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Rangers FC lodge papers to go into administration

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,748 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    003idf.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,521 ✭✭✭bobmalooka


    Dempsey wrote: »
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17564092



    Strange for McCoist to be saying that unless one of the bidders have raised it as a option when they get control.

    I dont understand why everyone is so worried about liquidation.

    Liquidating and starting again debt free owning all your assets and revenue streams with a fan base as big as Rangers would leave the club in a seriously stronger position long term than struggling through administration (and the next one if the big tax case goes against ye) just to get in a position to manage your debts with limited revenue streams.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    bobmalooka wrote: »
    I dont understand why everyone is so worried about liquidation.

    Liquidating and starting again debt free owning all your assets and revenue streams with a fan base as big as Rangers would leave the club in a seriously stronger position long term than struggling through administration (and the next one if the big tax case goes against ye) just to get in a position to manage your debts with limited revenue streams.

    It makes perfect business sense but it would mean ending Rangers FC, pissing off fans and facing all the footballing penalties that comes with it. They wouldnt be popular owners if they have other options to keep Rangers alive.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,961 ✭✭✭Coillte_Bhoy


    Wow, some piece on Ch 4news there. Well Dempsey....
    I was talking about him in regards to the Scottish Game. He's a blow in.

    I bet he comes up with nothing that we dont know already.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭RoryMac


    Wow, some piece on Ch 4news there. Well Dempsey....
    I was talking about him in regards to the Scottish Game. He's a blow in.

    I bet he comes up with nothing that we dont know already.

    What was the jist of the item?

    Meant to watch it but forgot it was on!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    Wow, some piece on Ch 4news there. Well Dempsey....

    Well, what did he say that we dont know already?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    I'm sick of these journalists and their 'We understand' bollox.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,961 ✭✭✭Coillte_Bhoy


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    I'm sick of these journalists and their 'We understand' bollox.

    You're sick of the truth coos you cant handle it


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    20091119-pancakebunny.gif

    How can you take articles like that one from The Herald serious, when all they say is 'We understand, 'It is believed',... ?

    If the owner of Club9 came out and said it, fine, but this is just some idiot trying to stir ****.
    They literally say that they haven't got a clue who the 2 consortia are, but they pretend to know their plans ?
    Aye right.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,961 ✭✭✭Coillte_Bhoy




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,961 ✭✭✭Coillte_Bhoy


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    20091119-pancakebunny.gif

    How can you take articles like that one from The Herald serious, when all they say is 'We understand, 'It is believed',... ?

    If the owner of Club9 came out and said it, fine, but this is just some idiot trying to stir ****.

    Thought you were on about the ch4 report.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Ah, ok.

    I saw part of it, can't say I saw any news that we haven't heard before.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,748 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    How can you take articles like that one from The Herald serious,

    The Herald have been spot on in their reporting thus far so I do find their reporting credible


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey



    Only a 7 minute piece? Thought we were going to get a 2hr special or something, would have enjoyed that :D

    Nothing new really but its good to see them being able to apportion blame amongst some of the board members via a paper trail. Bain was able to use some amount of waffle and business jargon for "I'm not paying tax on this!" :pac:

    McCelland & Greig were spouting alot of shít earlier this season and now its clear that they were up to their necks in it. Whats Rangers fans reaction to how deeply involved a club legend is involved in the tax fraud for Rangers? I'd imagine its taints his status to a degree.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭Broxi_Bear_Eire


    Dempsey wrote: »

    Only a 7 minute piece? Thought we were going to get a 2hr special or something, would have enjoyed that :D

    Nothing new really but its good to see them being able to apportion blame amongst some of the board members via a paper trail. Bain was able to use some amount of waffle and business jargon for "I'm not paying tax on this!" :pac:

    McCelland & Greig were spouting alot of shít earlier this season and now its clear that they were up to their necks in it. Whats Rangers fans reaction to how deeply involved a club legend is involved in the tax fraud for Rangers? I'd imagine its taints his status to a degree.

    Same old stuff and as for Greig He was tainted in lots of fans eyes before any allegations of wrongdoing and this from a man who still gives him idol status as a player. But as a man he is s complete prick his arrogance knows no bounds


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭RoryMac


    If what was alleged last night is true it would mean that the EBT's Rangers used were not administered properly so therefore should have been subject to tax, not as been claimed by some ;) that the HMRC changed the goalposts after the fact to try to make money out of EBT's.

    Also what is alleged about Bain receiving contractual pay rises through the EBT's and stating this was the same procedure as coaches, players & directors could see this case become a criminal case about tax evasion rather than the current tax avoidance case.

    Pretty serious stuff


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭Broxi_Bear_Eire


    RoryMac wrote: »
    If what was alleged last night is true it would mean that the EBT's Rangers used were not administered properly so therefore should have been subject to tax, not as been claimed by some ;) that the HMRC changed the goalposts after the fact to try to make money out of EBT's.

    Also what is alleged about Bain receiving contractual pay rises through the EBT's and stating this was the same procedure as coaches, players & directors could see this case become a criminal case about tax evasion rather than the current tax avoidance case.

    Pretty serious stuff

    Yes pretty serious stuff if true nothing says it was yet ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭RoryMac


    Yeah it looks like this may hinge on how throughout Bain was with his shredding ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,704 ✭✭✭Broxi_Bear_Eire


    RoryMac wrote: »
    Yeah it looks like this may hinge on how throughout Bain was with his shredding ;)

    True very True :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    RoryMac wrote: »
    Yeah it looks like this may hinge on how throughout Bain was with his shredding ;)

    Bain probably owes VAT on the shredder :pac:


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17572133

    Prospective Rangers owner Paul Murray fears exiting administration via a company voluntary arrangement may not be possible.
    "I'm working flat-out over the weekend to try to come to an agreement with Ticketus," he said.

    "I need to be in a position by Monday to firm up our bid so that it can be submitted by Wednesday.

    "Without Ticketus, it makes a CVA solution more difficult because, if the administrators terminate the contract, they'll become the largest unsecured creditor and able to block a CVA.

    "That would also lead to a very messy and complicated legal process. A six-month legal battle could be disastrous for the club."

    Murray remains hopeful an agreement will be reached.

    "Both parties recognise this is a pragmatic solution, which is a good starting point," he said.

    "There are so many things to sort out - player contracts for instance," he explained.

    "If it's not resolved in the next couple of weeks, I fear they might not be able to do a CVA."

    Further complications. Its a messy administration so far, looks like its going to get worse before it will get better.

    EDIT

    Also in the article, Murray criticises the administrators about how they are dealing with Whyte's ownership and how slow they are to get things done
    And, of course, the elephant in the room remains the position of Whyte as majority shareholder and, certainly in the present owner's view, if not that of the administrator, secured creditor.

    Murray says he was told this week by the administrator that Whyte would not hand over his shares to him, so how does he square that particular circle?

    "He didn't say he wouldn't deal with other members of my consortium," Murray went on.

    "But the administrators believe there are legal mechanisms to get the shares from Craig Whyte.

    "What I'd say is, why didn't they start that legal action seven weeks ago, rather than now?

    "The last thing Rangers need is more protracted legal battles."

    They are milking this tbh


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Some people have said that too, but it's bollocks.

    Motherwell were in administration for 2 years, for example.
    Imagine that.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    Some people have said that too, but it's bollocks.

    Motherwell were in administration for 2 years, for example.
    Imagine that.

    Is what happened Motherwell the new benchmark for you? Set a ridiculous timeframe to you criticism of the admins can be ignored?

    The target is to be out of administration by the end of this season. They have missed several targets and deadlines already, and it looks likely that they'll miss their main target, unsurprisingly.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Dempsey wrote: »
    Is what happened Motherwell the new benchmark for you? Set a ridiculous timeframe to you criticism of the admins can be ignored?

    The target is to be out of administration by the end of this season. They have missed several targets and deadlines already, and it looks likely that they'll miss their main target, unsurprisingly.

    No, I'm just pointing out that 6 weeks of administration is not abnormal.

    As for 'milking it', administrators only get paid AFTER their job is done, and even then it has to be agreed by the creditors.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,529 ✭✭✭✭Dempsey


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    No, I'm just pointing out that 6 weeks of administration is not abnormal.

    As for 'milking it', administrators only get paid AFTER their job is done, and even then it has to be agreed by the creditors.

    I didnt say it was, I was pointing out all the missed deadlines, only putting into motion that could have been done the second that they walked in the door.

    They'll get paid for the hours they've put in, dont delude yourself into thinking that they wont.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,623 ✭✭✭lubo_moravcik


    Gers liquidation a 'possibility'

    Rangers are facing the real prospect of going into liquidation, according to the administrators of the struggling SPL club.
    Duff and Phelps have given a deadline of Wednesday for "best and final" offers with Chicago-based Club 9 Sports, the Blue Knights, headed by former Ibrox director Paul Murray, and a Singaporean consortium in the running to be the new owners.
    Co-administrator Paul Clark insisted a move out of administration through a Company Voluntary Arrangement (CVA) remained the "preferred option" and was the course of action being recommended to the three bidders.
    "We still think it's achievable," Clark said. "We must accept, though, that we have in Rangers a financially-stricken
    institution and there is an amount of toxicity in there as a result of what's gone on.
    "So all of the options have to remain open and it may be that some of the bidders decide that they would rather start afresh.
    "We cannot rule out the winning bid could prefer a different structure that meant the sale of the business to a new company and in that eventuality it is certainly possible that Rangers would be liquidated.
    "But it would only be done so after the football club was made safe."


    1z1fbte.jpg


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Seems like Ticketus are ready to slash 17m of our debt to them, if TBK win the bid :cool:
    PAUL MURRAY’S rescue plan for Rangers will see Ticketus slash a massive £17million off the bill from the notorious deal which funded Craig Whyte’s takeover.

    Record Sport can reveal the London firm yesterday signed off on the details of the proposed partnership with Murray’s Blue Knights who will tomorrow table their bid to save the club from Whyte’s clutches.

    The agreement means if Murray and his group are handed the keys to Ibrox, Ticketus will agree to rip up the infamous contract that saw them hand Whyte £24.4m to buy huge chunks of future season-ticket sales.

    We can reveal the overall debt due to Ticketus as a result of their tie-in with Whyte now stands at £27m.

    But, following some intense negotiations with former director Murray, Ticketus are now willing to accept clawing just £10m back from the most damaging deal in Rangers’ 140-year history.

    And they will allow Murray to pay it back, on an interest free basis, over the next NINE years.

    The news will strengthen Murray’s bid to win control of the SPL champions and drag them away from the brink of extinction. It will also go a long way towards allaying the fears of fans who were initially shocked to hear his plans to link up with the very firm that bankrolled Whyte’s regime.

    And Murray believes it provides cast-iron proof there is no need for the club to be plunged even deeper into financial crisis.

    A rival bid from Chicago, involving Club 9 Sports, is also expected to be tabled tomorrow but it’s believed the Americans favour liquidating the Ibrox outfit and starting up again as a new company with a clean slate.

    But Murray is determined to protect Rangers’ history and last night, speaking exclusively to Record Sport, he said: “This deal makes delivering a CVA a great deal easier and shows there is no need for Rangers Football Club to be placed in any further danger.

    “It brings the debt to Ticketus down to a level that the club can properly service without being hamstrung by the terms of the deal struck by Craig Whyte.

    “These numbers alone show there is no need for the club to be placed into liquidation. But let’s be honest here, why on earth are we even discussing liquidation when we are dealing with a club that can bring in more than 47,000 fans to watch a legends game.”

    Whyte’s original deal left the club facing massive instalments every summer, which would have wiped out up to 60 per cent of all cash raised from season-ticket sales over the next three years.

    A ruling at the court of session declared that while Whyte’s deal could not legally be dismissed as null and void the £27m of Ticketus debt makes the firm the club’s largest unsecured creditor.

    Murray’s plan is to remove them from any CVA pot and offer a higher pence in the pound deal to HMRC in the hope of doing a deal to save the club from liquidation.

    And now he has successfully persuaded Ticketus to relax the crippling terms and conditions of their deal with Whyte.

    The restructured agreement will also mean Rangers have nothing to pay for the first two years of the Blue Knights’ regime. And, even then, Ticketus will only be paid back in dribs and drabs when the club have coined in extra revenue from qualifying for European competitions.

    Ticketus will also supply Murray’s regime with a £10m loan to cover the club’s runnings costs until they launch a share issue to bring fans on board.

    The money will allow Murray and his group to carry out talks with key first-team players with the aim of keeping most of Ally McCoist’s squad intact over the summer.

    The cash would be repaid in full from the money raised by putting the shares on the market and opening the club up to a form of fan ownership.

    Murray added: “Our original aim was to get Ticketus on board so we could restructure the original deal and assist our efforts to secure a CVA. This deal does both.

    “It is important we recognise the role of Ticketus. They have been demonised because of their part in the original deal with Whyte.

    “But they have been supportive and professional. Clearly, they have an interest in making sure that Rangers survive but the concessions they have made have been painful for Ticketus and are in the best interests of the club. They have agreed to this to help Rangers survive and prosper.

    “Not only are they prepared to write off very significant sums but they are also committed to putting more money into the club in the short term which would give us the ability, this coming summer, to carry out some essential activity in terms of the first-team squad.

    “In effect, what Ticketus are prepared to do here is act like a ‘supportive bank’ in order to help us stabilise the club.

    “The deal reflects Ticketus’ position as an unsecured creditor and gives the club vital breathing space as Ticketus will not charge interest on the money and they will not expect any repayment for the first two years.

    “Any repayments over the remaining seven years are based upon us having European participation. If we are not in Europe we won’t be paying anything back.

    “It’s perfectly in line with the Blue Knights’ business plan which is to have the club breaking even on domestic revenue alone. Any European income will be a bonus which can be reinvested in terms of transfer activity and so on.”

    A consortium from Singapore has also been invited to bid for the club by administrators Duff and Phelps, who last week rejected an indicative bid from Sale Sharks owner Brian Kennedy, below.

    Kennedy and the Blue Knights have remained adamant the club can be saved without going into liquidation.

    And both camps are suspicious of the motives of the men from the Far East and North America.

    By the end of this week one of the interested parties is expected to be granted preferred bidder status and a two-week period of exclusivity to examine the full extent of the financial carnage Whyte left behind.

    Daily Record.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,919 ✭✭✭RoryMac


    Murray must be one hell of a negotiator to get Ticketus to agree to that or he's not telling us what Ticketus are getting from the deal.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,229 ✭✭✭✭Jelle1880


    Ticketus will agree to pursue 'other options' for the remaining money.

    Whyte, I suppose.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,501 ✭✭✭Madam


    Jelle1880 wrote: »
    Ticketus will agree to pursue 'other options' for the remaining money.

    Whyte, I suppose.

    Or a seat at the top table;)


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