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Rangers FC lodge papers to go into administration

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    They wont get their UEFA licence next season anyways, does that mean they'll be relegated regardless of being liquidated or not?

    Also

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17733970

    Rangers owner Craig Whyte has told the Scottish Football Association there is "not a chance" he will appear before its judiciary panel on Tuesday.

    He said this a while back but its still funny, him not turning up wont do any Rangers any favours


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,230 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Wasn't this why the SPL changed the rules ?

    Because if Rangers did form a newco then their re-entry into the SPL would also have to be voted upon by the other SPL clubs, the new rule would bypass that.
    So maybe he's telling the truth after all?

    We'll see, but I highly doubt it.
    He came on Clyde and quoted that twitter account I mentioned by the way, so if his other claims are of the same level...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    Wasn't this why the SPL changed the rules ?

    Because if Rangers did form a newco then their re-entry into the SPL would also have to be voted upon by the other SPL clubs, the new rule would bypass that.



    We'll see, but I highly doubt it.

    No, you'll still have to win a vote.

    The proposed changes just replace the current 10 point penalty, i.e. 10-point penalty for two seasons (rather than one season) for any club that transfers its share in the SPL to a new company


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭Broxi_Bear_Eire


    This is a serious MUST READ for Rangers (and Celtic!) fans!

    http://wingsland.podgamer.com/cheats-charter-controversy-ended/


    From the Scottish Football Association rules on Club Licensing (specifically  Part 3, Section 03 – The Club as Licence Applicant and the UEFA Licence). Emphasis ours.

    "3.1.1 The Licence Applicant may only be a football club, that is the legal entity fully responsible for the football team participating in national and international competitions and which is the legal entity member of the Scottish Football Association (Full or Associate Member). The licence applicant is responsible for the fulfillment of the club licensing criteria. This membership must have been in place at the start of the licence season for a minimum period of three consecutive years.

    [...]

    3.3.1 UEFA Licence Awards for Scottish Premier League Clubs (SPL)
    A Licence cannot be transferred from one legal entity to another."

    NB: "UEFA Licence" does not denote a licence to compete in UEFA competitions, which are governed by an entirely different set of criteria. As the SFA website explains:

    "National Club Licensing applies to Scottish FA member clubs and UEFA Club Licensing applies to Scottish Premier League clubs."

    In other words, to play in the SPL you must have a UEFA Club Licence, regardless of whether you actually compete in UEFA competitions or not. (SFL clubs, who in normal circumstances wouldn't be expected to qualify for European tournaments, are dealt with separately via an "extraordinary procedure" in the event that they do.)

    So, should Rangers FC be subject to liquidation and then reborn as a "newco", the new company would NOT be eligible for the licence required to play in the SPL, for at least three years. Furthermore, it is plainly and explicitly forbidden under SFA rules for such a licence to be transferred from one legal entity (Rangers FC) to another (New Rangers FC 2012). Well, that's that all sorted out, then. As you were.

    Not like you Bobby this is old news well to Rangers fans anyway ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,229 ✭✭✭bobbysands81


    Not like you Bobby this is old news well to Rangers fans anyway ;)

    First time I saw it buddy, 'twas tweeted about yesterday so that's why I posted it.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭lubo_moravcik


    So now that TBK have done the unthinkable and walked away, does anyone know anything about Ng?


    Edit: Any truth in any of this?
    He has a wealth of £40m

    His singapore club have finished 7th in the league, thats their best finish, and have changed their name 4 times!

    His club in Singapore, Hougang United, like the one he wants to buy in Glasgow, are known the Cheetahs :loel:

    This is actual merchandise on their official website: http://www.hgfc.com.sg/fans.html

    atknkj.jpg

    They're 7th this season in the signapore league
    Finished 7th last season
    Finished 15th the one before that


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17739292

    The Singaporean consortium led by Bill Ng that is bidding for Rangers has denied that an agreement has been struck with Ticketus.

    No surprise that Ticketus now find themselves out in the cold again after their stunt.

    http://news.stv.tv/scotland/west-central/303348-profile-bill-ng-the-singaporean-high-flyer-who-wants-to-make-history-with-rangers/

    STV's profile on Bill Ng.
    But in Scotland Ng, whose five-man consortium is offering £20m for the Ibrox club, is a largely unknown quantity.

    His family's wealth can be traced back to the Chinese Hokkien clan associations who make up Singapore's business elite.

    The clans were formed in the early days of modern Singapore after it was established as a British trading post in 1819. Waves of Chinese immigrants arrived, helping to swell the population of the port from 1000 to 10,000 in just six years.

    Ng's father was a prominent clan leader from the 1940s right through to the 1980, while his mother's parents founded Singapore's largest broking firm, Ong & Company Stockbrokers.

    When Ng took over S-League football club Hougang United questions were asked about his commitment to football, but the club is currently in sixth place and on course for its best ever league finish.

    He is also a keen motor racing enthusiast who is one of the marshals at the Singapore Grand Prix.

    Ng has said he wants to see Rangers make history rather than be history and has pledged to maintain the club's heritage.

    However, in Singapore he is known as a hard-headed businessman whose only concern is making a positive return on his investment.


    He has business contacts in Hong Kong and China, as well as Malaysia, where he flew on to after announcing his bid for Rangers in London on Monday.

    My money is on him giving the whole heritage spiel until he is in control then take the club down the liquidation route citing all the creditors demands as unreasonable.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 10,887 Mod ✭✭✭✭PauloMN


    Rangers owner Craig Whyte's lawyers face damages claim

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17749026

    Looks like D&P are turning anywhere they can in the hunt for some money. That's some claim, I'd like to see how that will hold up in court. Smacks of absolute desperation tbh.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭Broxi_Bear_Eire


    PauloMN wrote: »
    Rangers owner Craig Whyte's lawyers face damages claim

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17749026

    Looks like D&P are turning anywhere they can in the hunt for some money. That's some claim, I'd like to see how that will hold up in court. Smacks of absolute desperation tbh.

    Why! Could it not be the simple fact that this firm went out of there way to hide where one of their employees was when they needed him to confirm certain allegations and look what happened low and behold they let him go by mutual agreement after Rangers supporters from all over the world bombarded them with emails and telephone calls.
    When it comes down to it they washed their hands of him eventually but it in many peoples opinions was far to late
    Good on the administrators


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 10,887 Mod ✭✭✭✭PauloMN


    Why! Could it not be the simple fact that this firm went out of there way to hide where one of their employees was when they needed him to confirm certain allegations and look what happened low and behold they let him go by mutual agreement after Rangers supporters from all over the world bombarded them with emails and telephone calls.
    When it comes down to it they washed their hands of him eventually but it in many peoples opinions was far to late
    Good on the administrators

    £25m quid though? :eek: Where do they come up with that figure to sue them for?

    Personally it just seems desperate to me, as soon as the BK show less interest and Ticketus are looking for their dough again. Rangers in admin have not got a hope in hell of getting a £25m award against CB.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,748 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    More legal action which will take a while to progress through the courts, just as well Duff & Phelps are not on nice juicy daily rates... oh wait


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭lubo_moravcik


    Remember this :)


    Craig Whyte meeting with Rangers Assembly
    MEETING WITH CRAIG WHYTE

    - No scope for negotiating a settlement with HMRC due to the criticism they have had from MPs and the Media about some high-profile "deals". That means the case could take even more time to resolve as any outcome is likely to be appealed by either party.

    - If the decision is adverse and the Club appeal, HMRC can still seek to enforce the decision - not clear if they would but they can start to pursue payment of the tax liability.

    - He hopes "Rangers Football Club Plc" could survive any administration event but feels it would not be the end of the world if it didn't - I think he said that at our last meeting.

    - There are no concerns about current cash flow and the day to day running of the Club although he acknowledges that the running costs must be reduced - again that was said at our last meeting.

    - There will be comings and goings in the January transfer window - however, players need to go to ensure any new arrivals don't increase the number of players and the salary costs and it is unlikely that all income will be used to buy new players. He emphasised we need creative players and strikers. There is a list of targets but no names were mentioned.

    - He is really pleased with the backing from the fans and will continue to robustly defend the fans when necessary.
    The AGM will probably take place in March 2012 - the accounts are as yet unaudited - the delay is due to awaiting legal opinion on the tax case! He hopes by then to be able to give shareholders more information and be better placed to answer the questions that will inevitably be asked.
    He will remain accessible to us and he offered an "open-door" to raise any key issues.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17777456
    "We are only a few weeks from the end of the season at which time players' wages will legally revert back to what they were before cuts," said Wishart.

    "I don't think they will be making any more sacrifices."

    Its either get a preferred bidder in place or the firesale begins before the Euros.

    I'm surprised that there is not more anger towards Duff & Phelps than there currently is because they have all the excuses ready but none of the answers.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,406 ✭✭✭Pompey Magnus


    Dempsey wrote: »
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17777456



    Its either get a preferred bidder in place or the firesale begins before the Euros.

    I'm surprised that there is not more anger towards Duff & Phelps than there currently is because they have all the excuses ready but none of the answers.

    I'm not so sure D&P are fully to blame, it seems some of the bidders are messing around and showing no real signs of actually wanting to make a genuine offer, putting in derisory bids with no chance of success...a lot like Rangers' various transfer fiascoes over the last couple of windows actually.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭lubo_moravcik


    boomx.png


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,230 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Has he given that evidence yet of those threats ?
    Didn't think so.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,014 ✭✭✭Eirebear


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    Has he given that evidence yet of those threats ?
    Didn't think so.

    I'm actually very disapointed in his handling of the whole affair.
    The man is a journalist who i respect, but after having a couple of quick dialogues with him via twitter, and watching how he has handled himself on twitter it seems that he is struggling to get a handle on the whole thing.
    It shows when "Big Phil" and Rangertaxcase" have begun popping up more and more regularly on his twitter account that things arent all that they seem.

    He made a big deal a few days ago about how "UEFA had Alex Salmond in their sights regarding political interferance".
    yet when the blog was eventually posted a couple of days late, all he had was a phonecall from Stewart regan, who is always looking to cover his own ass, and a very profound nothing from UEFA.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,230 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Agreed, sounds like me that he should stick to reporting wars, instead of seeking attention with stuff he clearly doesn't know much about.

    His earlier 'groundbreaking' reports turned out to be stuff we've all heard before as well.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,748 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Bill Ng has pulled out of the bidding to buy Rangers, this leaves the Blu Knights to mend their ways with Ticketus and go for it.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17783064


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    Bill Ng has pulled out of the bidding to buy Rangers, this leaves the Blu Knights to mend their ways with Ticketus and go for it.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17783064

    I still see Kennedy getting the club, everyone else is looking at this as a money making exercise whilst all he wants to do is save the club. He maybe on the outside at the moment but that could change very quickly.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,230 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    He already stated today that he may be back in soon, but this is all taking way too long I fear.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,220 ✭✭✭the realpigiron


    I'd imagine the longer this drags out, the more likely that Rangers will be liquidated.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,229 ✭✭✭bobbysands81


    I'd imagine the longer this drags out, the more likely that Rangers will be liquidated.

    If Rangers lose their appeal in the Big Tax Case then I do not see anything bar liquidation UNLESS a sugar daddy comes in and throws obscene millions at the problem.

    As it stands liquidation is the most probable outcome.

    This is not said with green tinted glasses on, nor is it wishful thinking, this is based on looking long and hard at what's owed and what's capable of being paid back. Rangers do not, and will not, have the ability to pay back their debts if they lose their appeal (surely the announcement of outcome is imminent?) to the Tax Case. HMRC cannot be seen to give them preferential treatment so the maximum return possible must be delivered to British taxpayers.

    A CVA will realise far less money for creditors than liquidation according to Duff and Phelps' creditors report which valued Ibrox and Murray Park at £109m.

    Thus if they lose their appeal and nobody is willing to step in and literally gift the club £50m or even more (which there's no chance of seeing again) then liquidation is inevitable.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,340 ✭✭✭TheBuilder


    BILL MILLER STATEMENT IN FULL

    I am making my proposal to takeover Rangers Football Club open, transparent and available to all those interested in Rangers future.
    Given all of the noise in the media from various sides of the transaction and given the numerous inaccuracies in much of what has been reported or intimated by others, I have decided the time has come to set the record straight and to issue a challenge to any would-be suitors of the club.
    Most importantly, I am doing this now so that Rangers fans and supporters can judge my bid and plans for the club on their actual merits - rather than rumours and innuendo.
    There is no time left for empty promises and grand-standing.
    The time has come for all interested parties to either put up or shut up. Everyone involved has had their ‘15 minutes of fame’.
    Let’s save Rangers. There is no time left.


    Facts about my bid:

    :: Of the three qualified bidders, I am the only bidder who refused to entertain offers from Ticketus or engage in discussions with Craig Whyte.

    It is difficult for me to see how any parties who were present when this awful situation was created can be a legitimate part of the solution.
    I believe firmly that when you mortgage the future by the use of debts and financing instruments like has been done in the recent past, you endanger the very survival of the club.
    All of the ground swell created in the attempt to indicate that a CVA is a simple solution to save the club and its history is simply a naove understanding of how this CVA process would work and the risks associated.

    :: Despite constant rumours and suggestions by others, I have proposed a purchase of the club through a CVA from the beginning.

    I have no plans for liquidation of the club. After careful evaluation of a Rangers CVA process, it has become apparent that there are substantial roadblocks and risks associated with such an approach.
    Of the qualified creditor claims, which is currently under £100M, the Ticketus claim of £27M (in excess of 25% of the total) would put Ticketus in a position to be able to block any CVA agreement with which they did not agree.
    There is no way that Ticketus would agree to accept a “pence on the pound” settlement as has been suggested by others.
    In addition, it is apparent that there will be several lawsuits that will emerge in relation to a potential CVA exit among the various creditors and claimants (you pick them), which will need to be settled by the courts.
    Consequently, the CVA will be prolonged - meaning the process would go on well into next season and possibly beyond. This would place additional penalties on Rangers as long as they remain in administration.
    Obviously, the longer the process dragged on without a resolution, the less viable the club would become. If this process continued on for a long period without resolution, the inevitable result would be real liquidation.


    :: Over several weeks of discussions, my advisory team and I have created a solution that saves Rangers, protects its history and gives it a fresh start - rescued from the ruin created by others.

    I believe, and we have compelling professional advice to support my view, that my offer, as structured, can enable this to happen without any question of Rangers seeking or being given any special treatment.


    :: My proposal on the table now is to pay £11.2M for the club which includes the £500,000 deposit required by Duff & Phelps.

    In order to preserve the club’s history, records, championships and assets, I will put the “heart” of the club into an “incubator” company while Duff & Phelps works to make the “sick patient” healthy through a CVA process that effectively works to “radiate” the toxicity of past administrations’ sins out of the patient while the “healthy heart” is preserved and moves forward. Once the CVA process has been completed and the patient is on the mend, the administrators will return Rangers Football Club plc to me for a nominal sum.
    The healthy heart and the healthy patient (The Rangers Football Club plc) will then be reunited through merger.
    In this scenario, the club can continue with all of its business assets, including its history, protected from the present illness.
    Thus a new corporate entity will own the club’s assets during the incubation period including all of its history.
    Any suggestion that Rangers history is lost by such a process is preposterous.
    Using such logic, Rangers would not actually have a 140-year history as its current corporate structure was only created in 1899. To suggest that Rangers thus have only a 113-year-old history is absurd.


    :: As a final step in the process, I have held a series of talks over the past week with officials from the SPL and SFA in an effort to ensure Rangers play in the 2012/13 season without further points deductions, fines or other punitive sanctions, relating to either the terms of my purchase or the actions of the prior administrations, beyond those levied during the 2011/12 season.

    My offer is contingent upon the regulatory bodies agreeing that the club will begin play in the 2012/13 season in the SPL and that they will do so without any loss of points and with all historic titles intact.
    I will not acquire the club unless I receive written assurances from both regulatory bodies to this effect.
    It is my strong view that Rangers and their fans should not continue to be punished in the future for the past failures of others.
    Rangers need a fresh start and I will always stand up for the club.

    The plan:

    I have retained the services of certain sports business and UK football experts from Scotland, England and America to assist with the turnaround of this distressed and loss-making business.
    I realize Rangers have been losing money on a monthly basis and can easily find itself right back in administration in short order if significant changes are not made to the business and if the new owner does not have the financial wherewithal to accomplish the turnaround while the club haemorrhages cash.

    :: We will focus on a disciplined business approach that uses strict adherence to budgets and metrics to ensure the club does not attempt to live beyond its means so that it can be in compliance with UEFA’s new requirements of financial fair play.

    I am acutely aware that the club will require working capital and this will be assessed in more detail in coming weeks as the due diligence period progresses.


    :: “We will focus Rangers aggressively on growing current revenue streams and developing new ones. I believe that such a program is necessary to ensure Rangers have the kind of player wage bill that is necessary to field a highly competitive team, while not operating at a loss.

    :: “As I have already discussed directly with him, Ally McCoist will be retained as the First Team Manager and will be responsible for the success of Rangers on the pitch.


    The challenge to others:

    Since other bidders and/or would-be bidders have consistently made claims in the press for weeks and months about how they have all the solutions and answers for saving Rangers, I have decided to offer a challenge.
    I have worked quietly over the past several weeks to put together a plan that saves Rangers from liquidation and allows the club to be made healthy again.
    I have attempted to do this without fanfare or without drawing personal attention to myself as I don’t need or desire to see my name in the headlines.
    However, it appears there are others who suggest that I have some motive other than to acquire and protect the history of this great club and put in on a strong footing for the future. They maintain they have better plans to save Rangers.
    So, in an effort to give Rangers and its fans, supporters, players and staff an opportunity to see for themselves, I have shared the details of my plans.
    Although it was my intention to wire the required deposit tomorrow to secure preferred bidder status, I have notified Duff & Phelps that my offer is to be suspended until Monday to give anyone else interested in acquiring Rangers time to complete their bid and put down the £500,000 deposit.
    I would not want anyone to have the impression that my offer is not the best one for the club.
    So I now put it to the other suitors who claim to want what is best for Rangers. If you sincerely want to save Rangers, the time has come for you to put up or shut up.
    I will agree to “stand down” until Monday, April 23rd to allow any and all “saviours” to step up and claim the club by paying the required deposit and entering into an agreement to purchase.
    The time for talk is over. The club is in serious jeopardy of dying. “Real” liquidation is looming.
    If no one else steps up by Monday, then I will assume everyone is done talking and I am the only one serious about saving Rangers.
    In the meantime, I will continue talks with the SPL/SFA in an effort to get a quick and satisfactory resolution so I can then move forward to become the preferred bidder as outlined.
    I ask Rangers fans, supporters, staff, players and Ally McCoist, after reviewing my plan for the club, to make their opinions known by Monday to the press and to the SFA and SPL officials. Time is running out to save Rangers.

    Miller making his move.


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 10,887 Mod ✭✭✭✭PauloMN


    This is getting tasty now. Can't wait to see how this pans out. He wants the SPL to assure him that whatever body he throws together will be guaranteed to be playing in the SPL next season, and with no points deductions? :D

    Absolutely hilarious reading that. Amateur night stuff designed purely to appease fans.

    The best bit:
    Thus a new corporate entity will own the club’s assets during the incubation period including all of its history.

    Any suggestion that Rangers history is lost by such a process is preposterous.

    :D Setting out his stall. It won't be Rangers, but sure ignore all that and pretend the new setup has all the history?

    Liquidation by another name imo.

    I think you might have found Craig's alter-ego in that guy!

    Edit: actually this bit is better:
    Although it was my intention to wire the required deposit tomorrow to secure preferred bidder status, I have notified Duff & Phelps that my offer is to be suspended until Monday to give anyone else interested in acquiring Rangers time to complete their bid and put down the £500,000 deposit.

    I swear I was going to give them the money.... but erm.... I want others to have a chance. Seriously, comical stuff.

    Murray is still your best bet, if he can agree a deal with Ticketus.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭Fuhrer


    So, basically this guy wants to strip all the assets from the club, dump the debt and thinks he'll just be allowed to continue?


    Christ, what an absolute moron.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,230 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    What he probably means is that he won't accept any further punishment, above those already set in stone (the point deduction etc.)

    But yeah, the guy obviously doesn't get the picture: You can't get a deal without getting Ticketus on your side.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 10,239 ✭✭✭✭KeithAFC


    Can't the club just go down to division 3 if a new owner is found?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,229 ✭✭✭bobbysands81


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    Can't the club just go down to division 3 if a new owner is found?

    Keith,

    Forget about Rangers' debt, any chance you're going to pay YOUR debt?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,229 ✭✭✭bobbysands81


    KeithAFC wrote: »
    Can't the club just go down to division 3 if a new owner is found?

    Keith,

    Forget about Rangers' debt, any chance you're going to pay YOUR debt?


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