Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12 MOD POST #1130

Knex* · 17-07-2012 05:08PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

Sweet as, I look forward to the first criticisms of Rodgers when we loan him out/let him go for less than £15m.

Why? Because you'll feel (wrongly) vindicated about your criticism of the whole thing now?

Nobody here is saying to do either of the options you just posted, naturally, if it does happen then there will be criticism from the fans. People here are saying 17m + as the figure deemed acceptable, and that also comes with the assumptions of Carroll being replaced by Dempsey and one or two others. Its the whole package.

Coming on here and calling it a disaster if Carroll is sold and then saying you look forward to him being sold for less than anyone wants, or loaned out, so as you can start quoting yourself when people complain about the deal and "prove" you were right is something I honestly don't get.

Kess73 · 17-07-2012 05:09PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

More meant that I'm looking forward to proof that the majority of people in this thread aren't the droolers & football manager experts I currently suspect they are.

Must be terrible to be so bothered about the opinions of others that it becomes a case of hoping something goes wrong at the club so that you can be proven right.

I much prefer when any negative opinions I have on a player or manager get smashed to pieces as it means my team is doing well.

Mr Alan · 17-07-2012 05:11PM

Knex. wrote: »

Nobody here is saying to do either of the options you just posted, naturally, if it does happen then there will be criticism from the fans. People here are saying 17m + as the figure deemed acceptable, and that also comes with the assumptions of Carroll being replaced by Dempsey and one or two others. Its the whole package.

The way it's been handled selling on the cheap or loaning are the only real outcomes IMO. We shall see though.

Mr Alan · 17-07-2012 05:12PM

Kess73 wrote: »

Must be terrible to be so bothered about the opinions of others that it becomes a case of hoping something goes wrong at the club so that you can be proven right.

I much prefer when any negative opinions I have on a player or manager get smashed to pieces as it means my team is doing well.

LOL

Super-Rush · 17-07-2012 05:16PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

More meant that I'm looking forward to proof that the majority of people in this thread aren't the droolers & football manager experts I currently suspect they are.

If at first you don't succeed, insult people.

Kess73 · 17-07-2012 05:19PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

LOL

I will always love you though. Mainly because you are as stubborn about your opinions as I am with mine.:)

K-9 · 17-07-2012 05:19PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

More meant that I'm looking forward to proof that the majority of people in this thread aren't the droolers & football manager experts I currently suspect they are.

Now I know you are on the wind up.

Mr Alan · 17-07-2012 05:22PM

K-9 wrote: »

Now I know you are on the wind up.

I was actually serious, but ok

17-07-2012 05:23PM

In fairness, anything less than £20m for Carroll is a disaster from a financial point of view.

He's cost us £41m so far including wages.

We need to at least get half our money back so I can get where Alan is coming from.

Imo anyway it doesn't make sense getting rid when he starts to show form especially when we have signed a guy from Italy that could take as long as Carroll to settle.

Carroll will score more than 9 goals this eason, I'd be sure of it.

Keep Carroll and get Dempsey, that's what I think.

whatawaster · 17-07-2012 05:33PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

In fairness, anything less than £20m for Carroll is a disaster from a financial point of view.

He's cost us £41m so far including wages.

We need to at least get half our money back so I can get where Alan is coming from.

Imo anyway it doesn't make sense getting rid when he starts to show form especially when we have signed a guy from Italy that could take as long as Carroll to settle.

Carroll will score more than 9 goals this eason, I'd be sure of it.

Keep Carroll and get Dempsey, that's what I think.

That money is gone. We need to make cold decisions now about our future

As much as I personally want to keep Carroll, if the manager doesnt want him then we have to get rid.

If that's the case we need to sell him for market value (i suspect around 14m) and buy a better player for less. that would be good business

daithijjj · 17-07-2012 05:36PM

Carroll will end up leaving on loan.......only if.....there is a guaranteed fee. No messing, guaranteed. The fee and loan fee together will be close to 20m before its deemed acceptable imho. Thats how i think it will play out.

The owners signed that cheque and fee on the last day before FFPR came into effect. If they had an ounce of 'sporting play' they should absorb that hit on the fee themselves and back Rodgers with 'that' out of the equation.

Chucky the tree · 17-07-2012 05:37PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

In fairness, anything less than £20m for Carroll is a disaster from a financial point of view.

He's cost us £41m so far including wages.

We need to at least get half our money back so I can get where Alan is coming from.

Imo anyway it doesn't make sense getting rid when he starts to show form especially when we have signed a guy from Italy that could take as long as Carroll to settle.

Carroll will score more than 9 goals this eason, I'd be sure of it.

Keep Carroll and get Dempsey, that's what I think.

I really don't get this logic at all. It doesn't matter what he cost. It's not Rodgers fault Comolli is a complete clown and massively overpaid for a donkey. The £35m is gone, at this stage it is irrelevant. What matters next is getting the best value you can from Carroll which is about £15-£20m. And that's being generous.

Mr Alan · 17-07-2012 05:40PM

daithijjj wrote: »

Carroll will end up leaving on loan.......only if.....there is a guaranteed fee. No messing, guaranteed. The fee and loan fee together will be close to 20m before its deemed acceptable imho. Thats how i think it will play out.

Can you cite me am example of any loan move that had a similar guaranteed purchase at the end? I don't believe they exist & I have no idea why a club taking a player on loan would sign up for 1. What happens if the player is ****e on loan? Or gets injured? Why would a club agree to it when we've already made it known he has no place in our managers plans?

17-07-2012 05:42PM

whatawaster wrote: »

That money is gone. We need to make cold decisions now about our future

As much as I personally want to keep Carroll, if the manager doesnt want him then we have to get rid.

If that's the case we need to sell him for market value (i suspect around 14m) and buy a better player for less. that would be good business

Carroll is young, he'll only get better. Getting rid is showing no patience in a player that is likely to improve. He showed that after a tough 6 start to his Liverpool career.

Why not keep him and bring in another top forward too? The season is long with the Europa Cup and inevitable injuries/suspensions.

17-07-2012 05:45PM

Chucky the tree wrote: »

I really don't get this logic at all. It doesn't matter what he cost. It's not Rodgers fault Comolli is a complete clown and massively overpaid for a donkey. The £35m is gone, at this stage it is irrelevant. What matters next is getting the best value you can from Carroll which is about £15-£20m. And that's being generous.

My point is that I think we can get more value in keeping Carroll than letting him go.

As for calling a current player a donkey? Bit sad tbh.

whatawaster · 17-07-2012 05:45PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

whatawaster wrote: »

That money is gone. We need to make cold decisions now about our future

As much as I personally want to keep Carroll, if the manager doesnt want him then we have to get rid.

If that's the case we need to sell him for market value (i suspect around 14m) and buy a better player for less. that would be good business

Carroll is young, he'll only get better. Getting rid is showing no patience in a player that is likely to improve. He showed that after a tough 6 start to his Liverpool career.

Why not keep him and bring in another top forward too? The season is long with the Europa Cup and inevitable injuries/suspensions.

The manager obviously wants to buy different players with the money and obviously doesn't rate Carroll.

we may not have the money to keep him, Borini and Suarez and bring in another top forward as you suggest

17-07-2012 05:50PM

whatawaster wrote: »

The manager obviously wants to buy different players with the money and obviously doesn't rate Carroll.

we may not have the money to keep him, Borini and Suarez and bring in another top forward as you suggest

If the manager doesn't like Carroll, and he has to go, so be it, but personally I'd like to see him stay for another year at least.

Also, if he goes we don't need one striker,we need two.

If it's Dempsey for Carroll only, it's a mistake.

Chucky the tree · 17-07-2012 05:53PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

My point is that I think we can get more value in keeping Carroll than letting him go.

As for calling a current player a donkey? Bit sad tbh.

How? I honestly can't see him improving to a level where he is ever worth £25m. Not only that but how long will it take? As time goes by his contract becomes shorter and his price will decrease because of that. Not to mention we'll be paying £4m ever year to ride the bench. To me turning down £15m or so now an saving on £4m a year on wages in the hope he becomes a £25m play in a year or two max is a bit stupid.

lol - I take it you've never said anything ngative about Poulsen, Konchesky or Joe cole for example.

People in glass houses

rarnes1 wrote: »

Poulsen, WTF YOU ****

Yakult · 17-07-2012 06:03PM

Carroll is worth keeping. Yeah he was pretty woefull last season but so were a lot of the team. Not to mention he was injured for quiet a while when we signed him and didnt look fit at all. As the season progressed he looked much more of a threat. Just hope he gets a chance to impress BR.

daithijjj · 17-07-2012 06:06PM

Mr Alan wrote: »

Can you cite me am example of any loan move that had a similar guaranteed purchase at the end? I don't believe they exist & I have no idea why a club taking a player on loan would sign up for 1. What happens if the player is ****e on loan? Or gets injured? Why would a club agree to it when we've already made it known he has no place in our managers plans?

Not off hand no, im on me hols so cant be arsed to look either :pac: but im sure it has happened however which way it was dressed up. Of course there is always wriggle room with such things but the crux of the point stands. Basically a 20m stg amount is reached some way or gtfo.

17-07-2012 06:08PM

Chucky the tree wrote: »

How? I honestly can't see him improving to a level where he is ever worth £25m. Not only that but how long will it take? As time goes by his contract becomes shorter and his price will decrease because of that. Not to mention we'll be paying £4m ever year to ride the bench. To me turning down £15m or so now an saving on £4m a year on wages in the hope he becomes a £25m play in a year or two max is a bit stupid.

lol - I take it you've never said anything ngative about Poulsen, Konchesky or Joe cole for example.

People in glass houses

If Carroll scores 15 goals do you think he would be worth keeping for example?

Calling Poulson a cúnt? C'mon, at least get a better example than that!

Sir Gallagher · 17-07-2012 06:21PM

Match threads are open season for insulting players they're basically like an online pub :pac:

Tusky · 17-07-2012 06:25PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

In fairness, anything less than £20m for Carroll is a disaster from a financial point of view.

He's cost us £41m so far including wages.

We need to at least get half our money back so I can get where Alan is coming from.

Imo anyway it doesn't make sense getting rid when he starts to show form especially when we have signed a guy from Italy that could take as long as Carroll to settle.

Carroll will score more than 9 goals this eason, I'd be sure of it.

Keep Carroll and get Dempsey, that's what I think.

He can always go down in value - you're forgetting that. In a sense, he is still living off that six month spell of rich goal scoring form at Newcastle. The longer he is with us, the more that period fades from memory. If we can get enough from his transfer to replace him with a better player, we should do it.

witnessrenegade · 17-07-2012 06:27PM

Well the Andy story is gonna run on and on, so on another note, anybody have any views on Kevin Mirallas? Been linked with him today

Gbear · 17-07-2012 06:29PM

I think there's 2 separate arguments here.

Nearly everyone agrees that we could get rid of Carroll and it could be the best choice for us. Now the price we'd accept might be different - I'd be fairly happy with 20m quid or a good cash+player deal. I'd like Carrol not to go but for that money I'd drive him all the way back to newcastle.

The other argument is about why we should sell him. I think the notion put forward that he can't work under Rodgers system is bollocks and has little or no evidence backing it up seeing as he hasn't even trained under Rodgers yet and hasn't even been tested under the environment of the kind of system we're expecting.
He might well be completely unsuitable, but right now, without any evidence to back that assertion up, it's utter bollocks.

Chucky the tree · 17-07-2012 06:29PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

If Carroll scores 15 goals do you think he would be worth keeping for example?

Calling Poulson a cúnt? C'mon, at least get a better example than that!

Firstly that's a massive if, second it depends in the competition. For £15m I'd be disappointed if we could find a striker who could get us 15 goals a season. Didn't realise there was a list of players who I could slag.

djPSB · 17-07-2012 06:34PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

In fairness, anything less than £20m for Carroll is a disaster from a financial point of view.

He's cost us £41m so far including wages.

We need to at least get half our money back so I can get where Alan is coming from.

Imo anyway it doesn't make sense getting rid when he starts to show form especially when we have signed a guy from Italy that could take as long as Carroll to settle.

Carroll will score more than 9 goals this eason, I'd be sure of it.

Keep Carroll and get Dempsey, that's what I think.

The problem is if he spends a year on the bench, his value will half.

If he stays, we need to keep him for 2/3 years.

djPSB · 17-07-2012 06:37PM

17-07-2012 06:37PM

Tusky wrote: »

He can always go down in value - you're forgetting that. In a sense, he is still living off that six month spell of rich goal scoring form at Newcastle. The longer he is with us, the more that period fades from memory. If we can get enough from his transfer to replace him with a better player, we should do it.

Of course he could go down in value, but I think he could be an asset for us as a player.

People forget he's only 23.

We have just signed a young player from Italy. What happens if it takes him a year or so to settle? Sell him too?

If we can sell Carroll for good money and replace him with a better player, then fair enough but I have a feeling we could end up with serious egg on our faces if we sell him for a small fee and not bring in adequate strikers.

cson · 17-07-2012 06:38PM

Selling Carroll leaves you very short up front I would think.

Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12 MOD POST #1130

Comments