Phil Hogan refusing to pay property charge in Portugal.

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 08:53AM #1

lividduck wrote: »

"Would you pay a charge if you were unhappy with the service?" asks big Phil
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/hogan-wont-pay-penthouse-charge-3067684.html

You cannot make this stuff up. Posted in AH but thought worthwhile posting here.

dunleakelleher · 01-04-2012 09:01AM

What day is it today?;)

The Waltzing Consumer · 01-04-2012 09:09AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

You cannot make this stuff up. Posted in AH but thought worthwhile posting here.

It is probably not worth posting it here. There are plenty of people who pay management fees of thousands in apartments and housing in Ireland already and plenty who contest them. This is nothing to do with the Household charge and typical of Sindo standards.

Some management companies are very good and charge fees that reflect the true value of what they do, whilst others are pathetic and simply ripping people off.

OP, if you had an apartment and in your contract with your management company, they said they would provide "x, y and z", but did not, would you still pay in full the management fees? Or do you think you would dispute the charge?

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 09:18AM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

OP, if you had an apartment and in your contract with your management company, they said they would provide "x, y and z", but did not, would you still pay in full the management fees? Or do you think you would dispute the charge?

Yes. That is why 800,000 have refused the household charge introduction here. The services provided already are poor. Someone posted this and I think it explains my feelings on the whole proposal.

true wrote: »

Fix the bucket before you ask me to throw more water in to it.

BTW I'm not opposed to the Household tax when it's eventually introduced in 2013-2014. It makes sense that expand the tax net. But remove the waste in public spending first.

The Waltzing Consumer · 01-04-2012 09:28AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Yes. That is why 800,000 have refused the household charge introduction here. The services provided already are poor. Someone posted this and I think it explains my feelings on the whole proposal.

BTW I'm not opposed to the Household tax when it's eventually introduced in 2013-2014. It makes sense that expand the tax net. But remove the waste in public spending first.

Well it is less then 800,000 now and I say by next week, it will be less again.

Over half the people have accepted the charge and this figure will grow next week more then likely as people see the late charges. You are right about waste but the best way to change that is to vote in elections.

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 09:30AM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

You are right about waste but the best way to change that is to vote in elections.

If FF, FG and labour are not capable of removing waste who is left? It's permanent government who is responsible for waste and we don't elect these people. The only chance we have is while the IMF are in here.

The Waltzing Consumer · 01-04-2012 09:35AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

If FF, FG and labour are not capable of removing waste who is left? It's permanent government who is responsible for waste and we don't elect these people. The only chance we have is while the IMF are in here.

I will have to disagree here, you may try and blame the parties in Government but at the end of the day, it si the people who put them in there and they repeatedly put FF back in Govermnment, which is a thumbs up for waste. Your anger is misdirected, it should be at the electorate, not the Government.

Howjoe1 · 01-04-2012 09:36AM

dunleakelleher wrote: »

What day is it today?;)

it has to be made up, doesn't it?

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 09:41AM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

I will have to disagree here, you may try and blame the parties in Government but at the end of the day, it si the people who put them in there and they repeatedly put FF back in Govermnment, which is a thumbs up for waste. Your anger is misdirected, it should be at the electorate, not the Government.

High level civil servants who we do not vote for are beyond our reach no matter who we vote in. Just look at the guy FG/Labour moved over to Europe. Unless the IMF tackle these people we have no chance of proper reform. Why should these guys be protected from being fired for incompetence?

01-04-2012 09:45AM

Hee Hee

Best one yet!

bijapos · 01-04-2012 09:47AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

You cannot make this stuff up.

You can, someone did, and it looks like it worked.

The Waltzing Consumer · 01-04-2012 09:47AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

High level civil servants who we do not vote for are beyond our reach no matter who we vote in. Just look at the guy FG/Labour moved over to Europe. Unless the IMF tackle these people we have no chance of proper reform. Why should these guys be protected from being fired for incompetence?

this is dragging topic way off now. The thread was about management fees right?

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 09:52AM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

this is dragging topic way off now. The thread was about management fees right?

I was only replying to your post about elections

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 09:54AM

bijapos wrote: »

You can, someone did, and it looks like it worked.

If it is an AFJ fair play. LOL but wouldn't that be overstepping the mark?

buzz123 · 01-04-2012 10:11AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

You cannot make this stuff up. Posted in AH but thought worthwhile posting here.

I hate saying this but APRIL FOOLS DAY !!

Try posting a reply, over 27 likes and no published comments, no mention of it anywhere on the Net except the Indo Page, Jody up to his tricks again, I hope I'm wrong, surely they would have released this information prior to the deadline, it would have been like a Bolt of Lightning..

copacetic · 01-04-2012 10:24AM

The problem with an crazy baseless aprils fools in the Sindo is that there is absolutely no way to tell it apart from any other given Sunday for them.

buzz123 · 01-04-2012 10:26AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

You cannot make this stuff up. Posted in AH but thought worthwhile posting here.

I hate saying this but APRIL FOOLS DAY !!

Try posting a reply, over 27 likes and no published comments, no mention of it anywhere on the Net except the Indo Page, Jody up to his tricks again, I hope I'm wrong, surely they would have released this information prior to the deadline, it would have been like a BOlt of Lightning..

Wait , I take it back !!! Comments have been posted now, maybe there is some truth in this!!

Bullseye1 · 01-04-2012 10:30AM

Someone on another board said it was reported by the Mail. I know I know. But wouldn't they and the Indo be leaving themselves open to litigation and possible action from the media ombusman?

lugha · 01-04-2012 10:31AM

buzz123 wrote: »

I hate saying this but APRIL FOOLS DAY !!

Try posting a reply, over 27 likes and no published comments, no mention of it anywhere on the Net except the Indo Page, Jody up to his tricks again, I hope I'm wrong, surely they would have released this information prior to the deadline, it would have been like a Bolt of Lightning..

What gave it a ring of truth for me was that that Corcoran's name is attached. This is out of sync with other AFJ that I can recall, which tend not to be credited.

Also, it was borderline inappropriate in the sense that an AFJ should not seek to influence any real issues.

I wonder if the Sindo are playing a cute game and hoping for an over-reaction from FG to this?

DarkJager · 01-04-2012 10:34AM

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Someone on another board said it was reported by the Mail. I know I know. But wouldn't they and the Indo be leaving themselves open to litigation and possible action from the media ombusman?

I'm thinking the same, April Fools jokes generally don't try to throw a grenade in to an already volatile issue. Reading the article, I honestly can't see anything out of place that would suggest this isn't true.

copacetic · 01-04-2012 10:41AM

DarkJager wrote: »

I'm thinking the same, April Fools jokes generally don't try to throw a grenade in to an already volatile issue. Reading the article, I honestly can't see anything out of place that would suggest this isn't true.

I actually agree that it isn't an Aprils Fool, whether it is 'true' or not is another thing!

It's in the Sindo, it's by Jody Corcoran, it's politically motivated and planned as part of 7 page concerted attack on FG and Denis O'Brien. Where all the main FF and O'Reilly lackeys have been told what to write yet again.

So there is probably something behind it but they'll have twisted and exaggerated the facts tabloid style.

buzz123 · 01-04-2012 10:43AM

If it turns out to be true I won't be able to comment because there are no words that could convey my feelings, suffice it to say, a large Shredder should be wheeled into Dail Eareann and Mr Hogan should be tipped into it, Head first!

mathepac · 01-04-2012 10:45AM

dunleakelleher wrote: »

What day is it today?;)

Today is National Phil Hogan Day, to be memorialised in future by everyone facing Carlow-Kilkenny and giving the now-famous Two Fingers for Phillo Salute (digitally challenged voters can give the Single Centre Digit of Solidarity Salute for Centrist Shaggers).

mike65 · 01-04-2012 10:51AM

This is actually a true story. Seriously

lugha · 01-04-2012 10:59AM

copacetic wrote: »

So there is probably something behind it but they'll have twisted and exaggerated the facts tabloid style.

It quite possibly is substantially as they reported it, but of course has no relevance to the household charge.

I.e. a politician in his private capacity has issues with a service being provided by private individuals. Aren't we all in the boat at one time or another.

The spurious link in really a form of word play (penthouse == house, charge == household charge). But of course such word association can have an impact. Look at the damage Sean Gallagher shipped simply by using the word "envelope".

buzz123 · 01-04-2012 11:08AM

lugha wrote: »

It quite possibly is substantially as they reported it, but of course has no relevance to the household charge.

I.e. a politician in his private capacity has issues with a service being provided by private individuals. Aren't we all in the boat at one time or another.

The spurious link in really a form of word play (penthouse == house, charge == household charge). But of course such word association can have an impact. Look at the damage Sean Gallagher shipped simply by using the word "envelope".

It has relevance if his reason for not paying is because he isn't getting the required services for the Money/payment being sought.... Does that not ring a Bell?

thebman · 01-04-2012 11:09AM

Confirmed true on the Marian Finucine show just now by the guy that is on I think the editor of the Irish Independent (definitely someone that works there who is on VB sometimes as I recognise the voice).

buzz123 · 01-04-2012 11:10AM

thebman wrote: »

Confirmed true on the Marian Finucine show just now by the guy that is on I think the editor of the Irish Independent (definitely someone that works there who is on VB sometimes as I recognise the voice).

So, let's hear the Sh1t hit the Fan now , regardless of relevance!!

The Waltzing Consumer · 01-04-2012 11:13AM

buzz123 wrote: »

It has relevance if his reason for not paying is because he isn't getting the required services for the Money/payment being sought.... Does that not ring a Bell?

No, it does not. Is it a charge from the Spanish Government? No.

Do we have management companies in Ireland that charge thousands a year? Yes

Do people contest those charges in certain cases? Yes

jd · 01-04-2012 11:16AM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

OP, if you had an apartment and in your contract with your management company, they said they would provide "x, y and z", but did not, would you still pay in full the management fees? Or do you think you would dispute the charge?

The biggest problem Owner Management Companies have in providing services is the owners who won't pay..
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/courts/late-stars-relative-told-to-pay-8000-property-service-fees-3060020.html

".., the judge said everyone knew that service charges were necessary to cover expenses for property insurance, bin collections, fire alarms, lifts and grounds and car parking maintenance..."

buzz123 · 01-04-2012 11:20AM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

No, it does not. Is it a charge from the Spanish Government? No.

Do we have management companies in Ireland that charge thousands a year? Yes

Do people contest those charges in certain cases? Yes

Yeah yeah, the point I am trying to make is that he feels he requires a service for Monies paid, as do Irish Citizens irrespective of to whom the Cash is paid, either way, there are a lot of upset Stomachs at the Breakfast Tables of those who have shelled out!!