.

Besides, I've helped pay for their cheaper ticket as well as paying for my own

/rant

Why cinemas can go to hell, and I will pirate [** MOD WARNING IN OP **]

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Why cinemas can go to hell, and I will pirate [ MOD WARNING IN OP ]