A WHOPPING 46% Of Americans Believe In Creationism According To New Gallup Poll

Wibbs · 06-06-2012 09:25AM

rn wrote: »

It would be of no surprise if the majority in Ireland believed in creationism.

It would to me. For a couple of reasons. 1) we're a more secular nation in the last generation than Americans would be. 2) Creationism tends to come from a more Protestant literal reading of the texts, something Catholicism tends not to do. The latter is much more likely to say "x passage is a metaphor". Ireland come from a predominantly catholic mindset even if today it's spelled with a small c.

Beruthiel · 06-06-2012 09:35AM

bbam wrote: »

Also he believes that god initiated the big bang, how else would it start from nothIng to become everything it is now. Science can't prove he's wrong.

At one point in time, we did not know what the sun was so we decided to call it a god.
Humans don't like not having an answer to everything, it scares them.
But just because you don't understand something doesn't mean you should just fill in the blanks with a 'god' to satisfy your need to have any answer.
Science may not know the answer now, that doesn't mean they won't come up with one in the future.

Biggins · 06-06-2012 09:35AM

the_syco wrote: »

I like how the questions give two answers that are god related, and one not god related. The way they are worded the answers seemed biased, so I'm wondering who sponsored the study?

Exactly - watch the video below folk.
Although its a sketch, it points out how surveys can be done and swayed:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0ZZJXw4MTA

Shenshen · 06-06-2012 09:44AM

bbam wrote: »

That's his point.
There is as much proof of god existing before the big bang as anything else being there so therefore he concludes that god cannot be disproved.
He says he is open to change his mind when evidence rather than theory of pre the big bang exists.
His point is also that science can not prove that god didn't guide us through evolution as a tool of creation.

It's a simple argument but in fairness, as he says in the absence of alternative proof it's as good a theory as any other.

You might want to tell him that there is plenty of evidence, otherwise it wouldn't be a theory but a hypothesis.

And once he got his head around that, you could point him to Russell's Teapot, just to see if he decides that simply because it can't be disproved it should be an accepted potential fact.

fenris · 06-06-2012 09:45AM

Wow - only another 5% and it will be true!

Who needs real proof when you have democracy, astroturfed polls, nukes and cliches!.

Pushtrak · 06-06-2012 09:46AM

fenris wrote: »

Wow - only another 5% and it will be true!

Who needs real proof when you have democracy, astroturfed polls, nukes and cliches!.

Facts for some, miniature American flags for others?

Nothingbetter2d · 06-06-2012 10:00AM

how many of those still think Jesus will return to Jerusalem?

Duggys Housemate · 06-06-2012 10:02AM

rn wrote: »

It would be of no surprise if the majority in Ireland believed in creationism.

Rubbish, people believed in evolution in 1950. The Catholic church is not creationist, although it believes that God started the whole thing, it isn't the 6,000 year protestant thing. In fact I am sure that evolution is commonly believed in all Catholic countries.

EDIT:

20% or so, which is higher than I would have thought. That said, it is similar to the UK and even Japan is 10%

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_KCBhXK7psSs/SrH7GjX4FVI/AAAAAAAAACo/tsA7wKci2NQ/s1600-h/440px-Views_on_Evolution.svg.png

flutterflye · 06-06-2012 10:05AM

That is a terrifying figure! :eek:
I can't understand how they can justify not teaching the facts to kids in schools.
It's craziness.

Duggy747 · 06-06-2012 10:10AM

Education in the US is going down the toilet with so many groups fighting over what stupid shìt should be taught in it, regardless of facts.

That's not to say we don't have people believing in that sort of thing here. Met a girl in college who believed we were 6,000 years old and that mentally handicapped people were bad people reincarnated as punishment. She would then go on to teach religion to children.

I should've gotten a medal for restraint.

fenris · 06-06-2012 10:12AM

We should probably mount a global push for a temporary flat earth day to even out all of that geological stress that is causing earthquakes and then roll it back up into a ball the next day, it could be a bit rough on the ISS but everybody should be grand provided that they believe strongly enough.

You have to wonder if this is a test case on how civilisations fail, drag your selves out of the mud, organise, inovate, develop until you reach a point where the old tools are holding you back, the tools become more important that the job, cue a big dark age style die off until the retarding influences have been eliminated to a level that survival dictates circumstances that will allow progress to begin again.

The only problem this time is that the retarding elements could outlast the progressive elements in a self fulfilling race ending prophecy.

Wibbs · 06-06-2012 10:13AM

Shenshen wrote: »

You might want to tell him that there is plenty of evidence, otherwise it wouldn't be a theory but a hypothesis.

Plenty of evidence of what? The non existence of an external influence on the universe, particularly it's creation? As for "before" the big bang all we have is hypotheses and imaginings.

And once he got his head around that, you could point him to Russell's Teapot, just to see if he decides that simply because it can't be disproved it should be an accepted potential fact.

To be fair Russell's teapot while amusing and having some weight is equally full of holes philosophically if one extrapolates it out to encompass any potential universal creator/deity(EDIT I see your link gives such arguments. Missed that

) .

smash · 06-06-2012 10:13AM

Duggy747 wrote: »

Education in the US is going down the toilet with so many groups fighting over what stupid shìt should be taught in it, regardless of facts.

Was talking to an American guy recently about brainwashing and the American military. He said it's no wonder when every day in school growing up, the first thing you do in the morning is pledge your allegiance to the flag.

Duggys Housemate · 06-06-2012 10:14AM

Stiffler2 wrote: »

This figure doesn't suprise me tbh.

I'd thought it would have been more like 80%+

have you been to America ?

I've been to America, mostly Seattle and San Francisco, and I thought the figure would be 5%. America is a big place. In fact most of the places Irish people go are fairly liberal.

sbsquarepants · 06-06-2012 10:15AM

Gnobe wrote: »

So perhaps the hype about America and the world in general turning out to be more secular is a false one??

What hype?
If anything the opposite is hyped, america seems to be getting more and fundamentalist, or divided between believers and atheists at least. For example there would be very little chance of an atheist being elected to high office in america, (in fact look at the number of presidential candidates who claim to speak directly to god, if you done that in europe you'd more likely be commited than elected!) A lot of americans equate holiness with goodness/honesty and so on and basically refuse to accept that an atheist could be moral without god. There is a big advertising campaign going on at the moment to try and change that opinion, but it seems to be fairly ingrained.

Duggys Housemate · 06-06-2012 10:19AM

OldGoat wrote: »

A friend used science theory to prove the existence of god to me, the bastard.

The multiverse could/must contain a God somewhere, if you assume that the different universes within it don't necessarily have to follow the same laws of physics as our universe, then one of them must have a God if there are an infinite amount. It does depend on whether the multiverses are bound by the same laws as this one - are merely deviations from it because of quantum fluctuations - and the type of infinite series we are talking about.

IrishAm · 06-06-2012 10:23AM

Ive just conducted a poll. 90% of Irish people would give their right arm to live in America, yet 99% of them bash Americans at any given opportunity.

opinion guy · 06-06-2012 10:25AM

Pushtrak wrote: »

There is a huge home schooling thing over in the states isn't there? I'd be interested in how the figures look for home school VS public schools. Some interesting things could probably be drawn from that.

planetX wrote: »

who ever said that?

Look to your own before laughing though. The American public school system is secular, unlike in this country where the Catholic church is still prevalent.

But you have certain states mandating that creationist theory should be thought alongside evolution - amongst other things.

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

I've been to America, mostly Seattle and San Francisco, and I thought the figure would be 5%. America is a big place. In fact most of the places Irish people go are fairly liberal.

Seattle and San Francisco are not representative of the US in general. They are very much freak cities in fact. Costal, affluent, democrat. They are also centre of high tech industry (or close enough) and attract lots of educated immigrants (from within and outside the US).
For all we know - the level in those cities is 5% - its just balanced out by a few thousand hicksvilles all over the middle of the US

dyl10 · 06-06-2012 10:25AM

bizmark wrote: »

Rabble Rabble anti american nonsense.

What's nonsense?
Through their foreign policy, they've committed the worst atrocities since the holocaust.

You have posted an article of relatively irrelevant statistics; it creates a link between military spending/size and population size/wealth, assuming a linear relationship between those indicators - which statistically, makes no sense.

It doesn't justify anything, except that the US are comparatively low on some numeric ratios, which do not even reflect the discussion.

The US has had the most aggressive foreign policy since WWII and has both directly and indirectly led to huge casualties on foreign soil, as well as undermining democracy and countless other attributes we value.

As a point aside; it's rather pointless to compare the dichotomy between religious belief and actions against others. We all know religion has been a factor/driver for some of the worst acts/crusades in our collective history.

Pushtrak · 06-06-2012 10:26AM

IrishAm wrote: »

Ive just conducted a poll. 90% of Irish people would give their right arm to live in America, yet 99% of them bash Americans at any given opportunity.

Well, where ever we'd be we'd be complaining. So, we're getting in to an imagined spirit of living there...

Or, in this case it actually needs to be said.

sbsquarepants · 06-06-2012 10:27AM

The multiverse could/must contain a God somewhere, if you assume that the different universes within it don't necessarily have to follow the same laws of physics as our universe, then one of them must have a God if there are an infinite amount. It does depend on whether the multiverses are bound by the same laws as this one - are merely deviations from it because of quantum fluctuations - and the type of infinite series we are talking about.

I don't think that the different universes don't have to follow the rules of physics, the rules are the rules - it's just each possibility, each decision that could go two or more ways is played out somewhere. The impossible is still impossible.
That's my understanding of the theory anyway (but i'm not going to lie to you, i'm no theoretical physicist!)

Duggys Housemate · 06-06-2012 10:28AM

opinion guy wrote: »

Seattle and San Francisco are not representative of the US in general. They are very much freak cities in fact. Costal, affluent, democrat. They are also centre of high tech industry (or close enough) and attract lots of educated immigrants (from within and outside the US).
For all we know - the level in those cities is 5% - its just balanced out by a few thousand hicksvilles all over the middle of the US

Sure but I was responding to a guy who said "Of course, this is obvious, have you ever been to America?" Most Irish people go to Liberal Coastal America, the cities mentioned already and New York, Boston etc. So the "had you ever been to America" comment made little sense. We generally don't go to the bible belt.

In short we only know about America's fundamentalism because we read about it, not because we go there.

flutterflye · 06-06-2012 10:28AM

IrishAm wrote: »

Ive just conducted a poll. 90% of Irish people would give their right arm to live in America, yet 99% of them bash Americans at any given opportunity.

What poll?
Where?

No chance I'd ever live in the U.S. unless for some reason it was absolutely necessary.

Biggins · 06-06-2012 10:29AM

flutterflye wrote: »

That is a terrifying figure! :eek:
I can't understand how they can justify not teaching the facts to kids in schools.
It's craziness.

When religious nuts gain power - anything is attempted.
...And by golly, we have seen that all too often!

Duggys Housemate · 06-06-2012 10:37AM

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I don't think that the different universes don't have to follow the rules of physics, the rules are the rules - it's just each possibility, each decision that could go two or more ways is played out somewhere.

Thats one reading, for sure. In that reading, the multiverse is really a many worlds version of this universe where quantum fluctuations, and deviations from this one, are all there is, so all follow the logic and the laws of this one. Or, rather, we follow the logic and laws of the other multiverses, baring some quantum fluctuations. In fact we are in many of the universes consisting the multiverse writing on boards, or reading on boards.

However we are told the multiverse is infinite, so how far can the laws deviate from the norm? That is the question.

Duggys Housemate · 06-06-2012 10:38AM

Biggins wrote: »

When religious nuts gain power - anything is attempted.
...And by golly, we have seen that all too often!

The belief that religions cause most of the wars in history, is misguided.

IrishAm · 06-06-2012 10:40AM

flutterflye wrote: »

What poll?
Where?

No chance I'd ever live in the U.S. unless for some reason it was absolutely necessary.

Hahaha!

If America completely opened its borders to Irish citizens and offered them the same benefits as they are entitled to here, Ireland would be empty in a month.

flutterflye · 06-06-2012 10:43AM

IrishAm wrote: »

Hahaha!

If America completely opened its borders to Irish citizens and offered them the same benefits as they are entitled to here, Ireland would be empty in a month.

Yeah, so where is this poll?

I guess I'd be here on my own so

I'd quite like that actually.

Biggins · 06-06-2012 10:45AM

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

The belief that religions cause most of the wars in history, is misguided.

Fair enough, thats debatable and another topic - but just for the record, I am not saying that here!
So don't impose that I might be!

Pushtrak · 06-06-2012 10:46AM

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I don't think that the different universes don't have to follow the rules of physics, the rules are the rules - it's just each possibility, each decision that could go two or more ways is played out somewhere. The impossible is still impossible.
That's my understanding of the theory anyway (but i'm not going to lie to you, i'm no theoretical physicist!)

Any speculation about what other universes would be like if they existed is futile. It would be way above our pay grade. Maybe even anyone who is alive today.

If you take for our own universe, general/special relativity which applies on the large scale in the universe, the galaxies. That doesn't apply to the small scale, the atoms. That's where quantum physics comes in. And then string theory. And trying to unify all the forces in to one theory. And that'd be our universe. It's safe to say there is enough to try to wrap our heads around with that much, and then say, the question: Are there multiverses and not, if there are how would they work.

A WHOPPING 46% Of Americans Believe In Creationism According To New Gallup Poll

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